CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct. 2012 - #22

[DylansMom34]

one stupid question, how does a kid get addicted to *advertiser censored* esp gory *advertiser censored*?
no parental settings?
maybe I am stupid, I have raised 1 son. 4 grandsons and many of their friends around.
yes, all boys have that curiosity of sex but to get that far involved?
was he not into sports? friends? normal boy stuff?
did he just spend all his extra time looking at *advertiser censored*?
amazes me.......

I don't know if most parents are like me, but my 11 year old son is far more internet/ technology savy. I have some security settings and my husband and I go through the history to make sure he's only accessing the things we have said ok to. However, I'm sure as he gets older and interested in more adult type themes, it will probably be more difficult to stay on top of everything he does.

I think lots and lots of parents don't have the technology knowledge to even know how to check what their kids do.

 

[nursebeeme]

I don't know if most parents are like me, but my 11 year old son is far more internet/ technology savy. I have some security settings and my husband and I go through the history to make sure he's only accessing the things we have said ok to. However, I'm sure as he gets older and interested in more adult type themes, it will probably be more difficult to stay on top of everything he does.

I think lots and lots of parents don't have the technology knowledge to even know how to check what their kids do.

ita (bbm)... we have K9 web protection (it is free) and it is WONDERFUL. It even barks if a banned website comes up (you can choose your areas to be verboten according to content) I am just sharing this with you all as my bil who is in the computer biz recommended it... and it truly gives peace of mind (it also cannot be deleted by tech savy teens LOL)

 

[SurfieTX]

one stupid question, how does a kid get addicted to *advertiser censored* esp gory *advertiser censored*?
no parental settings?
maybe I am stupid, I have raised 1 son. 4 grandsons and many of their friends around.
yes, all boys have that curiosity of sex but to get that far involved?
was he not into sports? friends? normal boy stuff?
did he just spend all his extra time looking at *advertiser censored*?
amazes me.......

Based on his online footprint, this kid was pretty well educated and versed with computers - far beyond most adults' knowledge. He would have had absolutely NO problem circumventing any parental settings or parental restriction programs.

Some kids just aren't very social growing up. I wasn't. I preferred to read (way before computers came around) and listen to music. I never participated in a sport or joined a club. I only had a about 3 close friends. Some people are introverts like that, and I can't blame his parents for choosing to view him in that light as long as he was functioning on a peripheral level (that they saw). I've made a lot of comparisons to BTK, and I do think these 2 are very similar. BTK hid his dark thoughts, "Factor X" for a long time before acting out, and by all societal standards before his first murder was an upstanding citizen. Hell, he was even "upstanding" after the murders - boy scout leader, church leader, husband, father and community worker.

 

[SurfieTX]

ita (bbm)... we have K9 web protection (it is free) and it is WONDERFUL. It even barks if a banned website comes up (you can choose your areas to be verboten according to content) I am just sharing this with you all as my bil who is in the computer biz recommended it... and it truly gives peace of mind (it also cannot be deleted by tech savy teens LOL)

O/T, but Nurse, will you ask him if this program works with the "deep web?" I think AS was heavily into the dungeon down there.

 

[ImWithTheBand]

one stupid question, how does a kid get addicted to *advertiser censored* esp gory *advertiser censored*?
no parental settings?
maybe I am stupid, I have raised 1 son. 4 grandsons and many of their friends around.
yes, all boys have that curiosity of sex but to get that far involved?
was he not into sports? friends? normal boy stuff?
did he just spend all his extra time looking at *advertiser censored*?
amazes me.......

I think the gory *advertiser censored* thing was a speculation. And I have sort of had an opinion on the whole "*advertiser censored* addiction" report anyway. Even if he was treated for a supposed *advertiser censored* addiction, it wasn't a legal charge and really no way to say whether or not it's true. I believe that for some people, anything can be seen as an "addiction". Somebody's mama may be so against it that looking at Playboy every month when it comes in the mail could be considered a sick "addiction". (and yes I have met people that are convinced THAT is an addiction). If a parent sought treatment for a teenage boy, it doesn't necessarily mean it's as bad as we all picture in our minds an "addiction" to be. Do I think ASR is a sick @*(&!? ~ABSOLUTELY! But I am just not so sure about all that addiction stuff. Just my random thoughts..

 

[nursebeeme]

O/T, but Nurse, will you ask him if this program works with the "deep web?" I think AS was heavily into the dungeon down there.

this one will absolutely block it. My son basically cannot go anywhere unless I put it in the settings. It also cannot be deleted or removed (my dh tried and he is a signal officer in the army). You can even get it for phones.

 

[Victoriouswon]

I don't think the 'creation' of this monster had a thing in the world to do with 'parenting'....sometimes there is just pure evil.....

One always can argue the percentages of 'nature' vs. 'nurture'....this was one pure sick F##&....

Maybe his Dad wasn't a role-model citizen, so what....

And at the end of the day, kudos to his Mom for turning him in....

I am studying psychology and I remembered that infants are born with a temperament and depending on that temperament is how they are treated by their parents which affects their entire life. I am not making excuses but I am trying to understand.

In my family I was born very shy-therefore I was ignored at all family gatherings which made me even more shy. I have no self-esteem then or now. My older brother was very outgoing and everyone loved him and he grew up to be very popular and the captain of every team. He is very successful today and I am a hermit. He has thousands of friends and I have 2.

As for my children, my oldest was ( and still is at age 23) easygoing, sweet, never gave me a moment's trouble. My second daughter is hell on wheels-from birth to now (age 19), My last child, a boy, is much like me. And honestly I've treated them all different and still do today- partly because of their inborn temperament. I react to their nature and no matter than I tried to parent them the same (same rules,same attention) it is every different for all 3.

Based on what we know about AS so far, I wonder if he was born with a off temperament that was not compatible with either parent and he suffered from not having enough nurture or the right kind of nurture for his needs.

Let me be clear- I am in no way excusing his heinous behavior or excusing his parents, I am simply trying to understand how this can happen.

http://www.washingtonparent.com/articles/1001/temperament.php

 

[SurfieTX]

This is the kind of computer stuff AS was into - very technical:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field-programmable_gate_array

 

[GrainneDhu]

I'm really curious how the below bolded phrase will be interpretted for Sigg in sentencing. My understanding is that he could be eligible for 40+ years in prison. That would make him 57 ... but that's life for some people. Without a cap for life expectancy, this seems too vague.

"The Supreme Court of the United States, in the June ruling in the Miller v. Alabama case, decided that mandatory life sentences without the possibility of parole are unconstitutional for juvenile offenders. Additionally, the Supreme Court ruled in Roper v. Simmons that the death penalty was cruel and unusual for people who committed crimes while under the age of 18."

http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/world/...cted-killer-of-jessica-ridgeway#ixzz2AtlskGmm

It seems pretty clear to me. I am a layman not a lawyer, so what do I know?

To me, what the Supreme Court said was that life without parole cannot be automatically applied to minors. If the state where the minor was convicted allows for life without parole for a specific crime, a minor cannot automatically receive that sentence.

It does not say that minors cannot receive a life without parole sentence. I believe that it means that a judge or jury must consider all factors pertaining to the specific minor before imposing a life without parole sentence.

So far as the role of life expectancy in sentencing, my impression is that it is not considered a factor because no one really knows how long someone else will live. And no one really knows what medical advances will happen to drastically prolong life expectancy.

 

[nursebeeme]

It seems pretty clear to me. I am a layman not a lawyer, so what do I know?

To me, what the Supreme Court said was that life without parole cannot be automatically applied to minors. If the state where the minor was convicted allows for life without parole for a specific crime, a minor cannot automatically receive that sentence.

It does not say that minors cannot receive a life without parole sentence. I believe that it means that a judge or jury must consider all factors pertaining to the specific minor before imposing a life without parole sentence.

So far as the role of life expectancy in sentencing, my impression is that it is not considered a factor because no one really knows how long someone else will live. And no one really knows what medical advances will happen to drastically prolong life expectancy.

ita: I watched a video clip on either denver nbc or abc this morning and it basically said that someone who was found guilty of crimes like this would never see the light of day again... in other words sure they may be able to go up for parole but they will never get it.... (he said it had to do with the nature/severity/etc of the crimes)

 

[GrainneDhu]

I think the gory *advertiser censored* thing was a speculation. And I have sort of had an opinion on the whole "*advertiser censored* addiction" report anyway. Even if he was treated for a supposed *advertiser censored* addiction, it wasn't a legal charge and really no way to say whether or not it's true. I believe that for some people, anything can be seen as an "addiction". Somebody's mama may be so against it that looking at Playboy every month when it comes in the mail could be considered a sick "addiction". (and yes I have met people that are convinced THAT is an addiction). If a parent sought treatment for a teenage boy, it doesn't necessarily mean it's as bad as we all picture in our minds an "addiction" to be. Do I think ASR is a sick @*(&!? ~ABSOLUTELY! But I am just not so sure about all that addiction stuff. Just my random thoughts..

I agree.

Saying "*advertiser censored* addiction" alone doesn't give me enough context to understand what is meant, let alone how it may have factored into the crime.

I would need to know what specific behaviours led to his being diagnosed as addicted to *advertiser censored*, who made the diagnosis, what their qualifications and philosophy is, etc.

 

[LotusPawprint]

Lots and lots and lots of people have mental illness at some point in their life.

For a lot of people (me) luckily it takes the relatively mild form, depression, which is easily treated and managed.

For others it is not so easy, they have paranoid delusions, visions, hear voices, all sorts of terrible stuff.

These people are overwhelmingly non violent...or, only violent to themselves.

They too can live a normal life but it takes a whole lot more medical intervention and managing to do so.

There is a section of mental illness also called Narcissistic Personality Disorder, NPD. We ALL know someone with this...or hypochondria, or borderline personality disorder, or even psycopathy or sociopathy.

It is very, very common.

What is not common, is to become a raping, dismembering hunter.

If ARS was truly "mentally ill" as we commonly define it, he would have shown a great many signs of his illness. His previous behaviour would have been bizarre, not fairly normal and productive as it seems so far. He would have likely been hearing voices, perhaps talking back to them, doing other strange acts, and be clearly in the grip of a some sort of episode.

This did not happen.

He is a perfectly sane teenage boy who just happens to have decided to become a rapist and murderer. He seems to show no emotion about the whole thing apart from boredom and possibly annoyance at being caught.

If he does have a mental illness as such, it would fall under the banner of sociopathy. I imagine he was just born wired wrong, and maybe it didn't come out till his teens...or maybe we will find the sociopathic behaviour was there from infancy.

:dunno:

There is more and more research indicating that this tendency can be a symptom of brain damage.

If one or another parent used a lot of recreational drugs, even before he was conceived, he could have inherited damaged DNA.

Either way, he needs to be kept out of society permanently. He has lost his right to be "one of us".

But we really need to stop using the blanket "mentally ill" when discussing this freak...it's offensive to a lot of people.

ITA with you and your post expresses my thoughts much much clearer than I would have myself! TY!

On a somewhat related note, I notice terms like "crazy" "psychotic" "insane" are used quite often in everyday language and the words get watered down. I think the overuse of these words in everyday use as well as misuse and misunderstanding when discussed in cases of freaks like this monster give legitimate mental illness a bad name.

To clarify: I'm NOT talking about WS. I hear this in real life and when I would post on or read other forums (facebook was the worst), everyone was a sociopath or a psychopath or bipolar. It bothers me when those terms are used interchangably for criminal or without basis. As does the overuse of the insanity defense in criminal court as well as the rising trend of criminal defendants being diagnosed with mental illnesses (unfounded, imo). This devalues people who really suffer from mental illness and heaven forbid commit an offense as a result, should require that defense.

As you said, AS is clearly not right. I think all of the nurture/nature issues are completely relevant and should be examined. But he's not "just" mentally ill and he needs to be caged for the rest of his dangerous vile life... he is a monster who made these choices and the duty of our "justice" system is to keep our society safe from him for the rest of his life. Jessica paid with her life to expose this monster, it's the least we owe her to ensure he dies in a cell.

 

[SurfieTX]

Something was feeding this dude's fantasies over the years whether it be the internet, *advertiser censored* or his imagination, or a combination of all 3. I say this because he said outright that he didn't get the "joy" he felt he would feel with just the kill (and now that the sexual assault has come out, who knows what order this horrific event unfolded). He also started to become a little more visible and vocal about his death obsession based on his friend's statements and his expressed desire for a profession.

 

[nursebeeme]

I just reread Alyssa Bustamonte's thread (re: her sentencing) and it gives me hope for what lies ahead for Sigg (re: it is my opinion he will never be looking at anything but bars just like Alyssa... who btw... was 15 when she murdered Elizabeth)

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105756&page=3


(also, there is news today from the case at the end of the thread)

this may be slightly off topic but in the scheme of things may be interesting reading in the interim. :twocents:

 

[Confusion]

I believe that may vary by state. Iowa does not publically have minors on the registry that I am aware of. CO may be different though...

Actually, that's not true. If you look at Iowa's most wanted in the registry, the ages of some of the offenders when the act was committed are: one 12 yr-old, one 13 yr-old, two 14 yr-old, one 15 yr-old, one 16 yr-old, and at least two 17 yr-olds. I think that's where the one who was 8 was also listed, but he may have moved to another state or something because I didn't see him when I checked this time.

 

[i.b.nora]

This is the kind of computer stuff AS was into - very technical:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field-programmable_gate_array

I am curious about this and because I have followed this case fairly closely, is there a link to a MSM article or interview that specifies that 'this is the kind of computer stuff' Austin Sigg was into? Thanks in advance. I do not remember seeing such a thing and would like to listen to or read about it.

 

[otto]

one stupid question, how does a kid get addicted to *advertiser censored* esp gory *advertiser censored*?
no parental settings?
maybe I am stupid, I have raised 1 son. 4 grandsons and many of their friends around.
yes, all boys have that curiosity of sex but to get that far involved?
was he not into sports? friends? normal boy stuff?
did he just spend all his extra time looking at *advertiser censored*?
amazes me.......

I too am surprised. It seems that he needed more direction and supervision than he had, but I think that it can be very challenging for a single parent to manage work, finances and children's schedules. What is important is that the problem was identified and that steps were taken to help Austin through counseling. Unfortunately, something went wrong, and his obsession became worse rather than better. I get the impression that he simply internalized the problem and became more secretive ... and that should not have happened if a qualified therapist was working with him.

 

[Dee10]

IIRC the only we know from the MSM is he received some sort professional help for a *advertiser censored* addiction when he was 15 and he sometimes "worked on" (whatever that means) computers after school. That is all I recall.

 

[SurfieTX]

I am curious about this and because I have followed this case fairly closely, is there a link to a MSM article or interview that specifies that 'this is the kind of computer stuff' Austin Sigg was into? Thanks in advance. I do not remember seeing such a thing and would like to listen to or read about it.

No, no MSM link. I just followed his footprints on the web and found out what he and his gamer friends were into.

 

[otto]

This is the kind of computer stuff AS was into - very technical:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field-programmable_gate_array

Taking a stab in the dark here, but is that some sort of plug in that can be used to modify maps/tasks in game environments? If it is, isn't that a pretty common mapping tool for gamers to use?