Meredith Kercher murdered - Amanda Knox convicted, now appeals #7

[SleuthyGal]

There is so much WRONG with the behavior of Amanda and Raffaele....but you "Friends of Amanda" who seem to think that vague, imprecise answers are "normal" for young people today, have apparently never been involved in a murder investigation.

1. What "behavior" are you referring to? What is your source for this "behavior" you speak of?

2. No one here, to my knowledge, is a "friend of Amanda." In fact, no one here has ever met Amanda.

3. What "vague, imprecise answers" are you referring to exactly? There is no transcript or recording of the interrogations. Anything you've read outside of her 1 or 2 emails and the letter is imagined, or not accurate, or outright manufactured. That's one of the biggest contentions on this site, in fact. You are seeing imagined and made-up comments and conversations attributed to AK.

4. Have you been involved in a murder investigation? What answers did you give to police? How do you know you weren't being "vague?" And by whose scale are you comparing statements to level of "vagueness?" Based on what?

 

[Allusonz]

I'm not discussing semantics. Barbie Nadeau is a travel author and it appears to be within the realm of travel to write about the experiences of a woman that went sideways during travel, and Candice Dempsey is a food critic. Steve Moore can't distinguish between the two, and that demotes any credibility he had before/after he was fired from his job at the University.

Steve Moore being fired had nothing to do with not knowing the difference between a travel auther(when in fact she wrote as a food critic) and a food critic

FBI agent Steve Moore, a Los Angeles resident, told the West Seattle Herald he was fired Tuesday after refusing to stop speaking out in support of Amanda Knox on national television and radio. He was deputy director of Public Safety at Pepperdine University in Malibu, California. His supervisors were concerned that he was endangering students in Pepperdine's Florence, Italy program

http://www.westseattleherald.com/2010/09/29/news/former-fbi-agent-steve-moore-fired-speaking-out-a

Two weeks ago, while its students were writing some of their thoughts on a hastily constructed "Free Speech Wall" on campus, Pepperdine's administration was preparing to write to Steve Moore that if he didn't stop talking about Knox, he would be have to resign. Pepperdine felt Moore's advocacy for Amanda Knox was incompatible with keeping his job at the university
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-504083_162-20018133-504083.html

Although Moore only conducted is activities on behalf of Knox and Sollecito when he was not working, Pepperdine reacted to the media attention Moore was garnering by firing him on September 28, 2010.

Moore filed a wrongful termination lawsuit against Pepperdine University on October 7, 2010

http://justicedenied.org/wordpress/archives/401

Steve Moore, who lives in Los Angeles, says he was fired as deputy director of Public Safety at Pepperdine University in Malibu, Calif. Moore says his supervisors were concerned that he was endangering students in Pepperdine's Florence, Italy program

http://www.king5.com/news/local/Former-FBI-agent-who-says-Knox-is-innocent-is-fired-104051923.html

 

[SleuthyGal]

Being someone who can eat and then provide a critique of food does not disqualify the same person from also being able to research, analyze, interview, and write a book about a murder case.

I'm not sure why such a big deal is being made about this. Ann Rule, for instance, is a famous crime writer, very respected. She wasn't born knowing how to analyze cases either. Know how she got started? She worked alongside Ted Bundy at a women's crisis center and later wrote a book about her experiences ("The Stranger Beside Me"). That was her first foray into crime writing. There was nothing that prepared her for this new vocation. She just did it. And now she's authored some 30+ books. That's how it usually works with authors.

But forget about Ann Rule for a moment...let's talk about someone who is eminently qualified to analyze cases. John Douglas, formerly of the FBI. Famous and respected profiler, 20+ years in the FBI, consultant, author, a guy who cuts to the chase and tells it like it is. HE finds the evidence against AK and RS to be weak at best and he has no reason to be on their side.

 

[Allusonz]

Patrick was not convicted and thrown in jail for 26 years ... he was falsely accused by a monster, a woman with no soul - according the Patrick.

I think it's fair to say that because Knox and Sollecito were convicted in a completely transparent trial that was monitored by the US embassy, that they are indeed guilty.

It was ILE the supposed ADULTS that made the CHOICE to arrest him and then KEEP him in jail not AK

 

[otto]

The Motivation Report for Rudy Guede's trial is out.

Here is an Italian story. I read a google translation, which states that the conviction should be held against Rudy only and not AK or RS who are still at the appeal stage. Didn't Mignini state that Rudy's final conviction could be held against RS and AK because they found that he committed the crime with others?

It's probably time to walk away from those online translators ... they never get it right.

"British student Meredith Kercher was killed by more than one person in a violent and "orgiastic" attack, Italy's Supreme Court said on Thursday. American college student Amanda Knox, her former Italian boyfriend Raffaele Sollecito and African immigrant Rudi Guede were all jailed for murdering Kercher, who was found semi-clothed with her throat slit in November 2007 in the Italian city of Perugia. All three deny killing Kercher.
...
Nevertheless, the ruling is bound to affect Knox and Sollecito's claim that Guede was the sole perpetrator of the crime."

http://www.adnkronos.com/IGN/Aki/En...-one-person-top-court-rules_311723203597.html

 

[Allusonz]

I'm not discussing semantics. Barbie Nadeau is a travel author and it appears to be within the realm of travel to write about the experiences of a woman that went sideways during travel, and Candice Dempsey is a food critic. Steve Moore can't distinguish between the two, and that demotes any credibility he had before/after he was fired from his job at the University.

Actually they were both food critics

 

[otto]

1. What "behavior" are you referring to? What is your source for this "behavior" you speak of?

2. No one here, to my knowledge, is a "friend of Amanda." In fact, no one here has ever met Amanda.

3. What "vague, imprecise answers" are you referring to exactly? There is no transcript or recording of the interrogations. Anything you've read outside of her 1 or 2 emails and the letter is imagined, or not accurate, or outright manufactured. That's one of the biggest contentions on this site, in fact. You are seeing imagined and made-up comments and conversations attributed to AK.

4. Have you been involved in a murder investigation? What answers did you give to police? How do you know you weren't being "vague?" And by whose scale are you comparing statements to level of "vagueness?" Based on what?

I find it so very refreshing to see more people commenting on the case. Is it really necessary to expect anyone to again rehash things that have already been discussed like Amanda's vague, imprecise answers (her very frequent use of "I don't know" throughout her testimony)? I think you know perfectly well that Anne Bremner is the lawyer for the group "Friends of Amanda" so there is no reason to misunderstand that reference. It is not necessary to be involved in a murder or questioned by police to recognize that a witness' lies and ever changing story are problematic.

 

[otto]

It was ILE the supposed ADULTS that made the CHOICE to arrest him and then KEEP him in jail not AK

You can't be serious. The police arrested Patrick so sweet little Amanda is off the hook? Are you suggesting that Knox isn't an adult?

 

[SleuthyGal]

One of the most important qualities for any potential writer (or anyone analyzing a case) is the ability to not misconstrue the evidence, not to make up things, not to misquote, not to twist statements to prop up a bias, and to only work with that which can be corroborated as fact. The moment you make misstatements is the very moment you lose any credibility (assuming you had any to begin with).

 

[Allusonz]

You can't be serious. The police arrested Patrick so sweet little Amanda is off the hook? Are you suggesting that Knox isn't an adult?

I am quite serious

They are the ones that make the final determination not AK

AK does not make the determination to charge someone in Italy, to arrest them, or to keep them incarcerated

 

[Allusonz]

Who knows. It's not like anyone was reported missing. The police were there to return a cell phone and nothing more.

Which always brings me back to the point that if I had of committed a murder that was not known to anyone and with so many people away i would of walked out not done something out of concern. She could of gone on her merry way for at least one day if not 2 more

 

[Allusonz]

They also would not walk away from a foot sticking out of a duvet with blood without checking to see if there was a person in need of immediate medical care underneath. Unless they were complete idiots. Or liars. Since they said they did not enter, take your pick.

Yes Trillian!!! Imagine if she was alive and they did nothing to aid her. I then believe this could lead to charges against them according to Italian Law. That is one of the reasons that argument has simply never made much sense to me

 

[otto]

One of the most important qualities for any potential writer (or anyone analyzing a case) is the ability to not misconstrue the evidence, not to make up things, not to misquote, not to twist statements to prop up a bias, and to only work with that which can be corroborated as fact. The moment you make misstatements is the very moment you lose any credibility (assuming you had any to begin with).

Amanda Knox made vague, imprecise statements. That is a fact. She repeatedly claims she does not remember (in many instances), but when questioned a different way about the same point, it appears she does remember. For example, when asked whether she remembered her mother asking her why she made the first phone call, she doesn't remember. A little later, she does remember her mother asking her about the call. Another example, Amanda claims that she was all drugged up and didn't remember the night Meredith was murdered, and then miraculously she remembers that she had a little walk with Raffaele, then ate at 11:00 pm, or maybe 10 or maybe 9:30, had sex, got stoned, slept. There were some problems corroborating that "imprecise" information. Imprecise is an awfully polite way of saying that Knox is a liar.

 

[OldSteve]

I would tend to agree. It was the cirucmstantial evidence of the lies Amanda told, her voluntary statement, the completely unbelievable story that she found the door open where she did nothing, and so much more that made police suspicious. There is nothing normal about the way that Amanda reacted to the murder of Meredith Kercher, and it cannot all be excused as "Amanda being Amanda" or "Amanda being Amelie". She was a mature student traveling and studying in Europe who had a history of taking advantage of situations (Berlin), indulging in drugs, selecting friends that enjoyed the world of drugs, lying to police, treating a murder investigation like a joke and basically doing exactly the opposite of what others in her situation were doing.

Have you ever watched "Campus PD"? It's amazing how very immature and self-centered some college kids are now-a-days. Not all are, but it is surprising how many drink, smoke pot, are out all night, and act inappropriately when questioned by police!
It’s been a few days since I’ve seen the movie and one thing that rattles around inside my old noggin is how this topic is all about Amanda and unlike other crime threads, it is not focused upon the victim –
Meredith Kercher. I would like to have seen a movie about her life. What did she do that night?
From the little I saw, Meredith seemed sensible and mature, unlike the others. For reasons I have no proof of, JMO, I see her in her room that night, trying to sleep or study, meanwhile AK and others were smoking, drinking, loudly partying. When Meredith complained, they teased and killed her. Again, this is all IMO.

 

[otto]

I am quite serious

They are the ones that make the final determination not AK

AK does not make the determination to charge someone in Italy, to arrest them, or to keep them incarcerated

Why don't we just say that Amanda wasn't in Perugia ... that would create better distance between Amanda and her false accusations against innocent people.

 

[kemo]

SleuthyGal,

1. What "behavior" are you referring to? What is your source for this "behavior" you speak of?

All of the "inappropriate" or "odd” things they did before and after the discovery of the body. An obvious example would be "hand stands at the police station", but there are many "things" that they did that just don't add up.

2. No one here, to my knowledge, is a "friend of Amanda." In fact, no one here has ever met Amanda.
I meant "folks who support the argument that she is innocent.

3. What "vague, imprecise answers" are you referring to exactly? There is no transcript or recording of the interrogations. Anything you've read outside of her 1 or 2 emails and the letter is imagined, or not accurate or outright manufactured. That's one of the biggest contentions on this site, in fact. You are seeing imagined and made-up comments and conversations attributed to AK.

Over the last few days, there have been a number of posts that seem to address the vagueness and inconsistencies in their statements as "just the way young people are today"

4. Have you been involved in a murder investigation? What answers did you give to police? How do you know you weren't being "vague?" And by whose scale are you comparing statements to level of "vagueness?" Based on what?

I had, a neighbor/acquaintance who was murdered (it turned out, by her boyfriend). The detective who interviewed me let me know, in no uncertain terms, what was expected of me; clear, concise answers down to the last detail. He didn't have to warn me about the seriousness of the situation, I knew. Even though all I could say was that I saw nothing, heard nothing, knew nothing, I was pinned down to a lot of details. He used a standard technique where questions weren't asked in chronological order.

 

[Allusonz]

Why don't we just say that Amanda wasn't in Perugia ... that would create better distance between Amanda and her false accusations against innocent people.

Is it now being suggested that AK was the one the made the arrest, kept him in jail, and would not allow him to re-open his business for months?

 

[otto]

Have you ever watched "Campus PD"? It's amazing how very immature and self-centered some college kids are now-a-days. Not all are, but it is surprising how many drink, smoke pot, are out all night, and act inappropriately when questioned by police!
It’s been a few days since I’ve seen the movie and one thing that rattles around inside my old noggin is how this topic is all about Amanda and unlike other crime threads, it is not focused upon the victim –
Meredith Kercher. I would like to have seen a movie about her life. What did she do that night?
From the little I saw, she seem sensible and mature, unlike the others. For reasons I have no proof of, I could see her being in her room that night, trying to sleep or study, while AK and others were smoking, drinking, loudly partying. When Meredith complained, they teased and killed her.

No, I haven't seen the movie, but I've spent enough time on a campus to know what students are like. There are some students that should not be attending colleges and universities because their objective is to party. They show up to class hung over and in bad moods. They are sitting there, eyes glazed over, watching the clock, downing gallons of coffee on an empty stomach and planning where to go drinking later in the day. There are many other students that should be there because they are mature and interested in pursuing career objectives. Knox was in Italy, and she was expected to govern herself accordingly ... too bad she connected with the drug crowd as soon as she arrived.

It would be great if Lifetime would now make a movie about Meredith, the real victim.

 

[SleuthyGal]

Kemo,

1. The inappropriate/odd things are things described 2nd and 3rd and 4th hand. How do you know you're getting accurate info and full context? (hint: you can't know that). You might be reading a rumor and basing your opinion on something not quite accurate. Are you okay with doing that? I'm not okay basing my opinions on something UNcorroborated, that's for sure.

2. Amanda may very well be innocent, that's true. Although apparently that doesn't matter either because there are those who seem to hate her with the heat of a thousand suns, so even if she was 100% innocent of this crime, they'd still deign to see her in prison because of their feelings. At the very least, one can say she is legally "not guilty," because the evidence doesn't take one over the barrier of 'reasonable doubt' to make her 'guilty.' (Yes I realize an Italian jury thought otherwise).

3. You realize that statements made on this forum have been quite inaccurate and in some cases twisted into something altogether false, right? The 'best' evidence that anyone can point to is what they find to be disingenuous or vague remarks supposedly made by AK or RS, based on....ummm....some source, but certainly not from any verifiable and corroborated source. Rumors on top of rumors. This forum (as nice as it is) is not a font of case accuracy, nor should be construed as such. Some things are correct. Some...not so much.

4. So you were questioned by a cop in your main language in your own domicile. Excellent. How do you think it might have gone had you been in a different country, being questioned in a language not your own? Exactly the same? Possibly different?

 

[Allusonz]

No, I haven't seen the movie, but I've spent enough time on a campus to know what students are like. There are some students that should not be attending colleges and universities because their objective is to party. They show up to class hung over and in bad moods. They are sitting there, eyes glazed over, watching the clock, downing gallons of coffee on an empty stomach and planning where to go drinking later in the day. There are many other students that should be there because they are mature and interested in pursuing career objectives. Knox was in Italy, and she was expected to govern herself accordingly ... too bad she connected with the drug crowd as soon as she arrived.

It would be great if Lifetime would now make a movie about Meredith, the real victim.

I would then hope that the get the approval of the Kercher family prior to proceeding MOO