GUILTY MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #8 *Arrest*

[OldSteve]

wethenorth -:welcome: to WS - great post!

I'm new to the board but been following this case since the beginning. Stumbled on this website and been reading each single post since Monday. Everyone has great insight.
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[FONT="]I'd like to highlight something about the Northborough runner case on June 23rd. According to the runner, it happened on a Thursday at 10:30am. She was running on Lyman Street near Talbot Road. She spotted him waiting and once she passed him attacked her from behind. Her description of the man was 5'8, hispanic, black shirt and kakis. [/FONT]
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[FONT="]If you search that address in Google Map (Lyman Street/Talbot Road Northborough MA) you'll notice it's the home of the Fedex Warehouses! Hopefully this women is capable to correctly identify if ACO was the attacker. [/FONT]
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Keep up the good work everyone!

 

[Kickoff61]

There are still many unanswered questions. I don't believe they ever released the cause of death or Medical Examiner report. Now, there is a delay in the murder charge as well.

A couple other contradicting thoughts. If he were to be acting impulsively (as would be the case having just moved here 3 months prior) and then randomly impulsive , he would more likely be acting out quickly in Worcester on impulse.

If he drove to Princeton because he was heading to target her and had in fact seen her or stalked her before, it is questionable how he would know if she would be running 'Sunday', if he didn't work the area Sundays and the specific time she would be running, in order to sit on the side of the road and wait for her.

Lastly, it is still pushing it very far to leave the vehicle there nearby in plain sight for at least approx. 1 hour and 1/2 while this is happening and the location she was left at. Which includes, the attack, the acts that followed leading to her death and then the burning also.

Lastly, they tracked his phone to the area, so they also should be able to find out the location he connected to with who he spoke to on the phone, when the witness saw him on it.

 

[Rocky1]

I’m just catching up from yesterday - really great post from Searunner and thanks Rocky for the outline of the knowns vs unknowns. I agree with almost all your points except for how long he was with her. My guess is that she didn’t reach his vehicle until ~1:30 - and I think he probably turned her cell phone off at 2:11, after it was all over, so only around 45 minutes. MOO

Regarding if VM was the specific target, I’m slowly changing my way of thinking. I initially thought she was targeted directly but I’m not sure he would have had the opportunity to interact with VM enough to know her schedule. I’ve been dwelling on the fact the CO had only been in the US for 3 months before this attack and he started working soon after moving here. He did not have a chance to get familiar with the area.

SO - where was he comfortable? What was he familiar with?

As others have suggested I totally think this was not his first attack and I am strongly considering that he was behind the Northborough attack as well. Here’s what I’m thinking:
-May 2016: CO moves to Worcester, gets a job working for Fed-Ex contractor within 2 weeks, works 4am-11am, weekdays, some weekends; this does not leave much time for him to explore the community

**Assuming - MOO – that he is a repeat predator and has done this before in PR, he probably immediately starts to look for places where he can easily attack women

-June 2016: Big assumption here - if, as hypothesized, he works out of the Northborough FedEx warehouse, he would first feel familiar with the area around his workplace. He scopes out the roads, nearby parks, and attacks a jogger in the vicinity of his work; she escapes; he’s forced to find a new location

-August 2016: He’s been driving the Princeton route for approximately ~3 months; has noticed women walking/jogging on BSR; it’s rural, fairly secluded, and there is a good pull-off near the cart path; he decides this is the area of his next attack

On the day of VMs attack, maybe he was tied up with family obligations in the am (church?) and wasn’t able to leave Princeton until ~12:00, putting him on BSR at 12:30/12:45ish. I don’t think he could have been there for very long or else there would probably be additional witness testimony. He opens his trunk, talks or pretends to talk on his cell, and waits.

MOO

Good post.
Do you think at 2.11 he was all done, or just done killing her? Remember he had burned her body, and that took time. I believe she was dead at that that time, no longer fighting so he could concentrate on shutting off the phone.
What makes me sway towards her being a specific target, is, Why would he be on Brook Station road ever, to begin with?
Judging by the hours he works (4am-11am) I don't believe he was working doing home deliveries. If he was, his hours would be more like say 8 am to 6 pm, so he only delivers to the Post Offices in the surrounding towns.
If BSR was a shortcut to the Post Office, I could see him randomly seeing joggers on BSR, but it's not.
If he works out of the Northboro hub, He would drive Rt.62 to the center of Princeton, then turn left on Rt 31 south. BSR runs parallel with Rt.31.
Below is a map. If you look at it you can see VM's running route from BSR, to RT.31 S past the Post Office to Ball Hill Rd. then north on BSR to her house.
I think he spotted her while he was at the Post Office, while she jogged by and zeroed in on her.
https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Nor...424366114d4!2m2!1d-71.877296!2d42.4487019!3e0

https://www.google.com/maps/uv?hl=e...ved=0ahUKEwjb0ordgbTTAhUG7CYKHRlCCs0Qpx8IZjAK

 

[Gussified]

If BSR was a shortcut to the Post Office, I could see him randomly seeing joggers on BSR, but it's not.
If he works out of the Northboro hub, He would drive Rt.62 to the center of Princeton, then turn left on Rt 31 south. BSR runs parallel with Rt.31.

Really depends on which other post offices were before and after Princeton on his route. Otherwise, agree with everything else you said.


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[1306kayaker]

Good post.
Do you think at 2.11 he was all done, or just done killing her? Remember he had burned her body, and that took time. I believe she was dead at that that time, no longer fighting so he could concentrate on shutting off the phone.
What makes me sway towards her being a specific target, is, Why would he be on Brook Station road ever, to begin with?
Judging by the hours he works (4am-11am) I don't believe he was working doing home deliveries. If he was, his hours would be more like say 8 am to 6 pm, so he only delivers to the Post Offices in the surrounding towns.
If BSR was a shortcut to the Post Office, I could see him randomly seeing joggers on BSR, but it's not.
If he works out of the Northboro hub, He would drive Rt.62 to the center of Princeton, then turn left on Rt 31 south. BSR runs parallel with Rt.31.
Below is a map. If you look at it you can see VM's running route from BSR, to RT.31 N past the Post Office to Ball Hill Rd. then north on BSR to her house.
I think he spotted her while he was at the Post Office, while she jogged by and zeroed in on her.
https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Nor...424366114d4!2m2!1d-71.877296!2d42.4487019!3e0

https://www.google.com/maps/uv?hl=e...ved=0ahUKEwjb0ordgbTTAhUG7CYKHRlCCs0Qpx8IZjAK

I actually think he killed her pretty quickly. A number of reports have said her throat was crushed so I'm assuming she was strangled, probably because she was fighting so much. I also don't think he spent much time burning her. My guess is she bit him and scratched him so he focused on head/face and hands. Although MOO

I'm still trying to figure out how he knew BSR - perhaps he dropped packages off in other locations as well. I need to check a map but maybe Northborough to Princeton post office to Rutland post office would take you via BSR? I agree he didn't do home deliveries and it sounds like he drove with a partner while working so he probably wasn't just cruising.

If he saw her jogging by while he was at the post office, do you think he followed her home and knew where she'd be starting from? I'm not against that theory - it's just harder to see how his work partner could fit in, but maybe he did some deliveries solo.

 

[Rocky1]

There are still many unanswered questions. I don't believe they ever released the cause of death or Medical Examiner report. Now, there is a delay in the murder charge as well.

A couple other contradicting thoughts. If he were to be acting impulsively (as would be the case having just moved here 3 months prior) and then randomly impulsive , he would more likely be acting out quickly in Worcester on impulse.

If he drove to Princeton because he was heading to target her and had in fact seen her or stalked her before, it is questionable how he would know if she would be running 'Sunday', if he didn't work the area Sundays and the specific time she would be running, in order to sit on the side of the road and wait for her.

Lastly, it is still pushing it very far to leave the vehicle there nearby in plain sight for at least approx. 1 hour and 1/2 while this is happening and the location she was left at. Which includes, the attack, the acts that followed leading to her death and then the burning also.

Lastly, they tracked his phone to the area, so they also should be able to find out the location he connected to with who he spoke to on the phone, when the witness saw him on it.

True, no cause of death released yet, but the Medical Examiner has it.
Targeting Worcester may have been harder, because there are more people around to witness an abduction.
If this guy wanted just any woman, he could have walked out his door, and literally had his pick of 20 Prostitutes in a square mile radius of where he lived. South Main St. is Worcesters area for known prostitution, and he lived about 1/4 mile from there. He could have easily got one in his car without a fight of any type.
I believe this guy's type were joggers, no different than Ted Bundy chose women with long hair parted in the middle. I also believe he targeted women that would put up a fight, because the overpowering was a thrill to him.

 

[Kickoff61]

I thought witness saw him with hood open? Is it the hood or trunk?

 

[1306kayaker]

True, no cause of death released yet, but the Medical Examiner has it.
Targeting Worcester may have been harder, because there are more people around to witness an abduction.
If this guy wanted just any woman, he could have walked out his door, and literally had his pick of 20 Prostitutes in a square mile radius of where he lived. South Main St. is Worcesters area for known prostitution, and he lived about 1/4 mile from there. He could have easily got one in his car without a fight of any type.
I believe this guy's type were joggers, no different than Ted Bundy chose women with long hair parted in the middle. I also believe he targeted women that would put up a fight, because the overpowering was a thrill to him.

I agree - the planning, the lying in wait, the surprise attack were important. If he just wanted an easy victim, he could have found one in Worcester.

Also cause of death hasn't been released but numerous sources have said her throat was crushed leading me to believe it was strangulation. Moo


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[Rocky1]

Really depends on which other post offices were before and after Princeton on his route. Otherwise, agree with everything else you said.


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Good point.
If he drove to Rutland Post Office, taking Ball Hill Rd, then left on BSR S which turns into Wachusett St.,that would almost put him in the driveway of the Post Office. Driving this direction would not put him driving past her house.
Maybe he saw her jogging on Ball Hill Rd, while she was turning N on BSR, and zeroed in on her from there.

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/''/...dfab103f3c926b!2m2!1d-71.9523056!2d42.3755888

 

[Rocky1]

I thought witness saw him with hood open? Is it the hood or trunk?

Hood. The witness thought he was broke down.

 

[Kickoff61]

Hood. The witness thought he was broke down.

Ok Thanks. That's what I thought. I saw trunk mentioned above and got confused.

 

[Cem75]

A couple of newspapers have reported that "the name “Adrian Colon-Ortiz” was written on one of the mailboxes out front" of the multi-unit building where he lives. Maybe he moved here because of family connections.

http://www.thelandmark.com/articles/marcotte-murder-suspect-did-not-make-impact-on-neighbors/

Edited to add: "The attorney also cleared up questions about where Colon-Ortiz lives, 68 Woodland St., Worcester. The apartment, according to Ryan, belonged to his client’s brother, Adrian, and the lease was in the brother’s name. It was not immediately clear whether the lease is no longer under that name."

https://worcestermag.com/2017/04/18/attorney-vanessa-marcotte-murder-suspect-no-stranger-high-profile-cases/50895

Its my umderstanding the brother is Adrian, lease is under his name is what I read


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[searunner]

http://www.leominsterchamp.com/articles/da-on-marcottes-killer-we-got-him/

"Colon-Ortiz will be back in court on May 24."

I'm not sure this really has anything new but figured I'd post it anyway. It's a local paper and one of the most current news articles that popped up.

Thanks for posting. That info is probably not known by everyone. I think it was only posted once (at least that I recall seeing). There have been SO many posts since the news broke, it can be very easy for people to miss some info even if they generally read all the posts. So it's very helpful that you posted that.

 

[Dot#5t]

So Oritz moves his entire family from PR to Worcester MA a place he has no known ties to in May 2016. He finds a place to live buys a car and lands a job within 2 weeks all without speaking the language we are led to believe. And in a matter of days finds an accomplice if we assume the Westboro attack was ACO to attack female joggers. That doesn't seem to add up.

I teach in a large urban city west of Worcester (similar size and demographics) and it's very common for families to move back and forth between MA and Puerto Rico throughout their children's education. I am curious if he has actually lived in the US before, maybe some years in childhood or younger adulthood.
JMO

 

[Dot#5t]

The way I understand it. He has 2 kids, and one from his wifes previous relationship/marriage. all living together.

I thought one of the MassLive articles stated one child was in PR. I need to go back and look.

jmo

 

[Dot#5t]

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Although Fed-X may deliver in some cases on Sunday, I don't believe Ortiz did, because the Post Office would not have been open.[/QUOTE]

I'm confused- did Ortiz only deliver to post offices or did he also deliver to homes and businesses?

 

[Rocky1]

Although Fed-X may deliver in some cases on Sunday, I don't believe Ortiz did, because the Post Office would not have been open.

I'm confused- did Ortiz only deliver to post offices or did he also deliver to homes and businesses?[/QUOTE]Not 100 percent sure, but I saw someplace where it was said he delivered to Post Offices in surrounding towns. Combine that with his shift ending at 11 am, I am apt to think it was only Post Offices. Route drivers work all day. I was thinking that maybe he delivered Fed-Ex "next day air", but I believe although those packages have to be delivered by 10 am, drivers work throughout the day picking up packages.
Just my thoughts. I may be wrong on this.

Just to add, Maybe Emb72 will know.

 

[Cem75]

Although Fed-X may deliver in some cases on Sunday, I don't believe Ortiz did, because the Post Office would not have been open.

I'm confused- did Ortiz only deliver to post offices or did he also deliver to homes and businesses?[/QUOTE]

Good question I am asking myself the same thing


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[1306kayaker]

Although Fed-X may deliver in some cases on Sunday, I don't believe Ortiz did, because the Post Office would not have been open.

I'm confused- did Ortiz only deliver to post offices or did he also deliver to homes and businesses?[/QUOTE]

I don't think we know for sure but the combo of his hours and the third party contractor employer lead me to believe he only delivered to post offices and possibly businesses.


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[searunner]

So Oritz moves his entire family from PR to Worcester MA a place he has no known ties to in May 2016. He finds a place to live buys a car and lands a job within 2 weeks all without speaking the language we are led to believe. And in a matter of days finds an accomplice if we assume the Westboro attack was ACO to attack female joggers. That doesn't seem to add up.

Agree, Fred. Something doesn't seem to add up in that equation. However, I'm wondering if his brother was in the US first, which seems likely, and helped him get settled, etc. The "Adrian Colon-Ortiz" on the mailbox of Angelo's family's apmt is his brother.

If Angelo is responsible for those attempted abductions (and like others, I believe there is a very strong possibility he is), his brother could have been his accomplice. Or if he wasn't, then Angelo could have met someone sick like himself through his brother pretty quickly.