Australia Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #11

[pauldking]

BRE sought value for money items looking at his eBay purchases. He often purchased gadgets and LED assemblies from overseas (China, HK) and he arguably happy to sacrifice waiting on postage to obtain the wholesale price. A well-planned approach perhaps. What if that principle was applied to everything – value for money. Surely the Eagles membership was value for money, time spent crabbing, bare CPU specs for gaming, driving around in a work car, etc.

So where did his money go... IMO if there is a link to LB taken off the streets in Northbridge around midnight Monday night/Tuesday AM in November 1998 could suggest that CSK did have a proclivity for working girls but we don't know why – diversification, convenience. LB was the same age as SS when they were both lost to this world.

Palmerston Street and several streets of Highgate have been cleaned up a couple of times since then with a bunch of stings that compromised many stalker types. Nine men ranging from 20 to 72 were caught in Highgate as recently as 2013 trying to procure the services of working girls. Street workers may have represented best value for money to him. I wonder if CSK was known to police in one of the stings over the years. Was he the guy who was pulled over with the blitz kit in Northbridge? Either way CSK would have had to adapt.

Perhaps nefarious activities online under various pseudonyms (how many secret email accounts did he fire up?) to procure working girls as an outlet for his psycho-sexualis. Has a serial killer blogged here? I reckon there's more chance that a serial killer who has sought the services of working girls more likely has focussed his efforts covertly on sex sites as part of his everyday 'second life' to achieve his value for money. What if he was rough with the working girls? Surely someone would remember him. Someone said somewhere the family were known to police...

If CSK used the Indian Ocean for LB it would remove any triangulation, as with SS and any other poor soul that had the absolute misfortune to run into this psychopath. BRE is innocent until proven guilty – I also love the authenticity of science.

 

[SherlockSleuth]

Maybe, BRE took several long trips overseas, that takes up a lot of money. His two wives are not Australian, so I'm thinking he's a world traveler. JMO

Hmmm, dunno about world traveller. I'm getting a picture of a fairly unsophisticated bloke. Loves video games, footy and crabbing. It's possible, but not my hunch. My money's on a hooker addiction.

 

[Perpendicular]

LOL He's a real goes right to the edge risk taker, snow dropping, breaking into womens houses when they're asleep and scooping women up off the streets almost under the nose of CCTV when the police knew there was a killer about and driving around with bodies in his car.

ShellyGale,
I have read your tendency to look towards 'outside substances' to explain the perpetrator's behaviour and lack of self-control, and while we can't rule this out and I would be happily proven incorrect, I think it is somewhat misguided. I would agree with you that the CSK is an addict - to dopamine. He is a serial sexual offender with offences which have started at a relatively young age, which means that as he was becoming sexualised (as an adolescent, or possibly even younger) he was relating to sex through a set of increasingly 'deviant' or distorted thoughts and fantasies. Over this period of time his neural pathways for sexual arousal and gratification would have become increasingly consolidated such that it would require exposure to increasingly strong and extreme sexual stimuli (mental, visual, physical) to achieve the same amount of dopamine release and arousal, hence the escalation in sexual offences. This would mean engaging in increasingly violent behaviours and taking greater risks. My point being that there does not need to be an additional substance to fuel his behaviour; his neurological wiring and brain's neurochemical thirst for dopamine release, and the influence and active indulgence in his thoughts and fantasies around sex and control more than explain this. To echo the thoughts of others, an introverted, emotionally avoidant, control-oriented and organised individual would not likely be a 'throw caution to the wind' risk taker, rather, it would more likely be that he would savour all aspects of the minutiae of his MO as his fantasies build towards enaction. Given this, while he might have ceased physical offences, without significant therapeutic and behaviour change intervention intervention it is unlikely that his neurological wiring and tastes sexual stimuli have changed much, and we would anticipate he has addiction to extreme *advertiser censored* only available on the dark web where he could access that type of content, possibly engage in 'like-minded' social networks, maybe even mutually brag about past achievements to relive the excitement and fuel further fantasies.

 

[ShellyGale]

That's all possible too. I'd actually let the addiction angle go until it was raised again in relation to the appearance that he didn't seem to have a lot of money and the reason why could be some kind of addiction. Only reason I put it forward was to offer perhaps another reason why at one point he appeared to just stop and my in my research of sex murderers rapists mass and serial killers found that quite a few of them were using substances. That means they're getting it from somewhere and someone else knows about it. If the case against him starts to fall apart, the DNA can't be used for whatever reason, that information about him just might come in handy. But I'm shutting up about it again because I don't want to cause any trouble or upset anybody else waffling on about it.

ShellyGale,
I have read your tendency to look towards 'outside substances' to explain the perpetrator's behaviour and lack of self-control, and while we can't rule this out and I would be happily proven incorrect, I think it is somewhat misguided. I would agree with you that the CSK is an addict - to dopamine. He is a serial sexual offender with offences which have started at a relatively young age, which means that as he was becoming sexualised (as an adolescent, or possibly even younger) he was relating to sex through a set of increasingly 'deviant' or distorted thoughts and fantasies. Over this period of time his neural pathways for sexual arousal and gratification would have become increasingly consolidated such that it would require exposure to increasingly strong and extreme sexual stimuli (mental, visual, physical) to achieve the same amount of dopamine release and arousal, hence the escalation in sexual offences. This would mean engaging in increasingly violent behaviours and taking greater risks. My point being that there does not need to be an additional substance to fuel his behaviour; his neurological wiring and brain's neurochemical thirst for dopamine release, and the influence and active indulgence in his thoughts and fantasies around sex and control more than explain this. To echo the thoughts of others, an introverted, emotionally avoidant, control-oriented and organised individual would not likely be a 'throw caution to the wind' risk taker, rather, it would more likely be that he would savour all aspects of the minutiae of his MO as his fantasies build towards enaction. Given this, while he might have ceased physical offences, without significant therapeutic and behaviour change intervention intervention it is unlikely that his neurological wiring and tastes sexual stimuli have changed much, and we would anticipate he has addiction to extreme *advertiser censored* only available on the dark web where he could access that type of content, possibly engage in 'like-minded' social networks, maybe even mutually brag about past achievements to relive the excitement and fuel further fantasies.

 

[billybanana]

Another Kewdale house only 2 mins drive away from BRE. I assume that is CG parents place.

 

[CP345]

ShellyGale,
I have read your tendency to look towards 'outside substances' to explain the perpetrator's behaviour and lack of self-control, and while we can't rule this out and I would be happily proven incorrect, I think it is somewhat misguided. I would agree with you that the CSK is an addict - to dopamine. He is a serial sexual offender with offences which have started at a relatively young age, which means that as he was becoming sexualised (as an adolescent, or possibly even younger) he was relating to sex through a set of increasingly 'deviant' or distorted thoughts and fantasies. Over this period of time his neural pathways for sexual arousal and gratification would have become increasingly consolidated such that it would require exposure to increasingly strong and extreme sexual stimuli (mental, visual, physical) to achieve the same amount of dopamine release and arousal, hence the escalation in sexual offences. This would mean engaging in increasingly violent behaviours and taking greater risks. My point being that there does not need to be an additional substance to fuel his behaviour; his neurological wiring and brain's neurochemical thirst for dopamine release, and the influence and active indulgence in his thoughts and fantasies around sex and control more than explain this. To echo the thoughts of others, an introverted, emotionally avoidant, control-oriented and organised individual would not likely be a 'throw caution to the wind' risk taker, rather, it would more likely be that he would savour all aspects of the minutiae of his MO as his fantasies build towards enaction. Given this, while he might have ceased physical offences, without significant therapeutic and behaviour change intervention intervention it is unlikely that his neurological wiring and tastes sexual stimuli have changed much, and we would anticipate he has addiction to extreme *advertiser censored* only available on the dark web where he could access that type of content, possibly engage in 'like-minded' social networks, maybe even mutually brag about past achievements to relive the excitement and fuel further fantasies.

Wow, some common sense! Thank you!

 

[jessicalouise]

BRE sought value for money items looking at his eBay purchases. He often purchased gadgets and LED assemblies from overseas (China, HK) and he arguably happy to sacrifice waiting on postage to obtain the wholesale price. A well-planned approach perhaps. What if that principle was applied to everything – value for money. Surely the Eagles membership was value for money, time spent crabbing, bare CPU specs for gaming, driving around in a work car, etc.

So where did his money go... IMO if there is a link to LB taken off the streets in Northbridge around midnight Monday night/Tuesday AM in November 1998 could suggest that CSK did have a proclivity for working girls but we don't know why – diversification, convenience. LB was the same age as SS when they were both lost to this world.

Palmerston Street and several streets of Highgate have been cleaned up a couple of times since then with a bunch of stings that compromised many stalker types. Nine men ranging from 20 to 72 were caught in Highgate as recently as 2013 trying to procure the services of working girls. Street workers may have represented best value for money to him. I wonder if CSK was known to police in one of the stings over the years. Was he the guy who was pulled over with the blitz kit in Northbridge? Either way CSK would have had to adapt.

Perhaps nefarious activities online under various pseudonyms (how many secret email accounts did he fire up?) to procure working girls as an outlet for his psycho-sexualis. Has a serial killer blogged here? I reckon there's more chance that a serial killer who has sought the services of working girls more likely has focussed his efforts covertly on sex sites as part of his everyday 'second life' to achieve his value for money. What if he was rough with the working girls? Surely someone would remember him. Someone said somewhere the family were known to police...

If CSK used the Indian Ocean for LB it would remove any triangulation, as with SS and any other poor soul that had the absolute misfortune to run into this psychopath. BRE is innocent until proven guilty – I also love the authenticity of science.

How old was he supposed to be at the time of death of CG? He was quite young, wasn't he? Perhaps with greater earning capacity came the tendency to veer towards working girls. Not only that but there is a high turnover of girls in the industry and many girls who travel who may only work briefly. And since LE don't really care about them well as well as to conveniently blame any deaths on "bikie actvity". Sex workers provide a smorgasboard of opportunities to rape and kill than "civilian" women don't.

Having worked in the industry before and also being in contact with LE i know that LE can be very, very out of touch with reality. There is also a distance from LE because many offences are not reported. They are either not reported at all or a dealt with "in house" so to speak (not literally, it's just a term we use.)

This is all speculation of course and MOO, but i think going down the track that he would only target a certain "type" of girl doesn't make any sense.

 

[PainExpress]

ShellyGale,
I have read your tendency to look towards 'outside substances' to explain the perpetrator's behaviour and lack of self-control, and while we can't rule this out and I would be happily proven incorrect, I think it is somewhat misguided. I would agree with you that the CSK is an addict - to dopamine. He is a serial sexual offender with offences which have started at a relatively young age, which means that as he was becoming sexualised (as an adolescent, or possibly even younger) he was relating to sex through a set of increasingly 'deviant' or distorted thoughts and fantasies. Over this period of time his neural pathways for sexual arousal and gratification would have become increasingly consolidated such that it would require exposure to increasingly strong and extreme sexual stimuli (mental, visual, physical) to achieve the same amount of dopamine release and arousal, hence the escalation in sexual offences. This would mean engaging in increasingly violent behaviours and taking greater risks. My point being that there does not need to be an additional substance to fuel his behaviour; his neurological wiring and brain's neurochemical thirst for dopamine release, and the influence and active indulgence in his thoughts and fantasies around sex and control more than explain this. To echo the thoughts of others, an introverted, emotionally avoidant, control-oriented and organised individual would not likely be a 'throw caution to the wind' risk taker, rather, it would more likely be that he would savour all aspects of the minutiae of his MO as his fantasies build towards enaction. Given this, while he might have ceased physical offences, without significant therapeutic and behaviour change intervention intervention it is unlikely that his neurological wiring and tastes sexual stimuli have changed much, and we would anticipate he has addiction to extreme *advertiser censored* only available on the dark web where he could access that type of content, possibly engage in 'like-minded' social networks, maybe even mutually brag about past achievements to relive the excitement and fuel further fantasies.

I reckon football can provide that level physical release as well. May account for more records of him playing in recent years rather than when he was younger and on the hunt.

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[Meloljo]

Re: comments about his modest house.

I was nearby the other day and thought I'd take a driveby the accused's house. I've seen the pictures online but what struck me on driving past was just how run down it was. Most of the other houses on the street are newer builds and relatively modern. The house itself looks like the kind of place old people hang on to with the intention of their children inherting and possibly sub-dividing and developing.

There was a big skip bin in the driveway too.

Dunno, it just seems like a very strange place for someone of his age with a steady job, with a wife and a child to be living.

Not really sure what conclusions to draw and I know that there are plenty of people that don't buy into material status. However, given that he's been in solid employment in what appears to be a decent job for his whole adult life, bought property when younger, had a wife (who may or may not have worked) and they brought up a child, on a scale of the type of house they could likely buy and probably want to buy, it would definitely be on the lower end. Say somewhere from a 2-4 out of 10.

Happy to have the comment picked apart but it is a touch unusual to me.

Perhaps he was saving a nest egg to fund a potential legal defense should he be arrested sometime in the future? Remember hes probably a control freak and would have thought ahead.

 

[pauldking]

So do you think it is likely he used the internet to discuss and choose working girls? Are there any relevant sites worth directing some WS effort into? Surely he would have been on the radar of several people if he was rough...

Here are some links on local streetwalker solicitation from 2010-13

Mayor says name and shame kerb crawlers in 2010
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2010-12-03/mayor-says-name-and-shame-kerb-crawlers/2362014

Police charge seven with soliciting offences in 2011
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-03-16/police-charge-seven-with-with-soliciting-offences/2654976

Nine charged in 2013 with seeking prostitutes in 2013
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-05-24/nine-charged-with-seeking-prostitutes-in-highgate/4711170

Interestingly some suburbs where offenders lived did not include Kewdale but there may be more cases in the early 2000s

 

[nini83]

Hmmm, dunno about world traveller. I'm getting a picture of a fairly unsophisticated bloke. Loves video games, footy and crabbing. It's possible, but not my hunch. My money's on a hooker addiction.

He could have a Pokie addiction... Crown isn't too far away


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[janwa]

ShellyGale,
I have read your tendency to look towards 'outside substances' to explain the perpetrator's behaviour and lack of self-control, and while we can't rule this out and I would be happily proven incorrect, I think it is somewhat misguided. I would agree with you that the CSK is an addict - to dopamine. He is a serial sexual offender with offences which have started at a relatively young age, which means that as he was becoming sexualised (as an adolescent, or possibly even younger) he was relating to sex through a set of increasingly 'deviant' or distorted thoughts and fantasies. Over this period of time his neural pathways for sexual arousal and gratification would have become increasingly consolidated such that it would require exposure to increasingly strong and extreme sexual stimuli (mental, visual, physical) to achieve the same amount of dopamine release and arousal, hence the escalation in sexual offences. This would mean engaging in increasingly violent behaviours and taking greater risks. My point being that there does not need to be an additional substance to fuel his behaviour; his neurological wiring and brain's neurochemical thirst for dopamine release, and the influence and active indulgence in his thoughts and fantasies around sex and control more than explain this. To echo the thoughts of others, an introverted, emotionally avoidant, control-oriented and organised individual would not likely be a 'throw caution to the wind' risk taker, rather, it would more likely be that he would savour all aspects of the minutiae of his MO as his fantasies build towards enaction. Given this, while he might have ceased physical offences, without significant therapeutic and behaviour change intervention intervention it is unlikely that his neurological wiring and tastes sexual stimuli have changed much, and we would anticipate he has addiction to extreme *advertiser censored* only available on the dark web where he could access that type of content, possibly engage in 'like-minded' social networks, maybe even mutually brag about past achievements to relive the excitement and fuel further fantasies.

Are you talking about him having a natural high level of dopamine in his brain or supplementing himself with dopamine?

 

[ShellyGale]

We'll see won't we, if and when the truth comes out. Certainly if there's any other illicit or criminal activity around BE or there has been, those people aren't going to be jumping up and down with their hands up in the air bringing attention to themselves. Nothing to see here, move along they will go to ground. And it seems like many have.

Wow, some common sense! Thank you!

 

[lampformypath]

I don't either. Bayview Club is actually a bit more interesting imo because there were so many sexual assaults actually around that club and the first rape victim KK had been there, not the Conti. I'm also curious that because this first rape which was denied for years as being linked but now is, if WAPol think perhaps all the girls were taken to the cemetery and died there. BE would think that was a safe place for him, he got away with it the first time and it's close to where all the girls were taken from.

You know ShelleyGale I thought this too about the cemetery being the spot for all 3 girls rapes and murders and then taken to the other different sites to throw WAPOL off. I'm wondering if it's part of his sick "ritual" in taking them to such a scary place. Important to him in some way? More fear factor, greater power/turn on for him? Wonder if cemeteries have been close by to other rapes/murders at the time the CSK was active (if he ever really stopped?) It's interesting too that the KK victim said that he did not speak at all to her? So words don't turn him on, i.e. degrading the victims with vulgar names, telling them their dirty, too high and mighty, etc. which seem to be the MO for a lot of rapists/killers. It helps them to work themselves up into a state whereby they can carry out their heinous crimes. I don't believe it's about hiding his identity as he had a bag over her head and he could disguise his voice anyway, so I wonder why he doesn't talk?. Would that break the fantasy he is carrying out in his mind, the concentration he requires to do his vile work? Everyone who has given a description of BRE says that he's "quiet", be interested to know what he's "listening to" in his head, perhaps some voices? Ala "Son of Sam" David Berkowitz,(who was found fit to stand trial), and others who said they could hear someone/thing/demon telling them what to do. Would love to read the psych report/s for BRE (as I think they have 2 reports, one for prosecution and one for defence). The arson bit keeps coming up too with these types of people, wonder if there is arson in BRE's early years? BUT, I don't think BRE can get away with any of this by saying he was insane at the time, he hid it so he knows he did it, in my book anyway!

 

[ShellyGale]

I think it was Mandy who looked and saw that there are Edwards buried at Karrakatta Cemetery, if they're his relatives he might know that place really well. Very creepy.

You know ShelleyGale I thought this too about the cemetery being the spot for all 3 girls rapes and murders and then taken to the other different sites to throw WAPOL off. I'm wondering if it's part of his sick "ritual" in taking them to such a scary place. Important to him in some way? More fear factor, greater power/turn on for him? Wonder if cemeteries have been close by to other rapes/murders at the time the CSK was active (if he ever really stopped?) It's interesting too that the KK victim said that he did not speak at all to her? So words don't turn him on, i.e. degrading the victims with vulgar names, telling them their dirty, too high and mighty, etc. which seem to be the MO for a lot of rapists/killers. It helps them to work themselves up into a state whereby they can carry out their heinous crimes. I don't believe it's about hiding his identity as he had a bag over her head and he could disguise his voice anyway, so I wonder why he doesn't talk?. Would that break the fantasy he is carrying out in his mind, the concentration he requires to do his vile work? Everyone who has given a description of BRE says that he's "quiet", be interested to know what he's "listening to" in his head, perhaps some voices? Ala "Son of Sam" David Berkowitz,(who was found fit to stand trial), and others who said they could hear someone/thing/demon telling them what to do. Would love to read the psych report/s for BRE (as I think they have 2 reports, one for prosecution and one for defence). The arson bit keeps coming up too with these types of people, wonder if there is arson in BRE's early years? BUT, I don't think BRE can get away with any of this by saying he was insane at the time, he hid it so he knows he did it, in my book anyway!

 

[CP345]

Are you talking about him having a natural high level of dopamine in his brain or supplementing himself with dopamine?

Dopamine is a naturally occurring chemical and the release of this chemical in the brain is what creates addicts. It can be released by various drugs or for some by certain activities. It's not something that you supplement directly, but you can stimulate its release.

 

[janwa]

Dopamine is a naturally occurring chemical and the release of this chemical in the brain is what creates addicts. It can be released by various drugs or for some by certain activities. It's not something that you supplement directly, but you can stimulate its release.

The reason I ask is that I have the one disorder of the brain that could excuse murder. I am prescribed dopamine to manage it.

 

[JoeDetective]

I actually agree with Harluna Steroids, where he played his footy or who he was in a relationship with at the time has no relevance with the crimes committed, as a friend of the brother of one of the girls murdered, the family was pestered with nutjobs early in the piece with allsorts of theories about the murders, mainly clairvoyants and psychics.

I don't think an expert would agree with you on that, all the information builds to an environment and mindset of an individual.
In terms of the clairvoyents and psychis, yes many would have been nutjobs but I am sure many genuinelly beleived they were helping, the families should send anyone suggesting they know where a dead body is directly to the police.

 

[JoeDetective]

I think it was Mandy who looked and saw that there are Edwards buried at Karrakatta Cemetery, if they're his relatives he might know that place really well. Very creepy.

Anyone who has lived 48 years in Perth would know karakatta cemetery quite well.

 

[meticulously]

I think it was Mandy who looked and saw that there are Edwards buried at Karrakatta Cemetery, if they're his relatives he might know that place really well. Very creepy.

1. Doubting he returned to the cemetary each time considering that would increase the risk of detection by the neighborhoods eyes after the kk rape .

2. Shellygal I think you should have just said ice user instead of steroids , Probably more chance & the acton house looks a bit den like .

Imo bra doesn't look like a junkie & he worked full time so I doubt a theory of drug addiction .

moo

.