IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #22

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indianagirl315 said:
2 points. . .

1) JW's house was not the official frat house. There is no official frat house, there are multiple different houses, in which the guys live in. There is no designated frat house.

2) This frat had no intention of getting back on campus. They did not want to.
Their letters had already been taken over by a newly colonized fraternity under their letters. They are fine being off campus as far as I know.
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AEPi is back. They are on N. Jordan Ave.
 
Tr. said:
Do you have any specific locations or areas that you think JR might have hidden the body that you would care to help me search this weekend? (other than the landfill)
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Do you have an answer to my question? Or a suggestion of how AB (and HT?) knows something that JR doesn't?
 
AbbeyR said:
But JW's friends were the first to insist the fight happened, after it was first reported - then denied - in the media. And the rumors that the altercation had to do with protecting Lauren from CR also came from people who identified themselves as JW's friends.

There may be more to the story, but what they said seems plausible to me: Concerned/protective/ angry/ drunk (or all of the above) friends of JW see Lauren out with another guy, messed up and possibly being taken advantage of. They confront them at Lauren's, trying to prevent them from going home together.

Vs. the ZO/ drug theory:

- Why would ZO be angry with CR for "letting Lauren talk" about drugs?
- And if that was behind the fight, why would JW's friends jump in and cover for ZO?
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All of the talk in this case about ZO/AB comes from anonymous sources, I believe, and has not been talked about by LE or local media. Clearly someone out there is trying to push them into the story. The question is whether that/those person(s)'s motives are good. Are they another POI? A random person with a grudge?
 
AnalyticalExaminer said:
All of the talk in this case about ZO/AB comes from anonymous sources, I believe, and has not been talked about by LE or local media. Clearly someone out there is trying to push them into the story. The question is whether that/those person(s)'s motives are good. Are they another POI? A random person with a grudge?
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Maybe they come from CR attorney Mr.Saltzmann.He is the one that claims he has all these leads in the case.Which is pretty amazing since his client says he remembers nothing.http://www.lohud.com/article/201106...ion-has-no-memory-their-last-moments-together
 
After hearing the latest from TR, I wonder if HT who is the one who told us that JR was the last to see LS, also is the one who told us that JR had a vistor from Mich. was giving all of that info to lead people towards them. It would also lead people away from ZO/AB.

Maybe she was getting all of her info from ZO/AB about who all was at JR's house since maybe they were there.

Just think it is all very interesting info. Needs to be looked at more. Hopefully LE has all of this info.
 
Chris007 said:
After hearing the latest from TR, I wonder if HT who is the one who told us that JR was the last to see LS, also is the one who told us that JR had a vistor from Mich. was giving all of that info to lead people towards them. It would also lead people away from ZO/AB.

Maybe she was getting all of her info from ZO/AB about who all was at JR's house since maybe they were there.

Just think it is all very interesting info. Needs to be looked at more. Hopefully LE has all of this info.
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HT said she spoke to JR. JR has denied neither that nor having been the last person to see her, which also comes from Salzmann, and I believe LE has confirmed that fact as well. HT did not become fb friends with ZO until after LS's disappearance.
 
The posts subsequent to and including today at 02:08 AM sure are INTERESTING! :coffeeup:
 
Assuming Tr.'s account is accurate, to answer his question, no I don't find it peculiar. These are all very social kids, with over 1000 facebook friends, who go to a party school together and apparently share an unusual circumstance that may well draw people together. AB appears to be a bit of a "player," as someone said upthread, while HT seems not to have much of a "filter," and may be a little naive. The implication that this means one or the other knows something, however, while not impossible, would not seem to follow to me. And to the extent they have no involvement (again, the family has pointed at the people who were with LS that night; HT was not after around midnight and AB's involvement is based on inferences from the report of a potentially discredited witness), I don't see that their lives are any of our business. What I would find more interesting is if HT and JR were spotted together.
 
AnalyticalExaminer said:
Assuming Tr.'s account is accurate, to answer his question, no I don't find it peculiar. These are all very social kids, with over 1000 facebook friends, who go to a party school together and apparently share an unusual circumstance that may well draw people together. AB appears to be a bit of a "player," as someone said upthread, while HT seems not to have much of a "filter," and may be a little naive. The implication that this means one or the other knows something, however, while not impossible, would not seem to follow to me. And to the extent they have no involvement (again, the family has pointed at the people who were with LS that night; HT was not after around midnight and AB's involvement is based on inferences from the report of a potentially discredited witness), I don't see that their lives are any of our business. What I would find more interesting is if HT and JR were spotted together.
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I think it would be interesting if JR were spotted at all!
 
I find this new post at JRNTT - http://jayrosenbaumneedstotalk.wordpress.com/2011/08/22/do-you-believe-it/ - very interesting. I have a bit of a problem with the assertion that LS knew she had no key, and the questions that follow from it, because the purported reason for the call was to have DR pick her up in his car (per PT). But that doesn't necessarily make the story any less illogical - if she needed a ride, perhaps it was because she had trouble walking or felt unsafe going alone, both of which she supposedly subsequently did.
 
AnalyticalExaminer said:
I find this new post at JRNTT - http://jayrosenbaumneedstotalk.wordpress.com/2011/08/22/do-you-believe-it/ - very interesting. I have a bit of a problem with the assertion that LS knew she had no key, and the questions that follow from it, because the purported reason for the call was to have DR pick her up in his car (per PT). But that doesn't necessarily make the story any less illogical - if she needed a ride, perhaps it was because she had trouble walking or felt unsafe going alone, both of which she supposedly subsequently did.
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Did we ever figure out whether or not Salzmann's camera's would've even caught LS on tape if she did walk by? Last I remember someone had said they were pointing at the parking lot and neither the near nor far sidewalks would've been in their view.
 
http://www.heraldtimesonline.com/stories/2011/08/23/news.qp-3438184.sto

Be forewarned: Pre-registration took place before they even left town, so all bets are off IMO.

"Spierer’s boyfriend, Jesse Wolff is among those who have pre-registered for classes this fall. So has Hadar Tamir and Alyx Steinberg, two of Spierer’s roommates at her fifth-floor Smallwood Plaza apartment.

Four of the young men, who were confirmed by attorneys to have been with Spierer on the night of her disappearance are also pre-registered. They include: Michael Beth, David Rohn, Corey Rossman and Jason “Jay” Rosenbaum."

I thought JW graduated?
 
IndyMom said:
Did we ever figure out whether or not Salzmann's camera's would've even caught LS on tape if she did walk by? Last I remember someone had said they were pointing at the parking lot and neither the near nor far sidewalks would've been in their view.
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No, we didn't. And it isn't the only problem with the list there - see Ann's comment for more. But it's not the only camera at issue - we don't know for sure the 10th and college cameras wouldn't have captured her, for instance - and it's only another block and a half to SW, past the donut shop (which closes when?). And the basic point regarding the logical consistency of the story with the reason for the call and then letting her go strikes me as a worthy one.
 
AnalyticalExaminer said:
No, we didn't. And it isn't the only problem with the list there - see Ann's comment for more. But it's not the only camera at issue - we don't know for sure the 10th and college cameras wouldn't have captured her, for instance - and it's only another block and a half to SW, past the donut shop (which closes when?). And the basic point regarding the logical consistency of the story with the reason for the call and then letting her go strikes me as a worthy one.
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I agree, I'm not sure about a lot of things in that blog post. It just reminded me of the Salzmann camera discussion so I wanted to make sure I hadn't missed some of that information.
 
If LS left JR's and made her way to ZO/AB's and something happened there, that would make more sense. But we'd have to establish that there is a path and entrance to ZO/AB's that is not covered with cameras - I don't recall whether we've done that. Absent that evidence, I have to go back to JR. ZO/AB involvement would also be inconsistent, imo, with their behavior after June 3, including Tr's supposed sighting.
 
IndyMom said:
Did we ever figure out whether or not Salzmann's camera's would've even caught LS on tape if she did walk by? Last I remember someone had said they were pointing at the parking lot and neither the near nor far sidewalks would've been in their view.
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Yes. Btown has done a very careful and comprehensive compilation and photos of all the cameras in the area. He has addressed Salzmann's camera and says he believes it does not pick up the sidewalk or street, just the parking lot.
 
The actual story of HT/AB actually makes me less suspicious of them being together. If they were screaming each other's full names at one another in front of a lot of people I don't think they felt guilty or like it was wrong to be together in public. If they had been hidden in the back and slunk off covering their faces when seen I would think it was more significant. I feel like everyone was social with one another in this case though so I am not sure if I am missing a huge AH HA! moment.

About the JRNTT post-I thought we had confirmed they had call boxes so she would have been able to call up and possibly wake up HT or her roommates if she had tried to walk home? Of course, that doesn't explain why she didn't just call them unless she didn't have their numbers memorized?


I don't think we have a really concrete 100% factual idea of where cameras would or would not catch someone OR what the confrontation was about. Everyone assumes it was about drugs, but I don't know. I would add both of those to my list of things I wish we knew.
 
Darcyline said:
The actual story of HT/AB actually makes me less suspicious of them being together. If they were screaming each other's full names at one another in front of a lot of people I don't think they felt guilty or like it was wrong to be together in public. If they had been hidden in the back and slunk off covering their faces when seen I would think it was more significant. I feel like everyone was social with one another in this case though so I am not sure if I am missing a huge AH HA! moment.

About the JRNTT post-I thought we had confirmed they had call boxes so she would have been able to call up and possibly wake up HT or her roommates if she had tried to walk home? Of course, that doesn't explain why she didn't just call them unless she didn't have their numbers memorized?


I don't think we have a really concrete 100% factual idea of where cameras would or would not catch someone OR what the confrontation was about. Everyone assumes it was about drugs, but I don't know. I would add both of those to my list of things I wish we knew.
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The only thing I wish I knew is the location of Lauren. "A really concrete 100% factual idea" is unrealistic in this case. I can deal with that.

As for cameras, Btown has provided us with location and camera analysis beyond what LE could ever supply. It has been very helpful in narrowing possibilities instead of having endless ones!
 
I thought Lauren's location went without saying. Factual truths are unrealistic, but many do take "sources" as 100% the truth which, to my naturally cynical nature, is difficult for me to do. When you cut down to what we know or what we have heard directly from a POI (NOT HT) what we do know for sure is frighteningly little. Pretty much everything seems to come from HT's second or third hand relating of the story or the plentiful "insider sources" that have popped up surrounding the case.
 
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