IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #26

[Ros]

PI BW of Sarasota now thinks that a registered sex offender (child molesting) who worked at a Taco Bell in Bloomington might be connected. However, the sex offender registry gives this person's work address as the Taco Bell on 3rd street rather than the one on Walnut near Kilroy's. Also, the US Marshals checked out all the sex offenders in the area. However, LE never has never said that any of them were cleared.

http://www.wthr.com/story/15044254/...earch-of-sex-offenders-near-spierer-apartment

 

[Jacobite]

We need to get BW looking in the correct Alley. This one with the gangsta graffiti.
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_c-935Sal4"](Lauren Spierer) Lauren Dear Lauren.wmv - YouTube[/ame]
I believe Lauren was snatched on College Avenue at the location where her parents
are photographed. Then taken west on the sidewalk N of the art institute. Then through
the camera blind spot in the alley and ever to 10th and College Apartments on Morton.
No it wasn't JW, CR, MB, JR, or DR that I observed chasing after a blond on 8,23,11 referred to in my first post.

 

[Jupiter812]

We need to get BW looking in the correct Alley. This one with the gangsta graffiti.
I believe Lauren was snatched on College Avenue at the location where her parents
are photographed. Then taken west on the sidewalk N of the art institute. Then through
the camera blind spot in the alley and ever to 10th and College Apartments on Morton.
No it wasn't JW, CR, MB, JR, or DR that I observed chasing after a blond on 8,23,11 referred to in my first post.

There is no "art institute" in Lauren's neighborhood. There are not even art galleries in the neighborhood.

 

[Jacobite]

Sorry to confuse you. I am not from bloomington. They had a John Herron sign up there which is an art school in Indy. Maybe, just advertising? Anyway there is a large red gray brick building at 10th and College. On the N side of it is the alley. I meant 1st house N of the alley.

 

[Jupiter812]

Sorry to confuse you. I am not from bloomington. They had a John Herron sign up there which is an art school in Indy. Maybe, just advertising? Anyway there is a large red gray brick building at 10th and College. On the N side of it is the alley. I meant 1st house N of the alley.

No, there's not a building like that either. The only thing closest is a one-story brick building of offices. First house north of the alley is wooden bungalow.

A few other things:
There is a camera in the alley just north of 10 and College.

There are a lot of security cameras at 10 & College Village--even more than Smallwood.

Darko is not "gangsta graffiti" but a popular street food vendor: http://www.yelp.com/biz/darko-taco-bloomington.

 

[AbbeyR]

<snipped> The NE corner of 10th and College Apartments would be an excellent place to stand out of camera view and watch a girl leaving 5 N Townhomes. You would be able to see which direction she took and go grab her. And, I wouldn't know all this except for I went to Bloomington myself on August 23, 2011. Two men and a blond were in the alley near sundown. The blond got ahead of us in the alley and a middle-eastern man came running after her. When he saw 2 men, he ran to a getaway car and sped away.
He came from 10th and College Apartments. So, I bet it's an abduction. But, it's not a random abduction because you really had to know that block in order to avoid the cameras. By the way, I also suspect Lauren dropped her keys during the kidnapping because you have your keys in hand on the way home, not on the way to visiting.

I'm a little confused by this post. Are you saying that in August you were visiting Bloomington, went to the alley where Lauren was last seen, and at that precise moment you believe you may have witnessed an attempted abduction? Or am I reading this wrong?? If not, did others think this too? and did you call the police?

 

[Jacobite]

I'm a little confused by this post. Are you saying that in August you were visiting Bloomington, went to the alley where Lauren was last seen, and at that precise moment you believe you may have witnessed an attempted abduction? Or am I reading this wrong?? If not, did others think this too? and did you call the police?

Hi Abbey,
On 8,23 of last year 3 witnesses did see such a thing and it was reported. The guy had a getaway car as well. They were lightning fast and I'd bet these guys will strike again. I was also informed this is very near the location where the dogs lost Lauren's scent. This is why I think this is an abduction.

 

[Jacobite]

No, there's not a building like that either. The only thing closest is a one-story brick building of offices. First house north of the alley is wooden bungalow.

A few other things:
There is a camera in the alley just north of 10 and College.

There are a lot of security cameras at 10 & College Village--even more than Smallwood.

Darko is not "gangsta graffiti" but a popular street food vendor: http://www.yelp.com/biz/darko-taco-bloomington.

OK. An investigator said it was Darko Saric an international slave trader. But, I like tacos, so, I will take your word on this. And, if you reread my post, I was describing a red gray building also called 621 N College.

 

[jjenny]

Hi Abbey,
On 8,23 of last year 3 witnesses did see such a thing and it was reported. The guy had a getaway car as well. They were lightning fast and I'd bet these guys will strike again. I was also informed this is very near the location where the dogs lost Lauren's scent. This is why I think this is an abduction.

Are you saying some other blond was chased and abducted? I presume that would have been on the news but we heard nothing of the sort.

 

[Jacobite]

Are you saying some other blond was chased and abducted? I presume that would have been on the news but we heard nothing of the sort.

The guy saw the blond was with two men. He suddenly stopped and ran to a getaway car and sped away. I believe he was about 5 foot 10 inches tall
and about 160 pounds. He had olive brown skin and dark hair. Three witnesses
saw it.

 

[Jupiter812]

OK. An investigator said it was Darko Saric an international slave trader. But, I like tacos, so, I will take your word on this. And, if you reread my post, I was describing a red gray building also called 621 N College.

That building is 10 and College Apartments. The name is the same as the location. That corner is lit and there is a security camera in the alley that points to College.

There is also a musician/composer named Darko (I just learned), so that could be it as well.

 

[jjenny]

The guy saw the blond was with two men. He suddenly stopped and ran to a getaway car and sped away. I believe he was about 5 foot 10 inches tall
and about 160 pounds. He had olive brown skin and dark hair. Three witnesses
saw it.

Where did the blond go? I am not understanding that whole story.
If there was an abduction or attempted abduction in the area where LS went missing, I think the press would have been all over it.

 

[akh]

Where did the blond go? I am not understanding that whole story.
If there was an abduction or attempted abduction in the area where LS went missing, I think the press would have been all over it.

Let's take the OP at their word. That doesn't mean the police took it seriously as an abduction. And even if they did somewhat take it seriously, the cynical part of me thinks they would downplay it as long as they could and keep that info from the media. IU and Bloomington doesn't want to be known as a place where random abductions are happening or being attempted. And LE probably would tend to downplay anything in their minds that could point that way in hopes that such a thing isn't happening. At least until something would happen that would leave them no other choice than to believe it.

'Hopes' is probably the wrong word... I'm saying they would have a hard time believing something like that could be happening in Bloomington, Indiana to the point of even having a small blindspot to it.

Add to that a desire to manage PR for the city and college and I can see how they'd want anything that can't be 100% confirmed as a random abduction (or attempt) to remain off the radar.

 

[imkeylime]

Let's take the OP at their word. That doesn't mean the police took it seriously as an abduction. And even if they did somewhat take it seriously, the cynical part of me thinks they would downplay it as long as they could and keep that info from the media. IU and Bloomington doesn't want to be known as a place where random abductions are happening or being attempted. And LE probably would tend to downplay anything in their minds that could point that way in hopes that such a thing isn't happening. At least until something would happen that would leave them no other choice than to believe it.

'Hopes' is probably the wrong word... I'm saying they would have a hard time believing something like that could be happening in Bloomington, Indiana to the point of even having a small blindspot to it.

Add to that a desire to manage PR for the city and college and I can see how they'd want anything that can't be 100% confirmed as a random abduction (or attempt) to remain off the radar.

I once worked in the University Relations Dept. of a regional university that tried to keep a rape quiet. The PR director handled it, or should I say mishandled it, directly. My half of the department (Publications) didn't even know about it. He got bit when it eventually leaked, though.

Under these circumstances and in today's more investigative climate, I'd like to believe that such a thing wouldn't happen.

But if the scenario's true, I wonder if a "perfect storm" befell LS ... partying too hard with CR or maybe even being slipped something; ending up minus cell, shoes, and keys with a guy who let her leave alone at 4:30 am; and then being in the wrong place at the wrong time totally defenseless. If so, she sure didn't catch a break that night ... makes me sad.

 

[Jupiter812]

Let's take the OP at their word. That doesn't mean the police took it seriously as an abduction. And even if they did somewhat take it seriously, the cynical part of me thinks they would downplay it as long as they could and keep that info from the media. IU and Bloomington doesn't want to be known as a place where random abductions are happening or being attempted. And LE probably would tend to downplay anything in their minds that could point that way in hopes that such a thing isn't happening. At least until something would happen that would leave them no other choice than to believe it.

'Hopes' is probably the wrong word... I'm saying they would have a hard time believing something like that could be happening in Bloomington, Indiana to the point of even having a small blindspot to it.

Add to that a desire to manage PR for the city and college and I can see how they'd want anything that can't be 100% confirmed as a random abduction (or attempt) to remain off the radar.

I would have to know and understand a lot more about this incident before I could accuse Bloomington and IU LE of trying to hide crime. I know it seems to be a favorite pastime of people who are frustrated with this case (not talking about you btw), but I just don't see what people are basing that on.

How do we know this wasn't an attempted robbery? How do we know these men didn't live in the area or in the city and didn't know the blonde, in which case it would not be a random attempted abduction.

I recall a number of incidents around BLoomington that were reported and published around the time the students started to return and for a few weeks after the first semester started--which would fit August 23 timeframe.

Other than Lauren, I know of no other unsolved case of a missing person in the last quarter century in Btown.

 

[jjenny]

I would have to know and understand a lot more about this incident before I could accuse Bloomington and IU LE of trying to hide crime. I know it seems to be a favorite pastime of people who are frustrated with this case (not talking about you btw), but I just don't see what people are basing that on.

How do we know this wasn't an attempted robbery? How do we know these men didn't live in the area or in the city and didn't know the blonde, in which case it would not be a random attempted abduction.

I recall a number of incidents around BLoomington that were reported and published around the time the students started to return and for a few weeks after the first semester started--which would fit August 23 timeframe.

Other than Lauren, I know of no other unsolved case of a missing person in the last quarter century in Btown.

I don't even understand the story. Clearly the blonde didn't go missing because there is no way the University could cover that up. Somebody saw a man running? And a blonde was there? I am very confused as to what exactly is even alleged to have happened.

 

[Jupiter812]

<Snipped>

How do we know this wasn't an attempted robbery? How do we know these men didn't live in the area or in the city and didn't know the blonde, in which case it would not be a random attempted abduction.

I recall a number of incidents around BLoomington that were reported and published around the time the students started to return and for a few weeks after the first semester started--which would fit August 23 timeframe.

Other than Lauren, I know of no other unsolved case of a missing person in the last quarter century in Btown.

Case in point: Below is a report from IU's crime site. This is one of the incidents I was referring to. It took place just hours after Jacobite saw the men and the blonde, so it could be the same men (assuming the robber was a man). This is not far from 10th and College.

Female Student Reports Strong Armed Robbery near Bloomington Campus.
Subject area:
August 24, 2011 at 11:13 AM
IU Bloomington
At approximately 1:00 AM on Aug 24th, a 22 year old female Indiana University student reported to Bloomington Police that she was robbed while walking between 12th and 13th street on Indiana Avenue just off of the Indiana University Campus. There was no weapon displayed and no injury.

 

[Jupiter812]

I don't even understand the story. Clearly the blonde didn't go missing because there is no way the University could cover that up. Somebody saw a man running? And a blonde was there? I am very confused as to what exactly is even alleged to have happened.

All I know is what Jacobite wrote and that s/he thinks it was an attempted abduction. I may have confused the issue with my last statement about there being no missing women in Btown in the last 25 years. With that, I was trying to make the point that LE could not make a habit of not reporting abductions--because as you said, you can't cover up a missing person.

 

[akh]

I would have to know and understand a lot more about this incident before I could accuse Bloomington and IU LE of trying to hide crime. I know it seems to be a favorite pastime of people who are frustrated with this case (not talking about you btw), but I just don't see what people are basing that on.

What I am saying is if the OP (or another witness) reported this incident unless someone was reported missing or reported this incident themselves then LE isn't likely to have taken it very seriously.... and as such aren't likely to allow a mention of it to reach the public where it can be speculated upon and take on a life of it's own (especially in the current climate).

Normally, I don't think LE would seek to hide the existence of a crime.

That said, it's in the city and IU's best interests (PR-wise) to downplay any unsubstantiated reports of this type.

And going further.... If LE doesn't think they have an issue with random abductions or random violence then they probably aren't going to take a report such as what the OP described as credible. They might believe the OP saw something but will want to believe it wasn't what the OP thought they saw. And then they will treat it as such... rightly or wrongly...

Of course I believe that is likely why this case has the deadends it has, LE didn't take it seriously enough at the very beginning and probably assumed LS had hooked up with a new 'boyfriend' or was sleeping off a night of partying at a friend's place (maybe a new friend). That left things like the dumpsters and transfer station unchecked, and allowed a window of opportunity for evidence to be destroyed (intentionally or unintentionally), stories to be developed, etc.. And it allowed potentially exculpatory evidence to be lost. Example- If CR, JR, and MB are innocent then I bet they'd like nothing more then for the dumpster near their place to have been searched in a timely fashion to forever rule out the idea they easily disposed of LS there. Of course maybe it was searched before it was emptied... it's not like LE has exactly been forthcoming with that type of info. But the idea remains the same, timely evidence could've narrowed the spotlight on the list of PsOI.

 

[AbbeyR]

I don't know what to think about the attempted abduction, but in response to the posts above, I will add that I agree with Akh that Bloomington police may downplay and keep certain information from the media.

At the beginning of this case, one of the reasons I dismissed the possibility that Lauren was the victim of a random crime was that I assumed that if this was the case, there would be a different reaction from LE (they would issue public appeals, warn students about safety, etc).

However, I posted recently about a case I randomly came across involving violent robberies against IU students last year, which made me re-think this. ([ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7531789&postcount=323"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - IN IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #26[/ame]).

To follow up on that last post:

Jupiter responded that it seems like that case was swept under the rug -- While I don't have a subscription to Bloomington news, I couldn't find any article online about the robberies or assaults prior to the one posted in the IU student paper, which describes the arrest. Note that the article makes the arrest sound like a police success story:

Putting a stop to these robberies was extremely important to us. This operation is one where several officers and detectives worked together and did an excellent job of surveillance, intensive patrol techniques, information gathering and, finally, arrest. I am very proud of their efforts and the outcome of this investigation,&#8221; BPD Chief Michael Diekhoff said.

http://www.idsnews.com/news/story.aspx?id=80315

Based on that, one might miss this part:

Additional charges against Charleston and against other suspects involved in the crimes are possible.

Looking up the link to Indiana court records that RoS posted, it turns out that an accomplice was arrested (There is a link to a co-defendent case, if you look up the name of the arrested man), but not until June. 10th, 2011 -- 3 months after that article was written. He made a plea agreement, which involved paying restitution to two women, who I believe were IU students, and received a suspended sentence of three years.

Does this have anything directly to do with Lauren's case? Probably not... but it made me rethink:

1)whether Lauren could have been the target of a random attack: I still think this is unlikely, but maybe a little less so after reading about real (not just hypothetical) thugs targeting girls walking home late at night in Bloomington
(at least one of whom was still out on the streets when Lauren went missing)

2) Whether police would share information about this case, if they have any: Hypothetically, if there was any evidence that she was abducted by a stranger, would students be clearly warned to take precautions? Doubt it.