Amanda Knox found guilty for the murder of Meredith Kercher in Italy #15

[redheadedgal]

I'm sorry, I really am not trying to be snarky. I just have a herd time with the saying "unbiased TV station" in this case. You said the same yourself a few posts back I think.

i said what?

a tv station in italy investigating the evidence is biased? in what way? or am i misunderstanding?

TG5 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Linda7NJ]

I think the reason she stayed was to stay close to the investigation and it's progress. I agree she thought she could continue her wonderful life in Italy m



I completely agree!!! She wants to portray herself as the innocent victim who is always easily taken advantage of.

During this appeal hearing she says the lawyers told her not to come so she did not. What's next? The devil made me do it?

That's odd. Iirc one of her attorneys was on tv right before the verdict and seemed upset she wasn't going. I seem to recall him saying something about an empty chair is never good for a defendant.
I'm not sure if he was one of her current lawyers or what. I do know he spoke English with no accent. I'm assuming he was American.

Did anyone else see it?
I kinda half heard it because I wasn't really paying attention...I was probably posting here. lol

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[Linda7NJ]

I think the reason she stayed was to stay close to the investigation and it's progress. I agree she thought she could continue her wonderful life in Italy .

I completely agree!!! She wants to portray herself as the innocent victim who is always easily taken advantage of.
During this appeal hearing she says the lawyers told her not to come so she did not. What's next? The devil made me do it?

The whole being at the cottage for the discovery, and making sure someone else discovered Meredith ...her going to the police station because she didn't want to be alone...allegedly.

That entire morning of the discovery ....is just OFF.




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[redheadedgal]

What bothers me is that Nencini even opened the door to any of this: It is after all the Italian commission which has voted unanimously to investigate him. At worst, this puts the verdict in jeopardy. At the least, it gives the defense a boost for the appeal.

it amazes me that the commission was able to see nencini's word were possibly inappropriate yet so many other things about this investigation were overlooked... thankfully hellman (and C&V) had the courage to stand alone in this chaos and admit he too saw faults...

It seems to me that there should be basic principals that apply to all murder investigations, not different principals for different suspects.

YES!!! and many here have been stating the international standards re: evidence collection and analysis were clearly ignored... but for some reason it's all fallen on deaf ears...

Ugh. Poor Meredith. Knox gets all this attention and it's like the Kercher family doesn't even exist.

how about blaming italy for this... this chaos, this mess, SEVEN years of hell for all families involved (kercher, knox, sollecito)... one trying to obtain justice for their lost loved one and two fighting for the lives of their loved ones ??? only faulty systems in italy can be blamed imo.

 

[redheadedgal]

So a good reason to ignore evidence is to demand a video of evidence collection and if that is not available, then evidence should be ignored. If there is video, then it should be easy to find fault one way or another. If investigators return to a sealed crime scene to collect more evidence, all evidence from that second date should be excluded because anything could have contaminated the evidence while investigators were sleeping.

I think I could almost argue that every suspect is innocent.

barbie nadeau and nina burleigh have stated that investigators, police, and others were in and out of the cottage b/w nov 2 and dec 18 so no, it was not "sealed".

I'm sorry, but I have no idea about that picture of the knife overlay which you posted. It looks like a representation of a knife is being held about 2-3 inches above the imprint, causing a shadow which does not match up with the imprint. Of course, shadows are imprecise. All I see there are shadows.

now there are shadows? :facepalm:

several pics of the knife can be seen in the link supplied... why not go see what the knife actually looks like before fault finding?

 

[redheadedgal]

If the investigators are inept in the collection of one piece of evidence, then they are inept in the collection of all evidence.

Therefore, there is no evidence implicating Guede and he is innocent.

this oft repeated "argument" doesn't hold up to scrutiny for several reasons. one being, that guede's handprint and his shoeprints didn't need to be "collected". they certainly were well photographed, then examined, and matched to his prints and shoes.

will there now be an argument finding fault with the photographer? maybe the film?

"word salad" has a specific meaning that's not even close to what this says. More, it's most commonly associated with schizophrenia. jmo

you are correct! i googled it: "confused or unintelligible mixture of seemingly random words and phrases".

 

[otto]

barbie nadeau and nina burleigh have stated that investigators, police, and others were in and out of the cottage b/w nov 2 and dec 18 so no, it was not "sealed".

Of course they were. When a crime scene is sealed, the public is excluded, but obviously police and investigators access the crime scene. That's their job.

 

[Sor Juana]

It's is a medical/psychiatric term, for sure, associated with schizophrenia. Maybe there's a better way to describe Amanda's manner of speaking. jmo

word salad /word sal·ad/ (werd sal´ad) a meaningless mixture of words and phrases characteristic of advanced schizophrenia.

Dorland's Medical Dictionary for Health Consumers. © 2007 by Saunders, an imprint of Elsevier, Inc. All rights reserved.

confused or unintelligible mixture of seemingly random words and phrases, specifically (in psychiatry) as a form of speech indicative of advanced schizophrenia.

http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/us/definition/american_english/word-salad

Not to be confused with cognitive slippage though, also with tachyphemia or logorrhoea.

 

[Kavya01]

A better way to describe Amanda's speech patterns, succinctly, would be:

verbosity to bamboozle and lie.

 

[minazoe]

I love her feigned outrage and wooden movements...my 84 year old uncle only knew a little bit about the case, and we were wTching tv together and he saw her for the first time, talking. My uncle was an infamous celebrity type bartender all his life and he took one look and listen, and said she is a bad person....watch out.

He knows people better than anyone I know. MOO

 

[SMK]

I think this New Republic piece makes some very good points:

Why the U.S. Should Hand Over Amanda Knox If Italy Asks

http://www.newrepublic.com/article/116451/amanda-knox-extradition-should-be-granted

 

[aa9511]

You may mock the coerced statement information, but the research was written by Saul Kassin a leading authority on false confessions. He included Amanda Knox in the research paper I posted.



Saul Kassin - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


http://madon.public.iastate.edu/595E/WEEKLY READINGS/Week4/2.Kassin 2012.pdf

But do you not think that if his original premise is false, then the conclusions drawn from that premise will be false?

It is clear that his premise is that Amanda is innocent.

This is the first sentence of his paper:
"As illustrated by the story of Amanda Knox and
many
others wrongfully convicted,........"

He is starting with the premise that she was wrongfully convicted.

He goes on to say, basically, that all of the witnesses were not credible, and that the DNA was not credible.

He uses her actions to support his thesis, but he is viewing her actions from an innocent-perspective.

Such as, he says she stayed willingly to answer questions, and that is because she was innocent. However, I think that a guilty person close to the victim and "on the radar" from the beginning due to this closeness to the victim, would not just run away or refuse to answer questions, as that would draw more attention to them. So he is viewing her actions through the prism of her being innocent, however, her actions would also make sense through the prism of her being guilty.

He also appears to add falsehoods, such as this:

"Two weeks later, the rapist whose DNA
was found in sperm and other biological matter at the crime
scene was apprehended."

So he is actually adding false information to make his original premise more credible.

I would also like to say there is not just one piece of evidence against Amanda. For example, it is not just her false accusation. There is a whole load of other evidence - circumstantial as well as forensic. Even without her false accusation, there would still be overwhelming proof of her guilt. It is not that the false accusation is a make or break in this case, IMO.

Just look at RS as an example - he made no false accusation or false confession or whatever we want to call it, and he is still thought to be guilty.

And lastly, I would like to say that, necessarily, one side of this is correct and one is incorrect. Either they are guilty, or they are innocent. Therefore, one side of "experts" is also incorrect, regarding this particular case, necessarily. So just because an expert says something, does not mean that expert is corrrect regarding this case. Like I said, by necessity, one side or another of the experts is going to be incorrect, concerning this case. It can't be that they're all right. It can't be that Amanda and RS are innocent, but guilty also.

It could be that they are right in general terms of their theories, but wrong in how they connect Amanda's case to their general theory. For example, a scientis can be right about DNA in general terms, but incorrect in how they connect it to Amanda's case. Or, as in this paper, the author can be right about false confessions, but incorrect in connecting Amanda's case to false confession, because he is going on the incorrect premise that she is innocent.

I think that what he says about false confessions is probably right, but he falls into the same trap he accuses the prosecutors and detectives of, except he does it coming from the other side. He believes from the beginning that Amanda is innocent, and he draws the rest of his conclusions from there. Meaning, he interprets all the evidence in a way which supports his original premise of innocence. That was very obvious to me, from his first sentence and onwards. He is doing the same thing that he accuses others of doing.

JMO.

 

[aa9511]

I think the reason she stayed was to stay close to the investigation and it's progress. I agree she thought she could continue her wonderful life in Italy .

I completely agree!!! She wants to portray herself as the innocent victim who is always easily taken advantage of.
During this appeal hearing she says the lawyers told her not to come so she did not. What's next? The devil made me do it?

bbm

Oh yes, I forgot about that. Good point.

 

[aa9511]

That's odd. Iirc one of her attorneys was on tv right before the verdict and seemed upset she wasn't going. I seem to recall him saying something about an empty chair is never good for a defendant.
I'm not sure if he was one of her current lawyers or what. I do know he spoke English with no accent. I'm assuming he was American.

Did anyone else see it?
I kinda half heard it because I wasn't really paying attention...I was probably posting here. lol

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I have not heard about that. Maybe someone else knows?

 

[aa9511]

barbie nadeau and nina burleigh have stated that investigators, police, and others were in and out of the cottage b/w nov 2 and dec 18 so no, it was not "sealed".




now there are shadows? :facepalm:

several pics of the knife can be seen in the link supplied... why not go see what the knife actually looks like before fault finding?

But you were using that photo to illustrate how the knife supposedly doesn't line up with the outline of the imprint. And I said that, to me, it looks like they are holding a representation of the knife up from the outline about 2-3 inches, and it looks like the shadow from the knife is actually what they are trying to match with the imprint.

 

[Footwarrior]

Interesting how the analysis of a subject matter expert is dismissed because he dares to suggest Amanda is innocent.

Yet in this same discussion tabloid psychological analysis and pseudo science are accepted at face value.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

:seeya: Morning Y'all !


:drumroll: I see I missed a lot of "excitement" last night ... :floorlaugh:

Raf's appearance on the AC Show ...

:drumroll: Surprise Surprise !


As to Judge Nencini, I think it is much ado about nothing ...

Nothing but a desperate defense tactic !

:moo:

 

[Kavya01]

:seeya: Morning Y'all !


:drumroll: I see I missed a lot of "excitement" last night ... :floorlaugh:

Raf's appearance on the AC Show ...

:drumroll: Surprise Surprise !


As to Judge Nencini, I think it is much ado about nothing ...

Nothing but a desperate defense tactic !

:moo:

BBM:

Could not agree more. Storm in a water glass.
Sill much looking forward to that report

 

[dog.gone.cute]

The whole being at the cottage for the discovery, and making sure someone else discovered Meredith ...her going to the police station because she didn't want to be alone...allegedly.

That entire morning of the discovery ....is just OFF.

:seeya:

RBBM: I totally agree ...

:waitasec: And Knox and Raf were supposed to be going to Gubbio that morning ... but their plans changed significantly ...

 

[Footwarrior]

The knife from Raffelle's kitchen deist fit the wounds in the victim. Nor does it fit the bloody outline left on Meredith's bed. But if with a big hammer, you can force a square peg into a round hole and your loyal supporters can be counted on to applaud it as a perfect fit.

The knife that actually killed Meredith has never been found. Rudy Guede is the one person who knows what happened to it, but a good guess is that it was disposed of along with his size 14 Nike shoes.