Connecticut school district on lockdown after shooting report at a Newtown elemen #5

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Who knows (re: HDs) .. they are saying that they are not very hopeful to get info from HDs ... but some dude on Nancy Grace (last night) said / thinks that HDs are OK .. and LE should be able to get info from them...

Time will show, i guess ... And yes .. I know, I know we are talking here about Nancy Grace and her show :D
 
tiredblondy said:
I don't understand why that guy ran away? I cannot understand it no matter how hard I try. It's time for me to go to bed.
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Same reason some of the staff hid in a closet, and some lunged at the gunman.

We instinctually have flight or fight mode, we don't always get to logically decide which we will use and when. We are trying to apply a thought process to an instinct.
 
~n/t~ said:
Heck some people think Coyote and Road Runner are violent. What about Taz the tasmanian devil? Destruction in its path. The cookie monster and Oscar the grouch.

All I'm saying is these are ridiculous excuses to cover up the REAL issue. Just like video games, movies and music. They don't make one kill.
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Video games are used to teach, aren't they? If you want to learn a language, you sit in front of a computer and immerse yourself. They also desensitize. See something enough and there becomes an absence of horror. Ask people who served in hot combat situations. You can become numb. If night after niight, one is participating in the violent destruction of the "enemy"....you are "learning" too.

Todays TV shows have tried to ameliorate our old biases by shoeing us all kinds of families in a positive light. They have been useful in removing old prejudices, haven't they, by exposing our children each day to positive reinforcement of the values of diversity. They are TEACHING.

But the culturally obnoxious shows, the "violence-makes-me -big shot" shows...THEY teach too. It is disengenous to embrace Movies, TV, video games in the good that they do in changing society's values...and then ignore the dark side. EVERYTHING needs to on the table here.

Of course, it is about the individual. One side says millions own guns and don't shoot up the neighborhood school; the other side says millions watch violent shows, movies and play violent games. Politicans protect the guys that give them money. "Look at THEIR friends, not mine!"

Of we are sincere, we look at it ALL in depth and look within ourselves too.
 
Dr.Fessel said:
BBM

I am really glad you asked the question why the big spurt in the last 10 years. Something about that just got me thinking.

We have always had troubled kids in school. We have always had mentally ill kids in school and we have always had guns around.

What has changed? I think you have to go back 20 to 25 years and look at what has really changed in the life of a student. That puts you back to when the Columbine shooters first started school.

Schools are a very big part of the molding and shaping of a student and in any serious discussion of this problem they have to be looked at too. What has changed in teaching and learning in the last 20 to 25 years.

I know 20 years or so ago I pulled my youngest daughter out of school because they went to a method of teaching that involved teams. All school work was being done in teams and rewards handed out for the best teams and best team players. My daughter is very smart and she was always the team leader and her team was always winning the special gifts and prizes.

Well what we ended up with was an 9 year old coming home in tears, she had trouble sleeping and started getting "sick" not wanting to go to school. The stress was to much. The strain of the team, the focus on the wins and the anger towards other team members and guilt for that anger was to much for her. We pulled her out of school and home schooled her till high school.

Now this is the effect this team teaching had on a very good student. What is the effect it has on the poor student or the troubled student or the ones with a mental illness?

How wide spread is this teaching method? Maybe it would be worth going back in these shooters school records and see how they were taught.
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Yes, daughter's high school did this as well, 6 or 8 to a team, she was in the (AP) classes, Advanced Placement. This was 10 years ago. The way she told the story was that she felt that the teacher would divide up the "teams" to insure that the not so smart ones were not on the same team. Bottom line is every body got the same grade, she did the work on her team.
 
~n/t~ said:
Exactly. The underlying problem is not toys, video games, music .......

Another problem I see is the immediate dispencing of medication without proper diagnosis. A child acts up in class and they're immediately labeled ADD or ADHA and pumped with ritalin. Yes perhaps some kids do need it but how many are misdiagnosed and this was a quick fix ?

Like I said, I don't have the answers but clearly there is something horribly wrong when a presumably smart kid with some awkwardness (as is being described) decides to get up one morning and kill his mom in cold blood while she's in bed and then decides to assasinate a classroom full of children and teachers.
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There is NO one single thing at play here. When people want to blame it on ONE thing they're refusing to look at the bigger picture.

We are dealing with it personally. My oldest daughter has Asperger's. They wanted us to medicate her for ADD and we flat out REFUSED. We used flash cards and stuff to keep her focus at school. (She was a visual learner... and if she had flash cards with pictures for things, it helped keep her focus to do that certain task) We did this for kindergarten and first grade. She is top of her class in second grade and no longer struggles with classwork and keeping attention. It just took a lot more effort than making her swallow a pill.

Many school districts don't want to take the effort, and I can understand to a point. Their classrooms are overcrowded, and the teachers are overwhelmed.

My younger daughter (first grade) does better with one-on-one interaction. We are fighting the school district AGAIN about medicating her. I don't think it's an issue that medication would even fix. We are taking her to a tutor and a therapist because she does awesome in those environments. Large classrooms, she just shuts down, gets beligerent, and doesn't want to do the work. It's overwhelming to her. My sister was the same exact way in elementary school.
 
Ronso said:
"LOL..thanks for proving my point..a Spanking is not Assault"

Um, how is it not? You're hitting a child. If you hit an adult, it's assault. Why is it not okay for me to punch someone in the face for being a raving jerk, .
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Are you seriously comparing a swat on the butt with your hand to punching a grown adult in the face?
 
~n/t~ said:
Exactly. The underlying problem is not toys, video games, music .......

Another problem I see is the immediate dispencing of medication without proper diagnosis. A child acts up in class and they're immediately labeled ADD or ADHA and pumped with ritalin. Yes perhaps some kids do need it but how many are misdiagnosed and this was a quick fix ?

Like I said, I don't have the answers but clearly there is something horribly wrong when a presumably smart kid with some awkwardness (as is being described) decides to get up one morning and kill his mom in cold blood while she's in bed and then decides to assasinate a classroom full of children and teachers.
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As Ronald Reagan said we must not blame society but hold the individual lawbreaker accountable for his actions.

I think AL had no attachment to what he did. He was methodical and not workng off of emotions, imo. He knew his mother would never ever let him leave that home with her weapons. The only way to take them was to kill her first and that would also let him take her car. She was nothing more to him than collateral damage on his insane mission.

I dont know why he did this but he and he alone is responsible for his own actions. I dont even know if it will turnout that he is mentally ill. You dont have to be criminally insane to carry out such heinous plans.

IMO
 
O/T - but not

I am just in awe of the comfort dogs that have shown up to help the people of Newtown. How wonderful, how loving, how comforting................

Why is it that the horrible, the heinous, the unthinkable is ALWAYS guaranteed to make the news, be the talk around the water cooler but yet the wonderful, the loving, the kindness isn't?




JMHO
 
oceanblueeyes said:
As Ronald Reagan said we must not blame society but hold the individual lawbreaker accountable for his actions.

I think AL had no attachment to what he did. He was methodical and not workng off of emotions, imo. He knew his mother would never ever let him leave that home with her weapons. The only way to take them was to kill her first and that would also let him take her car. She was nothing more to him than collateral damage on his insane mission.

I dont know why he did this but he and he alone is responsible for his own actions. I dont even know if it will turnout that he is mentally ill. You dont have to be criminally insane to carry out such heinous plans.

IMO
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Holding a dead killer responsible for his actions is fine, but suggesting this problem as a whole died with the killer is unwise.

Quoting Reagan as if he were some great king-philosopher is funny, though not necessarily ha-ha funny.
 
TDEAN30 said:
Are you seriously comparing a swat on the butt with your hand to punching a grown adult in the face?
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Would you rather me compare it to swatting an adult on the rear end, which is just weird and STILL ASSAULT?
 
I understand why people are saying, "it's not violent games because I played them and I didn't kill anyone", "it's not autism because most autists don't kill anyone", "it's not spanking because most spanked children are all right", "It's not medications because they save a lot of lives", "it's not bullying because most bullied children don't shoot their peers".

JMO, I think if we were all knowing and all powerful we might very well find that violent games and spanking and any the other things that have been mentioned as possible causes and triggers but denied because they're not universal triggers could very well be triggering factors, for someone, somewhere. But we'd also find that the same triggers never function as triggers for everyone, because you need a combination of factors. There needs to be a special susceptibility and probably usually more than one trigger acting in such ways as they reinforce each other, and not enough protective conditions.

I don't think we're ever going to find an universal trigger that works to produce mass murder tendencies in every affected individual and thank God for that.
 
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/18/opinion/dont-blame-autism-for-newtown.html?_r=0

"Let me clear up a few misconceptions. For one thing, Asperger’s and autism are not forms of mental illness; they are neurodevelopmental disorders or disabilities. Autism is a lifelong condition that manifests before the age of 3; most mental illnesses do not appear until the teen or young adult years."

BBM. Glad to finally see an article like this. Autism is NOT a mental illness and the media spreading around it's uneducated garbage on the issue just goes to show how we really should not rely on the media for factual/good information in a lot of these cases.
 
TDEAN30 said:
Are you seriously comparing a swat on the butt with your hand to punching a grown adult in the face?
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Seriously.

We raised five children. We didnt have to spank them much at all thank goodness they were really good children and still are but they knew we would if it was necessary. They are all grown now and tell us they know they deserved way more spankings than we ever gave them.:floorlaugh:

Not one of them has ever been in trouble with the law. They were taught to respect others from the very beginning. They were taught they had limitations on just what was acceptable and what wasnt.
 
nyc said:
The more I read about Adam Lanza, the more I wonder if nutritional issues might not have played a big role in his problems. One of the articles I read mentioned that his mom made him vegan meals. While I don't know Adam's mental health history, he looks like someone with some severe nutritional deficiencies--which can often greatly exacerbate and even cause psychiatric problems. The brain needs healthy fats and proteins to grow and remain balanced, which is much harder to do on a vegan diet--especially for a growing child.
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Trimmed for space...I know I am several pages behind, but these are the same thoughts I had when I read the vegan thing. The Gut and Psychology Syndrome (commonly called GAPS) book makes a strong point that veganism in adolescence can be quite detrimental to psychological health, and can in fact increase risk of suicide. Completely tangentially, we as a society are vastly uneducated about nutritional health. Our nerves are coated with myelin which requires animal fats to remain healthy, but we are told to minimize animal fats, eat lean meats if any at all, substitute margarine or vegetable oils for butter. And we have rampant neurological disease (alzheimer's, parkinson's, etc.), suicide, and autism. This boy should never have been allowed to eat vegan.
 
dizzychick said:
I expected he would crawl out of the woodowork...eeekkkk
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Yea, but he is actually helping these families deal with there fears. The conversation between him and the parents is pretty good. One little boy is just sleeping in his moms arms. They are afraid to send there kids back to school and their children are afraid to go back also.
but I know what you mean about Dr Phil.
 
justanother said:
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/18/opinion/dont-blame-autism-for-newtown.html?_r=0

"Let me clear up a few misconceptions. For one thing, Asperger’s and autism are not forms of mental illness; they are neurodevelopmental disorders or disabilities. Autism is a lifelong condition that manifests before the age of 3; most mental illnesses do not appear until the teen or young adult years."

BBM. Glad to finally see an article like this. Autism is NOT a mental illness and the media spreading around it's uneducated garbage on the issue just goes to show how we really should not rely on the media for factual/good information in a lot of these cases.
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Thank you. Aspergers had absolutely nothing to do with why Adam did this. In fact those with Aspergers are sticklers for abiding by the law.

IMO
 
Wise Old Owl said:
O/T - but not

I am just in awe of the comfort dogs that have shown up to help the people of Newtown. How wonderful, how loving, how comforting................

Why is it that the horrible, the heinous, the unthinkable is ALWAYS guaranteed to make the news, be the talk around the water cooler but yet the wonderful, the loving, the kindness isn't?


JMHO
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I saw that on my Fb page, and then on the news..One of my favorite stories, pets can heal better than a human can
 
oceanblueeyes said:
Seriously.

We raised five children. We didnt have to spank them much at all thank goodness they were really good children and still are but they knew we would if it was necessary. They are all grown now and tell us they know they deserved way more spankings than we ever gave them.:floorlaugh:

Not one of them has ever been in trouble with the law. They were taught to respect others from the very beginning. They were taught they had limitations on just what was acceptable and what wasnt.
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It's sad that's a mindset being instilled in our children. "I was bad, so I deserved to be hit."

No wonder so many women stay with abusive husbands/spouses.
 
Is there a phone number or contact to report people who are impersonating family members of the suspects and victims' family members i.e. trolls? I want to haul one in.
 
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