GUILTY OH - Two women & child killed, 13yo abducted, Apple Valley, 10 Nov 2010 #7

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SmoothOperator said:
Tikki said:
I, too have been searching for the past hour for photos of the tree that I know that I saw last night..and cannot find them ANYWHERE!!!!!!!!!

I know I did not dream up these pix...or did I?

It was a pic looking strait on at the tree{not an aerial pic..one taken on the ground standing directly in front of the tree}..Fairly close, as its mainly the trunk of the tree that is visible in this pic.. and there were 3-4 large and filled black garbage bags that seemed to be tied off shut at the top that were in front of the tree and visible in this same pic...

Does anyone else remember seeing this pic?
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Sorry to quote and repost my own post but am going bonkers searching and searching for this pic. (which I described above)

I have even pulled up my "History" from the past 24 hrs and literally at this point have gone to everysingle page in my computer history of past 24 hrs.

And still CANNOT FIND THIS DANG PICTURE.

so have come to the conclusion that it HAS GOT TO BE ONE OF THE FOLLOWING TWO:

1) for whatever reason(and I can't think of any particular reason off the top of my head) the picture that I saw has been removed and/or deleted??

OR

2) at this point am considering that I guess it could be possible I dreamed this. But could swear that I DID NOT.

It is a specific picture that I cannot locate that is an upclose view(either literally taken at close range or zoom lens) with great clarity and detail. Mainly the trunk of tree visible and there were definitely 3 or 4(not positive if it was 3 or was it 4. But do know it was NO LESS THAN 3 and it was NO MORE THAN 4)..black extra large sized garbage bags(the very thick and durable type) appeared to be almost filled and each looked as if the bag itself was tied in knot on top of each bag. And all 3-4 of these bags were clearly visible and located directly in front of the large tree(with trunk being what is mainly visible in pic).

Again I apologize if this is coming across as bothersome or unimportant. But have scoured my computer and news media sites on the Internet and cannot find this pic.

If anyone else saw this pic or knows anything about what I am describing that I saw last night I would be forever grateful if you'd share with me where you saw It(and I'll shut up. ..lol)

TIA to anyone who takes time to answer and/or has knowledge of what I am inquiring about.

Thanks
~Smooth



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Smooth - if it was a picture of garbage bags, then it's very possible that it was removed by the news site b/c it's plausible those garbage bags had bodied in them IMO

don't let it drive you too crazy :D
 
FWIW-

http://www.gardenguides.com/90742-beech-tree-identification.html


"The typical beech tree grows to heights between 60 and 80 feet. Trunk diameters can range from a foot to 2.5 feet."


"A young beech looks nothing like the older version, as there are few branches on the tree until its trunk reaches around four inches wide. Beech trees are prone to developing a hollow trunk, meaning you may find them on your property with creatures such as raccoons or flying squirrels living inside them. The hollow trunk makes them susceptible to storm damage, with large branches coming down in high winds."



Read more: Beech Tree Identification | Garden Guides http://www.gardenguides.com/90742-beech-tree-identification.html#ixzz15lzE7oTv
 
Smooth,

Did you see this slideshow? Maybe it was from the video (which is also on the site) and they chose not to put it in the slideshow for the reason already mentioned by someone else.
 
Betty P said:
I found this web site, selling supplies for tree trimmers and recreational climbers. It helps understand what tools he may have had in his kit.

Also, it appears there are some who climb trees for recreation and actually hang out or even camp in the branches with special equipment. Never knew this, but it may explain some of his habits.

http://www.sherrilltree.com/Recreational-Gear/Posters/Poster-Porta-Ledging-1034
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My limited knowledge on this subject comes from my very outdoorsy ex-husband. It's actually a safer place to camp, especially with dangerous animals in the area. He never had the gear to do that, but always wanted some. We don't have many dangerous animals in Ohio (maybe a bear here and there), but he is an avid hunter, and has considered that type of gear for when he went hunting out west.

ETA......I seem to remember him also mentioning hollowed out trees as a good place to store camping supplies and food (bears are bad about getting into food). I do know he would hoist his food up with a rope to hang from a tree, he did that a lot when we would go camping to keep it out of reach of wandering dogs, etc.
 
mikeysmommom said:
I had read on topix that Sara heard the tub running and a saw.There also was a poster who said to look in trees, that he hiked up a tree and put the bodies there.This was all before they were found.
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OMG!!! Vile, evil, non-human creature!!! Like someone else said.. house of horrors. Thank God they caught him.. we'd have another Dahmer on our hands...:furious::furious::furious:

He'd better get DP or I may have to move to Europe or something, I'd be so mad at our sappy country's laws.:banghead:
 
SmoothOperator said:
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Smooth Operator -- I understand what you are saying. But I would think that some of the clothing would remain intact if you dismembered a body -- at least part of a shirt and jeans. I just don't know how he would be able to carry the dead weight of a body. JMHO
 
Mish said:
GXM:

I didn't take offense to anything you had written; unfortunately when we are typing our thoughts, our feelings can come across wrong to others, as I fear mine did to you. ((hugs)) I would guess that 99.9% of us here on WS would never intentionally offend one another. When I read "Souls" post, the last question made me smile (in a good way), because here at WS part of what we do is brainstorming ideas in our efforts to gain a better understanding in these horrific cases we sleuth.

I apologize that my post came across with a different "feel" than what I wished to convey. ALL our thoughts and opinions matter, because we all care about the victims, survivors and justice. When I wrote, "with all due respect", I wrote that with gentleness, not sarcasm. Never would I wish for my words to come across in that manner.

-Mish:crazy:
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I hope my post didn't offend anyone either. It if did, it wasn't my intention at all. Sometimes when we write things, they don't come across the same as spoken words. WS is a great place for people to brainstorm and use the ideas and thoughts of others in these terrible cases. I admire people who are able to come with some truly amazing theories as I am the kind of person who can't really think outside the box. I am not a very imaginative, creative person by nature. All of us get emotional in these cases because we are all human beings who care about others.
 
SmoothOperator said:
SmoothOperator said:
Sorry to quote and repost my own post but am going bonkers searching and searching for this pic. (which I described above)

I have even pulled up my "History" from the past 24 hrs and literally at this point have gone to everysingle page in my computer history of past 24 hrs.

And still CANNOT FIND THIS DANG PICTURE.

so have come to the conclusion that it HAS GOT TO BE ONE OF THE FOLLOWING TWO:

1) for whatever reason(and I can't think of any particular reason off the top of my head) the picture that I saw has been removed and/or deleted??

OR

2) at this point am considering that I guess it could be possible I dreamed this. But could swear that I DID NOT.

It is a specific picture that I cannot locate that is an upclose view(either literally taken at close range or zoom lens) with great clarity and detail. Mainly the trunk of tree visible and there were definitely 3 or 4(not positive if it was 3 or was it 4. But do know it was NO LESS THAN 3 and it was NO MORE THAN 4)..black extra large sized garbage bags(the very thick and durable type) appeared to be almost filled and each looked as if the bag itself was tied in knot on top of each bag. And all 3-4 of these bags were clearly visible and located directly in front of the large tree(with trunk being what is mainly visible in pic).

Again I apologize if this is coming across as bothersome or unimportant. But have scoured my computer and news media sites on the Internet and cannot find this pic.

If anyone else saw this pic or knows anything about what I am describing that I saw last night I would be forever grateful if you'd share with me where you saw It(and I'll shut up. ..lol)

TIA to anyone who takes time to answer and/or has knowledge of what I am inquiring about.

Thanks
~Smooth



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Was it this one on Nancy Grace last night?
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Tikki said:
Also I don't think he could carry all of them intact, SS weighed I think 130 lbs? I think this is why he needed the bags, to make several trips? jmo

And this may sound strange, but when I saw this I wondered if he had heard about Zahra and this gave him ideas? But seems like it was planned before that came out, sick minds maybe think alike? jmo
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I had thought that too.. that Zahra's case gave him ideas..only I suspected MH used a wood chipper. God this is awful.
 
Snapdragon -
That's what gets to me even more than the tree, if that's not horriffic enough, is the tub filling draining and refilling, and hearing the saw.

I do not even have words to express how terrible I feel for this poor child. It makes me sick to my stomach, it hurts to type it.
 
I read through (most) of the posts and was wondering if the police hace released any new statements regarding how they knew where to search for the victims. Last I heard they would not say that MH confessed to the crimes. Also, I've still only seen that he has only been charged with kidnapping. I'm wondering if he hasn't said anything at all and sadly Sarah was the one that told them where to find her family.
 
I took a break today and went fishing......it was nice to get my mind cleared after following the horrifying events in Knox County. I'm way behind seeing the pictures/video, and commenting, about the tree where the victims were found but I have to say....I was really shocked to see how high up that tree that hollow area was :eek:. I would think it's fairly safe to say MH had been in that area before. I'm amazed he knew the tree was hollow so far down and deep enough to fill it with 3 humans and a dog :eek:. If he hadn't directed LE to the area....I have a feeling it would have been a LONG while before they were found......IF ever.
 
lishac23 said:
I read through (most) of the posts and was wondering if the police hace released any new statements regarding how they knew where to search for the victims. Last I heard they would not say that MH confessed to the crimes. Also, I've still only seen that he has only been charged with kidnapping. I'm wondering if he hasn't said anything at all and sadly Sarah was the one that told them where to find her family.
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The sheriff said the information about where to find the victims came from MH through his attorney.
Barber said all three were killed in Herrmann's home in Howard, though he did not say how. Hoffman gave investigators information through his attorney that led them to the bodies, which were removed after part of the tree was cut away, Barber said.
http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/slain-womans-manager-i-747244.html
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darlin gal said:
pictures of the tree and the clearing
ABC6 - ODNR cut down the tree today because it is considered unstable and dangerous.
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With the tree down, small seedlings/underbrush can get more light now and grow. I like the thought of that... new life there.
fl19.gif
 
JenRen said:
My limited knowledge on this subject comes from my very outdoorsy ex-husband. It's actually a safer place to camp, especially with dangerous animals in the area. He never had the gear to do that, but always wanted some. We don't have many dangerous animals in Ohio (maybe a bear here and there), but he is an avid hunter, and has considered that type of gear for when he went hunting out west.

ETA......I seem to remember him also mentioning hollowed out trees as a good place to store camping supplies and food (bears are bad about getting into food). I do know he would hoist his food up with a rope to hang from a tree, he did that a lot when we would go camping to keep it out of reach of wandering dogs, etc.
Click to expand...

A somewhat related comment...
I needed a very tall spruce tree cut down on my property. The man I hired to do it was a electrical line worker for a utility company up here in Canada who has experience climbing very tall poles for transmission lines. He showed up with his harness and climbing gear and climbed up that tree in no time flat. He cut off the branches first, then cut the trunk in 3 feet lengths from the top to the bottom. All in all it took, at most, 10 minutes. It is amazing what someone can do with the right equipment and experience.

I imagine MH was pretty experienced climbing trees and using the equipment. I don't know this particular tree's circumference or the circumference of the hollowed-out part. However, I just can't imagine how he could get the bodies inside the tree without at least partial dismemberment.
 
gxm said:
I meant no offense. It's not hiding the bodies in a hollow tree that I find twisted. It's the pulley system and looking for a tree ahead of time and then devising this elaborate plan to carry out his violent acts. I apologize to any sleuthers who may have taken offense at my comments. But when I first read Catfish Billy's comment it blew my mind especially the "if he were smart he would have…" I now suspect it was someone close to MH. But I felt like screaming at the monitor not smart that's mean crazy psychopath!
Click to expand...

The clarification was much appreciated! :) I found that poster to be rather crude in his typing but he was only trying to think out of the box also. I for have a hard time putting what I mean to say into text on message boards so I know how that can go too. That guy, I took as trying to think out of the box but it just came out all wrong.

I think it is great that some can think out of the box. You never know if one person says something what another might pick up on that would take it in another direction and further investigating.

I always try to remember that everyone bring their own experiences to the table. Mine, well my husband use to be a cop for 29 years, so this is why maybe I think a little more out of the box then others. I'm usually way out there in my "what ifs" but I do it because you never know if something I said helps another to see something that we all missed.

I'm babbling, and so I'll stop and perhaps just start reading for a few days instead of posting.
 
It wouldn't take much equipment to climb a tree (even though he had access to equipment and some reports say he owned some tree-climbing gear). Below is a picture I took when we lived in Egypt of a tree-trimmer. They climb with no gear: barefoot and with a rope wrapped looped around both the tree and themselves for leverage.

There are many ways MH could have gotten up there and then hoisted the bodies... :(


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