Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #43

[Doidy]

Yep. And to make it more sus these are actually deleted Skype chat messages.
Why delete them? I suspect it was OW. Maybe she didn't want the olds to know? Or QPS once it was seized?

Also you have the time wrong - the software package they're using reports in UTC time - add 10 hours to get Brisvegas.

ie. 2143 on the 20/4/12: "Hi there! Can we talk. Something very serious."
then in the following morning:
0504 on the 21/4/12: "I'm at Mum's - please call asap. O"

Generally people have a reason for trying to cover up their tracks... what would OW's reason be? Sounds like she thinks she might be a potential suspect...

I actually assumed that would be GBC skyping as he stayed at his parents after allison 'went missing' I think

 

[whitechapel]

I actually assumed that would be GBC skyping as he stayed at his parents after allison 'went missing' I think

I think 'O' at the end of the message indicates OW was the sender of that message.

 

[wewillgetyou]

What time does hearing start today , does anyone know ?

 

[Obsessor]

GBC reported Allison missing at 7:15am on Friday 20 April 2012. The police arrived at the Brookfield house at about 8:30am in answer to GBC's OOO call. By 3:00pm that day the house was declared a crime scene.

Sometime after GBC was interviewed by the attending police he;

phoned criminal lawyer Darren Mahoney's office as early as 12:29pm on Friday 20 April.

There was a further call by GBC to Mahoney's office at 12:55pm on the same day.

GBC phoned the office of solicitor Robyn Ratcliffe in Toowoomba twice. Firstly at 1:11pm and again at 1:12pm.

At 2:01pm GBC phoned Darren Mahoney's mobile and called that same number again at 3:08pm.

For a man whose wife was missing, it didn't take GBC very long at all to contact and engage criminal lawyer Darren Mahoney on the very same day that he'd reported his wife missing. A bit odd that! And why a criminal lawyer? Stupid question really. We all know why.

It is interesting to note that NBC also phoned criminal lawyer Darren Mahoney at 3:23pm on Friday 20 April. NBC also sent an SMS to Darren Mahoney as early as 8:12am on Saturday 21 April and his last SMS to Mahoney was at 1:15pm the same day.

Desperate measures for two men who, IMO should have been out searching for Allison and not driving down the highway to the Gold Coast to confer with a criminal lawyer on the same day that GBC reported Allison missing.

What is also very intriguing is that at 12:25pm on Friday 20 April, GBC phoned Andrew Willsford, the Brookfield showgrounds maintenance man. This call preceded the calls mentioned above. Why did GBC phone the maintenance man of the showgrounds across the road from his house? I've always had a sneaking suspicion that GBC somehow had access to the showgrounds and that was where he cleaned the Captiva before returning home. Why did he phone the maintenance man? It will be very interesting to see if Mr. Willsford is called as a witness either at the committal hearing or the trial.

My opinion only and not that of Websleuths.

Thanks for this post Makara. Very interesting about the maintenance man. You wouldn't think a call to there would be required on that day.

Also, I just wanted to say, it is almost funny how GBC s bad timing has made him look so guilty.
I used to date a customs officer, and he used to say, if ever you were going to do anything wrong -import drugs or the like -(we werent into that) you NEVER confess. Just say nothing and engage a lawyer. The onus then is upon the prosecution to prove you guilty which can be very hard.
This is pretty well known, and could have come up in the BC family many times over the years- all just as innocent conversation- as it was in my case.

BUT- you dont engage the lawyer until you look guilty. If you were to walk through customs with your lawyer ready for the suspicion to be thown at you, you would look guilty.

GBC, in his haste to protect himslef, has jumped the gun and in doing so looks so guilty. There is really only one way to stuff up that advice and he found it.

 

[whatif?]

What time does hearing start today , does anyone know ?

It says 9am on the law list but I'm sure I heard the judge say 9.30 start. Will get there in time for a 9am start just in case.

 

[Ippygal]

Looking forward to some more good info today! I will sadly be at work but will sneak in when I can

 

[LollyPop]

I think 'O' at the end of the message indicates OW was the sender of that message.

You'd assume so but with this lot who would know? GBC could have signed it O, as an example. MOO

 

[linette]

GBC reported Allison missing at 7:15am on Friday 20 April 2012. The police arrived at the Brookfield house at about 8:30am in answer to GBC's OOO call. By 3:00pm that day the house was declared a crime scene.

Sometime after GBC was interviewed by the attending police he;

phoned criminal lawyer Darren Mahoney's office as early as 12:29pm on Friday 20 April.

There was a further call by GBC to Mahoney's office at 12:55pm on the same day.

GBC phoned the office of solicitor Robyn Ratcliffe in Toowoomba twice. Firstly at 1:11pm and again at 1:12pm.

At 2:01pm GBC phoned Darren Mahoney's mobile and called that same number again at 3:08pm.

For a man whose wife was missing, it didn't take GBC very long at all to contact and engage criminal lawyer Darren Mahoney on the very same day that he'd reported his wife missing. A bit odd that! And why a criminal lawyer? Stupid question really. We all know why.

It is interesting to note that NBC also phoned criminal lawyer Darren Mahoney at 3:23pm on Friday 20 April. NBC also sent an SMS to Darren Mahoney as early as 8:12am on Saturday 21 April and his last SMS to Mahoney was at 1:15pm the same day.

Desperate measures for two men who, IMO should have been out searching for Allison and not driving down the highway to the Gold Coast to confer with a criminal lawyer on the same day that GBC reported Allison missing.

What is also very intriguing is that at 12:25pm on Friday 20 April, GBC phoned Andrew Willsford, the Brookfield showgrounds maintenance man. This call preceded the calls mentioned above. Why did GBC phone the maintenance man of the showgrounds across the road from his house? I've always had a sneaking suspicion that GBC somehow had access to the showgrounds and that was where he cleaned the Captiva before returning home. Why did he phone the maintenance man? It will be very interesting to see if Mr. Willsford is called as a witness either at the committal hearing or the trial.

My opinion only and not that of Websleuths.

When you put it that way it looks like a total overload of phone calls to a lawyer that you have no need for.

Wouldn't the lawyer have thought it was way too early to be contacting him? Would he say "Mate, she's only missing. I'm sure she'll turn up! " ? Surely his desperation at speaking with a criminal lawyer must have raised even the lawyers eyebrows????
It would even seem suss if GBC was to say "They're going to think I killed her!" .... Ummm, she was only MISSING!! With 'no reason' to suspect anyone would do anything to her??
After the fight the night before {if he hadn't already killed her} he should have assumed she was just VERY p'd off with him.
Don't think this will look good in court either.

 

[linette]

Yep. And to make it more sus these are actually deleted Skype chat messages.
Why delete them? I suspect it was OW. Maybe she didn't want the olds to know? Or QPS once it was seized?

Also you have the time wrong - the software package they're using reports in UTC time - add 10 hours to get Brisvegas.

ie. 2143 on the 20/4/12: "Hi there! Can we talk. Something very serious."
then in the following morning:
0504 on the 21/4/12: "I'm at Mum's - please call asap. O"

Generally people have a reason for trying to cover up their tracks... what would OW's reason be? Sounds like she thinks she might be a potential suspect...

Seems like the brother didn't find out til later that night? So he still didn't know by 9.43pm the night she went missing?

 

[Fuskier]

Thanks for this post Makara. Very interesting about the maintenance man. You wouldn't think a call to there would be required on that day.

Also, I just wanted to say, it is almost funny how GBC s bad timing has made him look so guilty.
I used to date a customs officer, and he used to say, if ever you were going to do anything wrong -import drugs or the like -(we werent into that) you NEVER confess. Just say nothing and engage a lawyer. The onus then is upon the prosecution to prove you guilty which can be very hard.
This is pretty well known, and could have come up in the BC family many times over the years- all just as innocent conversation- as it was in my case.

BUT- you dont engage the lawyer until you look guilty. If you were to walk through customs with your lawyer ready for the suspicion to be thown at you, you would look guilty.

GBC, in his haste to protect himslef, has jumped the gun and in doing so looks so guilty. There is really only one way to stuff up that advice and he found it.

He also looks guilty because he is wearing Allison's fingernail scratches on his face, neck, chest and underarm, etc.

 

[marlywings]

Morning everyone

Here we go once again...Committal Hearing Day 4.


[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=202248"]***Day 4 -Committal Hearing*** 18th,19,20th March 2013*** - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

 

[bearbear]

GBC reported Allison missing at 7:15am on Friday 20 April 2012. The police arrived at the Brookfield house at about 8:30am in answer to GBC's OOO call. By 3:00pm that day the house was declared a crime scene.

Sometime after GBC was interviewed by the attending police he;

phoned criminal lawyer Darren Mahoney's office as early as 12:29pm on Friday 20 April.

There was a further call by GBC to Mahoney's office at 12:55pm on the same day.

GBC phoned the office of solicitor Robyn Ratcliffe in Toowoomba twice. Firstly at 1:11pm and again at 1:12pm.

At 2:01pm GBC phoned Darren Mahoney's mobile and called that same number again at 3:08pm.

For a man whose wife was missing, it didn't take GBC very long at all to contact and engage criminal lawyer Darren Mahoney on the very same day that he'd reported his wife missing. A bit odd that! And why a criminal lawyer? Stupid question really. We all know why.

It is interesting to note that NBC also phoned criminal lawyer Darren Mahoney at 3:23pm on Friday 20 April. NBC also sent an SMS to Darren Mahoney as early as 8:12am on Saturday 21 April and his last SMS to Mahoney was at 1:15pm the same day.

Desperate measures for two men who, IMO should have been out searching for Allison and not driving down the highway to the Gold Coast to confer with a criminal lawyer on the same day that GBC reported Allison missing.

What is also very intriguing is that at 12:25pm on Friday 20 April, GBC phoned Andrew Willsford, the Brookfield showgrounds maintenance man. This call preceded the calls mentioned above. Why did GBC phone the maintenance man of the showgrounds across the road from his house? I've always had a sneaking suspicion that GBC somehow had access to the showgrounds and that was where he cleaned the Captiva before returning home. Why did he phone the maintenance man? It will be very interesting to see if Mr. Willsford is called as a witness either at the committal hearing or the trial.

My opinion only and not that of Websleuths.

i totally agree re cleaning the car at the showgrounds, no water or dna evidence left in their carport, and also why a criminal lawyer? is it because he just happened to be old friends with one or is there evidence on his computer in the weeks before of him sourcing a criminal lawyer?

 

[AAAA]

Neil Robertson't statement - Interesting Skype call on 20/4/12 at 11:43 am: "Hi there, can we talk. Something very serious." From Nigelain's laptop to Adam in Canada. Was this OW calling or Elaine? Was NBC still at the house with GBC and police at that time?

I would have said: "Hi there, Allison is missing and we can't find her!"

Another very suss thing!

If this were my family I doubt they would even bother phoning my brother only a few hours after calling police. What's the point? He's on the other side of the world! Wouldn't you you way too busy that early on, calling every single person in Brisbane that you could think of? Or be out searching?

 

[Fuskier]

i totally agree re cleaning the car at the showgrounds, no water or dna evidence left in their carport, and also why a criminal lawyer? is it because he just happened to be old friends with one or is there evidence on his computer in the weeks before of him sourcing a criminal lawyer?

Good sleuthing IMO Bearbear.

 

[Cyansea]

Hi All, haven't posted for a while but been following this case closely and have read the statements which have been so kindly provided. Thank you!
Just a list of notes I have jotted down, all these put together do not make me think of innocence, it makes me think Allison was murdered:
Facial Scratches (statements to say fingernail scratches, highly unlikely to be anything other than fingernail scratches)
Doctor's Visits by GBC (to document scratches)
Lying re saying Police told him to have injuries documented
Screaming (multiple)
Botanical Report - (plant species from Brookfield home in Allison’s hair)
Blood in Car
Body found under bridge (placed under bridge)
Lying re using Find my Friend App. to try and locate Allison
Lying re Walking Times
Lying saying he slept all night
Allison’s Life Insurance - Calling Insurance Co. before body I.D.
Financial Trouble - to the tune of over $1M (he was begging for money at the stage of her disappearance)
Affairs with TM (and others)
Told TM he would be free by 1 July
From OW's mouth: GBC told his children (Allison) fell down a hole and won't be back (to his children)
Did not try to find Allison (after reporting her missing)
Demeanor not that of a worried husband (also noted by GP whom he saw re: scratches)
GBC was in a position to benefit financially from Allison's death
These are only a few things I have jotted down and my no means exhaustive. Feel free to add change as necessary as I’m sure there is so much more to this list. There is only one conclusion I can find and it is NOT consistent with innocence. The suicide hypothesis does not fly, imo. I think he's done like a dog's dinner, let's see what happens this week. OW is panicking. IMO On to Day 4 of the committal!

 

[AAAA]

Yep. And to make it more sus these are actually deleted Skype chat messages.
Why delete them? I suspect it was OW. Maybe she didn't want the olds to know? Or QPS once it was seized?

Also you have the time wrong - the software package they're using reports in UTC time - add 10 hours to get Brisvegas.

ie. 2143 on the 20/4/12: "Hi there! Can we talk. Something very serious."
then in the following morning:
0504 on the 21/4/12: "I'm at Mum's - please call asap. O"

Generally people have a reason for trying to cover up their tracks... what would OW's reason be? Sounds like she thinks she might be a potential suspect...

Sorry, trying to catch up. Do you mean that the Skype calls were actually at 9.43pm and then at 5.04am? This makes it worse in my opinion.

 

[Obsessor]

He also looks guilty because he is wearing Allison's fingernail scratches on his face, neck, chest and underarm, etc.

Absolutely- that too!!! As if they didn't look bad enough, he then goes and stuffs up by calling his lawyer way too early. This bit makes me laugh. He's an idiot.

 

[Fuskier]

Hi All, haven't posted for a while but been following this case closely and have read the statements which have been so kindly provided. Thank you!
Just a list of notes I have jotted down, all these put together do not make me think of innocence, it makes me think Allison was murdered:
Facial Scratches (statements to say fingernail scratches, highly unlikely to be anything other than fingernail scratches)
Doctor's Visits by GBC (to document scratches)
Lying re saying Police told him to have injuries documented
Screaming (multiple)
Botanical Report - (plant species from Brookfield home in Allison’s hair)
Blood in Car
Body found under bridge (placed under bridge)
Lying re using Find my Friend App. to try and locate Allison
Lying re Walking Times
Lying saying he slept all night
Allison’s Life Insurance - Calling Insurance Co. before body I.D.
Financial Trouble - to the tune of over $1M (he was begging for money at the stage of her disappearance)
Affairs with TM (and others)
Told TM he would be free by 1 July
From OW's mouth: GBC told his children (Allison) fell down a hole and won't be back (to his children)
Did not try to find Allison (after reporting her missing)
Demeanor not that of a worried husband (also noted by GP whom he saw re: scratches)
GBC was in a position to benefit financially from Allison's death
These are only a few things I have jotted down and my no means exhaustive. Feel free to add change as necessary as I’m sure there is so much more to this list. There is only one conclusion I can find and it is NOT consistent with innocence. The suicide hypothesis does not fly, imo. I think he's done like a dog's dinner, let's see what happens this week. OW is panicking. IMO On to Day 4 of the committal!

Agree, it does all point in a certain direction at this stage. Welcome back Cyansea. Great to see you again. Look forward to your posts. There has been good sleuthing discussion going on lately.

 

[Cyansea]

Agree, it does all point in a certain direction at this stage. Welcome back Cyansea. Great to see you again. Look forward to your posts. There has been good sleuthing discussion going on lately.

Thanks Fuskier, believe me if I had my way I'd be on here all the time, especially at this crucial stage!
I have been reading all the statements, some are doing my head in (the financials). There has been great sleuthing happening I have read all of the posts, great job everyone!

I still believe there has to have been an accessory/s before or after the fact so no wonder people are jittery. I feel confident this matter will go to trial.

 

[Snoopey]

Hi Doc, I wasn't trying to compare the cases at all. I was just watching 60 mins and was intrigued by the case, that's all. I thought other sleuths would be interested in watching it

Hi all,

I too am a first time poster on this thread although I have also been reading all the threads since not long after Allison went missing. Feel a bit like a freeloader but to be honest I haven't posted as I really have not had anything of note to add. Others have mimicked my thoughts and said it so much better than I could. There has been some amazing research and comments from you all. Allison's case has touched a nerve. She could have been a sister, daughter, friend. So sad and so unfair.

Off topic, as shown in the Susan Neill-Fraser case (a case I followed closely) a conviction can result even if there is only circumstantial evidence. More info on this link for those interested:

http://netk.net.au/Tasmania/SentencingRemarks.pdf

As Doc Watson said, with GBC, there is a body and so much more. Let's hope justice prevails!