Kansas teen won't apologize to governor's office for Twitter post

[LimeCola]

The more speech is limited, the more freedom of speech is lost.

Sam Brownback's involvement in Kansas Youth in Government is really no more than a media event. He isn't clamoring, say, to work exclusively with the students of Shawnee Mission East. It's a block of time filled in on his calendar, a one-shot yearly deal.

Brownback can espouse his views - anti-gay, anti-evolution, anti-Choice - because we have freedom of speech, regardless of how others of us feel about these matters.

Emma Sullivan was not working at a job. She is a student.

Emma's freedom of speech gives her the right to state her opinion of Sam Brownback.

Ms Sullivan has the right to say what she wants on Twitter. She isn't going to jail for her comment, nor should she.

It is perfectly acceptable to disagree with a political position; however, if the discourse doesn't rise above insults, where is there room for discussion?

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I agree with the man quoted from VML that it's great that she has such a strong opinion and cares about politics. It was a high school gov't group and she said she is trying to get more involved and learn more, since she just registered to vote.

I used to teach, and there is nothing worse than apathetic students who only care about passing and giving the 'right answer'. Kudos to her.

Hello fellow former teacher!:seeya: I understand your excitement about Ms Sullivan's interest in politics! Our children are our future and it is refreshing that Emma is taking a stand for freedom of speech.

I agree with her mother that she could have chosen a better choice of words. However, the expressions "that/he/she/it sucks" ......and......"that/he/she/it blows", is common slang among young adults and teens nowadays.

Here is a link to UrbanDictionary's defination of the word 'blows'.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=blows

 

[wfgodot]

So...there should be no consequences?

Hey, if you want to call that teacher you don't like every name in the book, and scream it to the whole studyhall while you're dancing on a table, go ahead. You have freedom of speech.

Just know that there are consequences for everything. Some good, some not so good.

What worries me is this is the generation we're raising, to be the next "people in power." Rude, arrogant, nasty, with, seemingly, no manners.

There should be no consequences for stating the opinion she did while using social media.

Limiting freedom of speech will not make us any less rude, arrogant, or nasty.

It will, however, put a damper on the rights to state our own opinions, whether others agree with us or not.

Formulating consequences for matters protected by the Constitution is unconstitutional.

I taught high school for several years. I do know the issues here.

I attended high school for several years. I do know the stultifying effect of being governed by those with narrow minds.

 

[wfgodot]

Ms Sullivan has the right to say what she wants on Twitter. She isn't going to jail for her comment, nor should she.

It is perfectly acceptable to disagree with a political position; however, if the discourse doesn't rise above insults, where is there room for discussion?

No one has said she is going to jail for her comment. That's not the issue.

I believe Emma stated her opinion of the governor quite clearly and economically.

Room for discussion of that opinion? Oh yes, of course there is.

 

[TrackerSam]

Read it again, TrackerSam.

She, herself says, "...and told him he sucked"...sounds like she told him, to me, even indirectly, as in, a tweet.

It's not a matter of being thin skinned as I see it. It's a matter of respect, and perhaps being mature, wherein one does not have to say, out loud, everything that pops into their little pea brain.


Should she have to write a letter of apology? What would be the point? She has a right to her feelings, and she obviously thinks she acted appropriately. Any apology letter she sent would be insincere. She has a right to express her feelings, but perhaps she should choose her words more carefully to avoid such backlash. Was she an embarrassment to her school? Well, her actions sure put the school in the public eye, and not in a positive way.

Sullivan wrote: "Just made mean comments at gov brownback and told him he sucked, in person #heblowsalot."

That's what she Tweeted - not what actually happened.

"The Shawnee Mission East senior said she did not actually talk to Brownback, and the post referenced a joke she had with a student on the trip.
But if she did say that to him, as you claim, there should be witnesses.

Thin skinned -"A Brownback staffer had notified the principal, she said."
I think that fits the definition pretty well.

Whether she has a pea brain or was an embarrassment to the school is a matter of opinion.

 

[belimom]

I don't think she'll be punished or have this held over her head when employment opportunities arise.

She's a teenaged high-school student and is learning the ropes of life. We all did - the hard way. And learned lessons and matured. If it affected us forever, none of us would have a chance.

I don't believe she meant to cause a stir - she seemed surprised that anyone really cared, considering she only had a handful of Twitter followers. I'm sure she'll think twice next time she wants to tweet something, but she's free to tweet what she wants.

If she cares about how it will affect job aspects down the road, then I'm sure she'll learn to temper her opinion to be more socially acceptable. JMHO

However, there are many leaders who haven't learned their lesson about respecting others. For example (bbm):

A Republican House member shouted, "You lie" during President Obama's health care speech to Congress on Wednesday, and members of both parties condemned the heckling.

http://articles.cnn.com/2009-09-09/...on-illegal-immigrants-outburst?_s=PM:POLITICS

Wilson's donations increased dramatically after the outburst and he was re-elected.

And VP Cheney:

In response to Cheney, Leahy reminded Cheney that the vice president had once accused him of being a bad Catholic, to which Cheney replied either "f--- off" or "go f--- yourself."

http://articles.cnn.com/2004-06-24/...al-nominee-senate-democrats?_s=PM:ALLPOLITICS

Also on the left side of the aisle, Jesse Jackson regarding Obama:

An open microphone picked up Jackson whispering, "See, Barack's been talking down to black people ... I want to cut his nuts off."

Jackson told CNN's "Situation Room" that he didn't realize the microphone was on.

http://articles.cnn.com/2008-07-09/...ign-jesse-jackson-black-voters?_s=PM:POLITICS

 

[angelmom]

This is a lesson for many people.

For this girl, it is a lesson that while you can say whatever pops into your head, sometimes it isn't worth the fallout. Sometimes it is. If her goal is a conservative job or political career, maybe she screwed up. If her goal is lots of twitter followers, then it was a home run. How many of our talk radio hosts, celebrities, and marketing majors say provocative things just to get noticed?

For the governor and his staff, it is the old lesson my mother always tried to teach me about my little brother; that is, he will stop bugging you faster if you ignore him. If the governor and the principal could have managed to ignore this teenager with fewer than 100 followers (most of whom are probably other teenagers who can't even vote in the next election) it would have been over. They would have moved along to who hooked up with whom, how hard that Lit test was, and twitpics of these cool boots she just bought. Unfortunately the governor and his staff are as incapable as I always was of just leaving well enough alone. Now it's in the paper, along with the name of her school and principal, and she has 3000 people hanging on her every word. They have given her a positive reward for rude behavior.

Forcing someone to write an apology they don't mean is a foolish punishment. We are teaching kids to lie, and to apologize when they get caught instead of when they feel true remorse. I'm not sure people even really know what that means anymore!

The kicker is that vague punishment "or else" thrown out by the principal. Every parent knows how effective that is! What will happen today if she doesn't write the apology? No one knows because the principal just said, "OR ELSE!" What more does he have the power to do? Can he kick her out of public school for a tweet? I seriously doubt it. It's hard enough to kick out kids who are truly disruptive and dangerous.

I'll say one thing about this school event; it may not have been the lesson they intended, but everyone learned something.

 

[MarthaM]

I don't think she owes an apology to the governor. I'm sure he's heard worse insults and seen more disparaging tweets about him.

However, if she tweeted that when she should have been participating in an educational field trip (as opposed to when they were on the bus or on a meal break during the trip), then she owes an apology to the principal for misusing her time and tweeting when she should have been learning something. She also owes an apology to her parents who probably think they raised her better than that; in the CNN article she later expresses her feelings on the issue in a mature and intelligent manner of which they can be proud. Her tweet? Not so much. I think it's the timing that matters here, and what the students were doing on the field trip when she sent the tweet.

But no apology needed to the governor. It looks like she didn't use his name or even a hashtag that's specific to him.

 

[oh_gal]

Sullivan wrote: "Just made mean comments at gov brownback and told him he sucked, in person #heblowsalot."

That's what she Tweeted - not what actually happened.

"The Shawnee Mission East senior said she did not actually talk to Brownback, and the post referenced a joke she had with a student on the trip.
But if she did say that to him, as you claim, there should be witnesses.

Thin skinned -"A Brownback staffer had notified the principal, she said."
I think that fits the definition pretty well.

Whether she has a pea brain or was an embarrassment to the school is a matter of opinion.

(b/u by me)
Yes, whether she has a pea brain or is an embarrassment is a matter of opinion....as is the opposite, as well.

So...things we tweet are not "real"? We don't really do it? I really need to start tweeting, then, and everything I say on there doesn't count, because, apparently, once you tweet it, it ceases to exist. Huh.

I understand (and have understood from the start) that she didn't really walk up to him and tell him he sucks. But she still tweeted it, she still "said" it, even if it was just to 20,000 of her closest friends. I've already maintained that she doesn't need to apologize, that she is entitled to her opinion, and free speech. I just happen to think she's a rude, ill-mannered snotty girl, whose penchant for speaking her mind will one day come back to bite her in the @ss.

 

[TrackerSam]

After high school student Emma Sullivan posted a tweet critical of Kansas Governor Sam Brownback (R-KS), the Governor and his office complained about the tweet to Sullivan’s high school principal, in an apparent attempt to retaliate for the unfavorable critique.

Many are angry that Governor Brownback and his office are pressuring the school to punish Sullivan for simply expressing her political convictions. Many others are quick to point out that it is always wrong to punish anyone for political speech protected by the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.

Few, if any, are sympathetic with Governor Brownback and his staff for wasting time and energy trying to bully a high school senior. And it seems apparent that the attempt to strike back at the school and the student is quickly becoming a public relations disaster for Brownback and his office.

As one might expect, the Twitterverse is having a great deal of fun mocking the thin skinned Brownback and his office for the petty and mean spirited attack on the high school teen.

http://www.examiner.com/democrat-in...bullies-teen-after-critical-tweet-heblowsalot

 

[oh_gal]

I don't think she'll be punished or have this held over her head when employment opportunities arise.

She's a teenaged high-school student and is learning the ropes of life. We all did - the hard way. And learned lessons and matured. If it affected us forever, none of us would have a chance.

I don't believe she meant to cause a stir - she seemed surprised that anyone really cared, considering she only had a handful of Twitter followers. I'm sure she'll think twice next time she wants to tweet something, but she's free to tweet what she wants.

If she cares about how it will affect job aspects down the road, then I'm sure she'll learn to temper her opinion to be more socially acceptable. JMHO

However, there are many leaders who haven't learned their lesson about respecting others. For example (bbm):



Wilson's donations increased dramatically after the outburst and he was re-elected.

And VP Cheney:



Also on the left side of the aisle, Jesse Jackson regarding Obama:

You're right. She may grow up and mature, or, if people keeping telling her, "Yeah, you go, girl! Tell him what a jerk he is! Exercise your right to free speech!", she may just decide, "hey, this is pretty cool! I like this attention! I tell it like it is!"

As you've shown, there are several mature adults who haven't learned that not everything needs to be said.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I wonder how many other students tweeted during this 'independent' field trip. Were students allowed cell phones on their person? Were the students instructed prior to the field trip by their educators whether cell phones/tweets/pics were allowed at the event?
Were Ms. Sullivan's parents required to sign a consent form for her to attend since she is 18 yrs old? Did the Gov have more employees monitoring social media due to the event?

Just some questions off the cuff.....

 

[oh_gal]

There should be no consequences for stating the opinion she did while using social media.

Limiting freedom of speech will not make us any less rude, arrogant, or nasty.

It will, however, put a damper on the rights to state our own opinions, whether others agree with us or not.

Formulating consequences for matters protected by the Constitution is unconstitutional.

I taught high school for several years. I do know the issues here.

I attended high school for several years. I do know the stultifying effect of being governed by those with narrow minds.

In an idealistic world, there would be no consequences. But haven't you, as an adult, learned that there are consequences all around you?

 

[oh_gal]

I wonder how many other students tweeted during this 'independent' field trip. Were students allowed cell phones on their person? Were the students instructed prior to the field trip by their educators whether cell phones/tweets/pics were allowed at the event?
Were Ms. Sullivan's parents required to sign a consent form for her to attend since she is 18 yrs old? Did the Gov have more employees monitoring social media due to the event?

Just some questions off the cuff.....

I thought it was pretty customary in most schools to prohibit having and/or using cell phones? Or is that just another one of those voluntary "rules"?

 

[wfgodot]

School district says teen won't have to apologize for tweet critical of Gov. Sam Brownback (midwestdemocracyproject.org)

 

[wfgodot]

In an idealistic world, there would be no consequences. But haven't you, as an adult, learned that there are consequences all around you?

I can only repeat: attaching consequences to rights guaranteed by our Constitution is anti-constitutional.

For the governor's office to throw a snit about this, and for Shawnee Mission East's principal to harangue Ms. Sullivan for an hour about this, and then to demand a letter of apology be sent - each of these is antithetical to an American citizen's right to freedom of speech, particularly considering the means chosen in this case to exercise that right.

 

[raeann]

It appears that Ms. Sullivan's specific concern with the Governor is in relation to arts funding being cut.

"I think it would be interesting to have a dialogue with him," she said. "I don't know if he would do it or not though. And I don't know that he would listen to what I have to say."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/27/emma-sullivan-apology-sam-brownback-tweet_n_1115382.html

Why would the Governor listen to what she has to say? She said nothing constructive at all.

If Ms Sullivan had tweeted her thoughts about cuts arts funding, she would have a) behaved maturely, b) started a respectful dialogue about an important issue and c) reflected well on herself, her family and her school.

Frankly, I am surprised by how many people seem supportive of her tweet. How does it further dialogue when vulgar, rude language is used?

Manners go a long way in the world. Ms Sullivan is now nationally known as a person who is proud of using social media in a crass manner. Is that the kind of reputation anyone would want for their child? I suspect that this will come back to haunt her...perhaps when she starts her job search?

ITA....as a Kansas taxpayer who pays for HER school, and HER free bus trip, I would not agree with her vulgar, rude, demeaning behavior toward ANY person be it the governor or not. There is a big difference between expressing a legitimate political difference of opinion and being a snotty rude little brat who was obviously just trying to get attention by bragging about her own immature behavior. Freedom of speech does not release one from common courtesy and proper respect for others. I am sure if someone in her school group came up to her that day and made a rude, nasty remark and then bragged about it in a tweet.......she would have been immediately reporting that act to her principal and crying for them to be punished.

jmo

 

[oh_gal]

I can only repeat: attaching consequences to rights guaranteed by our Constitution is anti-constitutional.

For the governor's office to throw a snit about this, and for Shawnee Mission East's principal to harangue Ms. Sullivan for an hour about this, and then to demand a letter of apology be sent - each of these is antithetical to an American citizen's right to freedom of speech, particularly considering the means chosen in this case to exercise that right.

But everyone who is applauding this girl and her rights is attaching positive consequences to her actions. Are those consequences somehow ok, then? Sometimes consequences are good. Sometimes, they're not.

 

[gitana1]

Yep. But how far? How many television and radio people have recently been fired for exercising their right to free speech?

Freedom is not free. There are consequences and now she's getting hit with them.


One thing, in watching the video that's linked above you see that this wasn't a chance meeting. The Governor worked with the school for a government class. He took time out of his day to give a speech to the students and the girl said something and then tweeted.

In the video listen to how she repeats what she said, she said she listened to the speech and then said he sucked and she didn't agree with things he said.


She said

"Just made mean comments at gov brownback and told him he sucked, in person #heblowsalot." The way she said it was she just made mean comments to him and told him he sucked, IN PERSON as if she was happy she told him off in person.

That's rude.



I think this is what led to them finding the tweet, otherwise how in the world would they find out about it?

I think the school got upset because for the governor to work for your school for a program like that is very nice and supportive even if he is a jerk.

She's basically ruined the experience for all future students. Well done Emma. You must be so proud.

They found out about the tweet because one of the governor's staffers surfs social media to see what is being said about the governor. He found the tweet and the school was alerted, which, in my opinion, is a bit think skinned.

It appears that Ms. Sullivan's specific concern with the Governor is in relation to arts funding being cut.

"I think it would be interesting to have a dialogue with him," she said. "I don't know if he would do it or not though. And I don't know that he would listen to what I have to say."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/27/emma-sullivan-apology-sam-brownback-tweet_n_1115382.html

Why would the Governor listen to what she has to say? She said nothing constructive at all.

If Ms Sullivan had tweeted her thoughts about cuts arts funding, she would have a) behaved maturely, b) started a respectful dialogue about an important issue and c) reflected well on herself, her family and her school.

Frankly, I am surprised by how many people seem supportive of her tweet. How does it further dialogue when vulgar, rude language is used?

Manners go a long way in the world. Ms Sullivan is now nationally known as a person who is proud of using social media in a crass manner. Is that the kind of reputation anyone would want for their child? I suspect that this will come back to haunt her...perhaps when she starts her job search?

So...there should be no consequences?

Hey, if you want to call that teacher you don't like every name in the book, and scream it to the whole studyhall while you're dancing on a table, go ahead. You have freedom of speech.

Just know that there are consequences for everything. Some good, some not so good.

What worries me is this is the generation we're raising, to be the next "people in power." Rude, arrogant, nasty, with, seemingly, no manners.

I agree with you both. We have become a nation that celebrates incivility. And that can be a horrible thing.

I disagree with the governor's policies. I agree with Emma's sentiment. I disagree with her public expression of it at the meeting and via twitter.

Perhaps the school does not have the right to demand she apologizes but they do have the right to discipline her for rude behavior at a public event when she was acting as an ambassador for the school(she was taking part in a youth in government program).

If she had stood up and firmly stated, "Governor, your cut of the arts program has hurt many students and is very unpopular. Why do you think it's okay to cut arts for students? Why is creativity less important than the beloved sports programs that you wouldn't dare cut? Why are creative students singled out as unworthy? I would like an answer to that." Now that would have been a speech and while challenging the governor, it would not have been rude and childish.

This was not a protest or demonstration, it was a student government event where they met the governor. She acted like a brat and her mother appears to be supporting such immature behavior.

And yes, the governor is think-skinned.

 

[belimom]

You're right. She may grow up and mature, or, if people keeping telling her, "Yeah, you go, girl! Tell him what a jerk he is! Exercise your right to free speech!", she may just decide, "hey, this is pretty cool! I like this attention! I tell it like it is!"

As you've shown, there are several mature adults who haven't learned that not everything needs to be said.

I agree. I don't think it should be applauded/encouraged - but I don't think she should be *forced* to issue an apology. Seems like a moot point now that the school has dropped that requirement, though.

From watching the video, I got the sense that she really didn't mean to cause a stir and was surprised. I don't think she wants to be the center of attention - I think it's just something that happened. I could be wrong, but she doesn't seem - to me - to be the type of person who wants to keep causing similar issues.