AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #15

[Anita Richman]

BBM:

JMO and MOO ... Seriously ? Really ?

Is he really getting "threats" -- OR -- :waitasec: is this just another "act" in his "theatrical performances" ?

:moo::moo::moo:

I don't believe Mr. Celis has stated nor claimed that he is getting deaththreats. It's the supposition of some on this board.

 

[PAXIMUS]

I dont even call that sex trafficking.

This mother sold her baby to this one pedophile to support her drug habit.

Never ceases to amaze me what addiction causes people to do, that said these people do not belong in prison, they are sick with a disease and need to be under a medical professionals care, that way the prisons have more room for the real bastards who belong there.

 

[Donjeta]

BBM:

JMO and MOO ... Seriously ? Really ?

Is he really getting "threats" -- OR -- :waitasec: is this just another "act" in his "theatrical performances" ?

:moo::moo::moo:

No, it can't be blamed on Sergio's theatrics, he's never said that he's getting death threats, as far as I know, it's just speculation on WS that CPS might have wanted the children away from him if his life is threatened.

 

[Theforeigner]

Her is a link to where you can hear the full 911 call made by SC:

http://thestir.cafemom.com/in_the_news/137622/911_calls_from_isabel_celis

 

[spoiledmom]

Well I am a former US Marine and I dont panic, in fact I was trained to ALWAYS keep my cool during any crises and THAT is basic training that is also offered by most police and fire departments and other crises workers, if you ever take such training or listen to such people talk the first thing they tell you and the one thing they ALWAYS stress is the IMPORTANCE of keeping your head during an emergency/crises.


I am certain it would be suggested I am a sociopath if someone seen me in the midst of a crises. If I were to have lost my cool during the emergencies and crises I have been in I would have been brought back from Iraq/Afghanistan in a body bag.


Granted not everyone has had such training but it really isnt out of the norm for some people to be able to remain calm during the most frenzied times.

Thank you for serving our country. I am married to a former marine. He handles situations as you are describing. Always trying to be the hero. Poor guy.

 

[txanmom]

Well I am a former US Marine and I dont panic, in fact I was trained to ALWAYS keep my cool during any crises and THAT is basic training that is also offered by most police and fire departments and other crises workers, if you ever take such training or listen to such people talk the first thing they tell you and the one thing they ALWAYS stress is the IMPORTANCE of keeping your head during an emergency/crises.


I am certain it would be suggested I am a sociopath if someone seen me in the midst of a crises. If I were to have lost my cool during the emergencies and crises I have been in I would have been brought back from Iraq/Afghanistan in a body bag.


Granted not everyone has had such training but it really isnt out of the norm for some people to be able to remain calm during the most frenzied times.

My dad was a marine in Vietnam - Semper Fi!

With all due respect Pax, my son got lost for 2 hours at DisneyWorld on Christmas Eve 4 years ago. I was a complete MESS!! You have no idea how upsetting this was. I reported it to Park Police after a few minutes of looking on our own. I knew everything he was wearing down to the color of his underwear, lol! Also, (no tomatoes, please) I had had a few glasses of wine before it happened at dinner (it was a holiday, vacation and we were not driving). Trust me that will sober you up in an instant. I was crying, panicking, hyperventilating and ended up vomiting in the office while they made me wait with my daughter. I did NOT want to be taken away from the area where we had lost him. It was in a huge crowd/mob of people and he had gotten knocked down by a man and we just could not find him. Eventually my husband found him (thank goodness) but the park police had sent out a bulletin and the whole park was looking for him during those two hours.

That 911 call was what did it for me. There is no way (after my own personal experience) that he could wake up at 8am go in his baby daughter's room (his youngest and only daughter) see her window open and screen off and just casually convey to 911 that she was abducted and not know the simplest of things such as what she was wearing, how tall she was, how much she weighed her cotton-pickin' BIRTHDAY!! No way. Sorry. I was supporting them before I heard that call and his demeanor, but there is just no way anyone no matter how well trained or how naturally calm you are could be that nonchalant in that situation. Even if he was under the influence of drugs or alcohol I promise you he would still have known the simple answers to those questions and he wouldn't have needed to add all that extraneous info. Heck he even knew his wife's height (I doubt seriously my husband has any clue how tall I am. :moo:

 

[imjustinterested]

I am not in any camp, I got my tent pitched outside the gates where I sit alone, starving for a friend or companion to come join me in my madness.


At this point anything is possible.

I'm thinking about joining you but need to know whether your tent is air-conditioned.

 

[PAXIMUS]

Although I don't live in the "Tuscons barrio area", I feel comfortable driving in, shopping and dining all over Tucson. There is a lot of socio-economic deprived people and lots of Hispanic descent, but I see more mental health/homeless issues rather than "meth heads" and outright drug dealing.

I agree, South Tucson is one of the worst places in the city but I love to go down there and shop and dine and hang out with and meet the old traditional Hispanic families that live in the area. Generally if you dont mess around with the bad guys they wont mess around with you, if you walk around with an attitude that you are better than others they will surely beat you down and teach you that you are not.

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

I don't know if he harmed her or not but in the 911 call, I can clearly notice SC distancing himself from his daughter.

Talking to TPD, he says , I need to report a missing child. I believe she was abducted from my house. TPD had to ask him if he was referring to his daughter and then he says yes.

He mispells her name. It appears he gave the wrong birth date. When asked for Isabel's height, he gives TPD his wife's height, etc etc etc.

He then goes on to talking about himself and what I would consider setting up an alibi.

:moo:



http://cms3.tucsonaz.gov/files/poli..._911_audio_ref_isabel_celis_investigation.pdf

Yes. These were the same responses by SC that made me think :liar:

 

[dog.gone.cute]

I don't believe Mr. Celis has stated nor claimed that he is getting deaththreats. It's the supposition of some on this board.

:seeya: Thanks ... I am still trying to catch up here ... this thread is moving so fast I cannot keep up with it ...

Question : Will there be a Presser today ?

TIA !

 

[oceanblueeyes]

There are thousands of cases that have been solved though. There is certainly a lot of data out there about child abductions, matricide/patricide, and all different kinds of crimes. We know the FBI and other organizations gather statistical information and behavioral profiles from prior cases, and in order for them to do so there would have to be at least thousands of cases that have been resolved to make the information statistically-relevant.

I read that about 64% of cases are solved. That leaves 36% of all cases that remains unsolved and that can make the statistical data very flawed with those uknowns not known and where the perp is unknown.

And one thing I have consistently read is if the perpretrator has no link with the victim whatsoever these are the hardest cases to solve.

IMO

 

[Anita Richman]

Never ceases to amaze me what addiction causes people to do, that said these people do not belong in prison, they are sick with a disease and need to be under a medical professionals care, that way the prisons have more room for the real bastards who belong there.

Are you referring to the mother or the pedophile who raped and murdered her?

 

[deanna82437]

This may be of interest to some sleuthers ..

Aired May 15, 2012 - 22:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening, everyone.

It's 10:00 on the East Coast. And we begin tonight "Keeping Them Honest"

(snipped other portions not related)

COOPER: The violent drug war next door in Mexico. This time, dozens of bodies turned up headless, mutilated, and the murderers left their calling card at the scene, or did they? Why it's not so easy to determine which drug cartel is responsible. That's ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

Just south of the border the violent drug war rages in Mexico. Dozens are murdered in the latest round of violence. But determining which drug gang may be responsible is not that easy. We'll see why next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COOPER: A vicious and bloody drug war in Mexico is taking another violent turn. On Sunday, 49 decapitated bodies were found on the border, 80 miles south of the U.S. border.

This latest round of violence bears the marks of the escalating turf war between rival drug cartels. And the victims are most likely cartel members or associates.

Now, over the last several years, the rival gangs have increasingly used brutality murders as warnings to each other as they battle for control of this multi-billion-dollar drug trafficking business in Mexico.

So which cartel is likely responsible for these murders? Well, the answer may not be as clear as it looks. We want to warn you. The images you're about to see are difficult to watch. Here's Miguel Marquez.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1205/15/acd.02.html

You will need to scroll down to view the transcript of the videotape. It goes on to discuss how the cartels are moving into the US and abducting children to aid in their drugs/guns trafficing. A very interesting topic and appropriate (IMO) to the topic on this thread.

MOO

 

[mck16]

I agree, South Tucson is one of the worst places in the city but I love to go down there and shop and dine and hang out with and meet the old traditional Hispanic families that live in the area. Generally if you dont mess around with the bad guys they wont mess around with you, if you walk around with an attitude that you are better than others they will surely beat you down and teach you that you are not.

I think you could be describing any town in the USA. And isn't it funny it is always the south part of town? Here it is S. Dallas.

 

[Gardenlady]

You are allowed to have your own theory. There is nothing wrong with that. Spill it. What's your theory?

Not sure what your tone is here, but working in the assumption that you're just curious - I don't actually have one. Well, I think I know who it isn't - I don't thi it's SC, RC, or a cartel. But I'm not sure who it is yet.

Sort of like the game Clue. I tend to work process of elimination. But unfortunately, this isn't a game, none of us get bragging rights at the end. Just hopefully Isa home safe.

 

[winterrose]

I don't know if this has been mentioned, but there's some little things disturbing me. The photos of Isa, always decked out, in an interview on NBC her Mom said she would wear make up, jewelry, etc, she's only 6. The video where she's dancing to music and her mother said, "Look at me" and Isa had that smile, reminded me of that Tiaras show. Did she have her in talent shows or anything like this, I don't know, it just felt odd.

Beautiful little girl, I just wonder if parents were real strict on the kids, him a coach, all the kids on a team, which there's nothing wrong with that. Sometimes parents are so motivated to have thier children be out there, be in the spotlight, kids can be so dominated. There can be emotional or even physical abuse, not saying there is here, but I'd like to hear more on what type of parents they are. If they were the type to want that perfect life, perfect children, they do come off to me like that and that takes money, also.

 

[Anita Richman]

:seeya: Thanks ... I am still trying to catch up here ... this thread is moving so fast I cannot keep up with it ...

Question : Will there be a Presser today ?

TIA !

You're welcome! No, next presser at 2 pm tomorrow (Thursday).

 

[PAXIMUS]

My dad was a marine in Vietnam - Semper Fi!

With all due respect Pax, my son got lost for 2 hours at DisneyWorld on Christmas Eve 4 years ago. I was a complete MESS!! You have no idea how upsetting this was. I reported it to Park Police after a few minutes of looking on our own. I knew everything he was wearing down to the color of his underwear, lol! Also, (no tomatoes, please) I had had a few glasses of wine before it happened at dinner (it was a holiday, vacation and we were not driving). Trust me that will sober you up in an instant. I was crying, panicking, hyperventilating and ended up vomiting in the office while they made me wait with my daughter. I did NOT want to be taken away from the area where we had lost him. It was in a huge crowd/mob of people and he had gotten knocked down by a man and we just could not find him. Eventually my husband found him (thank goodness) but the park police had sent out a bulletin and the whole park was looking for him during those two hours.

That 911 call was what did it for me. There is no way (after my own personal experience) that he could wake up at 8am go in his baby daughter's room (his youngest and only daughter) see her window open and screen off and just casually convey to 911 that she was abducted and not know the simplest of things such as what she was wearing, how tall she was, how much she weighed her cotton-pickin' BIRTHDAY!! No way. Sorry. I was supporting them before I heard that call and his demeanor, but there is just no way anyone no matter how well trained or how naturally calm you are could be that nonchalant in that situation. Even if he was under the influence of drugs or alcohol I promise you he would still have known the simple answers to those questions and he wouldn't have needed to add all that extraneous info. Heck he even knew his wife's height (I doubt seriously my husband has any clue how tall I am. :moo:

Hey I understand that, I think MOST people would PANIC in this situation, my point though is SOME PEOPLE may not and you cant automatically assume guilt when they dont because they may have a reason for doing so.


In the case of Sergio I agree I dont see some hardened tough guy in him and he does seem to be the more drama queen type of the two, I dont know him and I just cant read much in to the 911 call because of that.

IMO Sergio did not INTENTIONALLY harm his little girl, it might have been an accident but I still dont know why anyone would turn an accident in to a murder and coverup and risk life in prison, OR it could be the result of him being involved with some bad people in one way or another, I just do not know but if it turns out he killed or was molesting his kid or whatever I will BE VERY SHOCKED.

 

[Gardenlady]

To those who seem to think that a gang or cartel being involved is some sort of far fetched idea or concept in this matter.. please take a weeks vacation to phoenix and spend a week in the southwest part of town on like central and southern or go down to Tucsons barrio area and get a feel for what its like around those areas. This isn't cookie cutter ville vermont or new england and it certainly isn't florida. This is Arizona where there is a mix of extremes you got your typical everyday folks blended right in with nutball types. Pot is the least of the problem in this area as well, there is more of a meth problem down there than anything. Anyway... a Cartel theory is just as up there as Daddy done it.

Okay! We get it! Arizona is completely unlike any other place in the nation. Or maybe on earth, for that matter. No other place has mixes of extremes, regular folks plus gangs or garden variety criminals. None! Only Arizona!

Look, I don't know what you think New England is like, but we aren't all sitting on walden pond in colonial houses behind white picket fences and looking at beautiful foliage 12 months of the year. . . :floorlaugh: hoh:

 

[oceanblueeyes]

This may be of interest to some sleuthers ..

Aired May 15, 2012 - 22:00 ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening, everyone.

It's 10:00 on the East Coast. And we begin tonight "Keeping Them Honest"

(snipped other portions not related)

COOPER: The violent drug war next door in Mexico. This time, dozens of bodies turned up headless, mutilated, and the murderers left their calling card at the scene, or did they? Why it's not so easy to determine which drug cartel is responsible. That's ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

Just south of the border the violent drug war rages in Mexico. Dozens are murdered in the latest round of violence. But determining which drug gang may be responsible is not that easy. We'll see why next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COOPER: A vicious and bloody drug war in Mexico is taking another violent turn. On Sunday, 49 decapitated bodies were found on the border, 80 miles south of the U.S. border.

This latest round of violence bears the marks of the escalating turf war between rival drug cartels. And the victims are most likely cartel members or associates.

Now, over the last several years, the rival gangs have increasingly used brutality murders as warnings to each other as they battle for control of this multi-billion-dollar drug trafficking business in Mexico.

So which cartel is likely responsible for these murders? Well, the answer may not be as clear as it looks. We want to warn you. The images you're about to see are difficult to watch. Here's Miguel Marquez.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1205/15/acd.02.html

You will need to scroll down to view the transcript of the videotape. It goes on to discuss how the cartels are moving into the US and abducting children to aid in their drugs/guns trafficing. A very interesting topic and appropriate (IMO) to the topic on this thread.

MOO

So they recruit 6 year old little girls?

I am confused how it got started that this is tied to a Mexican drug cartel. Is this because the Celis family happens to be Hispanic?

Does the cartel only target Hispanic families?

imo