General Discussion Thread #4

[sorrell skye]

It seems to me, that if OP "felt trapped as my bedroom door was locked and I have limited mobility on my stumps", after hearing an alleged "noise" in the bathroom, the simplest, safest, & wisest solution would have been to awaken Reeva, perhaps grab his pistol in case it was needed, grab the key to the locked bedroom door, leave the bedroom with Reeva, lock the bedroom door behind them (thereby locking the alleged intruder in the master suite), and call police after they had reached safety.

It would have probably only taken a few seconds longer than it took for OP to retrieve his pistol, hobble over to the bathroom, notice the bathroom window open, notice that no one was in the bathroom & conclude that the alleged intruder must be in the toilet, & then fire 4 rounds through the toilet door.

No matter how many times I read his affidavit, no matter how hard I try to give him the benefit of the doubt, I'm still very suspicious that his version of events is factual & truthful.

For one: his affidavit was composed AFTER Reeva's death. Yet, he still used these words:

16.11 I noticed that the bathroom window was open. I realised that the intruder/s was/were in the toilet because the toilet door was closed and I did not see anyone in the bathroom.

http://gretawire.foxnewsinsider.com/2013/02/19/copy-of-oscar-pistorius-affidavit-click-to-read/

To 'realize' something implies knowing or arriving at a fact. Since there was no 'intruder', it would have been impossible for him to 'realize' that an intruder was in the toilet.

When OP constructed his affidavit, he knew full well that there had been no intruder, therefore, IMO, his language in the affidavit should have reflected his mistaken belief in an intruder (if we are to believe that his affidavit is truthful).

In other words, if there HAD been an intruder in the toilet, it would have been correct to use the word 'realize', because his so-called realization would have been supported by fact.

If he would have used words such as: "I believed the intruder was in the toilet", or "I thought the intruder was in the toilet", it would be a more trustworthy description of events, IMO.

I don't believe he thought an intruder was in the toilet, as I've stated in previous posts. IMO, I believe he knew full well who he was shooting when he fired four rounds through the door.

 

[sorrell skye]

Argh, I know...he is a repulsive man. And I don't believe for one second that he was a dear friend of OP. I googled Kenny and OP name and could find no connection what's so ever and considering they are both high profile figures in SA, if they were friends, surely it would have been mentioned somewhere. The only links I could find with the 2 of them together was related to the case. They probably met at some event somewhere along the line and its only in kennys mind that they are now best friends. Well done to him getting his name in the papers! :facepalm:

I don't know anything about the man, but I trust your opinion of him. I think he's just using OP's name to try to garner attention for his repugnant self.

 

[natsound]

These stories today which are probably from the statement released from OP's team, just bolster my belief that they are strongly regulate what stories get out to the media.

So he wants people to know he's [1] mourning Reeva by talking to her friends, he's [2] widening his circle of activity while on bail and he is [3] strongly distancing himself from the Pistorians.

The way the statement is written.... spending time with people whom she loved, in surroundings where memories were created... is so vague it's pointless. Why not name some of these people, or some of these places? Because it's not true, I suppose!

 

[sorrell skye]

The way the statement is written.... spending time with people whom she loved, in surroundings where memories were created... is so vague it's pointless. Why not name some of these people, or some of these places? Because it's not true, I suppose!

I agree, natsound. It sounds like PR spin, to me, to try to paint OP in a sympathetic light.

I have serious doubts that any of Reeva's close friends would be spending time with OP during these past few weeks, especially since he's been charged with premeditated murder. Nope - don't believe it one iota.

 

[natsound]

All below are just my opinions.

I respectfully don't agree that blood being on the bedroom door's handle is highly speculative and prob. there is. Actually acc to my theory, it spreaded there from Reevas' hands. OTOH, OP and lawyer are clever enough to put in the affidavit that OP battled to get her out of the toilet ....... and then went downstairs to open the front door.
When he was battling and pulling her to the bathroom , his hands were bloody.. So the blood on the bedroom door handle, well be explained to spread there from OP ' s passing from locked bedroom door to go and open the front door .
( touching front door's handle again )..

I just tend to think that Reeva was able to reach the front door and struggled to open it... and then fell down somehow at that point in the hallway near the front door. So OP was not travmatized enough to go down to the front door and open it leaving Reeva in her last breaths upstairs alone trying to cover Reeva even reached the front door ..Might have started his engine at that time so as it would seem maybe he was abt to to take her to the hospital. This is how I explain opening the front door and coming back stuff..

Just speculating anyway

I'm at work now so will try to answer the rest later.

But are you building your theory on something that has not been stated anywhere (blood on the bedroom door knob)? No problem with that, but it may confuse some posters if they search for a statement regarding blood on the door knob and can't find one.

 

[Mango33]

Argh, I know...he is a repulsive man. And I don't believe for one second that he was a dear friend of OP. I googled Kenny and OP name and could find no connection what's so ever and considering they are both high profile figures in SA, if they were friends, surely it would have been mentioned somewhere. The only links I could find with the 2 of them together was related to the case. They probably met at some event somewhere along the line and its only in kennys mind that they are now best friends. Well done to him getting his name in the papers! :facepalm:

Exactly. Seems like the type whose "friendship" would not be much of a benefit! Remember, it was someone from Kunene's entourage who yelled "Yes!" at the bail hearing when OP got bail. That did not help anyone.

Here is Kunene's explanation of his friendship with OP. To me it sounds like they just crossed paths at a few PR and charity events.

http://www.news24.com/Multimedia/South-Africa/Kenny-Kunene-on-Oscar-Pistorius-20130225

 

[Mango33]

I agree, natsound. It sounds like PR spin, to me, to try to paint OP in a sympathetic light.

I have serious doubts that any of Reeva's close friends would be spending time with OP during these past few weeks, especially since he's been charged with premeditated murder. Nope - don't believe it one iota.

When I read it, my first thought was that it was probably just Justin Divaris and his girlfriend. I am sure they would hang out with OP, and they count as Reeva's friends, to a degree. But they unsurprisingly prefer not be mentioned in a press release, i guess!

 

[Carol70]

I want to mention a few things but apologies that I have to do it in bursts, my damn Internet is so slow and I lose posts as I push submit!!!

About security being called 2 hours before the shooting, I'm finding this very hard to believe. I'm under the assumption that alot of wires were crossed in the early days after the shooting, with rumor and huge amounts of speculation. I truly believe that if this was the case, this would have most definitely been mentioned at the bail hearing as it directly impacts the credibility of premeditated murder against Reeva and not the alleged intruder. Naturally alot of eyebrows would be raised if security was called and then 2 hours later she was shot dead nevermind that it would have been a complete contradiction to OP statement. In fact, I myself would believe he intentionally shot Reeva if this was indeed the case but there has been nothing to indicate this actually happened. I think this was assumed from the press release shortly after the shooting when it was indicated that there were "previous incidents" at the house. IMO.

 

[Carol70]

I think I have found the quarters of the domestic who allegedly heard nothing on the night and have a very hard time believing that. Thanks to someone who posted the below pic( think it was Murphy Law but Plse correct me if wrong). I believe that the domestic lives at the red house ( behind OP direct neighbour to the right if looking at the pic) . Domestic quarters are almost always discreetly at the back of a home, you can clearly see her access door to the house and that white small building against the red,which looks like its actually an addition to the home is the quarters. The water feature that was mentioned is in OP garden and it does stand directly between her room and OP side of the house where his bedroom is situated. Besides the fact not alot of people would have a water feature running at night, I know that if the husband leaves our pool pump on over night, it drives me nuts, there is no way in hell she heard nothing IMO.
Lol, hope this all makes sense and you manage get where the quarters are.

 

[Carol70]

I know that I am jumping in the middle of a deep analysis with an irrelevant subject.. :blushing:


Actually some of the neighbors were awake then and why didn't those witnesses mention any yelling from OP'S for HELP ?!! and ran to his house
for help..



aLL is just my opinions...

Respectfully snipped


Actually, there has only been mention of what one witness had to say and this testimony has already been under dispute. I'm sure all the witnesses have been interviewed and we will only know when trial rolls around what was heard.

Why no one went running to his house is pretty much what I would do. Stay put in the safety of my own home and call police. That's the way it is.

 

[Carol70]

Two quotes from the Affidavit:

"Although I did not have my prosthetic legs on I have mobility on my stumps.

<snipped>

"I felt trapped as my bedroom door was locked and I have limited mobility on my stumps.

LOL! :floorlaugh:

I must be the only one who does not see the contradiction.
1. I can get around without my legs on.
2. I cannot run, do cartwheels, kick, sprint, physically fight, protect myself ( unless I have a gun in hand of course) etc etc etc.

Funny indeed!

 

[Carol70]

An early article has an offhand/unsourced sentence about it starting at 8pm and that all of a sudden is put into the fact book?

I was wondering why I couldn't find any reference to an 8PM argument.

Thanks, I've also looked and couldn't find anything concrete.

I also think alot of people are forgetting that Botha stated, under oath, that there was nothing to contradict OP version of events ( at that date of bail hearing) I'm sure by now, more has come to light but no one knows what.

 

[sorrell skye]

I want to mention a few things but apologies that I have to do it in bursts, my damn Internet is so slow and I lose posts as I push submit!!!

About security being called 2 hours before the shooting, I'm finding this very hard to believe. I'm under the assumption that alot of wires were crossed in the early days after the shooting, with rumor and huge amounts of speculation. I truly believe that if this was the case, this would have most definitely been mentioned at the bail hearing as it directly impacts the credibility of premeditated murder against Reeva and not the alleged intruder. Naturally alot of eyebrows would be raised if security was called and then 2 hours later she was shot dead nevermind that it would have been a complete contradiction to OP statement. In fact, I myself would believe he intentionally shot Reeva if this was indeed the case but there has been nothing to indicate this actually happened. I think this was assumed from the press release shortly after the shooting when it was indicated that there were "previous incidents" at the house. IMO.

I agree with your assessment, Carol. Unless a trustworthy report comes forth that police were called to the residence the same night Reeva was shot & killed, I'm thinking the "previous incident(s)" occurred on another day/another time - perhaps it had to do with that woman (Cassidy Taylor-Memmory) who filed an assault complaint against OP in 2009 regarding the slamming of the door on her? IDK

Brigadier Beukes said police were aware of previous incidents at the house where Pistorius lives.

She said: &#8220;I can&#8217;t confirm that it&#8217;s related to the person who has been arrested, but I can confirm there has previously been incidents at the home of Mr Oscar Pistorius.&#8221;

Asked what they had been, Brigadier Beukes said they were &#8220;of allegations of a domestic nature&#8221;.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/world/pr...at-pistorius-home-pretoria-police-584753.html

Still, depending on what may have occurred between OP & Taylor-Memmory (or between whomever Brigadier Beukes was referring), it could support a possible history of violence against women on OP's part.

Based on the extremely slow-moving wheels of justice in SA, I have a feeling we're all in for a very long wait to learn more information.

 

[Carol70]

It is strange that RS had a Valentine's gift for OP, but he did not mention having anything for her. And obviously she was excited about Valentine's Day, hence her tweet. Yes, a woman her age, falling in love, marriage on her mind (according to her friends, anyway), and wondering what's "up everyone's sleeve" for V-Day... yes, I think she was expecting SOMETHING from her boo.

Maybe, just maybe..he did have something special planned for her and simply didn't feel the need to mention it to the entire world in his statement

 

[natsound]

Maybe, just maybe..he did have something special planned for her and simply didn't feel the need to mention it to the entire world in his statement

:seeya: My guess is... he mentioned RS's gift to him because investigators found it (the picture frame). Otherwise, he probably would have left it out of his affidavit. I do believe everything mentioned in the affidavit is there for a reason.

So, if he had bought a gift for her, it would only help him to mention it because it suggests affection, and he had a convenient avenue to slip it into his affidavit.. since he had to mention her gift to him.

 

[Carol70]

But are you building your theory on something that has not been stated anywhere (blood on the bedroom door knob)? No problem with that, but it may confuse some posters if they search for a statement regarding blood on the door knob and can't find one.

I actually would find it strange if there was no blood on the door knob. He must have had blood on his hands when opened that door if he had pulled Reeva out the loo??

 

[Patticake]

Thanks, I've also looked and couldn't find anything concrete.

I also think alot of people are forgetting that Botha stated, under oath, that there was nothing to contradict OP version of events ( at that date of bail hearing) I'm sure by now, more has come to light but no one knows what.

Again, as I replied to cityslick, here are the words of Botha [who you have denigrated in the past}:


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...s-himself.html

Quote:

Mr Botha said he doubted Pistorius' story from the start, and said he "immediately" ordered the Paralympian's arrest.

As for motive, he said the case was "strong".

He said that his actions in the witness box, when he admitted that there were no inconsistencies in Mr Pistorius's account of how he shot Miss Steenkamp, 29, believing her to be a burglar, meant little.

So, is Botha credible, or not credible?

 

[Carol70]

I agree with your assessment, Carol. Unless a trustworthy report comes forth that police were called to the residence the same night Reeva was shot & killed, I'm thinking the "previous incident(s)" occurred on another day/another time - perhaps it had to do with that woman (Cassidy Taylor-Memmory) who filed an assault complaint against OP in 2009 regarding the slamming of the door on her? IDK

Brigadier Beukes said police were aware of previous incidents at the house where Pistorius lives.

She said: “I can’t confirm that it’s related to the person who has been arrested, but I can confirm there has previously been incidents at the home of Mr Oscar Pistorius.”

Asked what they had been, Brigadier Beukes said they were “of allegations of a domestic nature”.

http://www.breakingnews.ie/world/pr...at-pistorius-home-pretoria-police-584753.html

Still, depending on what may have occurred between OP & Taylor-Memmory (or between whomever Brigadier Beukes was referring), it could support a possible history of violence against women on OP's part.

Based on the extremely slow-moving wheels of justice in SA, I have a feeling we're all in for a very long wait to learn more information.

Yep, I think the testimony of the ex, Sam Taylor is going to be very telling. I'm not sure if CTM will take the stand as I believe they reached some kind of settlement with their case and I'm sure the conditions would be confidentiality?? Could she be forced to take the stand??

 

[Carol70]

:seeya: My guess is... he mentioned RS's gift to him because investigators found it (the picture frame). Otherwise, he probably would have left it out of his affidavit. I do believe everything mentioned in the affidavit is there for a reason.

So, if he had bought a gift for her, it would only help him to mention it because it suggests affection, and he had a convenient avenue to slip it into his affidavit.. since he had to mention her gift to him.

Hmm, good point. I also believe everything in the statement is there for a reason...we can only imagine the importance of mentioning her gift but not his? If her gift was broken as has been alleged, surely he wouldn't have mentioned it at all so I have no clue what could have been the point of mentioning her gift. Is bizarre!

 

[Carol70]

I just wanted to add this last little snippet for the poster, who a few pages back said tourists were perfectly safe and crime was being exaggerated on this thread. Since that post, which was last week sometime I think and was at the time of the British tourist who was mugged and then murdered the next day, these 2 news stories caught my eye today from the past weekend.

Norwegian student raped
http://www.iol.co.za/news/crime-courts/foreign-student-raped-on-signal-hill-1.1497325#.UWcJWMsaySM

Italian businessmen leave in a hell of a hurry
http://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/Italian-businessmen-flee-SA-after-robbery-20130411

So yes dear folks, it's perfectly safe to visit SA!