CO - James Holmes Trial Discussion - Begins April 27, 2015 # 7

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Mental Illness is extremely difficult to fully comprehend, as it doesn't just check one box of diagnosis. JH fits the age group of when symptoms manifest themselves and the brain seems to go haywire.

I have personally witnessed a family member become psychotic and delusional, and even after medications and psychiatric hospitalization, she still believes the self talk delusions. I found her condition extremely hard To comprehend as it was not even remotely rational. Psych is not my forte, nor do I have the patience that medical personnel require, let alone family members.
 
I wasn't sure so I googled it. This was the definition:

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I have some friends that are agnostic. They are unsure in their beliefs. They are not Atheist. They are not opposed to God. Basically there are in the middle of the spectrum.
 
Even if JH is found sane by the Jury LWOP is still an option for the Jurors to make. If that happens it was a complete waste of taxpayers money just like in the Jodi Arias trials to go this route. All it takes is one juror. JH was willing to take LWOP to not go to trial per his parents request. The state said no deal. This will most likely be the outcome anyway. They are trying to pass a law not to put Mentally ill criminals to death.
 
I believe JH has handcuffs on which are taken off before the court day starts. Maybe that's what you hear jingling? Them being taken off?


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I seem to remember that his feet are chained to the floor.
 
I do not understand why the state would not just accept a LWOP deal.

While it is fascinating to watch this trial, I wonder if the victims will truly benefit in the long run by having this trial (and all that it entails), or if they would have been better served just having him locked away and fading into some level of obscurity.

I wonder what the future JH's will learn by being able to watch this trial.
 
My guess? Considering JH's intelligence and that he seemed to struggle with hiding his mental illness (pages of why in the notebook scream that imo), any future JH's hopefully will get help, but might struggle harder. If mental illness were looked at as an illness like it is, (no one would tell someone with cancer to "man up" or "shake it off", it'd be treated), then we wouldn't have JH's.
 
The sad thing is that mass shooters study, emulate, and inspire each other. The more info that is out there about each particular one... well, more for the next one to use in their planning.
 
Yep he is also harnessed down his trouser leg.


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I wonder if he was chained to the floor with the Dr? It didn't look like his hands were cuffed. If he wasn't I might be a tad nervous if I was the Dr taking his pulse and doing the eyes dilation test. But maybe by not being restrained builds a patient and Dr trust relationship. There was probably an armed deputy in the room and outside the door.
 
The sad thing is that mass shooters study, emulate, and inspire each other. The more info that is out there about each particular one... well, more for the next one to use in their planning.

That's a good point. I actually just read about that in the book "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin De Becker ---which I highly recommend, BTW. The author is an expert at recognizing pre-violent behaviors and owns a security firm that protects high profile and high risk families and government officials.

Something else I read in the book & found interesting...
A person who sees no other alternatives but violence will likely become violent in the immediate future; it's one of the strongest pre-violent indicators that exists. He wrote... "A person who feels there are no alternatives will fight even when violence is not justified, even when the consequences are perceived as unfavorable, and even when the ability to prevail is low."

JH made a list of "alternatives to death" in his notebook, and under his list... he wrote, "Despite knowing death is false and a suboptimal response, I couldn't find a working alternative."

The author actually talked about several things I think are true of JH... in my personal opinion, of course.

Here's a few of them...

People never, ever "just snap". There's a process as observable as bringing water to a boil.

Many violent criminals have self-defeating personalities. It's as if he expects people to slight or harm him. This causes him to alienate himself, which causes others to treat him as he expects them to.

For mass murderers, it's not the target, destination, or journey that matters... it is the act itself.

Mass murderers don't fear going to jail, they fear they're going to fail and that is unacceptable to them. Every cell of the MMs being shouts extreme narcissism. He is too self-absorbing and relentless to fail and is expressed at the heart of him... a desire to stand out and be in control.

He wants what everyone wants: recognition and significance. Individuals who don't get that feeling as a child seek ways to get it as an adult. It's as if they've been malnourished for a lifetime and seek to fix it with one huge meal.
*(I found this to be extremely significant when JH mentioned the reasoning behind his "parasuicide" in his psych interview. He said he did it because he didn't feel like he was being listened to and felt like his opinion didn't matter about his family's decision to move to San Diego... he mentioned not wanting to leave his friends and make new ones.)

Behaviors common to all mass murders:
They display some form of mental illness
They research their target
They create a diary, journal, or record
They obtain weapons
They display an exaggerated sense of self (grandiosity or narcissism)
They identify with a past villain or assassin
They have the ability to circumvent security
*(JH was able to do this--in his mind--by creating a diversion at his apartment prior to the shooting.)

The entire book was very informative and insightful.
 
I'm trying to read his notebook again. On page 12 of PDF but actually page 34 of notebook 3rd paragraph down. It says concern with c**k (male part) accidents suffered as child. Then it says allergic reaction to sex? I can't read the rest of the paragraph. Can Anyone else read it? Strange stuff.

http://extras.denverpost.com/trial/docs/notebook.pdf
 
I'm trying to read his notebook again. On page 12 of PDF but actually page 34 of notebook 3rd paragraph down. It says concern with c**k (male part) accidents suffered as child. Then it says allergic reaction to sex? I can't read the rest of the paragraph. Can Anyone else read it? Strange stuff.

http://extras.denverpost.com/trial/docs/notebook.pdf

I transcribed the entire thing (to the best of my ability) because his handwriting was extremely hard to read. After typing it out, it made more sense to me as a whole. I'm not saying what he wrote made any sense whatsoever... but it made sense in a way that tied the gibberish or mindless rambling pages together for me and gave me a better understanding of what I believe he was thinking when he wrote it.

ETA: You are reading that right. And you're also correct about it being strange stuff!
 
I transcribed the entire thing (to the best of my ability) because his handwriting was extremely hard to read. After typing it out, it made more sense to me as a whole. I'm not saying what he wrote made any sense whatsoever... but it made sense in a way that tied the gibberish or mindless rambling pages together for me and gave me a better understanding of what I believe he was thinking when he wrote it.

ETA: You are reading that right. And you're also correct about it being strange stuff!

Thanks do you have a link to your transcription? I want to know what that paragraph says. Lol.
 
Thanks do you have a link to your transcription? I want to know what that paragraph says. Lol.

I don't have a link but I can copy & paste it in a PM & send it to you that way if you want me to.
 
I transcribed the entire thing (to the best of my ability) because his handwriting was extremely hard to read. After typing it out, it made more sense to me as a whole. I'm not saying what he wrote made any sense whatsoever... but it made sense in a way that tied the gibberish or mindless rambling pages together for me and gave me a better understanding of what I believe he was thinking when he wrote it.

ETA: You are reading that right. And you're also correct about it being strange stuff!


I would love to read your entire transcription! That would help greatly. Which ever format is easiest for you. Feel free to pm me. Thx!
 
I would love to read your entire transcription! That would help greatly. Which ever format is easiest for you. Feel free to pm me. Thx!

I would as well--if you dont mind :)
 
I seem to remember that his feet are chained to the floor.

Does Holmes have a record of attacking his jailers or violently acting out against the people in a courtroom setting? Not as far as I know. I view this as nothing more than an attempt to demonize the defendant as some sort of rabid dog who is so out-of-control he must be chained down. The dense attorney is remiss in not demanding an end to this treatment.
 
I don't have a link but I can copy & paste it in a PM & send it to you that way if you want me to.

Would you mind sending just the pages hard to understand.?

Is there a way to post your version online and then send a link for everyone to view.?

Thank you
 
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