ID - Robert Manwill, 8, Boise, 24 July 2009 - #2

[Noway]

If water enters the airways of a conscious victim the victim will try to cough up the water or swallow it thus inhaling more water involuntarily. Upon water entering the airways, both conscious and unconscious victims experience laryngospasm that is the larynx or the vocal cords in the throat constrict and seal the air tube. This prevents water from entering the lungs. Because of this laryngospasm, water enters the stomach in the initial phase of drowning and very little water enters the lungs. Unfortunately, this can interfere with air entering the lungs, too. In most victims, the laryngospasm relaxes some time after unconsciousness and water can enter the lungs causing a "wet drowning". However, about 10-15% of victims maintain this seal until cardiac arrest, this is called "dry drowning" as no water enters the lungs. In forensic pathology, water in the lungs indicates that the victim was still alive at the point of submersion. Absence of water in the lungs may be either a dry drowning or indicates a death before submersion.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drowning




I don't know about the floating/sinking. Children who drown in swimming pools are often found face down floating in the pool, so I'm not sure whether floating has anything to do with drowning. No expert here.

 

[SuziQ]

I agree with you to a certain point... the turning point for me is that she has been covering this case. I guess this really is a defining moment for bombshells......

Except most of the local channels didn't cover the presser live either. And there are a ton of cases out there. How do we chose which one gets coverage? Even tes has to decide which case he gets involved with. People can't be everywhere at once.

 

[fhc]

In response to some of your comments. Is your community participating in National Night Out.

http://www.nationalnightout.org/nno/about.html

 

[Noway]

I'm watching NG now (as opposed to just listening) and it's not even NG who is on, so maybe that's why they didn't cover the recent updates in the Robert Manwill story?

 

[Angel Who Cares]

Body Found in Hunt for Missing Boy
Robert Manwill, 8, Missing Since July 24; Family Has History of Violence
Aug. 3, 2009
<snipped>
Someone walking by the New York Canal in Kuna, in Ada County, saw the body of a boy floating in the water and called police, Kerns said. One of the first officers on the scene jumped into the water and pulled out the body, he said.

"Robert's family, who has been incredibly strong throughout this entire ordeal, has been notified that a body has been found," Kerns said, adding that the boy's family has requested privacy.

His parents haven't said much of anything to the public. Jenkins has two other children and lives with a boyfriend.

Court documents show that Jenkins and her boyfriend Daniel Ehrlick were taken to court by the state for child support relating to an unnamed child in foster care.

Jenkins is on probation after being charged with felony injury to a child, a charge the Idaho Statesman reported came after she fractured the skull of Robert's infant half-brother, who was removed by the state.

Hightower told ABCNews.com that about 140 registered sex offenders live within a two-mile radius of Robert's home in a working-class neighborhood of the city and that each one has been visited.

"Some of them have been checked and rechecked and rechecked," she said.

Article:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=8243747&page=1

:angel:

 

[SuziQ]

Also, most of NG's shows are taped a good two hours before they are aired.

 

[daisy7]

In response to some of your comments. Is your community participating in National Night Out.

http://www.nationalnightout.org/nno/about.html

Thanks for posting. My organization is coordinating it here with a bunch of partners -- it's tomorrow! (unless you're in TX, then it's in October)

 

[Noway]

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Why_the_dead_body_float_on_water

Here is an answer to the floating/sinking issue.

I had a hard time associating it with Robert and didn't want to post the description.

 

[kiki the parrot]

A cadaver in the water starts to sink as soon as the air in its lungs is replaced with water. Once submerged, the body stays underwater until the bacteria in the gut and chest cavity produce enough gas&#8212;methane, hydrogen sulfide, and carbon dioxide&#8212;to float it to the surface like a balloon. (The buildup of methane, hydrogen sulfide, and other gases can take days or weeks, depending on a number of factors.)

http://www.slate.com/id/2126310/arrot:

 

[SuziQ]

Thanks kiki, I hear that ten days is the magic number.

 

[Paintr]

http://www.fox12idaho.com/Global/story.asp?S=10839836&nav=menu439_4

A disturbing scene at the New york canal this afternoon, as police pulled the life-less body of a little boy out of the water. Police tell us two people saw the child floating and called 911. An Ada County Deputy rushed to the scene, jumped in, and pulled the child out of the water. Speculation is swirling that it could be Robert Manwill, although police have yet to confirm that. They did say however, the boy matched the age and size of Robert. A press conference on the missing boy, originally scheduled for 2:00 P.M was cancelled just minutes before getting started. Spokeswoman Lynn Hightower confirmed it was because they were investigating this body. Police had most of the area around Deerflat Road just West of Cloverdale cordoned off as they worked the scene. Roberts family remained clear of the canal, and stayed at the police station while all this happened. The coroner arrived at the canal just 40 minutes later and took the child away to be identified. The family has been notified that the body was found in the canal. An autopsy will be performed by the coroner tomorrow afternoon.

 

[Paintr]

I have been away for most of the weekend. This was the first thread I checked. Really not the news I was hoping to hear.

 

[UnderDog]

From the AP report
BOISE, Idaho &#8212; Police say a body pulled from a canal in southwestern Idaho matches the size and age of an 8-year-old boy who disappeared more than a week ago.

Boise Deputy Chief Jim Kerns says the Ada County coroner has not yet identified the body found Monday and is performing an autopsy.

I've no doubt they are NOT waiting to perform the autopsy.

 

[Angel Who Cares]

Body found cannot be confirmed as eight-year old Robert Manwill
Story Published: Aug 3, 2009 at 7:05 PM MDT
Story Updated: Aug 3, 2009 at 7:05 PM MDT
<snipped>
The Ada County Sheriff's Office has found the body of a young male in the New York Canal in Boise. It was found near Deer Flat Road and South Cloverdale. That canal flows near where eight-year old Robert Manwill went missing ten days ago.

However, the body cannot be identified as Robert. Until an autopsy is performed Tuesday, we will not know the identity of the body. Police have indicated at Monday afternoon's press conference that the description of the body is similar to that of Robert.

VIDEO: Body found cannot be confirmed as eight-year old Robert Manwill
http://www.kidk.com/news/local/52375917.html?video=YHI&t=a

Article:
http://www.kidk.com/news/local/52375917.html
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
VIDEO: Monday&#8217;s press conference 08/03/09 3:47
http://videos.idahostatesman.com/vmix_hosted_apps/p/media?id=5432054&item_index=&genre_id=00001723

:angel:

 

[UnderDog]

Thanks kiki, I hear that ten days is the magic number.

In warmer water, it can take just a few days. Smaller bodies will float in a shorter period of time as well. Regardless, it's within the time frame of July 24th.

 

[SailorMoon]

Am the only one that just wants to cry??? I'm so sad for this child.......yet another one. Dang.

 

[LaLaw2000]

I want to know who found this body. The body was discovered a day or two after the reward went up to $10,000. I know I am too suspicious at times, but I really want to know. Better not be friends of Roberts so-called mother or the boyfriend. Here I go jumping the gun again. I must stop. Okay, I will stop.

I do have a valid question, tho. How far does it look to the nearest house from the spot in the canal where the body was found?

 

[nursebeeme]

Nurse, back me up here: From what I understand lungs are like a sponge. When someone drowns, the air sacs in the lungs fill with water. Since a body without air in the lungs is denser than water, it sinks. A person who is killed on the surface and then put in the water tends to float, since the lungs are still full of air. That's how pathologists can tell whether a person was drowned or was dead before hitting the water.

Yes, they will be able to tell.

 

[nursebeeme]

Except most of the local channels didn't cover the presser live either. And there are a ton of cases out there. How do we chose which one gets coverage? Even tes has to decide which case he gets involved with. People can't be everywhere at once.

you are right my friend!

 

[kiki the parrot]

Re drowning vs water disposal, as opposed to sinking or floating, in addition to w/e inexplicable injuries which could be indicative of postmortem submersion seems there is much which can be learned from lung tissue which assists at autopsy in distinguishing these including particulate matter, debris etc from water (she said happily deferring to nurse :blush Also it appears to be an advancing science, this is just an excerpt from an abstract I stumbled onto... steam coming from my ears about now...

The postmortem diagnosis of drowning continues to be one of the most difficult in forensic pathology because of unspecific autopsy findings. It must be always remembered that disposal of a victim body in water is not unknown in homicide. The most important physiological consequence in fatal drowning is hypoxemia. The air&#8211;liquid interface of alveoli and distal airways of the mature lung are lined with a thin layer of lung surfactant, composed of phospholipids, proteins and neutral lipids. Surfactant components are synthesized and/or incorporated into lung surfactant in alveolar type II cells, and secreted to form an airspace lining film. The composition and function of lung surfactant is disturbed in cases od acute lung injury (ALI) including drowning. Surfactant protein-A (SP-A) is the most abundant surfactant protein. Surfactant protein-A (SP-A) is secreted by type II alveolar cells and cells. It&#8217;s immunohistochemical distribution is observed in two different pathways: a linear membranous staining and a granular intra-alveolar staining... the significance of immunohistochemical detection of SP-A and its help in determination of the time of death, and possibly distinguishing of death by immersion vs. postmortem immersion using the morphological analysis applied on SP-A immunohistochemical stained lung tissue samples...


arrot: