Josh Powell blew his house up in WA #3

[annalia]

Not if it was an anonymous donation.

Not following, if he gave them away anonymously then where does the fact that he gave them away become a red flag that should have been picked up on?

 

[jjenny]

Not following, if he gave them away anonymously then where does the fact that he gave them away become a red flag that should have been picked up on?

Who told the press he donated to Goodwill?

 

[Kimster]

Who told the press he donated to Goodwill?

Josh Powell donated boxes of toys and books to a Goodwill charity over the weekend before he murdered his two children in a fire, police said Monday.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...s-toys-other-items-before-murdering-them.html

 

[Steely Dan]

Did you read my post? #10. The toys were an example I gave but then again, people give away toys to charities all the time. I think you might be misunderstanding my point. The warning signs of suicide may have been there based on some of the very things listed on that link Pensfan posted but if you go through the list, it won't give you warning signs for murder.

Proof is in the pudding. They let him have "supervised" visitation only because of that disgusting and disturbing photo and ordered a psych sex analysis. They did NOT recognize the warning signs of suicide nor murder and that's my point. Even the so called experts didn't!

Does anyone know what the picture was?

 

[jjenny]

Josh Powell donated boxes of toys and books to a Goodwill charity over the weekend before he murdered his two children in a fire, police said Monday.

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/...s-toys-other-items-before-murdering-them.html

So somebody must have told police?

 

[Kimster]

So somebody must have told police?

Looks like it.

 

[indicat]

Isnt the fact that he was obviously suicidal enough? Did the dots need to be connected all the way to murder/suicide in order to modify this visitation arrangement? I think the article that talks about the disturbing picture does a great job of pointing out why his mental state should have been anticipated. I think the fact that he was obviously suicidal should have been enough. On top of that murder/suicide seems to be coming more common place.

 

[Kimster]

Does anyone know what the picture was?

Yes, it was reported but I do not want it quoted here. Lemme look around and find the link for you, unless someone else beats me to it.

 

[~n/t~]

Does anyone know what the picture was?

Yes I posted the article on the previous page.

 

[Kimster]

Details of the photo that was presented at the custody hearing at the link.

http://www.nwcn.com/home/?fId=138831984&fPath=/news/local&fDomain=10212

Here you go Steely. Thanks n/t!

 

[krista]

So, Michael Powell provided the voicemail message to ABC/police? That seems a little out of character for him. He also took down his blog about how Josh was being harassed online. Wonder if he's had a change of heart......

Or maybe abc paid him.....

 

[Pensfan]

His wife has gone missing, has she not? Couldn't that be considered a warning?

Here's more warning signs for domestic violence and therefore, a potential for a domestic homicide:
-he had intense anger which could be seen in his blog which was removed from the internet
-very controlling personality,
-isolated his children (from their grandparents),
-abusive to at least one family member (Susan),
-blamed others for his problems,
-grew up in an abusive home, and
-many people had a gut feeling that he might kill his children

 

[danisisa]

I have wondered if Josh Powell ever knew his sons were talking about mommy being in the trunk. He probably felt betrayed by them. I am sure he had coached them many times before Susan's parents got custody. It is strange to me that the boys were reluctant to go, but ran ahead. They are heroes on my eyes because of that. The worker would have been killed too. I have no doubt they noticed daddy was acting different and they tried to run. But, they were up against a monster.

I believe so much in the afterlife, that it comforts me knowing they will never feel pain or confusion. They are with their mother now.

I do believe this could have been avoided as other murders of children. The courts need to stop worrying so much about keeping families together, and worry about the safety of the children. We as a nation need to stand up and say NO MORE!!!

 

[x_files]

In this case the suicide signs would have been enough. It was a murder - suicide, they occurred together.
However, there were signs of murder as well. Why get ride of the boys things if they would be here to use them?

If a person appears to be planning a suicide
Already has a missing wife
Has a father in jail

Has lost custody of his children to people he despises
Has given away his children's toys and books
and is getting a visitation with their children in a couple of hours...

It would probably be a good idea to prevent that visitation.

If someone had spotted the signs early enough... and stopped the visitation, that would have been enough to prevent it.
It doesn't appear that those who had time to react, knew enough to know that they needed to. Those who knew, didn't have time.

Whether Josh carried out his suicide or not, wouldn't have mattered... if they had kept the kids away.
They might have even figured out his plan without him carrying it out.

Of course they probably would have tried to prevent Josh from killing himself, but their priority would have been the kids.

Do you know who knew that Josh gave away all the toys?
If it was a family member or his attorney they should have called emergency crisis hotline/police asap and warned them of his strange behavior that visitation should have bee canceled.
Didn't anyone think that was heartless and bizarre behavior to get rid of all of their belongings right before visitation?
Are people too busy to notice or to care? Or is strange chaotic behavior the normal to the Powell clan?

 

[gitana1]

His wife has gone missing, has she not? Couldn't that be considered a warning?

I don't think anyone is disputing his suicide warnings, it's the murders that we need to recognize. Suicide warnings signs are there. How about murder?

In this case the suicide signs would have been enough. It was a murder - suicide, they occurred together.
However, there were signs of murder as well. Why get ride of the boys things if they would be here to use them?

If a person appears to be planning a suicide
Already has a missing wife
Has a father in jail

Has lost custody of his children to people he despises
Has given away his children's toys and books
and is getting a visitation with their children in a couple of hours...

It would probably be a good idea to prevent that visitation.

If someone had spotted the signs early enough... and stopped the visitation, that would have been enough to prevent it.
It doesn't appear that those who had time to react, knew enough to know that they needed to. Those who knew, didn't have time.

Whether Josh carried out his suicide or not, wouldn't have mattered... if they had kept the kids away.
They might have even figured out his plan without him carrying it out.

Of course they probably would have tried to prevent Josh from killing himself, but their priority would have been the kids.

Bingo. Let me clear this up right now. In family law cases, if a parent shows signs of suicidal ideation, that is enough to yank custody of their kids. It can be enough for a restraining order, protecting the children from the parent. Why? Because suicide and murder are known to go hand in hand, in numerous cases involving parents and their kids, every year, in every state. Thus, suicidal tendencies are considered a warning sign for possible murder. The missing wife and his obvious POI status just add to that.

I think part of the problem is that there are different departments that probably don't communicate with each other.
There's social services, the court system and the police.

I am curious to know why it is known that Josh donated the boy's toys to charity?

I get the sense that he wrote, in one of his e-mails, that he did so.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Here is the first responders going to the house.

http://www.kirotv.com/news/news/crime-law/raw-audio-recordings-first-responders-powell-home-/nHW9t/

 

[jjenny]

Here is the first responders going to the house.

http://www.kirotv.com/news/news/crime-law/raw-audio-recordings-first-responders-powell-home-/nHW9t/

Except the times are appear to be all off????

 

[gitana1]

Did you read my post? #10. The toys were an example I gave but then again, people give away toys to charities all the time. I think you might be misunderstanding my point. The warning signs of suicide may have been there based on some of the very things listed on that link Pensfan posted but if you go through the list, it won't give you warning signs for murder.

Proof is in the pudding. They let him have "supervised" visitation only because of that disgusting and disturbing photo and ordered a psych sex analysis. They did NOT recognize the warning signs of suicide nor murder and that's my point. Even the so called experts didn't!

I agree. Apparently, according to the Coxes, the psychologist who evaluated the situation and the coward, stated he was NOT a danger to his kids.

In addition, CPS stated that they were not concerned and could protect the boys from any risk.

Clearly, both were wrong.

I believe the signs were very, very clear. I also believe that bureaucrats often do the very minimum necessary to investigating such intense cases, either due to too-high case loads because there is too little money with which to hire more workers, or because they just don't care or are offended by anyone challenging their initial, "professional" assumptions.

I would be willing to spend much more in taxes to ensure that little lives like Charlie's and Braden's are not destroyed. But for what I pay, I expect the bureaucrats to care at least HALF as much as I do.

 

[Kimster]

Here is the first responders going to the house.

http://www.kirotv.com/news/news/crime-law/raw-audio-recordings-first-responders-powell-home-/nHW9t/

That's what our scannettes heard in the Scanner Forum.

 

[gitana1]

I have wondered if Josh Powell ever knew his sons were talking about mommy being in the trunk. He probably felt betrayed by them. I am sure he had coached them many times before Susan's parents got custody. It is strange to me that the boys were reluctant to go, but ran ahead. They are heroes on my eyes because of that. The worker would have been killed too. I have no doubt they noticed daddy was acting different and they tried to run. But, they were up against a monster.

I believe so much in the afterlife, that it comforts me knowing they will never feel pain or confusion. They are with their mother now.

I do believe this could have been avoided as other murders of children. The courts need to stop worrying so much about keeping families together, and worry about the safety of the children. We as a nation need to stand up and say NO MORE!!!

Here's a question that always comes to my mind in such cases: Do these murderers believe in an afterlife too? I wondered that in casey anthony's case and also in this one. Weren't they afraid of what was to come as they planned these horrible acts? I always wonder about that.