Casey and Family Psych Profile #11

[Jaykayelle]

Forgive me if this has been discussed already. Are any of our experts of the opinion that KC and likely CA are borderline? I have the unfortunate privilege of being very well acquainted with BPD. It appears to me that it is quite possible. It would "explain" the narcissism, lying, stealing, denial, GA being a "doormat", etc. This family dynamic hits a little too close to home, only no one has ended up "out of the picture", IYKWIM.

 

[HMSHood]

Forgive me if this has been discussed already. Are any of our experts of the opinion that KC and likely CA are borderline? I have the unfortunate privilege of being very well acquainted with BPD. It appears to me that it is quite possible. It would "explain" the narcissism, lying, stealing, denial, GA being a "doormat", etc. This family dynamic hits a little too close to home, only no one has ended up "out of the picture", IYKWIM.

I am not a shrink by any means, but I get the impression at least with Casey Anthony that she is possibly borderline. I see Cindy as more of a "pure" narcissist with paranoid tendencies. Casey Amthony is more like Diane Downs and Lori Drew. Downs and Drew are likely borderline. JMO.

 

[Spice]

I am not an expert...just an armchair, but I always thought that she showed signs of BPD as well. Bigtime.

 

[Whisperer]

I am not an expert...just an armchair, but I always thought that she showed signs of BPD as well. Bigtime.

...You are likely correct. Malignant narcissism + Borderline = pure evil, in my book.

 

[Whisperer]

FCA is a splitter, which is definitely a red flag for Borderline Personality. For years, she split her family and caused nothing but problems. She played her father, brother and cindy against each other. To achieve her plan, she had to get rid of GA. I'm quite surprised he survived it all and is still there.

Apparently, Cindy needed him more than she needed fca. FCA sensed this and it drove her to what she did. She hated her father and wanted her mother away from him because her mother was easy for her to manipulate. When she had Caylee, Cindy's time and money were directed to the baby. To get even, fca took away the source of cindy's attention. I have no doubt, fca was furious over cindy and GA being together. IIRC. They had just got back together earlier that year. This fumed fca and her plans to break this whole thing apart. She started her plan in March, GA just having returned to the home in Jan/Feb.

GA was the only one of them that was not afraid to confront fca. I still say there was a strange relationship with the brother. Lee drifts between protecting her and trying to please his parents. Something is amiss there....for Lee will choose to love his sister over his parents if he had too. He is the only who felt the splitting more than anyone else...and has problems because of it...imo.

 

[HMSHood]

...You are likely correct. Malignant narcissism + Borderline = pure evil, in my book.

I have heard borderline narcissists are the worst kind of people. They are very manipulative, controlling, and destructive.

 

[HMSHood]

I almost don't want her to be diagnosed, because then all her supporter would have a reason to defend her - it's not her fault, it's the disorder...

I rather think of her as a nasty, mean, spiteful b$#*@ (in her own words) who knew exactly what she was doing and should be blamed for it to the fullest extend possible!

P.S. While background info is important - doctors do use rating scales that should show at least "something". I deal with rating scales on a daily basis and you can at least see some tendencies and irregularities in numbers.

There are times I wish I did not want to know Casey Anthony's or any other evil person's psychology.

 

[claudicici]

FCA is a splitter, which is definitely a red flag for Borderline Personality. For years, she split her family and caused nothing but problems. She played her father, brother and cindy against each other. To achieve her plan, she had to get rid of GA. I'm quite surprised he survived it all and is still there.

Apparently, Cindy needed him more than she needed fca. FCA sensed this and it drove her to what she did. She hated her father and wanted her mother away from him because her mother was easy for her to manipulate. When she had Caylee, Cindy's time and money were directed to the baby. To get even, fca took away the source of cindy's attention. I have no doubt, fca was furious over cindy and GA being together. IIRC. They had just got back together earlier that year. This fumed fca and her plans to break this whole thing apart. She started her plan in March, GA just having returned to the home in Jan/Feb.

GA was the only one of them that was not afraid to confront fca. I still say there was a strange relationship with the brother. Lee drifts between protecting her and trying to please his parents. Something is amiss there....for Lee will choose to love his sister over his parents if he had too. He is the only who felt the splitting more than anyone else...and has problems because of it...imo.

I have to disagree.To me it was CA in control of the whole situation.I don't think FCA was manipulating her mother,I think CA knew FCA was not working,knew all her lies just like she knew all GA's lies but wanted it that way.Because that's how she stayed in control and could play the victim at the same time.
I don't think FCA cared at all whether or not her parents were together or not.She just cared about herself and with Caylee around she would never have been able to break from CA's control.I don't think FCA has the ability to feel deep.It was not hard for her to murder her own precious baby and make believe it was all for the better

 

[Jaykayelle]

I have to disagree.To me it was CA in control of the whole situation.I don't think FCA was manipulating her mother,I think CA knew FCA was not working,knew all her lies just like she knew all GA's lies but wanted it that way.Because that's how she stayed in control and could play the victim at the same time.
I don't think FCA cared at all whether or not her parents were together or not.She just cared about herself and with Caylee around she would never have been able to break from CA's control.I don't think FCA has the ability to feel deep.It was not hard for her to murder her own precious baby and make believe it was all for the better

I think it's a little of both. Casey is a splitter. Black and white thinking, which is very typical of BPD. BPD folks tend to have people that they believe are "good" and ones that are "bad" in their lives. In my experience, that can even change rapidly. As an example, on Monday one particular person may be able to do no wrong, but another will be the whipping boy. On Tuesday, it's the other way around. I have also seen that BPD people have people in their lives that can do no right at all, ever. Sorry, a little off track here.

FCA probably thought she was in complete control. I think in a way she was manipulating CA. I believe that CA was aware of at least some of the lies FCA has told, but somehow wanted to deny them/sweep them under the rug/deal with them later. I think every so often CA's frustration with FCA would "build up" and that's when arguments happened. But for the most part, their relationship was one of those where FCA would get away with something and CA wouldn't call her out on it, so it kept going and going. Why change a pattern if it works, right? Also, I believe CA needed GA because he is easy to manipulate. He's CA's and FCA's life-long whipping boy. As for LA, that's a tough one. I think he was torn. Maybe he too shares some characteristics of the narcissism/controlling, etc., (because when your family is that way, it's "all you know", it's your "normal"), but perhaps was actually aware that this wasn't necessarily "normal". Dunno.

As for Caylee...she was a "whoops", so she was doomed from the beginning. IIRC, CA was willing to take full custody of Caylee after she was born. I believe that FCA felt that she would lose any control she believe she had if she allowed that to happen.

Regarding FCA's capability to have deep feelings...I believe she is capable of deep feelings of resentment. Overall, her feelings are quite shallow otherwise. Since she had her new love interest, TonE. She saw him as "all good". No room in that soul/brain for anymore than one "all good" person. Her thoughts at that time were that she'd do just about anything to keep him. He didn't want Caylee staying overnight at his apartment like FCA had done at Ricardo's. Thus, she became resentful of Caylee. Perhaps she already had resentment towards her due to her power struggle with CA. She resented CA too. I think the compound of resentment toward both Caylee and CA came to a head in June 2008. It had always been there, but this was the straw that broke the camel's back, so to speak. I believe FCA had a lot in her head that justified killing her daughter (typing that makes me emotional). And she has no remorse.

This is based on my personal experience with my mother having BPD and is also JMO.

 

[Whisperer]

I have to disagree.To me it was CA in control of the whole situation.I don't think FCA was manipulating her mother,I think CA knew FCA was not working,knew all her lies just like she knew all GA's lies but wanted it that way.Because that's how she stayed in control and could play the victim at the same time.
I don't think FCA cared at all whether or not her parents were together or not.She just cared about herself and with Caylee around she would never have been able to break from CA's control.I don't think FCA has the ability to feel deep.It was not hard for her to murder her own precious baby and make believe it was all for the better

Cindy definitely knew FCA wasnt working and also knew she was in the house all day. She even left it unchanged (did not change the locks) while she was gone. Cindy also knew Caylee was dead...as there were no clothes of Caylee removed or taken from the home.

Cindy and fca are enmeshed. It is hard to see where one ends and the other begins. They are both trouble, imo. They are both control freaks.

I think cindy was glad caylee was being babysat by fca all day, every day. It saved her from childcare expenses. I think fca considered herself a "nanny" and grew tired of her position. In fact, when I think about it, she described Zenaida in the way she wanted to look and live her life.

 

[Knot4u2no]

Forgive me if this has been discussed already. Are any of our experts of the opinion that KC and likely CA are borderline? I have the unfortunate privilege of being very well acquainted with BPD. It appears to me that it is quite possible. It would "explain" the narcissism, lying, stealing, denial, GA being a "doormat", etc. This family dynamic hits a little too close to home, only no one has ended up "out of the picture", IYKWIM.

Overall Findings: [Note: date should be 09/21/2008]

301.50 Histrionic Personality Disorder (r = +0.64), 301.81 Narcissistic Personality Disorder (r = +0.52), a prototypical 40-point Hare PCL-R (r = +0.44), 301.83 Borderline Personality Disorder (r = +0.40), and traits of 299.80 Asperger's Disorder (r = +0.20).

Partial Analysis: In light of the absence of any overall positive correlation with the characteristics of Antisocial Personality Disorder, this combination reveals a level of narcissism that rises to Psychopathy. In combination with the fact that 1) there is no irrational thinking based on paranoid characteristics, 2) no perceptual distortions associated with Schizotypal characteristics, 3) power and control issues are not those associated with a Paranoid Personality Disorder, and 4) Histrionic characteristics exceed Narcissistic characteristics, this is the profile of a person prone to dramatic, uninhibited and dangerous acting-out. This person is independent, proactive, flexible and socially engaging. This is a person with characteristics consistent with a socially engaging Psychopath who motivated by social and interpersonal control, direct or indirect. The mild Asperger's characteristics are very likely secondary to a lack of regard for others and a high sense of interpersonal entitlement.

http://www.crimsonshadows.net/index...casey&catid=27:profiling&Itemid=140&showall=1

My personal opinion,
Russell

 

[Jaykayelle]

Overall Findings:

301.50 Histrionic Personality Disorder (r = +0.64), 301.81 Narcissistic Personality Disorder (r = +0.52), a prototypical 40-point Hare PCL-R (r = +0.44), 301.83 Borderline Personality Disorder (r = +0.40), and traits of 299.80 Asperger's Disorder (r = +0.20).

Partial Analysis: In light of the absence of any overall positive correlation with the characteristics of Antisocial Personality Disorder, this combination reveals a level of narcissism that rises to Psychopathy. In combination with the fact that 1) there is no irrational thinking based on paranoid characteristics, 2) no perceptual distortions associated with Schizotypal characteristics, 3) power and control issues are not those associated with a Paranoid Personality Disorder, and 4) Histrionic characteristics exceed Narcissistic characteristics, this is the profile of a person prone to dramatic, uninhibited and dangerous acting-out. This person is independent, proactive, flexible and socially engaging. This is a person with characteristics consistent with a socially engaging Psychopath who motivated by social and interpersonal control, direct or indirect. The mild Asperger's characteristics are very likely secondary to a lack of regard for others and a high sense of interpersonal entitlement.

http://www.crimsonshadows.net/index...casey&catid=27:profiling&Itemid=140&showall=1

My personal opinion,
Russell

In the "Summary Conclusions", it indicates that she positively correlates with ADHD. That could explain the lack of regard for others (lack of empathy) and a high sense of entitlement. Both ADHD and Asperger's are dysfunctions related to executive functioning. Just thinking out loud.

I see this profile was created during Sept. 2008. Do you think we have learned anything significant about FCA since then that could change that profile?

JMO

 

[Jolynna]

The main symptom of Aspergers is a significant lack of social skills...not meeting people's eyes, not being able to communicate well, clumsy & odd use of language.

Casey was a social butterfly and a charmer. She showed no language clumsiness in her taped interview with the police at Universal. She was so GOOD if I didn't know better I would have believed her because SHE WAS SO SKILLFUL with her words.

My husband's best friend's daughter has Aspergers and attends a special school in San Francisco which I've visited.

I think Casey is the opposite of someone with Aspergers.

Visit your local county jail. I think you'd meet lots of charmers like Casey there. Many jail residents can tell stories that will tug at your heartstrings and make you believe they are the nicest and most unlucky, abused people ever. Nothing is EVER their fault either. Every one of them is wrongly convicted and will have a convincing story that you will want to believe.

You won't meet young people like that at the school for those with Aspergers.

In my opinion.

 

[Whisperer]

FCA is a malignant narcissist. There is no Aspergers, ADHD or any of that, IMO. She has a cluster B personality disorder. In looking at her writings, drawings and collections of art from the web, she has a macabre interest. She is evil. There is no diagnosis for evil, probably why she has never been labeled.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I think she's a psychopath.

IMO there is absolutely nothing special about her.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Knot4u2no]

In the "Summary Conclusions", it indicates that she positively correlates with ADHD. That could explain the lack of regard for others (lack of empathy) and a high sense of entitlement. Both ADHD and Asperger's are dysfunctions related to executive functioning. Just thinking out loud.

I see this profile was created during Sept. 2008. Do you think we have learned anything significant about FCA since then that could change that profile?

JMO

Although Casey’s BRACE Character Profile revealed some characteristics related to Asperger’s Disorder and ADHD, IMO, these characteristics are not strong diagnostic indicators and I do not believe either is a strong fit. The Histrionic, Narcissistic, and Borderline characteristics are a strong fit, as is a psychopath with predominant Narcissistic (rather than Antisocial) characteristics.

I do not think any new information about Casey would change my ratings of her BRACE Character Profile; however, a clinician with more direct information might rate her differently.

My personal opinions,
Russell

 

[Tulessa]

Although Casey’s BRACE Character Profile revealed some characteristics related to Asperger’s Disorder and ADHD, IMO, these characteristics are not strong diagnostic indicators and I do not believe either is a strong fit. The Histrionic, Narcissistic, and Borderline characteristics are a strong fit, as is a psychopath with predominant Narcissistic (rather than Antisocial) characteristics.

I do not think any new information about Casey would change my ratings of her BRACE Character Profile; however, a clinician with more direct information might rate her differently.

My personal opinions,
Russell

I love reading your posts. You make SO MUCH SENSE!

 

[HMSHood]

Overall Findings: [Note: date should be 09/21/2008]

301.50 Histrionic Personality Disorder (r = +0.64), 301.81 Narcissistic Personality Disorder (r = +0.52), a prototypical 40-point Hare PCL-R (r = +0.44), 301.83 Borderline Personality Disorder (r = +0.40), and traits of 299.80 Asperger's Disorder (r = +0.20).

Partial Analysis: In light of the absence of any overall positive correlation with the characteristics of Antisocial Personality Disorder, this combination reveals a level of narcissism that rises to Psychopathy. In combination with the fact that 1) there is no irrational thinking based on paranoid characteristics, 2) no perceptual distortions associated with Schizotypal characteristics, 3) power and control issues are not those associated with a Paranoid Personality Disorder, and 4) Histrionic characteristics exceed Narcissistic characteristics, this is the profile of a person prone to dramatic, uninhibited and dangerous acting-out. This person is independent, proactive, flexible and socially engaging. This is a person with characteristics consistent with a socially engaging Psychopath who motivated by social and interpersonal control, direct or indirect. The mild Asperger's characteristics are very likely secondary to a lack of regard for others and a high sense of interpersonal entitlement.

http://www.crimsonshadows.net/index...casey&catid=27:profiling&Itemid=140&showall=1

My personal opinion,
Russell

Good analysis! Histrionic and borderline are a form of narcissism. I always thought Casey Anthony was a borderline narcissist as she is volatile, insecure, and immature like Lori Drew or Diane Downs. I think there is a possibility that Casey Anthony is similar to Adam Lanza as they are immature and rageful.

 

[LolaMoon08]

The answer is simple for me. George and Cindy should have never reproduced. Their genetic make-up created their offspring. Although Lee is not a murdering sociopathic monster... he is very off and has issues of his own. I suggest Lee never reproduce either. And God forbid Casey ever has another child! The only hope I have if Casey is to ever have another child is that DCF has found her responsible for Caylee's death and that they take that child immediately. Also, the child should never be put into the hands of Cindy and George based on Casey accusations of George's molestation and Cindy's calling her a *advertiser censored* when finding out about it.

MOO

 

[BuzzieCat]

To achieve her plan, she had to get rid of GA. I'm quite surprised he survived it all and is still there.

(snip)

Maybe because GA's dead body would have been a lot harder to load into the trunk and subsequently toss into the swamp. :moo: Also would have been more difficult to hide his disappearance for 31 days to allow for decomp and destruction of evidence.