IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #13

New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
At this point, I'm not even sure LS ever made it to CRs apt. Everything is so muddied after the 2:51am video. What if she and CR were followed, and he ran home but she stayed behind to "talk" to the person(s) following them? She could have never even made it to CRs. Then, when CR/MB find out she is missing, his roommate buddy covers for him and says she was with CR, dropped him off, then left. Wild theory I know. But, I have thought about it a lot, so I wanted to see if it's impossible or not. So, imagine they were chased up the alley, or a continued confrontation happened there. She stays behind as CR goes home. Something happens to HER by the person(s) following...maybe they are friends of JR and would end up with her at his door for help? IDK. The girl didn't necessarily have to have been doing drugs in this scenario. Even the stress of the evening punch could have stopped her heart. Maybe someone punched her hard enough it killed her? IDK. She's tiny. Maybe he then tried to get his own head screwed on, and slings her over his shoulder, pretending she's just drunk. Plans to take her somewhere, but doesn't know where yet. Finally ending up at a possible buddies house (JR)?
In my scenario, it sure would make her friends more able to blame her if they thought she was just using too much that night. But, if she was a total victim, then...sorry friends. MOO.
 
Tactically, I think it works well for LE to withhold some of the videos. If someone makes a statement that is contradicted by one of the videos, they then have someone to focus on.
 
This thread will close in about five minutes, and we'll move on to a new one. I'll post the link when it's ready.

Thanks.
 
In regards to presser on Friday, I could be that 30 days after a missing person report is filed seems to be an important milestone in the missing person protocols I have read - it could be that before they reach that milestone (next Sunday) they want to make a push for information because come next Monday this case might be handled from a different angle by LE. IMHO and just a hunch.
 
Forgive me if this has been raised at some point in the investigation, but why haven't the cell phone pings of the friends been studied?

Perhaps they have, however, that would be some very interesting finds.

By comparing the signal strength (it is archived onto servers for statistical usage), you could roughly find out the location of the cell phones. If we use a technique, such as signal trlateration, we could roughly find the location of the phone. Of course, this is worthless if the phone is not on the person.

If we assume a cell phone sends an outgoing 'get ping' every 6 seconds (its usually 6 or less), than investigators would simply KNOW if someone left the general area of that block LS was seen last. I would suggest that the range of the cell towers in that area might be 2-5 miles. However, by comparing strength of neighboring towers, we could draw a rough map; snapping it to a roadmap would yield a very conclusive study of where people drove, if they did.

People have been searching all around Bloomington for weeks, but nobody seems to realize that there are over 90 cell-sites in Bloomington, for different carriers. These could yield substantial evidence, i.e., there is no way someones cell phone was mated with the same cell tower while driving to/from Bloomington.

A bit far fetched, but haven't heard ANYONE mention the POI cell phones. Only Laurens. Just food for thought.
 
We have talked about pings, but have heard nothing from LE...so we don't know if they have worked off of them, are still waiting for some phone records, etc...
 
kissdegirl said:
At this point, I'm not even sure LS ever made it to CRs apt. Everything is so muddied after the 2:51am video. What if she and CR were followed, and he ran home but she stayed behind to "talk" to the person(s) following them? She could have never even made it to CRs. Then, when CR/MB find out she is missing, his roommate buddy covers for him and says she was with CR, dropped him off, then left. Wild theory I know...
Click to expand...

What would be the possible reason for MB to claim she was there when she wasn't? Especially if somebody chased her and CR into the alley. None whatsoever. I can not believe a person would implicate himself as a POI if the girl never made it into his and CR's apartment. And after MB I assume JR is confirming that she was in his apartment. So not one but two people would implicate themselves as POIs if the girl didn't make it to their apartments? I don't find that plausible. Also, in that scenario, CR is a victim, so neither MB nor JR would need to cover for him.
 
Azimuth said:
Forgive me if this has been raised at some point in the investigation, but why haven't the cell phone pings of the friends been studied?

Perhaps they have, however, that would be some very interesting finds.

By comparing the signal strength (it is archived onto servers for statistical usage), you could roughly find out the location of the cell phones. If we use a technique, such as signal trlateration, we could roughly find the location of the phone. Of course, this is worthless if the phone is not on the person.

If we assume a cell phone sends an outgoing 'get ping' every 6 seconds (its usually 6 or less), than investigators would simply KNOW if someone left the general area of that block LS was seen last. I would suggest that the range of the cell towers in that area might be 2-5 miles. However, by comparing strength of neighboring towers, we could draw a rough map; snapping it to a roadmap would yield a very conclusive study of where people drove, if they did.

People have been searching all around Bloomington for weeks, but nobody seems to realize that there are over 90 cell-sites in Bloomington, for different carriers. These could yield substantial evidence, i.e., there is no way someones cell phone was mated with the same cell tower while driving to/from Bloomington.

A bit far fetched, but haven't heard ANYONE mention the POI cell phones. Only Laurens. Just food for thought.
Click to expand...

Thanks for your post Azimuth. I think everyone has had general thoughts about this, but I for one am unclear about how this is done. Would LE do this by contacting the carriers of each POI? Would the carrier then be able to pull up activity in each of the 90 locations for the hours between 3:00 and 7:00? And then someone from LE would sit in front of a screen and scroll through. Would LE need to know the carrier of each POI cel? or have the actual phone to do this?
 
Epiphany and I exchanged posts on the previous page about LS's classes at Ivy Tech. If she enrolled in the first summer session which started May 23, perhaps she had a creeper following her or who knew of her whereabouts. Upthread is a comment by a current student there--about a peeping tom and someone else who was making (or otherwise involved in) *advertiser censored*.
 
Jupiter812 said:
It's absolutely your prerogative to show up any time there is neg on HT, British. You are to be commended for that. You may have missed the part in my original message where I said "My quotes". I removed the quotation marks to be clearer. I will not retract my comment.
Click to expand...

I believe that attacking and targeting people who are obviously unrelated to the case is wrong. By the way, I dont just "show up" here when there is neg on HT. I just find targeting her particularly wrong and inappropriate. She was her roommate, she was not with her that evening and her only problem is that she believed what a POI who happens to be her friend told her. That's not a crime.
 
holly2325 said:
Thanks for your post Azimuth. I think everyone has had general thoughts about this, but I for one am unclear about how this is done. Would LE do this by contacting the carriers of each POI? Would the carrier then be able to pull up activity in each of the 90 locations for the hours between 3:00 and 7:00? And then someone from LE would sit in front of a screen and scroll through. Would LE need to know the carrier of each POI cel? or have the actual phone to do this?
Click to expand...


That is sort of the basic idea. I do not work in telecom, but I am an avid ham radio operator, and I have an idea of how they do this. In order to understand how it is done, you have to understand the very basics of a cell phone.

On the most basic level, a cell phone is just a walky-talky that communicates with ground stations. The ground stations are then connected to the telephone network. In fact, back when cell phones were analog, you could very easily pick them up on all sorts of things. I remember back in my misspend days of high school, my buddy and I modified a Pro-39 radio scanner and walked up to a cell phone tower and we could hear everything. I digress, but the point is, nowadays, cell phones are digital devices that share the same frequencies, but have pretty much remained the same technology that was used in the late 80s.

When a cell phone is on and connected to the network, it is connected to a cell site. Typically, the phone is also 'speaking' (signal pinging) to other cell sites. An algorithm in the phone 'predicts' which cell site to switch to. For example, if you talk to your friend for an hour while driving down I-65, behind the scenes, your cell phone is passing your conversation from one cell site to the next. Typically this is every 2-5 miles, more in sparser areas. This is called a 'handoff' (a term that comes from air traffic control, but that is beyond the scope of what I am explaining here). Remember back in the day when your cell phone used to drop calls? Dropped calls are more rare nowadays, but it is called this because literally the call is 'dropped'; the cell sites fumbled it on the handoff.

My point is this,

A lot of this data is stored. For whatever reason, most of it would never be used, but your phone has a unique ID..after all, it has a unique number, and when someone calls you, it goes to your handset.

So, with this whole paradigm in your head, if someone, say, a carrier (lets just say Verizon) knows your signal strength measured to the dB, they can then graph this. If you take the graphs and crunch them, you will be able to see the general movement of the cell phone. It's sort of like magic, but that is the nature of math. It would work.

The problem I am having is I don't know how they would get this data, and again, of course the perp would have to have their phone on their person and on in order for this to work. But rest assured, it would. As you read this, if you have a cell phone near you, it is 'pinging' a tower about every 10 seconds. Your carrier knows where you are. if they didn't the towers wouldn't know when to transmit your text message, or your phone call. It is very valuable data! If the cell networks didn't know your location, the system would not operate.

Just food for thought.
 
I went food shopping today at the Scarsdale, NY Shop Rite and right in front of me was a Missing Flyer for Lauren. She lit my face with her huge smile. Praying for her and her family.
 
One thing about pings is that they still happen, apparently, even if the phone is turned off. The battery would have to be taken out to avoid pinging so hopefully whoever is involved would not know, or remember this in the heat of the moment.

LE did state early on that they had executed many search warrants and expected to do more. Those would probably include warrants for phones. How long it takes to get the records may depend as they could be coming from several states, depending upon where the billing is generated. So I am still hopeful that some ping info will come along that may point to someone having been away from downtown in the early hours of June 3rd.

PS- I don't think they need the actual phone (maybe someone can correct me on this if I am wrong.) The phone company would provide a listing of calls made and would be able to tell LE which tower each called used. As far as I know.
 
British said:
I believe that attacking and targeting people who are obviously unrelated to the case is wrong. By the way, I dont just "show up" here when there is neg on HT. I just find targeting her particularly wrong and inappropriate. She was her roommate, she was not with her that evening and her only problem is that she believed what a POI who happens to be her friend told her. That's not a crime.
Click to expand...

I know that. You've already said that. However I wouldn't say that HT is unrelated to this case. But more importantly, I will be more productive if you can help us address some of Northsider's questions on the previous page. Peace out.
 
cluciano63 said:
One thing about pings is that they still happen, apparently, even if the phone is turned off. The battery would have to be taken out to avoid pinging so hopefully whoever is involved would not know, or remember this in the heat of the moment.
Click to expand...

This is 'sort of' true. It is not possible to ping a cell phone while it is off. However, it is possible to track it via GPS. I think this was implemented as part of the e911 mandates. Which I should add, yes, this stuff is in federal regulations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enhanced_9-1-1#Wireless_enhanced_911
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 66 more.
Total: 3,948 (members: 67, guests: 3,881)

Online statistics

Members online
67
Guests online
3,881
Total visitors
3,948
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
592,490
Messages
17,969,780
Members
228,789
Latest member
Soccergirl500
Back
Top