"G (Guilty)" vs "NG (Not Guilty)" Where do you stand? #2

[Jolynna]

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Has anyone proven that she didn't work at universal??????[/b] Where is the proof that she didn't work at Universal as an event cordinator?[/b] Where is the proof that she lied. What evidence do you have that shows she lied. I think it boils down to opinion. It is my opinion that she did not lie.

BBM

Yes.

A myriad of information from Universal including pictures of and information about Universal's event coordinators has been released to the public. KC NEVER was one of Universal's event coordinators. She did take pictures of people on rides for Kodak at Universal Park. But she quit doing that after Caylee was born--according to her former boss and KC's tax withholding records.

According to Universal's HR department, Juliette L. was never a Universal employee and for certain was NOT an event coordinator nor was ZFG ever one of their part-time workers.

KC lied. She was caught red-handed.

 

[ynotdivein]

I am not sure I understand this concept at all. I see now we have thrown Baez under the bus, GA and CA under the bus, but we continue to point the finger away from Casey. I am not going to take my eye off the ball. I am beginning to believe that a good share of the majority are losing their focus. It just proves my case in point. There is no evidence that Casey is Guilty. At this point in time, I am coming off of the fence and saying NG

THERE IS NO BUS.

There is a white Pontiac Sunfire that apparently for some period of time held the decomposing remains of a nearly-three-year-old child who somehow got some duct tape wrapped around her head before she ended up in a swampy trash dump.

No bus. A white Pontiac Sunfire that was in the possession of said child's mother, little as she deserves the term, who for about a month after she claimed to have last seen her child utterly and completely failed to report said child missing.

No bus. A white Pontiac Sunfire that smelled like a dead body when it was finally retrieved, according to numerous witnesses and one panicked grandmother at least.

There is no bus. If investigators and prosecutors do their jobs well, no undeserving person is going to end up under one. Just like no hapless squirrels ended up under that white Pontiac Sunfire.

 

[notthatsmart]

BBM
STUART of the court????? Do you mean Steward?
Yet another thing you have in common with Cindy Anthony : )

I promise MissJames I will be careful with my spelling. Thank you

 

[sleutherontheside]

IMO.................
In the absence of a video of the murder / death / demise of Caylee we draw from what information we do have when forming an opinion. WHile I understand the lack of DIRECT evidence linking KC to the death, I respect the value of a "big ol stockpile" of circumstantial evidence. I have yet to see anything from the defense in the form of an explanation, alternative theory, evidence that points in another direction, or proof that his client is innocent. I am intelligent, thoughtful, and fair. I base my opinion of KC's guilt upon what I have seen. That is fair and reasonable isn't it? Now.....if I am presented with something substantive or at least compelling I may alter my position. At this point, as we argue our opinion of guilt or innocence......should a poster lean one way, it does not negate the possibility an opposing scenario, we just haven't seen anything that leads us there. I will not dismiss any one opinion provided my opinion is also not dismissed. There are few cases that offer proof of guilt that can't be disputed. However, if a case offers disputable evidence, that should not render it invalid. Anyone in the legal field can dispute any evidence on some level. That works both ways.

 

[sleutherontheside]

I believe Casey should be able to stay home until after the trial when the decision is made. I would not allow her to be near children until then.

I think there was a broken quote here. Hope I fixed it. If not, please advise as I don't want to misquote.

The State of Fl has provisions for home confinement regarding those charged with Cap. Murder. Her original terms of home confinement specified no internet usage, no contact with children, and limited cell phone usage. Those provisions were not adhered to. So....if history proves her untrustworthy...she is where she belongs.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

What is difficult for me to understand about the altruistic demands of "innocent until proven guilty" is that the proponents make me feel like I should suspend every bit of common sense I have in order to achieve that state of nirvana. And I just can't do that. I have to process data and facts as they are available. I feel like it requires me to completely disregard any and all information that points to guilt while speculating without limits on any and every random possibility that points away from guilt.

That just doesn't seem like the right way to get to the truth. Not everything points to guilt, by any means, but all should be weighed even-handedly. Maybe the truth is not supposed to be weighted on either side?!!.?

 

[Wudge]

What is difficult for me to understand about the altruistic demands of "innocent until proven guilty" is that the proponents make me feel like I should suspend every bit of common sense I have in order to achieve that state of nirvana. And I just can't do that. I have to process data and facts as they are available. I feel like it requires me to completely disregard any and all information that points to guilt while speculating without limits on any and every random possibility that points away from guilt.

That just doesn't seem like the right way to get to the truth. Not everything points to guilt, by any means, but all should be weighed even-handedly. Maybe the truth is not supposed to be weighted on either side?!!.?

All evidence is not equal -- I trust all understand this point. And certain evidence is critically required for a murder one conviction -- this seems not to be well understood -- and, from what we know, it's this evidence that is currently missing.

 

[notthatsmart]

How is it tricky of investigators if the defendent walks "with a purpose" down a hallway where she claims to work yet does not? How is it tricky of investigators to track down all of addresses KC gave them "on TAPE" where ZFG and her family supposedly lived only to learn that those addresses were not connected with these fictious suspects? How was KC tricked? She was not. She lied. Is a liar. A thief. Even admitted as much in a written statement...not tricked out of her by LE and in an officially recorded interview. She is in control of her fate. If it was an accident, and she is so ignorant as to not admit it, that is her decision. She was not arrested on a whim. She never reported her child missing. Her mother did. And even on that officially recorded 911 tape sounded about as interested in talking to the 911 operator about her "missing" child as one would conversing about carpet samples.

Translation = there are no other suspects. So this was either an accident or deliberate. The facts will fill in that gap. Whatever is leaked to us via the Sunshine law. But KC was not attacked in a park. KC had no nanny named ZFG. KC stole from her own grand parents. Her parents seem to think that because they "eventually" got to the truth with KC that somehow her lies are just a cover for an innocent mistake. The same daughter who allowed her parents to think up until the last moment that she would walk across the stage to graduate. A non-graduation that she was forced to admit ONLY because she would not be allowed to cross the stage. Never mind that her grand parents were in attendance to said non-graduation. The same girl who lied about being pregnant well up until her 7 month. Translation = this girl only lies when the truth seriously comes out. No pun intended. Because a dead baby was found dumped like trash...in their minds means...reasonable doubt...but with this girl's track history....lies on top of lies...she can't even keep her story straight on who the father of Caylee is. Yet she can be trusted?

What written statement? Do you have a link for that?

You seem to be making these statements of fact. Do you have any proof of these statements?

 

[ZsaZsa]

What is difficult for me to understand about the altruistic demands of "innocent until proven guilty" is that the proponents make me feel like I should suspend every bit of common sense I have in order to achieve that state of nirvana. And I just can't do that. I have to process data and facts as they are available. I feel like it requires me to completely disregard any and all information that points to guilt while speculating without limits on any and every random possibility that points away from guilt.

That just doesn't seem like the right way to get to the truth. Not everything points to guilt, by any means, but all should be weighed even-handedly. Maybe the truth is not supposed to be weighted on either side?!!.?

Couldn't agree more. AS someone on TV ? who said, unless there was a bus load of Nuns going by as Casey killed or dumped Caylee who can report everything they saw, we will have to make do with all the masses of other evidence the police have compiled.

 

[sleutherontheside]

What is difficult for me to understand about the altruistic demands of "innocent until proven guilty" is that the proponents make me feel like I should suspend every bit of common sense I have in order to achieve that state of nirvana. And I just can't do that. I have to process data and facts as they are available. I feel like it requires me to completely disregard any and all information that points to guilt while speculating without limits on any and every random possibility that points away from guilt.

That just doesn't seem like the right way to get to the truth. Not everything points to guilt, by any means, but all should be weighed even-handedly. Maybe the truth is not supposed to be weighted on either side?!!.?

Don't suspend your common sense.........there is no perfect trial / evidence / proof / or verdict. Each side will always have technicalities that can be argued. Look how many cases have ended up with a not guilty verdict that was predicated on a technicality. A jury must be objective, but IMO that does not = without emotion and reasoning. The word "reasonable" as in reasonable doubt is there for a purpose. One must be confident that a verdict is of guilt or innocence beyond a reasonable doubt. There can always be a "doubt" present. The question is......"Is it a reasonable doubt or just a doubt that has been introduced?". You could buy a blue car, and I could argue that it is not really "blue" but rather "indigo". That distinction may create doubt, BUT...is it reasonable??????????

 

[flourish]

It's a truth of life that no raindrop considers itself to be responsible for the flood. Yet, little by little, things accumulate by unseen degrees, as brooks run to rivers and rivers to seas.

True, and is a fitting homily for almost any point of view.

When I first read it, I immediately pictured the evidence against Casey as the raindrops accumulating.

BUT what I really want to know is who exactly has this proof that "no raindrop considers itself to be responsible...," I mean, is there a transcript of the raindrops' interviews where they stated whether or not they feel responsibility for floods? :waitasec:

 

[notthatsmart]

I am curious, right at the beginning of the case, when as she says,she had been searching high and low in all the local nightclubs to find Caylee, LE asked if she would give a DNA sample so that Caylee's name could be placed on the National Missing Persons database. She refused. Wonder why.... would you ascribe their efforts to find Caylee to trickery ?

I would not fall for anything that LE was offering after that interrogation out at Universal. I am sure she took the advice of her Lawyer. There is nothing wrong with that in my opinion.

 

[Rlaub44]

Or near her mother. I really believe this whole case is about Casey's contempt for Cindy. The grandparents decision to cremate Caylee, going against Casey's express wishes, would sure to exacerbate all that loathing.

Well it might be OK now, since the Anthony's are apparently uncertain that Caylee is even actually deceased.

There are many questions in this case, but some things are documented facts: It was Caylee's remains that were found (and later cremated), and KC lied to investigators, family members, and friends. Repeatedly.

Those lies after Caylee went "missing", when there was no logical reason for them, is one reason I confidently believe KC is guilty. Not the only reason, but certainly a contribution.

 

[Trapshooter]

I would not fall for anything that LE was offering after that interrogation out at Universal. I am sure she took the advice of her Lawyer. There is nothing wrong with that in my opinion.

Ah ha! So you DO admit there was an interrogation at Universal? It was THAT interrogation that KC admitted she LIED about having a job there, having an office there, etc. So there is your PROOF that KC lied!

Look it up, read the interview with Melich/KC and you will see HARD facts that she DID INDEED LIE!!!!!


By the way, she hadn't "lawyered up" at that point in the interrogation!

 

[Searchfortruth]

All evidence is not equal -- I trust all understand this point. And certain evidence is critically required for a murder one conviction -- this seems not to be well understood -- and, from what we know, it's this evidence that is currently missing.

There are quite a few prosecutors in Orlando who would argue this though...they certainly believe they have the evidence to convict.

 

[Bittiness39]

What written statement? Do you have a link for that?

You seem to be making these statements of fact. Do you have any proof of these statements?

Yes. From our own website. But if you don't trust that link I will be happy to provide others.

On Monday, June 9, 2008 between 9AM and 1PM, I, Casey Anthony took my daughter Caylee Marie Anthony to her nanny’s apartment.

Caylee will be 3 years-old on August 9, 2008. She was born on August 9, 2005. (true statement)

Caylee is about 3 feet tall, white female with shoulder-length, light brown hair. She has dark hazel eyes (brown-green), and a small birthmark on her left shoulder. (true statement)

On the day of her disappearance, Caylee was wearing a pink shirt, with jean shorts, white sneakers and her hair was pulled back in a ponytail. (probably a true statement)

On Monday, June 9, 2008, between 9AM and 1PM, I took Caylee to the Sawgrass Apartments, located on Conway Road. Caylee’s nanny ZFG has watched her for the past year and a half, to two years.

Zenaida is twenty-five years old, and is from New York. She is roughly 5 foot, 7 inches tall, 140 pounds. She has dark brown, curly hair, and brown eyes.

Zenaida’s birthday is in September.

I met Zenaida through a mutual friend, JMH. She had watched his son, Zachary H for about 6 months, to a year. I met Zenaida in 2004, around Christmas.

On the date listed above, June 9, 2008, after dropping Caylee off at Zenaid’s apartment, I proceeded to head to my place of employment, Universal Studios, Orlando.

I have worked at Universal for over 4 years, since June 2004. I left work around 5:00 PM, and went back to the apartment to pick-up my daughter.

However, after reaching the apartment, I realized that neither Zenaida, Caylee, or either of her two roommates were home.

I have briefly met Raquel F, and Jennifer R, on various occasions.

After calling Zenaida to see where she and Caylee were, and when they were coming home, I waited outside of the apartment.

I had called Zenaida earlier that morning prior to bringing Caylee over for the afternoon. When I called her that afternoon her phone was no longer in service.

Two hours passed and around 7:00 PM, I left the apartment and headed to familiar places that Zenaida would go with Caylee. One of Caylee’s favorite places is Jay Blanchard Park. (true statement)

I spent the rest of that evening pacing and worrying at one of the few places I felt “at home”, my boyfriend Anthony L’s apartment. (true statement of "I felt at home")

For the past four weeks since Caylee’s disappearance, I have stayed at Anthony’s apartment in Sutton Place. (true statement)

I have spent everyday since June 9, 2008 looking for my daughter.

I have lied and stolen money from friends and family to do whatever I could by any means to find my daughter. (In red - true statement)
I avoided calling the police, or even notifying my own family out of fear. I have been and still am afraid of what has, or may happen to Caylee.

I have been and still am afraid of what has , or may happen to Caylee. I have not had any contact with Zenaida since Thursday, June 12, 2008. I received a quick call from Zenaida.

Not once have I been able to ask her for my daughter, or gain any information on where I can find her.

Everyday I have gone to malls, parks, any place I could remember Zenaida taking Caylee.

I have gone out, and tried to find any information about Caylee, or Zenaida, whether by going to a popular bar, or restaurant. (true statements)

I have contacted Jeff H on several occasions to see if he had heard from or seen Zenaida. Jeff currently lives in Jacksonville, Florida.

On Thursday, July 15, 2008 around 12pm, I received a phone call from my daughter, Caylee. Today was the first day I have heard her voice in over 4 weeks. I’m afraid of what Caylee is going through after 31 days, I know that the only thing that matters is getting my daughter back. (in red true statement)

With many and all attempts to contact Zenaida, and with the one short conversation, on June 12, 2008, I was never able to check on the status or well-being of my daughter.

Zenaida never made an attempt to explain why Caylee is no longer in Orlando, or is she is ever going to bring her home. (possible true statement)
__________________

Show Videos For Nancy Grace, Issues and Prime News Can Be Viewed Here:

http://www.youtube.com/user/Sierra1947

 

[notthatsmart]

There is no evidence that shows that KC is innocent either. Eye on the ball and such. The vast majority of us are not falling for the smoke and mirrors defense. There was a dead baby in KC's car. That car was controlled by KC. To me, there are no other defendents. Period. So I am assuming you are leaning towards an "accidental" death of Caylee and KC just poorly covered for it? Incidentally, I understand that "someone" wiped decomp (decomp of Caylee) on paper towels...and that arm hairs or some type of human hairs were intertwined with said decomp. on the paper towels. and since we know KC was lazy...you know, that whole "I work somewhere.com" lie it can be reasonably assumed that she wasn't attempting to clean the trunk, just to wipe her daughter's decomp off of her. Just my best guess. But to say that this defendent is credible given her less than reliable track history is ludicrous.

I dont know of any evidence of Caylee being in that trunk. That may be another thread and off topic. I will just say that I would love to debate the docs with someone over this trunk evidence.

I don't know of any document that states the evidence on the napkins was human decomp. Seems you are basing your theory on evidence that doesn't exist. I am basing my opinion of NG on the evidence so far, and I have not seen anything that points to guilt. This is my opinion.

 

[knt]

When I first read it, I immediately pictured the evidence against Casey as the raindrops accumulating.

BUT what I really want to know is who exactly has this proof that "no raindrop considers itself to be responsible...," I mean, is there a transcript of the raindrops' interviews where they stated whether or not they feel responsibility for floods? :waitasec:

:floorlaugh:

 

[Bittiness39]

Oh and this:

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/05/21/crimesider/entry5030416.shtml


GUILTY = KC. If you have proof that someone else "may" have done it then come on with it.

 

[notthatsmart]

notthatsmart you are seriously NOT saying that Yuri's comment to "keep the Anthony's in your prayers" is pointing the finger AWAY from Casey???? HOW??


In your next post, you are saying "we" have thrown JB under the bus? Who is we? JB threw himself under the bus when he REFUSED the GAG order and shows his truly laughable "lawyering" in the court room. BTW, WHO is pointing their finger AWAY from Casey?

In my opinion, ALL of the members here at WS want justice!!! Not just justice but truth as well! We want justice for Caylee! If that truth points to KC as the prime suspect, so be it because it will be justice!!! We have NOT lost focus and we have NOT taken our eye off the ball! Caylee is forever ingrained in our hearts and souls. It is the Anthony's that have been focusing on the obvious suspect and ignored the death of their precious granddaughter. They may not answer for the blood on their hands on this earth but they will answer to a Higher Power one day!

I was just saying that Yuri was not throwing the Anthony's under the bus. He was asking for your prayers for the Anthony's. I think that is very big of him.