ID - 2 year boy accidentally shoots and kills mother in walmart in ths US

[K_Z]

A year ago my tween daughter was having a birthday party at an arcade/ bowling alley/ bar/ restaurant club. All was well till about 5:30 pm, when the "local crowd" appeared, dumping their very small children on the arcade to beg others for games, while they went to the bar. My daughter and friends were using the laser tag facilities.

I walked into the women's restroom, to encounter a woman changing a baby of about 9 months old on a diaper deck, in full view of anyone, with her big purse spilled open on the floor. A child of about 2 1/2 was toddling about on the floor near her purse, playing with her keys, reaching into the purse pockets for goldfish crackers. On top of a couple diapers was a handgun, clearly visible, not in a holster, and sliding out of the purse. I was so rattled I never said anything, and never did use the bathroom, and quickly did an about face and gathered our party to leave.

I will admit I should have called police from the car, or confronted her about the toddler and the obvious firearm. But I was so rattled, and intimidated by her appearance and attitude, that I didn't. We had already had an angry confrontation by a local woman. I just wanted to get out of there with my family alive.

 

[Donjeta]

Having guns for the personal protection of you and your family is all nice and good in theory but in practice it defeats its purpose to leave the weapons accessible to toddlers. You can die. You can be seriously injured for life. Your toddler could shoot himself. Your toddler could shoot his or her siblings. Your dog could get shot. Innocent bystanders could get shot. Innocent bystanders' innocent children could be shot.

It's very sad that a family lost their mother but she put everybody in that Wal-Mart at risk by her apparently irresponsible practices of handling lethal weapons.

I pray that this is the last time this happens but of course it won't be. People love their guns more than they love their children's safety.

If you can't keep guns away from children still in diapers you shouldn't have them. (Kids, or guns, preferably neither.) Playing russian roulette with your children's lives at stake is totally unacceptable.

The victim's father-in-law, Terry Rutledge said Ms Rutledge 'was a beautiful, young, loving mother'.
'She was not the least bit irresponsible,' Mr Rutledge added. 'She was taken much too soon.'
According to The Spokesman-Review, the victim was a nuclear research scientist and was employed by Idaho National Laboratory.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...entally-kills-mom-Wal-Mart.html#ixzz3NTsDRR00

In my world, people who are not the least bit irresponsible make sure their kids don't shoot anybody.

It's a tragedy but totally preventable.

 

[danzn16]

You NEVER have a handgun without a holster unless you're actively using it. This is such a sad situation but it was totally preventable. Also if you are purse carrying you need to guard that purse and NEVER let anyone handle it or out of your sight. I support handgun use by civilians but I absolutely believe in rigorous training and education before you even own it, use it, or have it near. It would prevent so many thoughtless tragedies like this. My sympathies go out to her children and everyone in that store that had to witness this.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[wfgodot]

I was just looking over a past thread -- a three-year-old in OK shot and killed his mother -- when I noticed how easy it seems for gun advocates to sidestep these killings, as if accidents have nothing to do with the easy availability of death weapons.

 

[wfgodot]

Toddler shoots, kills mother in North Idaho Wal-Mart (spokesman.com)

A nuclear research scientist died Tuesday after her 2-year-old son pulled a loaded pistol from her purse and shot her while she was shopping.
---
“She was a chemical engineer, a very bright young lady,” said a family member, who asked not to be named. “We considered her a rising star.”
---

much more at the link

 

[wfgodot]

....a bit more from that link:

She and her husband were Second Amendment advocates who strongly believed in the right to carry handguns, the family member said. He described them as “outdoorsy, responsible people” who practiced gun safety.

 

[Donjeta]

From wfgodot's link above:

Rutledge had a concealed weapons permit. She and her husband were Second Amendment advocates who strongly believed in the right to carry handguns, the family member said. He described them as “outdoorsy, responsible people” who practiced gun safety. He was at a loss to explain how the accident could have occurred.

Apparently because gun safety wasn't being practiced.

This could have been the first time ever that she handled her gun irresponsibly and it ended badly straight away but I doubt it. It might be no one just died any of the other times. JMO.

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

This sort of thing has nothing to do with the Second Amendment, just irresponsibility and not giving a damn about anybody's safety. Toddlers being allowed to shoot their mothers has nothing to do with well regulated militia or ensuring the security of a free state, just the opposite.

If you say you should be allowed to carry guns because of the Second Amendment then please bear in mind the purpose is to increase safety, not make you a danger to society as well.

 

[Fifth Avenue]

The people of WalMart.

I'll go hide now.

Please do not generalize, she was a young, bright scientist and nuclear researcher.
This is all very unfortunate.

People should pay more attention to gun safety, also should tell their kids they are not allowed to touch guns, kids are naturally curious.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[TrackerSam]

People love their guns more than they love their children's safety.

What a ridiculous statement. Totally untrue. Never pass up a tragedy when there are anti-gun points to be made.

 

[Elley Mae]

Some handguns have no safety, but the ones that don't take a certain amount of pressure to pull the trigger...would a two year old have that kind of strength?

Color me clueless and genuinely curious.

There is a chart here, not know what hand gun it was it seems to run between 5.5 lb pull to 11 lb pull unless the trigger was worked on.


http://www.balloongoesup.com/blog/what-is-the-best-polymer-9mm/

 

[Donjeta]

What a ridiculous statement. Totally untrue. Never pass up a tragedy when there are anti-gun points to be made.

What part do you disagree with?

This is not even an anti-gun statement, it's an anti-irresponsibility statement. By all means, carry all the guns you think you need but keep them away from babies.

Surely there can be no one with a brain who thinks it's a responsible loving parent thing to endanger their children's lives and everybody else's lives by allowing guns in the hands of babies who don't know what to do with them.

There is nothing ridiculous about a child who grows up knowing that he shot his mom, or somebody else. If you love your children you will do your damnedest that it will never happen, including, but not limited to, not carrying unsecured weapons in places that are freely accessible to toddlers.

This is not such a huge hardship and not such a sacrifice that it would be unreasonable and ridiculous to expect parents to observe some basic common sense precautions.

Having kids requires responsibility. You are responsible for their safety. Owning guns requires responsibility. So, you've got to keep guns and children separate until the children are old enough to be equally responsible for what they do with them. Anyone could have died there, it's just the merest accident that it was not the two year old himself or one of the nieces who got shot.

This death was totally unnecessary. This trauma for the child was totally preventable. None of this had to happen. The children are the biggest victims in these cases.

Just say no.

If you think you need and deserve a gun for your protection you need to be responsible enough to mind the safety.

JMO and I'm not going to make excuses for irresponsibility just because there was a tragedy.

It's not difficult if people just gave a damn about children's safety, and everybody else's.

There is no excuse for "accidents" that happen when kids who can barely talk are handling lethal weapons. I think the adults involved should be charged (if they lived).

 

[TrackerSam]

What part is ridiculous? Did you miss the quote - " People love their guns more than they love their children's safety. " You polled every parent in the country and they all said they value their guns more than the safety of their children? I doubt you'd find any parent that would agree with you. Utterly ridiculous. Or maybe you're saying that only anti-gun advocates are concerned about the safety of their kids.

She had a conceal carry permit which requires a training certificate to obtain.

There's no excuse for accidents is why they're called accidents.
It may not be about need or deserve a gun, maybe I just want one. What do think of that?
The whole post is anti-gun when words like 'need' and deserve' are used, as if gun owners had to justify having a gun. They don't have to justify anything to you or anyone else.

 

[keeponsearching]

One of those moments she just wasn't paying attention. I think the moment and excitement of shopping with her nieces and son over powered the thoughts of keeping the gun in sight. I won't get into the gun discussion, just hope that those who have children and guns just take another look at how they carry.

 

[Donjeta]

What part is ridiculous? Did you miss the quote - " People love their guns more than they love their children's safety. " You polled every parent in the country and they all said they value their guns more than the safety of their children? I doubt you'd find any parent that would agree with you. Utterly ridiculous.

You're a smart guy so you will have realized by now that I was not talking about all the parents in the country, I'm just talking about the ones who don't care enough to try to make sure their children are safe.

Sure, if I polled them and asked them, of course they would say they love their children more than anything. But actions and lack of action sometimes speak louder than words. People prioritize what they prioritize, it's as simple as that.

If you say that your children's safety is your utmost priority, yet you let your two year old outside to wander alone in the highway, I'm not going to take your words very seriously. If you let a toddler play with your collection of dangerous poisonous snakes alone I'm not going to think you're a model parent. If you leave your baby in the bathtub and he drowns while you had something more important to do than supervising him no one's going to think you prioritized his safety over everything else. If you let your baby handle dangerous acids and he gets chemical burns I'm going to blame you. If your house and your baby burn because you let your children play with matches there's no use telling me that you took their safety into account while making the decision. If you let your five year old drive a car and he crashes I'm going to say you endangered his safety. If you let your toddler shoot somebody with your gun I will hold you responsible.


Being a loving parent involves a certain degree of responsibility and you have to show you care about their safety, not just talk about it.

There's no excuse for accidents is why they're called accidents.

There are accidents and then there are "accidents", things that didn't have to happen but happened because people were negligent and didn't give a damn about anybody's safety.

It may not be about need or deserve a gun, maybe I just want one. What do think of that?

Lets did her up and arrest her.

Well actually I don't care that much why you have it as long as you keep your gun the hell away from small children.

If you let kids shoot people with your gun you're part of the problem, not part of the solution.

ETA because TrackerSam edited his post:

Or maybe you're saying that only anti-gun advocates are concerned about the safety of their kids.

No. I'm saying that people who are concerned about the safety of their kids ensure that children don't get access to their guns. Not just guns, any other things that pose an immediate and obvious danger to their safety qualify as well.

She had a conceal carry permit which requires a training certificate to obtain.

Having all the paperwork doesn't save anyone's life if you are nevertheless careless about safety measures.

The whole post is anti-gun when words like 'need' and deserve' are used, as if gun owners had to justify having a gun. They don't have to justify anything to you or anyone else.

There is nothing anyone could say anyway to justify the kind of carelessness where very young children are allowed access to lethal weapons and lives are destroyed just so people don't have to give a damn.

 

[TrackerSam]

She didn't 'let' her child shoot the gun. :gaah:

 

[keeponsearching]

I read another article and I at first missed the fact she had a new purse that had a design to hide a gun. Maybe this is the first time she left it in her purse thinking it was safer in the hiding spot. She got it for Christmas.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...r-shot-his-mom-at-wal-mart/?tid=hp_mm&hpid=z3

 

[Donjeta]

She didn't 'let' her child shoot the gun. :gaah:

Well if she didn't she wouldn't be dead now.

Keep guns away from the reach of babies and toddlers.

This is not a difficult concept.

 

[tlcya]

This is tragic. She did not "let" her child shoot her, but she certainly failed to prevent her child accessing it and doing just that.

I am a staunch believer in the rights of citizens to possess firearms under the regulations and standards provided by federal and state law. That said, far too many people IMO are concerned with their rights in regards to gun ownership and shirk the responsibility portion of that equation. Again JMO.

 

[Donjeta]

I read another article and I at first missed the fact she had a new purse that had a design to hide a gun. Maybe this is the first time she left it in her purse thinking it was safer in the hiding spot. She got it for Christmas.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...r-shot-his-mom-at-wal-mart/?tid=hp_mm&hpid=z3

An average two year old is perfectly able to open a zipper.

 

[Elley Mae]

I have not read that the toddler pulled the gun out, only that he reached in her purse. IMO he pulled the trigger without knowing what he was doing and shot her through the purse. Waiting to hear more of the details on this. jmo idk