GZ Case - Defense Perspective

[Dr.Fessel]

In this case, what evidence would they be contaminating to touch his jacket without gloves? They know it is either GZ's blood or TM's blood. Videos and pictures are taken at the scene, his clothes were collected at the SPD.


Since none of us were at the scene, and likely have no idea what CSI collected from Zimmerman, we have no idea how evidence was collected. Different crime scene labs have different protocol they require when evidence is collected (all require gloves, of course). Storage of large items is sometimes a consideration for certain labs.

"Wet Bloodstains LINK
If the bloodstained item is large or not easily transported, then absorb the stain onto a 1" X 1" square of the cotton muslin as described in part 2E under dried bloodstains. Package it in paper (or plastic to prevent contamination of other objects). Bring it to a secured location, take it out of the container and allow the cotton square and the container to thoroughly air dry. Repackage in the original paper container or, if necessary, a new paper container. If a new paper container is used, then the air dried original container should be packaged with the cotton square. If possible, the investigator should also collect samples from unstained areas of the item for negative controls.
Advantages: Requires little storage space; fairly easy technique to perform; stain is concentrated onto a relatively small surface area.
Disadvantages: Investigator must decide which stains and controls to collect; investigator must have direct interaction with bloodstain."



BEM: Please provide your source for this information, TIA

What Are Universal Precautions?

Universal precautions are standards that officers are taught for dealing with blood-borne pathogens (BBPs) and Other Potentially Infectious Materials (OPIMs). These other materials may be any bodily fluids, including amniotic fluid, tissues, spinal fluid, saliva, vomit, urine or secretions from genitalia.

Assume Infection

The first universal precaution is to assume that any blood or OPIM found at a scene is infectious. So law enforcement officers should take care to avoid any contact with those materials by using protective equipment. This equipment creates a barrier between the officer and the fluids and may include gloves, gowns, masks, face shields, lab coats and eye protection. The equipment should be provided by the employer and is appropriate only if it prevents any material that may be infectious from reaching the employee. Universal precautions state that an officer should use barrier protection all the time at a crime scene.


Read more: Forensics and Universal Precautions | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/info_8080162_forensics-universal-precautions.html#ixzz1ubgeg7EC

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Great point, yet I didn't see gloves on any of the officers, especially the one dusting off the back of GZ's jacket, so the point is really moot if that was the jacket he was wearing when he was bleeding and shot Trayvon. There had to be blood on it somewhere.

Maybe they collected his jacket at the scene, maybe his wife brought him another jacket. We know there was blood, where was it??

Brought him his other red jacket?

 

[Just K]

THANK YOU!!! lol I thought I was loosing my mind. I just watched it again at the link JustK provided and didn't see anything there either. I was asking b/c I'm wondering whether the IPad'ish device was either something inserted by the media or the in-court electronic exhibit viewing system.

It isn't there in the video footage. It may have been cut out at around the 1 hour and 45 minute and 50 sec mark. BUT, it did happen in real time.

As to the IPAD, even in the WRAL footage that is still there, the IPAD is on the defense table...most of the time covered by a piece of paper with a large dark image on it. I have searched high and low and cannot find it but the part where O'Mara asks Gilbreath if he has seen the picture is also gone. Maybe there was some issue that it was not bonified evidence or there were copy write issues about that particular photo.

I too want to know why that part of the footage cannot be found.

Just for the record, some people have a photographic memory and others have almost a tape recorder like memory for audio. I remember conversation like some people remember what they see or read. It happened and it was on the live feed. We just need to find uncut RAW VIDEO but as of now I can't find it.

The context was when O'Mara was asking about the injuries and possibly either just before or just after he asked DG about broken noses.

I hope we get an answer as to why the entire hearing is not being made available.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

The video on the Christian Science Monitor website is the same garbage that ABC put out. It is the *stolen* video of GZ at the station. Blow the YouTube link up to full-screen-size and you can see the camera shake. The later video, which is much clearer, and which does NOT have the ABC logo at the bottom is the official release from the Sanford PD. <modsnip>.

I don't know anything about all that. I just posted it because they call it a red fleece jacket like a lot of other news outlets did at the time. The Christian Science Monitor is a very well respected newspaper.

 

[Just K]

Just to Add: The CNN transcript of the hearing is very incomplete.

I look forward to an "official transcript" from the court of the entire bond hearing. AFAIK, one has yet to be made public.

 

[pcrum12]

O'Mara asked the detective if he had seen the picture. The detective said, yes or yes, I have seen the picture. Then O'Mara moved on.

For the life of me I don't remember that. Gonna go find video. I do recall him asking detective about GZ injuries and asking him if he had seen the medical report. Could that be it? And not the picture?

 

[LambChop]

Brought him his other red jacket?

Two red jackets would explain why there were no cuffs on him when the "injury" picture was taken by a "good" neighbor. :floorlaugh::floorlaugh: jmo

 

[Old_Hippie]

Why is it that the wound on the right side of GZ's head appears to be vertical in length on the picture released before the bond hearing and this wound appears to be horizontal? jmo

Good question! It does appear very different to me, too! Hmmm!

 

[Karmady]

It isn't there in the video footage. It may have been cut out at around the 1 hour and 45 minute and 50 sec mark. BUT, it did happen in real time.

As to the IPAD, even in the WRAL footage that is still there, the IPAD is on the defense table...most of the time covered by a piece of paper with a large dark image on it. I have searched high and low and cannot find it but the part where O'Mara asks Gilbreath if he has seen the picture is also gone. Maybe there was some issue that it was not bonified evidence or there were copy write issues about that particular photo.

I too want to know why that part of the footage cannot be found.

Just for the record, some people have a photographic memory and others have almost a tape recorder like memory for audio. I remember conversation like some people remember what they see or read. It happened and it was on the live feed. We just need to find uncut RAW VIDEO but as of now I can't find it.

The context was when O'Mara was asking about the injuries and possibly either just before or just after he asked DG about broken noses.

I hope we get an answer as to why the entire hearing is not being made available.

Just for the record, I don't doubt you at all. And I did see something on counsel table that looked whitish. I also have a kind of short-term photographic memory for text on a page. I can usually tell you what side of the page and column and about how far down and the gist of what it said, if not verbatim. I am an excellent test crammer lol. So I know what you mean

 

[Just K]

For the life of me I don't remember that. Gonna go find video. I do recall him asking detective about GZ injuries and asking him if he had seen the medical report. Could that be it? And not the picture?

Hi PC, no, I definitely heard O'Mara ask the investigator if he had seen the picture. Then the camera panned to the defense table and I saw the photo that we had just seen that morning on GMA. I was waiting for O'Mara to show it to him. I also remember and saw him waive the "medical reports" and ask DG if he had seen them and then did he want to see them...then oh, I'll give them to the prosecution..."

For some reason the WRAL video of the hearing seems like it has been edited down to 2 hours and 14 minutes. I wish I had written down the actual times.

I hope the court releases the complete "official transcript" of the Bond Hearing.

 

[Just K]

Just for the record, I don't doubt you at all. And I did see something on counsel table that looked whitish. I also have a kind of short-term photographic memory for text on a page. I can usually tell you what side of the page and column and about how far down and the gist of what it said, if not verbatim. I am an excellent test crammer lol. So I know what you mean

Thanks, i too have that type of memory...I can't remember names to save my soul, though. So, if I want to remember a name I have to give myself memory tricks...have to think of something about that person and then think of others with the same name and think of something they have in common...stuff like that.

I always crammed for test...I am ADD and OCD, so I have to make mental notes and physical notes and have always been a visual learner...BUT, I can't put IKEA furniture together from their diagrams. If I see it done...well, I am a champion at it.

 

[Karmady]

Thanks, i too have that type of memory...I can't remember names to save my soul, though. So, if I want to remember a name I have to give myself memory tricks...have to think of something about that person and then think of others with the same name and think of something they have in common...stuff like that.

I always crammed for test...I am ADD and OCD, so I have to make mental notes and physical notes and have always been a visual learner...BUT, I can't put IKEA furniture together from their diagrams. If I see it done...well, I am a champion at it.

So we DO have something in common, lol. I have not been dx'd with add or ocd, but I suspect that I would be if I were a child growing up now. I never attended a class I didn't absolutely have to, but two weeks before the exam I would copy the study guide longhand, verbatim, and ace the finals (with a few notable exceptions that involved statistics :blushing. And funny about the IKEA. I had a friend of mine come over just a couple of weeks ago to put together my IKEA furniture. If it had been up to me, it would still be all over the dining room floor

(Sorry for the OT mods, but we want to build bridges, right )

 

[pcrum12]

Thanks, i too have that type of memory...I can't remember names to save my soul, though. So, if I want to remember a name I have to give myself memory tricks...have to think of something about that person and then think of others with the same name and think of something they have in common...stuff like that.

I always crammed for test...I am ADD and OCD, so I have to make mental notes and physical notes and have always been a visual learner...BUT, I can't put IKEA furniture together from their diagrams. If I see it done...well, I am a champion at it.

O/T: Are we twins? lol.

 

[vlpate]

Hi PC, no, I definitely heard O'Mara ask the investigator if he had seen the picture. Then the camera panned to the defense table and I saw the photo that we had just seen that morning on GMA. I was waiting for O'Mara to show it to him. I also remember and saw him waive the "medical reports" and ask DG if he had seen them and then did he want to see them...then oh, I'll give them to the prosecution..."

For some reason the WRAL video of the hearing seems like it has been edited down to 2 hours and 14 minutes. I wish I had written down the actual times.

I hope the court releases the complete "official transcript" of the Bond Hearing.

This is unedited and the best copy (between Gilbreath and MOM), I have been able to find, excuse the title, not my doing
http://youtu.be/Hw0Shw075mo
.

 

[vlpate]

I don't know anything about all that. I just posted it because they call it a red fleece jacket like a lot of other news outlets did at the time. The Christian Science Monitor is a very well respected newspaper.

I've never seen a fleece jacket with leather piping, but then I've not seen every fleece jacket made.

Pic is from ABC.

 

[vlpate]

Brought him his other red jacket?

Obviously, it would have been red, but that wasn't my point. Whether what we are seeing is a pocket or blood, there was blood somewhere on whatever he was wearing, there had to be, why weren't they wearing gloves?

He seemed to like red, so I don't know that it's far fetched to think she would have brought him a jacket when he called her at 7:20. Maybe the police collected the other one. We don't know.

 

[vlpate]

Yep, now you know! This should be sent to the officers dusting off the back of his jacket without gloves on.

What Are Universal Precautions?

Universal precautions are standards that officers are taught for dealing with blood-borne pathogens (BBPs) and Other Potentially Infectious Materials (OPIMs). These other materials may be any bodily fluids, including amniotic fluid, tissues, spinal fluid, saliva, vomit, urine or secretions from genitalia.

Assume Infection

The first universal precaution is to assume that any blood or OPIM found at a scene is infectious. So law enforcement officers should take care to avoid any contact with those materials by using protective equipment. This equipment creates a barrier between the officer and the fluids and may include gloves, gowns, masks, face shields, lab coats and eye protection. The equipment should be provided by the employer and is appropriate only if it prevents any material that may be infectious from reaching the employee. Universal precautions state that an officer should use barrier protection all the time at a crime scene.


Read more: Forensics and Universal Precautions | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/info_8080162_forensics-universal-precautions.html#ixzz1ubgeg7EC

 

[Just K]

As to the gloveless officers:
If there were bodily fluids on GZ or his belongings, they didn't seemed concerned about touching him or the possibility of cross contamination. It's odd they weren't worried about the possibility of contracting any of a number of viral diseases. That's just scary. (HEP C HEP B, AIDS are just a few to worry about.)

 

[Just K]

So we DO have something in common, lol. I have not been dx'd with add or ocd, but I suspect that I would be if I were a child growing up now. I never attended a class I didn't absolutely have to, but two weeks before the exam I would copy the study guide longhand, verbatim, and ace the finals (with a few notable exceptions that involved statistics :blushing. And funny about the IKEA. I had a friend of mine come over just a couple of weeks ago to put together my IKEA furniture. If it had been up to me, it would still be all over the dining room floor

(Sorry for the OT mods, but we want to build bridges, right )

Karmady & PC...
We have a lot in common:
We are all determined
We are researchers at heart
We believe in Justice...just see it differently in this case, I think...
Statistics, my prof wrote the textbook, UGH!

Because of my OCD, I sometimes edit my posts 3 or 4 times...well that and I think faster and more accurately than I type.

 

[Karmady]

Karmady & PC...
We have a lot in common:
We are all determined
We are researchers at heart
We believe in Justice...just see it differently in this case, I think...
Statistics, my prof wrote the textbook, UGH!

Because of my OCD, I sometimes edit my posts 3 or 4 times...well that and I think faster and more accurately than I type.

exactly, JustK! We (general we) are not adversaries. Just good people who see things differently for all kinds of reasons that others may or may not understand, accept or agree with. The best we can do is to try and see each others' point of view. Which is best done, imo, in a spirit of kindredness. And I am NOT taking the high road here. I'm just as guilty of being a snark as the next person. But I do try, and will continue.

I don't know how old you are, but I think you will find that your need to edit will decrease in proportion to your age. Even ADD/OCD has a diminishing "give a chit" factor lol