Do you think this case will ever be solved?

[Solace]

Solace,

The golf bag was taken in as evidence by the cops.

BlueCrab

Okay, then with some of the things that the sister picked up and filled up the trunk of the car with.

 

[kaykay]

Does anyone know if there's a list of names who's DNA was taken?
Also, did they take DNA from children of the R's friends?

Thanks For Any Help,

kaykay

 

[BlueCrab]

Okay, then with some of the things that the sister picked up and filled up the trunk of the car with.

Solace,

Possibly. Pam Paugh carried out her police-sanctioned raid on the evidence on the 28th. The cops had searched much of the house by then for the obvious items of evidence. However, Pam, with directions from John and Patsy, knew where to look for the less obvious items of evidence.

BlueCrab

 

[BlueCrab]

Does anyone know if there's a list of names who's DNA was taken?
Also, did they take DNA from children of the R's friends?

Thanks For Any Help,

kaykay

kaykay,

I'm sure there is a list of names, but I doubt if it's been made public. And yes, there were children who were friends of the Ramseys whose DNA was taken. There have been well over 100 DNA samples taken, but that's only half of the story. What's more important is: How many have been tested?

DNA samples are quick and inexpensive to take, but are expensive to have tested. So I wonder how many samples are sitting in storage untested since there's no money in the Boulder budget to pursue an active investigation in the Ramsey case.

Remember, there were two blood stains in the crotch of JonBenet's underwear, but only one spot, the largest, had been tested by the BPD, apparently for cost reasons. The second, smaller, male, foreign, mixed blood stain was tested years later and yielded more evidence than the first one. It helped give up enough DNA markers (10) to finally enter the sample into the FBI's CODIS system (even though 13 markers are preferred).

BlueCrab

 

[coloradokares]

I too agree that it was an "inside job". But that doesn't exclude the evidence that points to a fifth person having been invited into the house by a Ramsey that night -- and that person being the killer.

For instance, how did all of that missing crime scene evidence (black duct tape, white nylon cord, nine notebook pages, tip of the paintbrush handle, a stun gun, etc.) get out of the house? How did the ransom note get written in the house, yet the handwriting of no one living in the house can be positively matched to the writing in the note?

And why was the outside security light turned off that night (for the first time in years)?

BlueCrab

OK I'll help you out on this. There was no evidence anyone but the four were there at all. Not even an small foreign faction behind the drapes. As to the evidence they had all night to stash a few items after staging was complete before they called 911.....Then Aunt Pam comes to retrieve funeral clothes and out goes a few items along with the kitchen sink. I think someone living in the house wrote the ransom note and I think we all know who it is. If we don't we are grabbing at straws from experts without anymore expertise than pfffft paid for by team Ramsey.

I think you'd have to ask them why they turned the light out. Whoever you might think they is. I know who I'd ask.

 

[coloradokares]

Solace,

The golf bag was taken in as evidence by the cops.

BlueCrab

One golf bag left with Aunt Pam.

 

[coloradokares]

kaykay,

I'm sure there is a list of names, but I doubt if it's been made public. And yes, there were children who were friends of the Ramseys whose DNA was taken. There have been well over 100 DNA samples taken, but that's only half of the story. What's more important is: How many have been tested?

DNA samples are quick and inexpensive to take, but are expensive to have tested. So I wonder how many samples are sitting in storage untested since there's no money in the Boulder budget to pursue an active investigation in the Ramsey case.

Remember, there were two blood stains in the crotch of JonBenet's underwear, but only one spot, the largest, had been tested by the BPD, apparently for cost reasons. The second, smaller, male, foreign, mixed blood stain was tested years later and yielded more evidence than the first one. It helped give up enough DNA markers (10) to finally enter the sample into the FBI's CODIS system (even though 13 markers are preferred).

BlueCrab

I'd like to know how you know it was budgetary reasons. I don't think us taxpayers would like to pursue that statement to find out it was not the gospel. Have you got something that proves these were budgetary line item exclusions in this investigation or is this an opinion you hold. I always felt if there was evidence not processed it was cause they know the facts .....

 

[Solace]

One golf bag left with Aunt Pam.

I thought so Colorado. But I was not positive. Thank You.

You know Colorado I was thinking again about this case and all the theories going around. The Ramsey Team did an excellent job in putting doubt in people's minds. I mean we have people questioning why they are going to Michigan, and I understand the questioning, but it shows just how much one can get away from the truth, imo. I really believe this is a rage crime and Patsy did it and John helped her. I do not think too many others know about the actual happenings (meaning family members). John is not stupid. He did not get where he is by being stupid. He is very good at manipulating interviewers and wins most of the time. I do not think John and Patsy are going to elicit conspiracy from anyone else - it makes them too vulnerable.

I just don't believe that John would compromise himself by strangling his daughter in a sex act. I believe he would help Patsy - I am sure she was insane in eliciting his help and he felt for her. One detective I watched recently said crime scenes are 90% of the time usually what they seem. Sometimes there is an "out there" reason for the crime, but most of the time, it is what it seems.

It has been 10 years and no evidence of an intruder. We see that Patsy lied, John lied and Berke changed his story. Why, because something awful happened that night and in their minds, there is no reason to make it worse by taking Patsy away from Berke.

 

[BlueCrab]

I'd like to know how you know it was budgetary reasons. I don't think us taxpayers would like to pursue that statement to find out it was not the gospel. Have you got something that proves these were budgetary line item exclusions in this investigation or is this an opinion you hold. I always felt if there was evidence not processed it was cause they know the facts .....

coloradokares,

The cops likely thought they had the facts since the two blood stains were both in the crotch, so they tested just one of them.

I have no information about line-item exclusions in regard to processing evidence in the Ramsey case, but my common sense tells me they don't have an endless amount of money to throw at just one murder case. Boulder hasn't budgeted as much as a nickel on an active investigation in the Ramsey case for about the last five years. In fact, Boulder has been in financial peril for years now and I doubt if an active investigation will ever be launched again.

Here's how Boulder police spending on the Ramsey murder unfolded during the height of the investigation:

1996: $21,000
1997: $531,000
1998: $631,000
1999: $238,000
2000: $146,000
2001: $41,000

BlueCrab

 

[coloradokares]

I thought so Colorado. But I was not positive. Thank You.

You know Colorado I was thinking again about this case and all the theories going around. The Ramsey Team did an excellent job in putting doubt in people's minds. I mean we have people questioning why they are going to Michigan, and I understand the questioning, but it shows just how much one can get away from the truth, imo. I really believe this is a rage crime and Patsy did it and John helped her. I do not think too many others know about the actual happenings (meaning family members). John is not stupid. He did not get where he is by being stupid. He is very good at manipulating interviewers and wins most of the time. I do not think John and Patsy are going to elicit conspiracy from anyone else - it makes them too vulnerable.

I just don't believe that John would compromise himself by strangling his daughter in a sex act. I believe he would help Patsy - I am sure she was insane in eliciting his help and he felt for her. One detective I watched recently said crime scenes are 90% of the time usually what they seem. Sometimes there is an "out there" reason for the crime, but most of the time, it is what it seems.

It has been 10 years and no evidence of an intruder. We see that Patsy lied, John lied and Berke changed his story. Why, because something awful happened that night and in their minds, there is no reason to make it worse by taking Patsy away from Berke.

I think that is when you separate the wheat from the chaff..and blow the rest away, what remains. Only it is possible that John or Patsy herself realizing that a coroner would take possesion of JonBenets lifeless body and do and autopsy would uncover sexual abuse or corporal wiping abuse or even a few too many times of the kids playing doctor.... and made some effort through staging to obscure it. There are more twists and turns to this whole thing than my current screen saver. (Pipes) I can never forget Holly Smith the sexual abuse officer relating how nearly every pair of underwear in the drawers was soiled. That is a RED FLAG like you cannot believe to sexual abuse. And that just can't be dismissed. JonBenet was acting out cause JonBenet was being hurt. And that makes me sooooooo ill its hard to even describe. My grandaughter was only a few months older than JonBenet. If I ever thought for a moment someone had hurt her. Well it would not go well for them ......lets just put it that way.

 

[Solace]

I think that is when you separate the wheat from the chaff..and blow the rest away, what remains. Only it is possible that John or Patsy herself realizing that a coroner would take possesion of JonBenets lifeless body and do and autopsy would uncover sexual abuse or corporal wiping abuse or even a few too many times of the kids playing doctor.... and made some effort through staging to obscure it. There are more twists and turns to this whole thing than my current screen saver. (Pipes) I can never forget Holly Smith the sexual abuse officer relating how nearly every pair of underwear in the drawers was soiled. That is a RED FLAG like you cannot believe to sexual abuse. And that just can't be dismissed. JonBenet was acting out cause JonBenet was being hurt. And that makes me sooooooo ill its hard to even describe. My grandaughter was only a few months older than JonBenet. If I ever thought for a moment someone had hurt her. Well it would not go well for them ......lets just put it that way.

Your grandaughter is very lucky!

 

[Albert18]

Will this case ever be solved?

Not formally, but on the street, yes. Today, I doubt few people really think there was a stranger in Lizzie Borden's house swinging an ax that day.

However this case has caused people to dig their foxholes much deeper than normal. I think John could announce tomorrow what really happened and if it didn't match what some people thought then they would not believe him. The same would be true if any of the kids eventually say anything. Especially if they point a finger at Patsy. You would hear, they are covering for Burke, they are covering for John, etc.

 

[coloradokares]

Will this case ever be solved?

Not formally, but on the street, yes. Today, I doubt few people really think there was a stranger in Lizzie Borden's house swinging an ax that day.

However this case has caused people to dig their foxholes much deeper than normal. I think John could announce tomorrow what really happened and if it didn't match what some people thought then they would not believe him. The same would be true if any of the kids eventually say anything. Especially if they point a finger at Patsy. You would hear, they are covering for Burke, they are covering for John, etc.

I honestly don't think so. I think the majority of people are ready to hear the truth. But we are not prepared to hear more of the same old same old. We want the truth we need the truth and we want to act on the truth and give JonBenet some semblance of justice, peace and dignity. As it is..... with the extreme passage of time and the way they focus on Little JonBenet's pageant persona like that is who JonBenet was..... NO I think many of us just want to see justice done so JonBenet at long last can be the sweet little innocent child she really was and may she rest in peace Justice done. If there is anyone that should serve time at the end of it. Then they have had enough freedom. How can they stand it and not turn themselves in for Heavens sake. If this person is gone then let that be known too. Someone killed JonBenet there is no justice in COLD CASE.

 

[Solace]

Will this case ever be solved?

Not formally, but on the street, yes. Today, I doubt few people really think there was a stranger in Lizzie Borden's house swinging an ax that day.

However this case has caused people to dig their foxholes much deeper than normal. I think John could announce tomorrow what really happened and if it didn't match what some people thought then they would not believe him. The same would be true if any of the kids eventually say anything. Especially if they point a finger at Patsy. You would hear, they are covering for Burke, they are covering for John, etc.

I cant see anyone speaking about it at all. Just from the reaction that the public has had to Karr, that would stop them. Who would want reporters 24 hours a day on you. No one will speak.

 

[kaykay]

kaykay,

I'm sure there is a list of names, but I doubt if it's been made public. And yes, there were children who were friends of the Ramseys whose DNA was taken. There have been well over 100 DNA samples taken, but that's only half of the story. What's more important is: How many have been tested?

DNA samples are quick and inexpensive to take, but are expensive to have tested. So I wonder how many samples are sitting in storage untested since there's no money in the Boulder budget to pursue an active investigation in the Ramsey case.

Remember, there were two blood stains in the crotch of JonBenet's underwear, but only one spot, the largest, had been tested by the BPD, apparently for cost reasons. The second, smaller, male, foreign, mixed blood stain was tested years later and yielded more evidence than the first one. It helped give up enough DNA markers (10) to finally enter the sample into the FBI's CODIS system (even though 13 markers are preferred).

BlueCrab

BlueCrab,

Does it say somewhere there are untested DNA?
I guess we will never know whos DNA was untested.

If the funds were not available to test all, doesn't it make sense to test just a few a year or as the funds are available?

kaykay :banghead:

 

[Jayelles]

BlueCrab,

Does it say somewhere there are untested DNA?
I guess we will never know whos DNA was untested.

If the funds were not available to test all, doesn't it make sense to test just a few a year or as the funds are available?

kaykay :banghead:

I don't think there is any untested DNA. There's unmatched DNA. There was further DNA testing at a later stage in the investigation, but it would be an absolute disgrace is there were still untested DNA.

 

[kaykay]

I don't think there is any untested DNA. There's unmatched DNA. There was further DNA testing at a later stage in the investigation, but it would be an absolute disgrace is there were still untested DNA.

Jayelles,
I agree, a disgrace indeed.

kaykay

 

[BBB167893]

I too agree that it was an "inside job". But that doesn't exclude the evidence that points to a fifth person having been invited into the house by a Ramsey that night -- and that person being the killer.

Easy, BC. Just keeping it straight. We'll get into that later.

 

[daphnec]

I think the majority of people are ready to hear the truth. But we are not prepared to hear more of the same old same old.

I agree. I believe that most people are very prepared to hear the truth. I think that is why last summer when the crazy, aka John Karr, came to our attention, we were all over it. We want someone to be guilty and then brought forth to get justice for JBR. Do I think it will happen? No. Sadly, No. Too many screw ups and too much focusing on things that didn't matter. And that is so sad. I think of JBR and Coralrose Fullwood. They both are such sad situations.:banghead:

 

[Tober]

I am very interested in everyone's opinion on whether you think this crime will be solved. If so, why and if not, why not.

Laurence Smith's book should be out soon. I'm always hopeful that with each surge of interest in the case, the probability that it will be solved increases just a little more. That would take some heavy-handed, aggressive action, though. Nothing timid would cut it. Personally, I'd like to see a forensic scientist who is also a deductive criminal profiler, such as Brent Turvey, examine the case and issue his findings.