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Thread: AZ - Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, 26 Dec 2009 - last seen in Texas - #3

  1. #326
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    I kind of believe that EJ is working with LE, and that's where the Nashville connection is coming in. --

    Okay - Logical Minds - I know you are going to hate me for this, but I believe EJ was brainwashed and coerced by TPS --

    Really, there is such a thing as postpartum depression -- really, there is --

    And everything in her background -- uhhhh, how many of us have been a foster child??? and even if we were, everyone has a different experience, but really, that is not what we have experienced, have we? And if so -- people with experience being a foster care child - what was it like?

    The thing is - I believe, after hearing that Logan and Elizabeth lived together for 2 years -- that her behavior changed totally after she had the baby -- that postpartum depression and the foster care/parents problem had a great deal to do with it.

    Who are we to say how she felt? Who are we to know what led up to this -- influences, etc.

    I hope and pray that the right attorney (not money-hungry pro bono atty) gets involved and finds this baby.

    I really do not ever want to judge someone on a path that I have never walked on (so to speak).

    As a matter of fact -- I love you, Elizabeth -- it's been really rough -- where is your beautiful baby boy? And you will get help -- just tell us what happened.

    Thanks,

    your friend,

    Marianne

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  3. #327
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    Quote Originally Posted by A_Closer_Look View Post
    Well, Nashville is making a lot more sense now!

    We knew TPS's business existed in Nashville originally, but to hear that there was a sighting of Gabe there, and to hear both of the Smith's admit to having friends and family there, etc...

    It's all starting to make sense to me now.

    If someone left Nashville, heading to San Antonio... at the same time someone left Tempe heading to San Antonio... I wonder how close to San Antonio they would intersect... just pondering
    BBM

    Noooooo! Not mathmatical word problems. I was terrible at those. But, it's a good thought so I'll just ponder with you until someone really smart replies.

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  5. #328
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    Not to mention, if she drove from Tempe to San Antonio, wouldn't she have gone thru El Paso?
    That's on the border.
    Last edited by Kimberlyd125; 01-08-2010 at 10:26 PM.
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  7. #329
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missy70Texas View Post
    Exactly and I was thinking of all the border cities in Texas Victoria doesn't make any sense.
    This is driving me crazy, I was checking out some names associated with either the Smith's or that church in Texas that had 'adoption meetings' in the park and came across someone with ties to KY, TN,AZ and TX, I remember something about Victoria TX from my searching but can't remember who I was looking at. I would be such a great sleuth if only I could remember who/what I'm sleuthing from one day to the next.

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  9. #330
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    Quote Originally Posted by Searchfortruth View Post
    Well, just as long as Elizabeth had the shot records up to date, getting approval from the father must have been a minor technicality. I can't believe the shot record was the only fact Tammi and Jack cared about, this is not a dog for Gods sake !
    You know, if you were trying to hide a baby, you wouldn't want to take it to a doctor to get shots. Plus, THAT costs money

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  11. #331
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    Quote Originally Posted by what about this? View Post
    I kind of believe that EJ is working with LE, and that's where the Nashville connection is coming in. --

    Okay - Logical Minds - I know you are going to hate me for this, but I believe EJ was brainwashed and coerced by TPS --

    Really, there is such a thing as postpartum depression -- really, there is --

    And everything in her background -- uhhhh, how many of us have been a foster child??? and even if we were, everyone has a different experience, but really, that is not what we have experienced, have we? And if so -- people with experience being a foster care child - what was it like?

    The thing is - I believe, after hearing that Logan and Elizabeth lived together for 2 years -- that her behavior changed totally after she had the baby -- that postpartum depression and the foster care/parents problem had a great deal to do with it.

    Who are we to say how she felt? Who are we to know what led up to this -- influences, etc.

    I hope and pray that the right attorney (not money-hungry pro bono atty) gets involved and finds this baby.

    I really do not ever want to judge someone on a path that I have never walked on (so to speak).

    As a matter of fact -- I love you, Elizabeth -- it's been really rough -- where is your beautiful baby boy? And you will get help -- just tell us what happened.

    Thanks,

    your friend,

    Marianne
    IF she had any love for Gabriel, she would've stayed on her meds for postpartum. (This is all my opinion) Being that she went through foster care herself, she should have wanted a better life for Gabriel. She didn't. All this blabbering about this is her way of giving Gabriel a better life is complete BS in my mind. She is selfish, doesn't care about anyone but herself. Her own grandfather said she is not the type to be a mother.

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  13. #332
    danni is offline You are reinforcing my inherent mistrust of strangers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by A_Closer_Look View Post
    Well, Nashville is making a lot more sense now!

    We knew TPS's business existed in Nashville originally, but to hear that there was a sighting of Gabe there, and to hear both of the Smith's admit to having friends and family there, etc...

    It's all starting to make sense to me now.

    If someone left Nashville, heading to San Antonio... at the same time someone left Tempe heading to San Antonio... I wonder how close to San Antonio they would intersect... just pondering
    Nashville to San Antonio = 940 miles
    Tempe to San Antonio = 980 miles

    All milage is a rounded rough estimate.

    So being that there is about a 20 mile difference they would actually get there about the same time as long as road conditions were faverable for both.
    And BTW if my mouse RATTED me out, I would squeeze cheese whiz out of his behind until he turned smurf blue. --Csquare

    Smith said, "Because it's not a truth detector, it's a lie detector. I did not lie, and so that's why it came back inconclusive."

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  15. #333
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ladybass0711 View Post
    Caller is asking tammie why she was trying to shut Jack up...
    Ha! Which one of us called in?

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  17. #334
    Quote Originally Posted by Dear Prudence View Post
    BBM

    Noooooo! Not mathmatical word problems. I was terrible at those. But, it's a good thought so I'll just ponder with you until someone really smart replies.
    Seems to me, according to map-quest, they'd both arrive in San Antonio within about 30 minutes of each other, weather permitting
    (EDIT - Thank you danni for the actual mileage and time, i had exited Mapquest already and was trying to remember)

    I think this whole thing was set up by the Smith's. I think they know who has the baby, and that it's a family member or friend in Nashville or near there. I think that EJ might not actually have any idea who has the baby, aside from the hand off to an unknown (to her) person. It makes perfect sense to set up someone from Nashville to meet someone from Tempe... in San Antonio.

    I also agree with an above poster that EJ might very well be singing like crazy, and it would make perfect sense for LE to claim that she isn't saying anything.
    Last edited by A_Closer_Look; 01-08-2010 at 10:25 PM.

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  19. #335
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    Quote Originally Posted by pghbrandi View Post
    IF she had any love for Gabriel, she would've stayed on her meds for postpartum. (This is all my opinion) Being that she went through foster care herself, she should have wanted a better life for Gabriel. She didn't. All this blabbering about this is her way of giving Gabriel a better life is complete BS in my mind. She is selfish, doesn't care about anyone but herself. Her own grandfather said she is not the type to be a mother.

    Kinda makes you think that she is trying to recreate her own life for him....being "abandoned" with no connection to her own parents. This is all this poor thing knows and this is why she seems so willing to give him a better life...even if it is with strangers. The Smith's have found a prime victim for their own agenda and she fell prey to them. The brainwashing was not too long so hope that she finds something inside of herself to save her connection with her own child and tell the LE where he is.
    As always, this is my humble opinion.

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  21. #336
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuziQ View Post
    Ha! Which one of us called in?
    That's what I though too! Also on a few of the questions asked tonight seemed like it was one of us. I loved it!!

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  23. #337
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    Quote Originally Posted by A_Closer_Look View Post
    Seems to me, according to map-quest, they'd both arrive in San Antonio within about 30 minutes of each other, weather permitting
    (EDIT - Thank you danni for the actual mileage and time, i had exited Mapquest already and was trying to remember)

    I think this whole thing was set up by the Smith's. I think they know who has the baby, and that it's a family member or friend in Nashville or near there. I think that EJ might not actually have any idea who has the baby, aside from the hand off to an unknown (to her) person. It makes perfect sense to set up someone from Nashville to meet someone from Tempe... in San Antonio.

    I also agree with an above poster that EJ might very well be singing like crazy, and it would make perfect sense for LE to claim that she isn't saying anything.


    BBM, that was what I was thinking the minute they gave the name of the park she made the hand off of the baby. They are so deep in it.
    As always, this is my humble opinion.

    Conquer the angry man by love.
    Conquer the ill-natured man by goodness.
    Conquer the miser with generosity.
    Conquer the liar with truth.

    The Dhammapada

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  25. #338
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    http://www.abc15.com/content/news/so...ZWBC0ifjg.cspx

    Not sure if this has been posted or not. The video has EJ's neighbors talking about her violent behavior.
    Last edited by Dear Prudence; 01-08-2010 at 10:29 PM. Reason: clarity

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  27. #339
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    Has there been any sighting of EJ in Victoria, TX?

    I think there is a very real possibility that Gabe may no longer be alive.

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  29. #340
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    Quote Originally Posted by pghbrandi View Post
    IF she had any love for Gabriel, she would've stayed on her meds for postpartum. (This is all my opinion) Being that she went through foster care herself, she should have wanted a better life for Gabriel. She didn't. All this blabbering about this is her way of giving Gabriel a better life is complete BS in my mind. She is selfish, doesn't care about anyone but herself. Her own grandfather said she is not the type to be a mother.
    I feel like the truth is somewhere in the middle. Elizabeth probably didn't want the baby and so on, she should have made different choices. However, in cases like hers, I think it is like walking on a fence. Given her background and being on meds and her temper/character/whatever, then getting pregnant she could tip either way given her support system. I get the feeling Logan tried to support her but there were a lot of other influences around. Trying to be supportive as one person is different than if you have a much greater support system, resources, family and lack of nonsupportive friends. Logan was probably stretched thin himself dealing with her and trying to support the three of them.

    I'm really curious about how much influence and of what kind the Smith's had on her. Were they constantly working on her? Did they put her in contact with others? Encouraging her to think certain ways. Feeding her disdain for the baby's father? Encouraging lies? Offering freedom, money, and a way out? Maybe Elizabeth knew she wasn't good for Gabriel (doesn't excuse not giving him to Logan and walking away or taking out her cruelty on him), and the Smith's worked on her to think she WAS being a good person by doing this AND it was a way to hurt Logan. You feed enough stuff to and manipulate a person that's vulnerable and your likely to get a different outcome. I think they know this.

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  31. #341
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marigold View Post
    What I don't understand....

    If EJ met someone who was going to take Gabriel to Mexico, why did she have to drive all the way to TX for the exchange? She drove about a thousand miles to Texas, yet Nogales/the Mexican border is less than 200 miles from Tempe AZ.
    I think because unless you had connections er, people to pay off at the border it wouldn't work. I'm going to bet that the Smiths have people in their pocket in Texas, but they don't in Nogales.

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  33. #342
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    Quote Originally Posted by iluvmua View Post
    Has there been any sighting of EJ in Victoria, TX?

    I think there is a very real possibility that Gabe may no longer be alive.
    Ya, she got on the bus in San Antonio by herself. Walked straight to the bus. He was passed off or dead before then. Poor poor baby.

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  35. #343
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    I do feel like TPS and husband took advantage of a bad situation here and they get no excuses from me. IF Elizabeth did this out of revenge (Logan) she gets no sympathy from me either. Elizabeth's phone call to Logan, telling him Gabriel was dead, indicates she was out to hurt him. I don't know EJ's whole story, but I do know that once we become adults we are responsible for our actions, we are also responsible for those we bring into the world. My mother was not made to parent, luckily I had good Grandparents. I am thankful now that my mother was not able to stick it out, it would have been worse.

    I hope Gabriel can be returned to the father that loves him soon. Hopefully he grows up to know nothing about this.

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  37. #344
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuziQ View Post
    I think because unless you had connections er, people to pay off at the border it wouldn't work. I'm going to bet that the Smiths have people in their pocket in Texas, but they don't in Nogales.
    It's been eons since I've been south of the border, but I didn't think people were screened that closely when going into Mexico? I thought they basically checked everyone's i.d. and whether or not the vehicle has insurance?

    I could be wrong. I know there were some laws changed recently for visitors to Mexico but I admit that I didn't pay much attention when it was on the news.

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  39. #345
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marigold View Post
    It's been eons since I've been south of the border, but I didn't think people were screened that closely when going into Mexico? I thought they basically checked everyone's i.d. and whether or not the vehicle has insurance?

    I could be wrong. I know there were some laws changed recently for visitors to Mexico but I admit that I didn't pay much attention when it was on the news.
    I'm pretty sure that you need a passport to get into Mexico now.

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  41. #346
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    And the plot thickens...

    http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/149285

    The Tempe mother of a missing 8-month-old boy who told her boyfriend she killed their son could be facing charges of providing false information to law enforcement after accusing the father of taking the child during an unrelated incident last month.

    Elizabeth Johnson, 23, had left her son, Gabriel Johnson, with Tammi and Jack Smith of Scottsdale for at least six hours on Dec. 9, but she accused Logan Scott McQueary, 25, of taking him, according to a Tempe police report.


    Johnson had placed an ad on craigslist seeking a nanny to take the baby, according to the police report taken when she left the baby with the Smiths. Charges are pending from Tempe city prosecutors, according to the report.

    Haven't watched NG yet but I can hardly wait!

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  43. #347
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    Quote Originally Posted by pghbrandi View Post
    I'm pretty sure that you need a passport to get into Mexico now.
    I think I remember hearing that, thanks for the info.

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  45. #348
    danni is offline You are reinforcing my inherent mistrust of strangers.
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuziQ View Post
    I think because unless you had connections er, people to pay off at the border it wouldn't work. I'm going to bet that the Smiths have people in their pocket in Texas, but they don't in Nogales.
    The whole going to Mexico nia Victoria just doesn't make sense to me.

    Looking at a map if you were going from San Antonio to Mexico why would you drive to Victoria? There is no reason, Victoria has no MAJOR highways leading in or out, yet there is a striaght shot from San Antonio to Mexico via 35.
    And BTW if my mouse RATTED me out, I would squeeze cheese whiz out of his behind until he turned smurf blue. --Csquare

    Smith said, "Because it's not a truth detector, it's a lie detector. I did not lie, and so that's why it came back inconclusive."

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  47. #349
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marigold View Post
    It's been eons since I've been south of the border, but I didn't think people were screened that closely when going into Mexico? I thought they basically checked everyone's i.d. and whether or not the vehicle has insurance?

    I could be wrong. I know there were some laws changed recently for visitors to Mexico but I admit that I didn't pay much attention when it was on the news.
    I don't know about the law now either.

    O/T:

    But, I can tell you this...it has gotten so dangerous to cross into mexico now due to corrupt cops.
    My boss was in California a couple years ago and he and his wife crossed in their rental car. They were pulled to the side and the "cop" told him the he was missing a sticker on the car that he had to have to cross. The "cop" searched the car. He even made him get out of the car and practically threw him against it to search him. He searched his wallet.
    He had exactly $500 in cash.
    He then told him he had to pay a fine right then. When my boss asked him how much the fine would be, the "cop" told him $500.00. It was either that or appear in court.
    Now, you tell me, what kinda carp is that?
    That "cop" knew an American would just let him have that $500 so he did not have to appear in a Mexican courtroom.

    From what I hear from several people, one from Mexico, it's getting really bad.
    Last edited by Kimberlyd125; 01-08-2010 at 11:00 PM.
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  49. #350
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    Some Nashville information...

    The day after Johnson was arrested in Florida, FBI agents in Nashville were called.

    “We were called by FBI agents in Miami and asked to check out an address here in Nashville," said Keith Moses, assistant special agent in charge. "We went and knocked on the door, interviewed occupants and, at this point, were unable to locate the child.”


    http://www.wsmv.com/news/22189120/detail.html

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