Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #9

[Fuskier]

An interesting case in Tasmania recently may convince prosecutors to rely on circumstantial evidence more than they have in the past. The jury in R v Blyth Neill-Fraser convicted the defendent without a body or forensic evidence. The verdict was subsequently upheld by the Court of Criminal Appeal. Whilst not binding in Queensland, the decision of the CCA could have significant impact on cases such as this one , where circumstantial evidence may be heavily relied upon. IMO

ACTUSREUS: Thank you for your helpful contribution. That the verdict was subsequently upheld by the Court of Criminal Appeal is good news. A precedent has been set.

 

[Neuromancer]

-police declare crime scene and impound both vehicles
-GBC engages lawyer
- GBC observed with scratches to face and torso
April 22
- GBCcrashes friend's car

April 24
Heavy rain Greater Brisbane area

April 22- 25
-GBC engages solicitor
- female colleague engages lawyer

Engaged solicitor Day 1 and barrister on 30 April
'Female colleague engages lawyer' was after that - approx a week ago
26 Apr police search parents' house and take away stuff including computers.

 

[Neuromancer]

does anyone else think allisons eyes look incredibly sad in this photo?

Yes that photo's always struck me as sad too.

 

[Cccclllaareb]

I am very, very little - need a cushion to reach pedals in car; I sit so close to the wheel I have been told that if the airbag pops out -it may kill me? Is that true?

Oh - just for my information - not suggesting it was an attempt of 'suicide by airbag!'

Awww hehe! Good things come in small packages!

 

[Rational]

Engaged solicitor Day 1 and barrister on 30 April
'Female colleague engages lawyer' was after that - approx a week ago
26 Apr police search parents' house and take away stuff including computers.

Thank you all. I will wait for another bit and will refine (read edit) original posts with all additions and take away anything which is wrong.

 

[coolcat]

Yes, I had heard about (b) when she first went missing. Don't know if it's true - don't know if we'll ever know!

Her best friend would know if this is true...I don't think the bloke will ever come out and say otherwise and if the Public ever found out his identity then he risks becoming a suspect aswell?

Maybe he is? If in fact this rumour is true?

Maybe he owns the Blue Car?

 

[Keyboredom]

Yes it has been mentioned here in a list from (Keyboredom) which i searched for yesterday and is a great reference to keep handy.I was going to ask them to repost but heres the page of facts and other info based on the jungle drums ....thread2#page37 post905 worth a look
I can't find any reference to that situation re the accident and taking off his shirt in that post. Have I misundertood?

No, you're right, I haven't posted anything about the accident (back then I was just trying to help separate fact from fiction).

All I know about the accident, is it's highly unusual I did notice the other day that crashing into that post wouldn't be difficult though (someone mentioned he'd have to navigate a complicated one way bus thoroughfare) ... but it's right next to the roadside footpath. Would be easy to hit if you lost control at speed. Would be harder to build up enough speed to lose control without major mechanical failure though, and Hondas are notoriously reliable ;-) Also you'd be in the right lane if you were heading to do a turn toward Indooroopilly police - that would take a lot to get across both lanes and slam into the post unless you decided to head left quite a way before the bus station.

 

[willough]

Yes that photo's always struck me as sad too.

Either sad...........or tired.

 

[Fuskier]

does anyone else think allisons eyes look incredibly sad in this photo?
as though she has a broken heart and has suffered for years but holding it all together.
her girls would have been such a source of happiness for her
i cant copy and paste the photo but here is the link to it. it has been used a lot by the press, maybe it was the most recent photo of her given by the family to the police/press
http://www.optuszoo.com.au/news/top/perth-now/hundreds-farewell-allison-baden-clay/665713

BEARBEAR: Are we reading our own thoughts/feelings into Allison's looks? You say 'sad', 'broken heart', 'suffered for years' etc. Are you alluding to 'depression'? Or living with DV in an unhappy situation for the sake of the children? Other people may look at the same photo and see just a busy mother around the age of 40 or so. She is still emitting a warm smile for the camera. Just a note that medical evidence re validity/invalidity of depression/DV will be judged in a Court of Law.

 

[xfiles]

GBC's demeanour during his only interview with the media reminded me of my ex-husband. It sent shivers down my spine and made me feel sick. And that, Ï'm sorry" oh how it sounded like my ex husband after he would either verbally or physically abuse me.
IMO I believe that the police are giving out tiny bits of info to freak the perp out. Maybe they are hoping that the perp will break. How much easier would it be to convict if the perp admitted to the crime. Or if not the perp maybe someone that was involved.
Does anyone remember the media release where it mentioned that up to 5 ppl could be arrested ? A bit of aiding and abetting here me thinks.

Does anyone know where the sister's husband lives (suburb, city) or what his name is ???

 

[True]

:woohoo:

BEARBEAR: Are we reading our own thoughts/feelings into Allison's looks? You say 'sad', 'broken heart', 'suffered for years' etc. Are you alluding to 'depression'? Or living with DV in an unhappy situation for the sake of the children? Other people may look at the same photo and see just a busy mother around the age of 40 or so. She is still emitting a warm smile for the camera. Just a note that medical evidence re validity/invalidity of depression/DV will be judged in a Court of Law.

Please let's not start reading into a photo. Some of you have to remember she was a mother of 3 at 43 years of age. She was no longer the glamour puss in her wedding photo, which was taken YEARS ago. Don't even compare a recent photo to the much younger photos being published, she looks her age. Some can fight it, some can't. Looks like a genuine smile to me. Just because she's aged, doesn't make it less.

 

[GlobeArtichoke]

Failed 000 call attempts on iPhone

I wish to share an event that demonstrates failure of a 000 or 112 call connection using an iPhone:

Last weekend, I tended to my crying toddler at 1am and re-settled him. I was in a light sleep next to him and was roused by sounds on the street outside my house. I heard the roar of a car taking off at speed followed quickly by screeching tyres a loud bang and smashed glass. A car had collided with another.

I was immediately panicked and grabbed my iPhone to call emergency services. I hit the "emergency call" button which took me to another call screen with a keypad. I punched in "000" ("112" also works but isn't necessary on most mobiles) followed by the green call connect button, but the call failed to connect. No dial tone or engaged tone at all. (A previous poster suggested this can happen at peak times).

The call screen then changed and instead of ONE green button, there were TWO: the call connect button at the bottom of the screen plus a green arrow next to the words "emergency call". In my panicked state, this unexpected result confused me. I pushed the arrow several times before realizing it was just cycling the "emergency call" term between different languages. After several attempts at pushing the call-connect button (and trying 112 and 000 again) it finally connected.

Crucially, this confusion brought on by failed connection plus the change in call screen can cost precious seconds during a state of panic, and can rapidly heighten a state of panic. I also discovered that my phone only recorded the single successful connection to 000, not the multiple attempts to connect. I expect telco records to be the same.

So for someone who has never had to phone emergency services on an iPhone in the past, it is possible to desperately attempt a call but fail and no record made of that.

 

[Thinking]

Engaged solicitor Day 1 and barrister on 30 April
'Female colleague engages lawyer' was after that - approx a week ago
26 Apr police search parents' house and take away stuff including computers.

I think it is probably important to also add in the first day that the female ex-colleague was questioned, - the first day she was brought in, she was questioned for 4 hours, right?

If my memory serves correctly, it was on the Sunday or Monday after ABC went missing (GBC's car accident was on the Sunday).

 

[Kay-ce]

Just saying he would have very sore ribs from air bag and cuts scratches are possible. I have also seen people have an alergic reaction to the powder that comes out. It wouldn't be unusual to get someone to take their shirt off to examine them at the scene in this type of accident.:moo:

I totally agree with you, that's what I was saying earlier. Perhaps he was trying to disguise the marks from the car crash..everyone gets affected differently by accidents... I was just having a stab in the dark...

 

[willough]

Some of you have to remember she was a mother of 3 at 43 years of age.

The very reason I thought she looked tired.....I sometimes (ummmm often) feel tired and I only have 2.

 

[Fuskier]

Not in great detail. The Neill-Fraser case caught many by surprise and since the unsuccessful appeal, has precipitated a number of arrests in previous colds cases. Tas Pol have stated that they have greater confidence to lay charges in cases based largely on circumstantial evidence.

Time will tell if juries in other jurisdictions follow this trend by giving greater weight to circumstantial evidence.

MOO is that there is insufficient evidence of this trend across the other states. Hence the apparent reluctance of QPS to lay charges at this stage.

ACTUSREUS: Exactly. That is the reason HAWKIN'S posts guide us in the right direction.
We wish to avoid premature action and secure a conviction(s) of the perpetrator(s) in a Court of Criminal Law in QLD.

 

[coolcat]

I'm glad you brought that up 543. The 'loss' of the phone has been troubling me too, so it's good to have a chance to re-explore that.

I can think of two possible scenarios for losing the phone, whilst it remains switched on, that involve a killer known to Allison. They are based on the triangulation reports of the phones location being within 150m of the Baden-Clay residence. Maps indicate this means the phone is on their property or an immediately neighbouring one, not down the road any great distance on a suggested walking route.

1) ABC is involved in a confrontation at home which leads her to fear for her safety. She runs out into the darkness with her phone to attempt a 000 call. She keeps as quiet as possible (no screaming) to avoid being found. The killer finds her easily by the light of the iPhone screen, snatches the phone and throws it away whilst muffling/strangling ABC.

2) ABC is involved in a confrontation at home, resulting in her death. The killer plants the phone nearby, leaving it switched on knowing it would be triangulated to the local area, to ADD credence to the 'Allison went for a walk' story.

Possible reasons for phone to remain missing
A hand & knee search of the area was carried out but was apparently fruitless. Did this include metal detector sweep of every inch? I don't know, perhaps unlikely - does anyone know? Regardless there are three possible reasons for it to remain missing:

1) phone was simply missed during search due to human error
2) search zone based on triangulation data was too narrow
3) phone was buried or planted in an inaccessible place

I'll share a failed 000 call story with you all in my next post - which could explain attempts at dialing 000 that never connect and are not recorded, even on the phone itself. This very situation happened to me a week ago.

I can't believe I am exploring the Phone idea but something did trigger a possible scenario regarding the roundabout.....It may be possible that ABC did infact call 000 or Direct number to Police..( I know I have Local Police number in my phone - Much easier process if you need them quickly...IMO)
and may of not been able to identify herself but left the call open.
Maybe the Police or witnesses seen something on CCTV at rounabout around the same time as call was made as they have the measures to track the distress call if 000 and if she called Local Police directly she may have been able to just get out some sort of message?

The roundabout really is key for me because in The CM I am sure that I read that Police conducted tests timing a white car for 20 mins??...Something has definetly happened there and the timing of the car has me stumped?

Another thing that I think would be helpful to know - as I have gone on about with every thread - Is knowing what happened with there day on THURSDAY because I am sure something has happened in the lead up??? IMO

 

[True]

I think I have to bow out for a while. We have already established he may have had the accident to cover previous injuries. We have also already established that the attempt is in vain because police can tell older injuries from fresh injuries.

Also, sleuthing on the photo of the 4WD after it hit the pole, the speed limit sign attached to the pole says 10km/hr. Not the place to have an accident that will LOOK like it MAY cause injuries, unless he wanted to get done for speeding and reckless driving. IMO

Too much rehashing and too many posters speculating on evidence that is not even accurate. I'll come back when some new evidence comes to light.

 

[Thinking]

Engaged solicitor Day 1 and barrister on 30 April
'Female colleague engages lawyer' was after that - approx a week ago
26 Apr police search parents' house and take away stuff including computers.

To be honest I don't think we can substantiate that a solicitor was engaged on day one - unless I have missed the relevant report?

The first I read about the engagement of a solicitor was about 5 or so days in when Darren Mahoney made his first statement to the media on GBC's behalf. Then the SC was engaged the day Allison was found.

The talk about engaging legal rep on the first day is speculation/gossip as far as I know.

Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong.

 

[bikerchick]

I feel the crashing into the pole at Indro was purposeful. For what reason I don't know.

I live in the area and go to Indro nearly every day - you would have to make a concerted effort to swerve and drive into the pylon as it is in the bus station.

Also notice how 'symmetrical' the crash is - if he'd clipped the pylon (a more likely scenario if an accident) the blue car's final resting position would be different eg facing at more of an angle to the pylon.

It is not on the way to the police at Indro UNLESS he was coming from the other direction. . <modsnip> .

I feel that the QPS know who killed Allison, but need more concrete evidence, so there is no trial by circumstantial evidence as Hawkins suggested.