Interpreting the "evidence"

I've TRIED to believe that general scenario, but I've had to disabuse myself because it doesn't pan out. I now think that our WANTING the head blow to have been an accident is impeding progress toward solving the case. After all, if it happened somewhat as you say, & if P for whatever reason felt the need to dissemble & all that, there's just no way she would've written THAT ransom note.
So, if I assume her death was NOT an accident, I ask myself "Why did she have to die?" The best answer I get is "Because she recognized the person." JB presumably knew she was being tied up, etc., but she wasn't supposed to know by whom.
Another tangentially related bit of evidence: the "MY TWINN" doll JB got for X-Mas--Could P have used it to practice kidnapping JB?
 
skybluepink,

Re: "axed"---Ye do err. Your little joke didn't go unnoticed, and was, therefore, not obscure. Sorry to disappoint you. Why on earth would you want to apologise? Oh, I get it---you're apologising for the obscurity of your little joke. OK, apologee accepted.

We can't say for certain that the writer knew the Ramseys would be up before 8 AM. Well, voice mail would work, too, wouldn't it? Hmmm...might be traceable though. Shucks! How's a kidnapper gonna' make an honest livin'!

And if Patsy had written seven AM in her exemplar, you'd eliminate her as the author of the note? Isn't AM more modern than am? Might help to determine the age of the author. Also, wouldn't a more modern version of the initials have been SBTC (without periods)? What was once F.B.I. is now more commonly FBI. It's this fast-paced world we live in, you see. Now, I would have preferred the :00, that's for sure. Nobody uses o'clock these days.

About the money, etc.: The note seems to have been designed to make all the important arrangements except for the time, place and means of pickup and delivery (not RN terms), which were to be transmitted telephonically. This makes perfect sense; wouldn't want to tip off the coppers regarding those factors. But, could have included those too, more riskily (a new word), and omitted the phone call. Do you detect intelligent thought, and careful planning in the note? No normal person could compose and write this apparently extemporaneous note, immediately after having killed, deliberately or otherwise, her innocent child. The note was either written after the murder by a non-participant in the crime; a cool customer, or before the murder in a leisurely manner, without fear of interference.

"Given that ALL scenarios......are illogical.": This means your scenario, too, is illogical? It is, after all, among the ALL. And your condemnation is logical? Also, might we want to distinguish between illogical and implausible? From here on, to your "just to conclude", I am in agreement. I can't see John entertaining this crazy note idea for one femtosecond. But who's axing me?

I can't feature that Patsy would kill JonBenet just to keep her from yapping. If she'd do that, she was one SICK senora. JonBenet was her life. She was JonBenet and JonBenet was she. In killing JonBenet, she'd be killing herself.

Now, there is a scenario that allows Patsy to get rough with the kid--it involves JonBenet having sex with John. I'm sure you can figure it out. Some mothers might go after the husband; beat the crap out of him. Others might go after the child. Depends on the circumstances and the personalities. JonBenet was too young to be a breadwinner. JonBenet may have been killed in a panic, but it wasn't because she recognized P.

I like your theory (my old theory) up to the point of the homicide. Substitute "the helpers did it" for "Patsy did it" and you've got a dog that might hunt.

By the way, to whom it may concern, Patsy's question, "Why did they do this?" could apply to the aforementioned helpers, just as it could apply to the "small foreign faction"; and, the question could be a genuine expression of anguished puzzlement, just as it could be phony as a three-dollar bill.

A dream is a wish your heart makes...
 
Yes, I absolutely include my own theory as illogical. NOTHING makes sense, which is one reason it's all so baffling.
I'm just trying to get from little girl having dinner in the evening to little girl being killed a few hours later, and THAT ransom note being left at the scene.
I can't think of any circumstance that would lead a member of the family to cover up in this bizarre manner if the death were an accident.
I also briefly entertained your J-JB sex premise, but, for 1 thing, I can't see his going along w/the SPECIFIC coverup. And the timing is all off.
Besides, I think J is innocent. For those who believe a Ramsey is involved, a key reason for believing so is that the Rs lawyered up. (And I agree that it strongly suggests guilt.) I think the reason J called a lawyer is that he started to suspect Burke did it--& that the reason he suspected Burke is that P LED him to suspect him, or at least LET him suspect him. Covering up for a 9-year-old is understandable; nothing else about this bloody case is.
 
FACT: Jonbenet was found in her basement
FACT: Jonbenet was found by her father, and carried up the stairs by him
FACT: There was a ransom note somewhere in the house
FACT: Whoever killed Jonbenet wanted to make sure she was dead.
FACT: The Ramseys security system was broken at the time of the murder
FACT: Jonbenet had underwear on that would have been too big on me in 1996, and I was 10 years old.
FACT: The blanket was under Jonbenet.
FACT: This story is still making tabloid headlines, 8.5 years later.
FACT: Jonbenet was a beauty queen. She looked even more beautiful without makeup in normal kid pictures than her beauty pagent ones.
FACT: Police botched the investigation big time

CONCLUSION: Jonbenet's murder will not be solved until a time machine is invented, and we can go back in time and see who killed her, because no other theories make perfect sense. Something souds "off" or doesn't fit in every single theory I've heard. Except for one very far-fetched theory I found here
 
Yes, Phylliyum, Bluefire had a good theory. 18-23 if I recall? was his guess for the perp? Too bad ,unless he's changed his name, that he isn't around anymore. Seems I remember him taking a lot of forum abuse, being called a ped and such, which was a shame. Wasn't he the guy who provided Jameson with the *advertiser censored* shot that some thought was a Pugh?
 
The neck abrasions tell me that JonBenet was attacked with the "garrote" before she was clubbed. Probably the perp approached her from behind, with the string wrapped around, and stretched between, his hands, and brought it up over her head and down and back against the front of the neck in a catching maneuver. This is the sort of maneuver that soldiers sometimes use to silently extinguish their adversaries while infiltrating enemy positions. The nylon string wouldn't be the apparatus of choice for them, though it would work as a field expedient. Something strong and of smaller cross-section, like piano wire, would work better; would require less strength to do maximum damage. Of course, in the military example, the object is to kill; whereas with JonBenet, the object was probably to capture and subdue without killing, at least initially. You can imagine him (her killer) capturing her this way and forcefully dragging her, by this means, to wherever he intended to go with her in the short term. He could even have knocked her out this way--temporary asphyxia leading to unconsciousness, and later, while she was out, fashioned the string into a noose.

The perp was probably taller than JonBenet (is this any surprise?); it appears that the string slid up her neck. She was clearly alive when this happened. She has cord burns and abrasions which attest to this. The abrasions verged on open bleeding in some locations. That big triangular abrasion (which looks more like a burn) is still mysterious to me, so I have to skip over it for now. I'm pretty sure it wasn't caused by anyone's knuckles. Forgetaboutit!

Edited to add: I just reminded myself, via internet search, that Dr. Wecht said he was surprised at the minimal bleeding inside the skull. From this, and other evidence, he deduced that the blow came after the strangulation process had begun. He actually said the blow was administered as a cover-up. This is precisely the opposite of what most theorists have surmised. Wow!

Thoughts?
 
Re Post #124, Phyllium, the site you visited is down and only part of it replaced, not including the JonBenet theory, so will you please, please, please try to recreate it for us? I agree that every theory so far has something about it that doesn't feel quite right, and I for one am extremely curious since you say this one is better. Thanks in advance.
 
E:
Strange--I was able to click right to it & found a fascinating, detailed hypothesis. (It's the specific ransom note that presents a problem for me.) Hope it works for you.
 
Taken from my previous link:

The killer of JonBenét Ramsey was an older teen or young adult who lived close by, probably within two blocks. He lived alone. His passing on the block would be seen as a normal part of everyday life. His family had been highly controlling and as a child he was punished frequently. He was considered by high school teachers as highly intelligent and an over-achiever. He had few, if any close friendships with peers because it was felt that he was over-controlling. He hated his parents and their relationship was extremely strained. He could, and did relate easily with children.
His sexual fantasies revolved around holding small, immature beautiful females captive. In his fantasies he would have a small girl held captive in a basement and tied with cords during repeated sexual assaults. She would comply with his every demand. If she didn't, she would die. The fantasy became an obsession over a long period of time To feed his fantasies he watched movies with kidnap themes, especially those in which children were victims.

The murder of JonBenét began when she became an object of his fantasies and the Ramsey's whom he knew slightly from neighborhood contact became a projection of the hatred for his parents. He would sometimes see her playing on the sidewalk. He might stop and watch or even talk to her for a bit, gradually establishing a sort of trusting relationship. Her parents most likely knew very little, if anything, about his existence or friendship with JonBenét. As his captive female fantasies focused in on JonBenét he planned, from videos, movies and true crime works, to kidnap JonBenét. The kidnap was not for money so much as to fulfill psychosexual needs. He began to "creepy-crawl" the Ramsey house while they were out, getting to know the layout and some esoteria concerning the family. He may have fulfilled masturbation fantasies during these few visits.

The plan that evolved was to have JonBenét voluntarily walk with him to his nearby dwelling where he would sexually abuse her for as long as he wanted, and finally kill her. On the morning of the 24th, he saw JonBenét playing on the sidewalk and told her to expect a secret visit from Santa Claus. She was to keep it secret. To deflect interest in a investigating the neighborhood, and also for the thrill of it, he would leave a ransom note claiming that JonBenét had been abducted by a foreign faction. While the Ramsey's were out on the 25th he broke into the Ramsey house and eventually left with a filched pad and sharpie pen. He also stole a pocket knife that he found in the pull-up cabinet. At home he wrote and rewrote the note until it sounded, in his own mind, the authentic work of a foreign faction.

His "kit" included cord, duct tape, stun gun, flashlight, the ransom note on its pad, and a teddy bear dressed as Santa Claus. Living in the neighborhood he had no problem keeping a sort of surveillance of the Ramsey house going. He simply waited for the lights to go out, then entered through the basement window.

Christmas Night, 1996

Her father John carried JonBenét from the garage to her bedroom asleep and put to bed at 9:15 PM. There were sheets on her bed, a white blanket and a comforter. John helped Burke finish his project and then got him up to bed around 9:30pm. Patsy Ramsey took the black velvet pants JonBenét had worn to the White's party off and put on a pair of long underwear like her daughter would use for skiing. She didn't change her top.JonBenét's pink Barbie nightgown was somewhere on or in her bed. Later it would be found near her body in the wine cellar.
JonBenét's darkened bedroom
From the basement the killer walked upstairs to the first floor. He kneeled beside the bed and gently woke her up, using the Santa Bear as a sort of puppet, reminding her as she awoke that Santa had promised a visit on Christmas night, and promising her that Santa was waiting for her to visit him someplace near the house. To understand how such a puppet lure is used see the ©1996 movie The Cold Light of Day. JonBenét didn't want to get dressed. She didn't want to leave the house. But, the lure-person convinced her to show her Christmas toys downstairs and she wrapped herself in the white blanket from her bed and accompanied him to the first floor.



Santa Bear

He grabbed up the Barbie nightgown and following JonBenét closing the door behind them. On the way down the stairs he stopped and left the ransom note, perhaps telling JonBenét that it was a note from Santa Claus to her parents so if they woke up they wouldn't worry, that she was visiting Santa.. JonBenét insisted on showing him her presents in the living room. Passing through the breakfast room she saw the bowl of pineapple, took a chunk in her fingers and ate it.

In the living room, something about the killer's demeanor began to make JonBenét queasy and anxious. Perhaps he insisted she get dressed up with new clothes from open presents in the living room, and put on her shoes. She didn't want to go, not without really telling mom and dad. Being tired, she may have become resistant and whiney and started towards her room. She was nervous, becoming fearful. The killer felt he was losing control and stun-gunned her in the kitchen. He placed the flashlight on the counter and lifted her up, re-wrapped the blanket around her and went for the door, looked out and saw people moving around from a church service and a dope party. It would be impossible to carry her past these areas to his dwelling without causing major suspicion and eventual arrest. The plan had failed.

So, he carried her to the basement and laid her face down on the floor, tied her wrists found the paint brush in the paint tote, and began fashioning the "garrote". While he was cutting the cord, or the stick he made a small cut in his finger, that began bleeding a few seconds afterwards. He fashioned the garrote so that her elbows were forward, arms to the side of her head and wrists looped around the stick of the garrote. He gagged her with duct tape. He laid the pocket knife down and carried her to the freezer where he pulled down her pants and began sexually assaulting her, using the finger that was slightly bleeding, while he masturbated with the other hand. JonBenét was regaining use of her muscles from the first stun gun attack and a part of the poorly applied duct tape "popped" off her mouth. Before he could ejaculate she screamed . The killer reached around with his left hand, thumb to one side forming the triangular injury under her jaw and hand over the duct tape and nostrils. Pressing the duct tape the second time superimposed a clearer lip print over the much lighter first one. He stun gunned her again in the face. She was still again. He grabbed up one of Burke's baseball bats and listened at the head of the cellar stairs. Hearing nothing he returned to his victim to check her, left her again and opened the wine cellar door.

She was bleeding vaginally. To remove any evidence he wiped her with his sleeve, then pulled up her long johns. The killer carried her into the wine cellar where he laid her on the floor. He stood with one foot on her back and one on the basement floor and strangled her with enough force to tear her hair, then bludgeoned her with the bat making sure she was dead. He stared for a few moments and left her to recover the two items (the blanket and the nightgown) from the freezer room. He tossed the blanket partially over the body, the nightgown fell to one side. He closed and latched the door. Once again he listened at the head of the stairs and hearing nothing escaped out of the butler's kitchen door. Near the front of the house he threw the bat to one side. It made a pinging metallic noise. Acting as if nothing had happened he walked past the Church Service/dope party as if nothing happened. No one noticed him. He went into his nearby dwelling.
 
It's a refreshing change from Patsy assumptions.

But would this kid have known about the bonus amount? His guessing it correctly isn't logical. I know, you're not saying he's the one.
 

Members online

Online statistics

Members online
166
Guests online
3,903
Total visitors
4,069

Forum statistics

Threads
592,522
Messages
17,970,319
Members
228,793
Latest member
aztraea
Back
Top