GUILTY NC - PFC Kelli Bordeaux, 23, Fayetteville, 14 April 2012 - #9

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If NH was only gone 10 minutes, it obviously sways me away from him being the perp. If it was close to 45 minutes, then it certainly sways me to him. So a statement in MSM vs. VOH's recollection, who was there. VOH...I have some sort of recollection of you commenting on how long NH was gone but I can't find that post now, so I'm second guessing myself too. Is there any clarification you can give on that point?
 
Woe.be.gone said:
I saw that one too and another case where the roommate was the main suspect because he ran out of the apartment before he saved his female platonic roommate. After they cleared the fiance, who lived far away, LE focused on the roommate who said, 'you think I did it'. It turns out it was a stranger who killed this lovely young woman in her apartment. It was proven by a trail of blood that was left out the back door of the apartment that didn't match the roommate's blood who had been stabbed by the guy too (making it look like he had wounds that may have occurred when he was killing his roommate). Luckily, in that case, their was DNA evidence that assisted LE in piecing the case together. Of course, the boyfriend and the roommate were the initial suspects but the suspicions got serious surrounding the innocent roommate. He's been scarred emotionally and by his own guilt for not doing more to help her at the time. He couldn't see her in the apartment and thought she had run out too. He was able to flee even though he was being stabbed.

The point is, LE focused on an individual suspect for a time but they obviously changed course when the DNA evidence came back showing a third person had left blood evidence behind in the apartment too.
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Yes! that's the case - thanks! I had forgotten the details...

It ties into what you mentioned:

But, since Kelli had several male friends (old friends, through work, through FB's, through prior dating and a husband and/or soon to be ex), there seems to be several realistic possibilities. Oh and then maybe one of the biker chics felt threatened by her presence at FB's too. It bothers me alot that she didn't settle her bar tab. Then, add to the list strangers from your post, man-oh-man, I guess the list is longer than I thought!
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And add to that list, someone who simply was watching Kellie from another apt. or anywhere...
 
I apologize for not knowing how to quote the posts from prior threads but what I found from VOH as post #146, thread 6 and post #1060, thread 7, where it was indicated that he/she doesn't remember anyone else entering/leaving the bar within 30-45 minutes before or after the time NH left with Kelli. I don't know if this is to include NH not returning in those 30-45 minutes or not or if there is still another post I missed.
 
phantomthought said:
The difference being in this case the family and LE both still believe the husband is innocent.In the Macdonald case the police always believed he was guilty.
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I don't think I read anywhere that LE believes the husband is innocent. I think the last I read was that "no one has been cleared."
 
phantomthought said:
The difference being in this case the family and LE both still believe the husband is innocent.In the Macdonald case the police always believed he was guilty.
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Show me where it says the police think the husband is INNOCENT. Lead me to a statement where they say he's been cleared.

I'm forced to spell this out directly. The article I linked regarding Peterson is a nod to the idea that LE often suspects the spouse but pretends they don't. At the same time, they observe and watch the behavior of the person, sometimes for years. I've seen this replayed time and time again.
Sometimes the guy gets to live freely for years and he remarries and has children before, fifteen years later, he's charged. That really irks me too.

Anyway, without having transcripts of LE interviews, specific info about the weekend the husband says he stayed in Florida, phone records and the like, there's no way to sort this out. Peeps will just have to agree to disagree because, no one can know for sure without seeing all the evidence that's been gathered so far.
 
Madeleine74 said:
http://www.fayobserver.com/articles/2012/06/22/1186243?sac=fo.local

"And whatever happened to her happened between 12:46 a.m. and 1:24 a.m.," Locklear says, noting the last time her cell phone was activated on April 14 between I-295 and Methodist University, and not far from the soldier's apartment complex and the tavern.



That's been the only time LE has mentioned specific times in this case. It's a 38 min span of time. It does not tell us exactly when KB and NH left the bar nor when NH got back, and it does not tell us the exact time of the texts sent. That info might be available elsewhere, but I haven't personally seen it.
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I would love to hear what every single patron who was in the bar that night had to say to LE. Something could have happened to Kelli while he was still in or around the bar and a whole group of people are covering up what happened to her. I've considered this because,

1. Kelli didn't settle her bar tab before she left the bar
2. LE indicates that NH knows something or they believe he has information, something like that.
3. LE asked the public to report if they saw anything outside of FB's that looked normal but may mean something to LE on the night Kelli was last seen. What came to my mind was something being loaded into a vehicle late that night/early morning.

Of course this theory does not involve Kelli's husband.

adding ~ here's a post from thread 2 (so early in the case) about the unpaid bar tab and VOH not being able to answer if NH returned to the bar or not after dropping Kelli off.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - NC NC - Fort Bragg soldier PFC Kelli Bordeaux, 23, Fayetteville, 14 April 2012 - #2 /#481
 
At this point I don't see any reason to state that Kelli's husband had anything to do with her appearance, or to compare him to Scott Peterson or other murderous husbands. There has been no indication that he was anywhere other than 550 miles away in Florida when Kelli went missing. I think it's really unfair to accuse him since he has lost a wife, estranged or not. I know other husbands have driven long distances to murder their wives, Doug Stewart comes to mind, but nothing we have heard leads me to believe LE are on that trail in this case. If something comes to light that points to him driving to Fayetteville that night or being the focus of LE I'll change my stance, but until that happens I'm uncomfortable with Mike Bordeaux basically being accused of his wife's murder.

I'm a pretty logical guy, I'm a scientist, and it seems logical to me that when the detective on the case says Holbert has "valuable information as to where she's at"...he probably means Holbert knows specifically where her body is because he placed it there (maybe even with an accomplice).
 
Woe.be.gone said:
Show me where it says the police think the husband is INNOCENT. Lead me to a statement where they say he's been cleared.

I'm forced to spell this out directly. The article I linked regarding Peterson is a nod to the idea that LE often suspects the spouse but pretends they don't. At the same time, they observe and watch the behavior of the person, sometimes for years. I've seen this replayed time and time again.
Sometimes the guy gets to live freely for years and he remarries and has children before, fifteen years later, he's charged. That really irks me too.

Anyway, without having transcripts of LE interviews, specific info about the weekend the husband says he stayed in Florida, phone records and the like, there's no way to sort this out. Peeps will just have to agree to disagree because, no one can know for sure without seeing all the evidence that's been gathered so far.
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This is not a case where the police are pretending not to suspect the spouse.This is a case where the police have came out publicly and accused someone else of knowing where her body is.The police do not come out publicly and accuse someone they know to be innocent just to lull the real suspect into a false sense of security.As far as her husband being involved I guess the next thing you are going to argue is the police think NH knows where her husband hid the body.
 
Excellent post, Chili!

Further, in each of the other cases mentioned, the husband was either at the crime scene and part of the crime (MacDonald) or was the last known person to be with the victim (S Peterson). MacDonald's account of the crime simply didn't match the physical evidence at the scene. Peterson placed himself at the very bay 100 mi away where his wife's body was found 4 months later. Those cases are not remotely similar either to each other or to the Bordeaux case, outside of each perp being male who was married to the victim.

Here we have an estranged husband who lives 3 states away and was not known to be either in the area or with the victim. No information has yet emerged which indicates the husband was either in the vicinity of FBs or KBs apartment, let alone in the state of NC, but never mind that, he is imagined as lurking in the area, and he seems suspicious.

Or, in the unluckiest coincidence ever, Kelli leaves the vehicle of a homeless RSO, within maybe 200 yards of her apartment, and is somehow confronted by an attacker who must have been watching her and was hunting her down. No one hears anything, sees anything, but the guy obviously has some ninja skills and a vehicle handy. Not even the RSO who was watching KB leave his vehicle saw anything. But it could be a random attacker because there have been other rapes in the area and even though their cases are different from Kelli's and none of the other victims are missing, attackers probably change their M.O.

Yet, for some reason, a guy, coincidentally a homeless RSO who KB only knew for a week or two, who was known to have asked KB about her marital status and showed some interest in KB and was known to be with the victim and was likely the last person who ever saw her alive, is not seen as the probable suspect because it doesn't "feel" right. And even though LE has publicly stated they believe the person who was known to be with Kelli has more information he's not telling, well, what do they know, they're fallible and probably wrong.

I'm with logical Chili on this one.
 
Time will tell, I hope. My wish is that MH has nothing to do with Kelli's disappearance.

To the ones who KNOW this to be true, good for you.
 
Madeleine74 said:
Excellent post, Chili!

Further, in each of the other cases mentioned, the husband was either at the crime scene and part of the crime (MacDonald) or was the last known person to be with the victim (S Peterson). MacDonald's account of the crime simply didn't match the physical evidence at the scene. Peterson placed himself at the very bay 100 mi away where his wife's body was found 4 months later. Those cases are not remotely similar either to each other or to the Bordeaux case, outside of each perp being male who was married to the victim.

Here we have an estranged husband who lives 3 states away and was not known to be either in the area or with the victim. No information has yet emerged which indicates the husband was either in the vicinity of FBs or KBs apartment, let alone in the state of NC, but never mind that, he is imagined as lurking in the area, and he seems suspicious.

Or, in the unluckiest coincidence ever, Kelli leaves the vehicle of a homeless RSO, within maybe 200 yards of her apartment, and is somehow confronted by an attacker who must have been watching her and was hunting her down. No one hears anything, sees anything, but the guy obviously has some ninja skills and a vehicle handy. Not even the RSO who was watching KB leave his vehicle saw anything. But it could be a random attacker because there have been other rapes in the area and even though their cases are different from Kelli's and none of the other victims are missing, attackers probably change their M.O.

Yet, for some reason, a guy, coincidentally a homeless RSO who KB only knew for a week or two, who was known to have asked KB about her marital status and showed some interest in KB and was known to be with the victim and was likely the last person who ever saw her alive, is not seen as the probable suspect because it doesn't "feel" right. And even though LE has publicly stated they believe the person who was known to be with Kelli has more information he's not telling, well, what do they know, they're fallible and probably wrong.

I'm with logical Chili on this one.
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I don't think anyone was comparing Kelli's husband to Scott Peterson or in my illistration to Jeffrey Macdonald. My point was that both families originally supported the spouse until new facts started coming out to make them change their minds. We don't know if there are facts that eventually will come out to change minds or not yet.
 
I guess realistically one can look at an RSO as well as some one with
potential maritial problems.
Not accusing anyone of anything, including NH at this point.
We don't really know anything regarding the relationship at that time
between KB and MB.
Sometimes the simplest solution isn't!!!!!

I believe something is brewing with someone other than NH and this
may very well turn cold.

Seems people are turning their sights on NH soley on the fact of what
happened back in the 90's or whenever; and he being the last
to see Kelli AT FB that night. That bit of info was in the article posted
up thread and found to be interesting to me. LAST to see Kelli at FB, NOT
last to see her that evening.

Someone seeming innocent means nothing to me. You have to take
the whole pic apart to see things and not just pick at NH because of
his standing. ALL just my opinion in this case and also picking on
NH as the possible perp with out an ounce of proof but giving
everyone else a free ride. That's not fairness, it's tunnel vision.

And to me this would apply TO anyone. Stranger, friend, foe, and
family!
 
So Kellie leaves the bar with NH, but he lives in a tent behind the bar - so where was she going with him - to his tent? Doesn't sound right. Take a guy who lives in a tent back to her place?
 
parker38 said:
I guess realistically one can look at an RSO as well as some one with
potential maritial problems.
Not accusing anyone of anything, including NH at this point.
We don't really know anything regarding the relationship at that time
between KB and MB.
Sometimes the simplest solution isn't!!!!!

I believe something is brewing with someone other than NH and this
may very well turn cold.

Seems people are turning their sights on NH soley on the fact of what
happened back in the 90's or whenever; and he being the last
to see Kelli AT FB that night. That bit of info was in the article posted
up thread and found to be interesting to me. LAST to see Kelli at FB, NOT
last to see her that evening.

Someone seeming innocent means nothing to me. You have to take
the whole pic apart to see things and not just pick at NH because of
his standing. ALL just my opinion in this case and also picking on
NH as the possible perp with out an ounce of proof but giving
everyone else a free ride. That's not fairness, it's tunnel vision.

And to me this would apply TO anyone. Stranger, friend, foe, and
family!
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I am not picking on NH simply because of his RSO status and neither is anyone else.We are pointing the finger in his direction because every piece of info we are privy to points in his direction and not one shred of info points to anyone else.He admits to giving her a ride home that night so he was not only the last person to see her at FB he was the last person that we know of to see her after she left FB.There has been no info released that anyone saw her after HE claims he dropped her off.His story of where and why he dropped her off is very suspicious.He was the one that was taking her home so he has the best motive for people to believe she "got home safe".LE who has access to all the cell phone records,witnesses,suspects and who knows what else are pointing the finger directly at him.
Her husband? Other than they might have been having marital problems what points to him.He was three states away,the police have said nothing other than he has fully cooperated,he has not hired a lawyer that we know of,there has been no reports of the police being called to their home for domestic disturbances.Her family does not believe he had anything to do with it or have they ever mentioned he was a controlling or jealous spouse.The exact opposite appears to be true. Not one of the usual red flags you see in a case where a husband kills his wife exist in this case.
So we are not picking on him or giving anyone a free ride.We are basing are opinion on all the info that is available to us.
 
I basically agree with your statement except that witnesses at the bar said that Nick was back at the bar from driving Kelli within 10 minutes. Also, never put all your eggs in one basket or else it might come back to haunt you.

phantomthought said:
I am not picking on NH simply because of his RSO status and neither is anyone else.We are pointing the finger in his direction because every piece of info we are privy to points in his direction and not one shred of info points to anyone else.He admits to giving her a ride home that night so he was not only the last person to see her at FB he was the last person that we know of to see her after she left FB.There has been no info released that anyone saw her after HE claims he dropped her off.His story of where and why he dropped her off is very suspicious.He was the one that was taking her home so he has the best motive for people to believe she "got home safe".LE who has access to all the cell phone records,witnesses,suspects and who knows what else are pointing the finger directly at him.
Her husband? Other than they might have been having marital problems what points to him.He was three states away,the police have said nothing other than he has fully cooperated,he has not hired a lawyer that we know of,there has been no reports of the police being called to their home for domestic disturbances.Her family does not believe he had anything to do with it or have they ever mentioned he was a controlling or jealous spouse.The exact opposite appears to be true. Not one of the usual red flags you see in a case where a husband kills his wife exist in this case.
So we are not picking on him or giving anyone a free ride.We are basing are opinion on all the info that is available to us.
Click to expand...
 
sundrop said:
I basically agree with your statement except that witnesses at the bar said that Nick was back at the bar from driving Kelli within 10 minutes. Also, never put all your eggs in one basket or else it might come back to haunt you.
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If NH left the bar after 1am as he is claiming and there are all of these witnesses to his coming and going why did the police come out with the statement
" whatever happened to her happened between 12:46 a.m. and 1:24 a.m.,"
LE must have reason to believe she left the bar before 12:46.Or none of these so called witnesses can place her at the bar after 12:46.When I look at all the statements police have made about the events that night I think what you are going to find is LE believes NH and KB left the bar around midnight which is why they are asking if anyone saw anything on ramsey st at that time.12:46 is the last text message that LE believes she sent having to do with how she felt about what was going on and who she was with and 1:24 is the first text sent from her phone that LE does not believe she sent most likely about getting a ride home.As I said just an opinion but one thing is for sure NH timeline and LE timeline of that night are not adding up.
 
I agree the timeline has been a bit wonky.

First we have VOH910, our verified insider, estimating they left FBs about 1:20am. But we know it was sometime before that.

Then there are some people at the bar who estimated NH was gone about 10 min. Possible? yes. Is that what happened?

NH has given his timeframe and placed himself with KB in his car after FB's and to the point where he claims she got out of the car. NH by his own admission is the last known person to be with KB.

We have LE who has the exact time of the texts sent from KB's phone, which presents a more accurate timeline based on KB's phone texts and pings. A 38 min span of time.

For an accurate timeline, the cell tower and text data LE has would trump any FB patrons estimates, and obviously would trump what NH claims in his timeline.
 
phantomthought said:
If NH left the bar after 1am as he is claiming and there are all of these witnesses to his coming and going why did the police come out with the statement
" whatever happened to her happened between 12:46 a.m. and 1:24 a.m.,"
LE must have reason to believe she left the bar before 12:46.Or none of these so called witnesses can place her at the bar after 12:46.When I look at all the statements police have made about the events that night I think what you are going to find is LE believes NH and KB left the bar around midnight which is why they are asking if anyone saw anything on ramsey st at that time.12:46 is the last text message that LE believes she sent having to do with how she felt about what was going on and who she was with and 1:24 is the first text sent from her phone that LE does not believe she sent most likely about getting a ride home.As I said just an opinion but one thing is for sure NH timeline and LE timeline of that night are not adding up.
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BBM:
could that be taken to mean someone slipping something in her drink before she left the bar?
 
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