2009.21.09 Nancy Grace

[Whisperer]

Yep, Suspicious...I believe you have a winner there.

 

[Whisperer]

This seventeen yr old is not fooling anyone. LE can not and may not question her like an adult...she has them over a barrel due to her age. They cannot force her to come in either. They can invite her but she doesn't have to go (which she didn't for 6 months).

Ron has held up the case since he married her. In marrying her, he kept himself out of prison for a very long time and forfeited the label of "pedophile". I would like to know the laws regarding this statutory rape charge and if it can be reinstated if they were to divorce and she files charges against him....never saw a case like this regarding this type of matter.

I am now hoping NG is catching up on her mail and research on this case.

 

[Whisperer]

RC's image is everything to him. He wants people to believe he is a good and loving father. From the first hours after this crime, that has been his mantra.

He must hold on to JR at any cost, I am afraid.

He is vengeful, IMO, and took those Kids to spite Crystal. I also believe he has not finished with her. There is a lot of unfinished business concerning he and Crystal.

 

[Whisperer]

It has been rumored from day 1 that Misty was not home that night. Why do people think this is new info? Ron knew she wasn't home and outright lied. People refrain from discussing that tidbit and move on to suggest he is helping LE...WTH? I am thinking that most still don't want to convict Misty because if they did, they would have to implicate RC some how....so they defend her and look for anyone else to pin the crime on....anyone but the obvious.

 

[atherella]

I think it is safe to say that is a given; we just won't know the official results from LE.

I don't think it is safe to assume that Tommy has taken a polygraph at all.

Here is a snippet of an article from August 28th when both Tommy & Lindsy were brought in for questioning regarding HaLeigh:

BBM

Hank Croslin tells First Coast News that detectives took his son, Tommy Croslin, to the sheriff's office at about 7 p.m. Friday. Hank Croslin is also Misty's father, but says allegations against his son that he was involved in Haleigh's disappearance are untrue.

Hank Croslin says his son told investigators that he would take a lie detector test to prove his innocence as he was led away.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/topstories/news-article.aspx?storyid=144116&catid=3


Wonder if Timmy is really ready to undergo the same battery of tests that Misty took? Then have the results leaked to the media? Perhaps Tim Miller can arrange it.

 

[blubuni99]

You know Nancy Grace said something at the beginning of this case that regarding Misty that I just can't forget. Nancy said a couple of times that she could not believe a 17 year old girl could outsmart the FBI.... and I ponder that sometimes when I watch Misty in her interviews. She doesn't seem like some mastermind criminal keeping the FBI from solving a case. Unless she is smart like a fox.....

(No disrespect since I know you weren't talking to me, I swear! lol BUT)
I don't think Misty HAS done anything worthy of being called a MASTERMIND. I know you weren't saying she was - I'm agreeing with Nancy to a point. All she has done is tell different versions of what she "thinks" happened and denied anything else. It's not hard to stick to one story (but she hasn't even done that, seeing as how she keeps changing her story) and it's definitely not hard to just sit there and be quiet. Which is all she has to do. She hasn't passed a poly or done anything really 'smart'. She's just changed her story and denied anything else.

 

[blubuni99]

Anyone notice how TN speaks with such authority on things she was told. She just told NG all about RC and MC having a conversation all night long and how Misty was exhausted from being up all night. Funny, how she knows all the intimate little details, isn't it? She seems to insert herself everywhere she can.

It is clear that TN has an agenda and that is to keep RC out of jail as long as possible. Mark Nejame saw it and so did Tim Miller, as did the prior attorneys, Snider and his law firm. Most professional people are distancing themselves from this family, i.e., Ron, Misty, AS and TN.....and that is wise....IMO

My Bold -
I said this downstairs too - if Misty was so exhausted from being up all night, wouldn't Ron be exhausted too? But he had enough energy to work an extra couple of hours and then stop on the way home for some extra things? That's weird to be - that they were both up all night but Misty was SO exhausted that she couldn't hear the door 20 feet away but Ron was able to stay up until 3 at work? Even volunteered to stay a few extra hours?
Then someone said something about Misty saying she took a nap after Haleigh went to school.

Nothing makes sense.

 

[PorcineGranny]

Ron's involvement has to be through drugs. Its his weakness. His contacts in that world have led to Haleigh's demise. That has to be why his family has circled him and Misty. Misty obviously knows something important. LE will need proof to break this down. I don't envy their job. JMO

 

[SeriouslySearching]

You know Nancy Grace said something at the beginning of this case that regarding Misty that I just can't forget. Nancy said a couple of times that she could not believe a 17 year old girl could outsmart the FBI.... and I ponder that sometimes when I watch Misty in her interviews. She doesn't seem like some mastermind criminal keeping the FBI from solving a case. Unless she is smart like a fox.....

A 17 yo mastermind criminal with barely a 7th grade education? Highly unlikely. Remember...she did not obtain counsel until after she spent well over 30 hours and at least 2 LDTs with LE, FDLE, and the FBI. Their best and brightest interviewed this girl and got nowhere with her. How is that even possible?

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I think it is safe to say that is a given; we just won't know the official results from LE.

No...it is not a given at all. We do NOT know he has taken one and as of the first time he was taken in and questioned which was fairly recent...he had not taken one according to Hank Sr.

 

[WillenFan21]

My Bold -
I said this downstairs too - if Misty was so exhausted from being up all night, wouldn't Ron be exhausted too? But he had enough energy to work an extra couple of hours and then stop on the way home for some extra things? That's weird to be - that they were both up all night but Misty was SO exhausted that she couldn't hear the door 20 feet away but Ron was able to stay up until 3 at work? Even volunteered to stay a few extra hours?
Then someone said something about Misty saying she took a nap after Haleigh went to school.

Nothing makes sense.

Does Ron work that shift every night or was it just that night? If he works it every night then people do get into a routine of staying up late & being able to do that job.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Strange....how short this thread is considering all that we learned tonight.....hmmm.

I don't know what you are talking about because I didn't learn anything new tonight except that Tommy placed himself at the crime scene which is pretty darned incriminating in my opinion!

 

[blubuni99]

Does Ron work that shift every night or was it just that night? If he works it every night then people do get into a routine of staying up late & being able to do that job.

Even if he was used to it, he would still be sleepy from being awake 24 straight hours. Unless he didn't work the day before, then IDK. I don't remember all the specifics.

 

[SeriouslySearching]

Even if he was used to it, he would still be sleepy from being awake 24 straight hours. Unless he didn't work the day before, then IDK. I don't remember all the specifics.

He was off all weekend, but I think he had the children, IIRC.

 

[PorcineGranny]

I don't know what you are talking about because I didn't learn anything new tonight except that Tommy placed himself at the crime scene which is pretty darned incriminating in my opinion!

I learned a few things....I learned that TN is still defending Misty, even though you could tell she knew she was telling untruths. I learned that TN was using very expensive makeup or had been to a surgeon for repair on her face. I learned that Ron has a weakness that his mother is going to defend to her last breath and that Misty is only a token now to be used for his defense. I'm not saying that Ron is the person who did away with Haleigh, but it is somehow connected to him. I also learned that Tommy has verified my suspicion that Misty was not at home that night. That those children were left without protection or they were taken, (blanket wrapped) somewhere where harm would or could befall them because of a young druggie's desire for "fun". I learned that Ron had confided to his attorney that he had called Tommy and asked if Misty was at his home when he could not get an answer to the phone. (You know, I never heard that before, only that Ron said she was home) I learned that upon finding she was not at Tommys that Ron did not ask Tommy to check on them and make sure everything was alright, but that he worked overtime and was late getting home.
I've got children and if I couldn't reach them and it was late in the evening, I would not hesitate to call and ask someone to check on them and tell them I was trying to reach them to make sure everything is alright. I mean that is just the normal thing to do. I can't compute Ron never asking Tommy to check on his beloved and those precious children. This is just what I learned and its my opinions.

 

[WillenFan21]

I don't think that the brother did anything to Haleigh & I think his story matches with everything else that has been said. I think that she took the kids with her and left that evening after her and Ron had a fight. There was no crime scene found in that home which leads me to believe that if Misty was never there then the crime scene could be at a friends house or wherever it was she went to. What if she was partying it up, took the kids with her & she put them to bed in room in the friends house but Haleigh threw a fit b.c it was in the dark & she was scared. What if one of her friends or Misty herself in the drugged up stupor kill Haleigh b/c she wouldn't shut up? RJ could have been asleep by the time they got to wherever Misty was going so they could have taken him straight to the bedroom. You wouldn't believe how kids can sleep through stuff. I mean I think that is highly possible that she wouldn't go to sleep and so Misty & her friends got annoyed and couldn't take it. You would be surprised at the crap some people do when they are drugged up. JMO

 

[Donjeta]

TN confirmed on NG that Misty partied the weekend away with friends, and returned to Ron's place Sunday evening and didn't get any sleep until Monday night; so TN's defence for Misty is she couldn't have possibly been out of the trailor because she was physically exhausted.
On Misty's recent forensic examination she states Ron, her and Jr slept and relaxed Monday while HaLeigh was in school and the atmosphere in the home is one of peace and tranquility. Based on what Misty said during the VA test, we are led to believe Ron had slept Monday and was physically rested and prepared to work the evening shift.
If Ron was awake and alert for his 10-12 hour graveyard shift on Monday, why does TN stubbornly deny Misty who got the same amount of sleep as Ron was exhausted and passed on the same evening?

TN was stuck in between a rock and a hard place IMO. Unless Hank was lying, or someone is lying about what Hank said, he was there knocking and Misty didn't hear him. If she said Misty wasn't there she'd have to admit Misty lied. But "She was too tired" is not such a good explanation because if she was too exhausted to move or to wake up at loud noises it doesn't seem right to have her babysit for two small children. And why did this passed out person wake up at three? You'd think it takes a bit longer than five hours to recover from Fri-Mon sleeplessness.

 

[Donjeta]

Knowing what I do about lie detector tests. I do trust them to an extent. Not 100 percent reliable, but trustworthy as a tool. I do know that it also comes down to the type of questions asked, the content and form in the way their asked, and the polygraph examiners interpretation of the answers. Especially when the questions and answers are not just a yes or no. Because then, you have to use interpretation.

Hardly any questions posed to Misty were a straight yes or no. The ones showing deception, or inconsistency, doesn't mean it's on Misty's behalf nor her fault. The proof in the pudding, meaning what actually did happen that night, those circumstances if Misty is innocent aren't her fault as it wasn't her doing causing inside or outside circumstances to be the way they are.

You can also look at it this way. If you take and believe what LE says, that the evidence points to inconsistencies in Misty's statements, well turn it around and say, if you wanted to use reason and logic as your foundation of thinking. Of course the evidence shows and points to things not being consistent with what Misty says. Because Misty says she put the kids down, then later went to sleep. Anything outside of that, our matched directly back to her isn't her inconsistency. It's the perps and LE needs to figure it out and quit saying it's Misty's lies.

The evidence points to an outsider, because what LE has doesn't fit Misty's story,which when I've always known a crime to occur, the victim gives a statement and recollection of events. Anything outside of that statement is normally placed as evidence against the perp, not the victim. We have Le blaming Misty because their supposed evidence doesn't fit her story, but yet they can't pin or place that upon her, so she must be lying? I think LE has had tunnel vision where Misty is concerned and hasn't looked outwards til recently when all the new interviews began.

They have stuck solely on pinning Misty in lies, that their own evidence doesn't back them up. Their I said it. :angel:

BBM. I'm confused. Do you know of some polygraph questions other than these that were published? Because these seem all pretty straightforward yes-no questions that require little interpretation.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/local/news-article.aspx?storyid=143962&provider=rss

Here are the four questions Miller says were asked to Misty on August 19, followed by her answer and the polygraph result:

Question: Did you intentionally withhold any information regarding Haleigh's disappearance?
Answer: No
Result: 99% deception

Question: Do you know what happened to Haleigh?
Answer: No
Result: 99% deception

Question: Do you know where Haleigh is now?
Answer: No
Result: 95% Deception

Question: Do you know who took Haleigh?
Answer: No
Result: 42% deception

It doesn't make sense to me to say that the deception showing in these questions is not on Misty's behalf or not her fault. Either she knows or she doesn't. Either she withholds information intentionally or she doesn't. There's no obvious way an outsider perp could manipulate the inside or outside circumstances to make her fail these questions.

I thought maybe you're not talking about the polygraphs but the voice analysis test? We saw the video and she was asked broad questions such as "tell us about that evening". The test is different in that the questions can't all be simple yes-no because they need the subject talking at length and yes-no questions can get you fairly clipped answers.

Also, it is a perfectly logical and reasonable alternative that Misty did not tell the truth about whatever happened that night. In fact, we know that she has told several alternative stories which can't all be true at the same time. I can see no reason and logical foundation to expect that everything must necessarily be some other perp's fault and LE needs to stop thinking that Misty lied.

More to the topic: here's the transcript
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0909/21/ng.01.html

 

[suspicious1]

Ron's involvement has to be through drugs. Its his weakness. His contacts in that world have led to Haleigh's demise. That has to be why his family has circled him and Misty. Misty obviously knows something important. LE will need proof to break this down. I don't envy their job. JMO

I believe that you are right.

I just had a thought...what if Misty went to Ron that night, I mean to his job. I just can't shake the feeling that they are both involved in this.

 

[Donjeta]

GRACE: OK, Art, let me ask you a question. You remember the door that Misty Croslin says was -- she found propped open with a cinderblock. If you`re at the front door, how far away are you from that door that was allegedly propped open?

HARRIS: Well, it`s -- it`s right -- it`s, you know, very close, Nancy. I -- you know...

GRACE: It`s on the back or the side?

HARRIS: It`s -- let`s see, there`s -- it`s a side. And then there`s a front door. So it`s probably about, oh, 20 feet.

GRACE: So that door is on the side.

HARRIS: That`s my understanding. It`s on the side. There`s a little ramp that goes up to it.

Where's NG going with this line of questioning?
is she thinking would Tommy have seen the bricked door, or would Misty have heard a commotion on the other door or what? Am I missing something?