ID - DeOrr Kunz, Jr., 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #27

[seventeenseconds]

Imo idt that they would waste their time or money buying burner phones. Plus the signal out sounds like it's kinda iffy. I think they may have found a little store with cheap chargers maybe?


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[Hatfield]

Imo idt that they would waste their time or money buying burner phones. Plus the signal out sounds like it's kinda iffy. I think they may have found a little store with cheap chargers maybe?

You could be absolutely right. Although they are rather cheap. I was surprised that you can buy a TracFone LG 441-G model for about 14.95 and 60 minute cards for 20 bucks.

http://www.walmart.com/search/?query=tracphone

I think I am more interested in why Kline says one person wiped their phone with a factory reset. Couldn't LE just get the records from cell phone provider so not sure what wiping a phone accomplishes.

 

[MorkFromOrk]

I think you have something there. This would explain a lot of things if they had trailer issue and had to pull over mid trip and everyone got out to help fix trailer and boy may have gotten runned over somehow. Or the trailer was unhitched and fell on him or something.

You are right that when something like that happens there is always a lot of commotion in a situation like that and it could be where the boy was in a spot where
nobody noticed as the trailer was moved or vehicle was moved.

I have been open to many possibilities but one thing I feel pretty sure of is that the boy never was really camping with them that Friday morning. I think whataver happened had to have happened before the fateful Friday morning when the parents started to claim he was missing.

The theory about them having trailer issues makes a lot of things fit.

We need to find the exact spot where they had trailer issues. There could be some clues at the scene.

Hi all:

First time posting in the deorr jr thread.
Your points are really interesting.
Or if the trailer trouble was some other thing.
Where?

I too lean towards him never being at the campsite. I always assume the victim to be within a radius 12 miles of the guilty persons home. ( I read that somewhere)

About the truck- I think that he was probably transported in the bed of the truck. Which is why cd dogs alerted there. Sadly his fluids could have leaked or spilled on all those places - truck bed- the bumper, wheel base.
When they were moving him. :/(
The same is true if they did hit him- I guess. Or if he was playing and fell out of the back of the truck.
Any accident involving s truck would be " trouble" for someone with a CDL license. Hmm

A few things that have always stood out from JA interviews were JA saying " you couldn't not have seen him"
And the whole part about how many times they tried to reach IR to go on the trip. Feels like they were trying to set him up- or spread the doubt. Yuck!

Also if they moved the time line up one day, is that Friday to Thursday ? Or Thursday to Wednesday ?

Just thoughts & opinions.
TIA for Yours
Mork

 

[neesaki]

Yes, I may have missed the prepaid phone post as I was reading quickly and trying to catch up too. LOL


Yes, the Burner Phones are the same as the Prepaid phones which is same as BAT PHONES. LOL

I have never bought one before but I heard that drug dealers buy them to keep from LE finding anything about their discussions with them. There is no way LE can trace the calls on them is my understanding. Not sure why though but it has something to do with the fact they are prepaid and somehow there is no record of who is using the phone.

Here is a good link that explains why LE cant really trace anything with a prepaid burner phone.

Simply it is because you don't put any personal information on the phone. The service just gets activated and you buy the phone with cash if you want.

LE cant get a search warrant because there is nobody to ask a judge to get search warrant for to get the records. And even if they knew the phones ID then nothing would hold up in court because LE cant prove who had the phone in their possession. You can give the phone to someone else if you want.

If LE could go to that provider of the phones and knew the store location then they may be able to find all phones usage from that store. But that would take lots of money and research and no judge will allow search warrants for something like that because its all speculation that they would be using the phone for some illegal reason.

These are the types of phones that get smuggled into prisons.

http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/sick-of-the-nsa-tracking-you-burn-them-with-a-burner-phone/

No you didn't miss it, I posted after your post, but it was before I read your post. I Need to get into the habit of reading through all the posts before posting, lol.

IF they did buy burner phones , one would assume they would have paid cash. But have you noticed how the younger generations don't usually have cash, at least the ones I know, they use credit / debit cards for everything. If they didn't have cash already, they would've had to round some up and that would take time. Still it's possible.
But now I'm really, really wondering what purchases that credit card was used for by the family friend .

 

[seventeenseconds]

Hi all:

First time posting in the deorr jr thread.
Your points are really interesting.
Or if the trailer trouble was some other thing.
Where?

I too lean towards him never being at the campsite. I always assume the victim to be within a radius 12 miles of the guilty persons home. ( I read that somewhere)

About the truck- I think that he was probably transported in the bed of the truck. Which is why cd dogs alerted there. Sadly his fluids could have leaked or spilled on all those places - truck bed- the bumper, wheel base.
When they were moving him. :/(
The same is true if they did hit him- I guess. Or if he was playing and fell out of the back of the truck.
Any accident involving s truck would be " trouble" for someone with a CDL license. Hmm

A few things that have always stood out from JA interviews were JA saying " you couldn't not have seen him"
And the whole part about how many times they tried to reach IR to go on the trip. Feels like they were trying to set him up- or spread the doubt. Yuck!

Also if they moved the time line up one day, is that Friday to Thursday ? Or Thursday to Wednesday ?

Just thoughts & opinions.
TIA for Yours
Mork

Great first post!!!!


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[The Apparition]

Can some please post a link where there is an official statement stating there were three PHONES purchased?

I get this is a sleuthing site but please...think about what you are posting and how there are those who will see your post, and not any of the back posts, and then believe your statement to be fact. This case has been filled with misinformation, rumor, misstatements, misleading comments, and just plain false statements that it will be so much more difficult to solve as it is. Please don't add to it.

<modsnip> Why 4 adults would need to purchase 3 phone chargers is definitely the kind of thing people should be looking into and sleuthing. If we play by your rules we can only wait for LE to give us "facts" in which case we might as well close the thread down until/unless there is an actual trial.

I add my agreement to the theory that maybe some new phones were purchased. It is unlikely that so many people would've forgot to bring their chargers along. There certainly could be a great explanation why so many chargers were purchased but in lieu of any explanation and bearing in mind what complete liars our "suspects" seem to be I will imagine the chargers were purchased with the most nefarious of intentions....

 

[desert-blue]

I think Isaac may have done a factory reset to delete photos or other apps, etc. from his phone because he realized his phone was going to be confiscated and he didn't want anyone perusing the contents of his phone. I personally don't think his action means anything as far as DeOrr is concerned. I think he's leery of cops.

I do think that buying three phone chargers from at least two, and possibly three, different stores is very suspicious. I would venture to say that the prices at the Stage Stop were not cheap. It's the only store in a tiny isolated rural town - I'm guessing the prices on everything are pretty inflated (at least that's been my experience in my travels around Idaho and surrounding areas). Cheapo chargers would come from a dollar or discount store in a bigger town. It would be interesting to know if the other two chargers were purchased together or if each of those was purchased separately as well. I also wonder if the chargers are compatible with their regular cell phones and/or if they still have the chargers in their possession (or did they dump them somewhere to get rid of them)? It seems odd that three of the four adults would have forgotten to bring a phone charger and that none of them could share. It would be interesting to hear their explanations.


.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Sorry to be a pain but please could someone post a picture of a "trailer" as used in this context. I'm figuring it's not the same as what we'd call a trailer in the UK, in fact I'm finding vehicle terminology is where we differ the most!

 

[desert-blue]

No you didn't miss it, I posted after your post, but it was before I read your post. I Need to get into the habit of reading through all the posts before posting, lol.

IF they did buy burner phones , one would assume they would have paid cash. But have you noticed how the younger generations don't usually have cash, at least the ones I know, they use credit / debit cards for everything. If they didn't have cash already, they would've had to round some up and that would take time. Still it's possible.
But now I'm really, really wondering what purchases that credit card was used for by the family friend .

Remember though, that these are folks with money judgments against them and who have since been evicted from their apartment. Lots of times people like this don't have bank accounts (so their money can't be seized) and with bad credit likely don't have credit cards either. Cash may be their preference. (Also this might explain why a family friend's credit card was used - perhaps they needed to buy something where they couldn't use cash and needed a credit card). I'm very curious to know about the purchase(s) as well.... very interesting.

 

[scmom]

Sorry to be a pain but please could someone post a picture of a "trailer" as used in this context. I'm figuring it's not the same as what we'd call a trailer in the UK, in fact I'm finding vehicle terminology is where we differ the most!

Travel trailer is what I'm thinking. Like these...http://www.jayco.com/products/travel-trailers/

 

[desert-blue]

Sorry to be a pain but please could someone post a picture of a "trailer" as used in this context. I'm figuring it's not the same as what we'd call a trailer in the UK, in fact I'm finding vehicle terminology is where we differ the most!

Something like this:

 

[Paulas88]

Remember though, that these are folks with money judgments against them and who have since been evicted from their apartment. Lots of times people like this don't have bank accounts (so their money can't be seized) and with bad credit likely don't have credit cards either. Cash may be their preference. (Also this might explain why a family friend's credit card was used - perhaps they needed to buy something where they couldn't use cash and needed a credit card). I'm very curious to know about the purchase(s) as well.... very interesting.

I'm very curious about the purchases on the credit card that was found in the sofa. Burner phones? Nah...

 

[CoverMeCagney]

There are so many hinky things in this case, admittedly some of them are speculation and conjecture, and many of the anomalies could be chalked up to coincidence or misfortune. But the biggie for me is Sheriff Bowerman's statement that he believes there has been a homicide.

Why would he go down that route, of accusing innocent / grieving parents, if he had no evidence or reason to suspect them? He has been very public and assertive in his thoughts about it, it's not like we've just picked up on a vague notion he mentioned in passing. He has said he "knows that they know" what happened to DeOrr.

Genuinely interested to hear the reasons why people think the Sheriff is wrong or lying (and let's leave Klein out of it for a minute) and why he would put his career, and that of his department, on the line by calling a homicide without a shred of evidence.

 

[desert-blue]

IF the chargers are related to the case, would that mean that DeOrr was probably deceased prior to the first purchase?

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Something like this:

View attachment 99076

Oh!!!! A caravan!!
Oh hang on though, that's confused me more then. So VDK had a truck (like a pick up / flat bed?) but grandpa was pulling the trailer in his 4x4? So what's a camper?

 

[desert-blue]

Oh!!!! A caravan!!
Oh hang on though, that's confused me more then. So VDK had a truck (like a pick up / flat bed?) but grandpa was pulling the trailer in his 4x4? So what's a camper?

The words "camper" and "trailer" in this case are probably referring to the same thing - they are commonly called camp trailers but it might be shortened and called just a trailer or a camper. Kind of confusing.... DeOrr had a pickup truck and Bob had a Suburban (SUV, not sure if it's 4 x 4, some are and some aren't).

 

[CoverMeCagney]

The words "camper" and "trailer" in this case are probably referring to the same thing - they are commonly called camp trailers but it might be shortened and called just a trailer or a camper. Kind of confusing.... DeOrr had a pickup truck and Bob had a Suburban (SUV, not sure if it's 4 x 4, some are and some aren't).

A-ha, this explains a lot, thank you!

 

[Tricia]

Can some please post a link where there is an official statement stating there were three PHONES purchased?

I get this is a sleuthing site but please...think about what you are posting and how there are those who will see your post, and not any of the back posts, and then believe your statement to be fact. This case has been filled with misinformation, rumor, misstatements, misleading comments, and just plain false statements that it will be so much more difficult to solve as it is. Please don't add to it.

As of today there has never been any sort of confirmation that three phones were purchased correct? What about phone charges?

I want to make sure we do make it clear what is fact and what is not.

 

[The Apparition]

As of today there has never been any sort of confirmation that three phones were purchased correct? What about phone charges?

I want to make sure we do make it clear what is fact and what is not.

It has been bandied about that perhaps the suspects needed chargers because they bought new phones. As to the chargers, Klein posted during his chat that 3 had been purchased during the camp out.

To my recollection no one stated it is fact that 3 phones were purchased everyone was treating that as a possible scenario. A particular reader thought to try and muddy the waters by saying it was being stated as fact.... That same reader always has very unkind words and critiques about anything Klein wants to share so who know why there is suddenly confusion about the issue.

 

[Cardinal47]

There are so many hinky things in this case, admittedly some of them are speculation and conjecture, and many of the anomalies could be chalked up to coincidence or misfortune. But the biggie for me is Sheriff Bowerman's statement that he believes there has been a homicide.

Why would he go down that route, of accusing innocent / grieving parents, if he had no evidence or reason to suspect them? He has been very public and assertive in his thoughts about it, it's not like we've just picked up on a vague notion he mentioned in passing. He has said he "knows that they know" what happened to DeOrr.

Genuinely interested to hear the reasons why people think the Sheriff is wrong or lying (and let's leave Klein out of it for a minute) and why he would put his career, and that of his department, on the line by calling a homicide without a shred of evidence.

Just MOO but LE and Klein and FBI and LE know a whole lot more than we do or has been talked about and published. I think they know enough to make such a statement. They don't have enough to arrest and charge.

I wonder if all of them have taken what they do have to the Prosecutor? Many times remains are not found but they still take such a case to trial if the other evidence is strong enough.

A Prosecutor decides the chances of a conviction with what is presented to him/her.

My thought is they suspect from all they know but don't have enough to assure a conviction. They are looking for more than remains but not sure just what that is.