Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #14

[dotr]

Missing Malaysia airlines - Malaysian plane Latest News - MH 370 - YouTube

 

[Roselvr]

Hope you don't mind if I use this as the link to post for the FAQ I'm writing up?

Think I found it but you need to pick through it; I'm out of time. I added everything to the timeline thread if you need it again

Pilot Spoke to Air Controllers After Shutoff of Data System
Timing of Report by Flight’s Pilot Focuses Inquiry
SEPANG, Malaysia — A signaling system was disabled on the missing Malaysia Airlines jet before a pilot spoke to air traffic control without mentioning trouble, a senior Malaysian official said on Sunday, reinforcing theories that one of the pilots may have been involved in diverting the plane and adding urgency to the investigation of their pasts and possible motivations.

 

[kmclaren]

I don't have anything much to add but it just really boggles the mind how in this age of such advances in technology, there is nothing that can point to where this plane is other than a few pings here and there within a massive area.

It is also a reminder of how vast the world is, all those countries ships, planes and crew out there looking in thousands of miles of nothingness....

 

[dotr]

Maybe a cyclone will uncover things..

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-missing-malaysia-plane-20140322,0,1501654.story
"China said its icebreaker "Snow Dragon" was heading for the area, but was still around 70 hours away. Japan and India were also sending more planes and Australian and Chinese navy vessels were steaming towards the southern search zone.

But the area is known for rough seas and strong currents, and Malaysia's Hishammuddin said a cyclone warning had been declared for Christmas Island, far off to the north."

 

[Holly G. Lightly]

<SNIP>
Before 1:07 a.m.: Route change believed programmed into computer Investigators believe a change in flight plan was programmed into the plane's guidance system -- though not yet executed -- by this time, a senior U.S. official who was briefed on the investigation told CNN. This belief is based on data that was transmitted 12 minutes before the pilots' last voice communication, the official said. <SNIP>

"&#8230;Route change believed programmed into computer&#8230;"

This is just a guess and not fact, right? If we don't put emphasis on this point it easily changes what we think happened, doesn't it?

Same for the part about ascending to 45K feet, then descending to 25K (or whatever it was). This seems to have been rumor, not fact. After all, the transponder wasn't working properly, or was turned off, so how could it have relayed this data when they don't even know if the plane went north or south?

 

[21merc7]

"…Route change believed programmed into computer…"

This is just a guess and not fact, right? If we don't put emphasis on this point it easily changes what we think happened, doesn't it?

Same for the part about ascending to 45K feet, then descending to 25K (or whatever it was). This seems to have been rumor, not fact. After all, the transponder wasn't working properly, or was turned off, so how could it have relayed this data when they don't even know if the plane went north or south?

Oh thank you. This is what I was trying to ask last night. Not good at getting the words together properly.

Seems something could have been going wrong with the system. Not anyone programming in, or turning off things. Could have been a short or any other number of things.

I doubt we will ever know about the directions being put in and transponder being turned off, even if the parts are found.

 

[lawstudent]

I know it was mentioned that pressure could cause these batteries to explode, but obviously passengers have all sorts of laptops both in the cabin and in the cargo. Are the batteries being talked about here more dangerous, or is this about a remote possibility like an electrical or engine fire?

 

[CARIIS]

Safe! Written in WORD!!

Put FOX on &#8211;ugh&#8212;it&#8217;s the weekend; most are just replying the packages from the week. FOX has started a theme--so is aviation behind? Do we need to rethink design on this new aircraft? It shows no fact checking.

The triple 7 is the last generation aircraft and still pretty amazing. Both players in commercial aviation (Airbus/ Boeing) have the following generation in service. A380/Dreamliner). In January 1993, a team of united developers joined other airline teams and Boeing designers at the Everett factory.[31] The 240 design teams, with up to 40 members each, addressed almost 1,500 design issues with individual aircraft components.[3

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_777#Background


To put in perspective, pause; think about where your cell phones were 21 years ago. It&#8217;s akin to saying (I know nothing about them &#8211; do not have one- never want one I think they are absurd!) Whatever cell phone models were the latest back in 93 and in 2014 (pretend they model is still in use!).
It&#8217;s such a stupid erroneous story line I have to be absurd to do an analogy! So cell phone Model 1993 has something wrong with it. And the headline today &#8211; are cell phones safe!!

FOX: Does aviation need to be revisited in terms of safety issues. The industry has been nothing other than stunning in safety improvements and the results of those accomplishments. I need go further than:
Airline Industry at Its Safest Since the Dawn of the Jet Age
Published: February 11, 2013 80 Comments

Note: Asian happened after this piece written, only accident since piece written and was pilot error. Three killed

Globally, last year was the safest since 1945,
In the last five years, the death risk for passengers in the United States has been one in 45 million flights, according to Arnold Barnett, a professor of statistics at M.I.T. In other words, flying has become so reliable that a traveler could fly every day for an average of 123,000 years before being in a fatal crash, he said.

There are many reasons for this remarkable development. Planes and engines have become more reliable. Advanced navigation and warning technology has sharply reduced once-common accidents like midair collisions or crashes into mountains in poor visibility.

&#8220;The lessons of accidents used to be written in blood, where you had to have an accident, and you had to kill people to change procedures, or policy, or training,&#8221; said Deborah Herdsman, the chairwoman of the National Transportation Safety Board. &#8220;That&#8217;s not the case anymore. We have a much more proactive approach to safety.&#8221;

Aviation safety officials will also go to considerable lengths to learn what caused a crash. Uncertainty is rarely tolerated, said Peter Goetz, a former managing director at the National Transportation Safety Board.
If a news outlet reported something so totally riddled in, obviously, and totally unchecked HISTORY. This gross transgression is different than MAL 370-all media on this story has been thrown on goose chases as a result of people stating facts that are not!

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/12/b...-globally-since-1945.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
Note

 

[Holly G. Lightly]

But I don't know if that is necessarily true due to the waypoints. According to what I have read, that is a standard way to plot an alternative course by the pilot.

I have been giving this a lot of thought about the set course and the waypoints. I am not so sure the pilot didn't add this particular autopilot course as one he came up with on his own as a contingency plan in case of a hijacking or dire situation such as a hypoxia event especially if it did take the plane out and over the open ocean until it ran out of fuel.

Can they check other planes he was responsible for flying to compare what he could have set up on those?

I am also thinking along these lines, SeriouslySearching. I think it is merely a guess that the alternate route was programmed in just a few minutes before losing contact.

I'm thinking some type of catastrophic mechanical failure, which included whatever controlled the oxygen supply. Losing consciousness from lack of oxygen, including last ditch efforts to turn the plane around, makes many of the puzzle pieces fit.

 

[Holly G. Lightly]

Oh thank you. This is what I was trying to ask last night. Not good at getting the words together properly.

Seems something could have been going wrong with the system. Not anyone programming in, or turning off things. Could have been a short or any other number of things.

I doubt we will ever know about the directions being put in and transponder being turned off, even if the parts are found.

I am right there with you!

 

[Nymeria]

Someone posted a link to this article last night (or early this am)-

KUALA LUMPUR: The consortium of insurers of Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 led by Allianz are bracing themselves for a huge payout in respect of insurance claims connected to Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 from KL to Beijing which has been missing since March 8.


Read more at: http://english.astroawani.com/news/show/mh370-insurers-of-flight-mh370-brace-for-payout-32108?cp

Has anyone floated the theory that this was just done plain and simple for the money?
By that I mean one person, in dire straits, decided to take this plane out (disregarding all other lives on board) just to give his/her family a pretty large sum of money?
I know that sounds crazy, but to a very poor family in a 3rd world (or close to it) country, a payout for a disaster like this is life changing, possibly for generations.


ETA-There were 154 Chinese passengers on board the missing flight and most of the Chinese passengers on the plane had purchased accident or life insurance policies, according to major Chinese insurers.

 

[CARIIS]

The only concern I have about the batteries is that , when asked, folks lied about the aircraft having level 9 cert danerous goods!!

For those of us who beleive she is on the ground, the implications are .....

I think we shall be hearing a bit more about Miss MAL 370 belly!

 

[Holly G. Lightly]

I know it was mentioned that pressure could cause these batteries to explode, but obviously passengers have all sorts of laptops both in the cabin and in the cargo. Are the batteries being talked about here more dangerous, or is this about a remote possibility like an electrical or engine fire?

I think a fire would have brought the plane down quickly. I don't think it would have been able to fly for as long as it did.

 

[MsFacetious]

Someone posted a link to this article last night (or early this am)-

KUALA LUMPUR: The consortium of insurers of Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 led by Allianz are bracing themselves for a huge payout in respect of insurance claims connected to Malaysia Airlines flight MH370 from KL to Beijing which has been missing since March 8.


Read more at: http://english.astroawani.com/news/show/mh370-insurers-of-flight-mh370-brace-for-payout-32108?cp

Has anyone floated the theory that this was just done plain and simple for the money?
By that I mean one person, in dire straits, decided to take this plane out (disregarding all other lives on board) just to give his/her family a pretty large sum of money?
I know that sounds crazy, but to a very poor family in a 3rd world (or close to it) country, a payout for a disaster like this is life changing, possibly for generations.


ETA-There were 154 Chinese passengers on board the missing flight and most of the Chinese passengers on the plane had purchased accident or life insurance policies, according to major Chinese insurers.

Taking down an entire plane for insurance money has been done before...

United Airlines Flight 629

United Airlines Flight 629 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Justice Story: Son plants bomb in mom&#8217;s suitcase, killing her and 43 others during flight

Jack Graham hated his mother, Daisie King, but was set to inherit a large part of her $150,000 estate upon her demise. Graham became proactive, planting the bomb in her baggage as she flew from Colorado to Oregon. But Graham got caught, meeting his own end in a gas chamber.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/jus...mom-luggage-kills-44-flight-article-1.1335372

 

[Nymeria]

Taking down an entire plane for insurance money has been done before...

United Airlines Flight 629

United Airlines Flight 629 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Justice Story: Son plants bomb in mom’s suitcase, killing her and 43 others during flight

Jack Graham hated his mother, Daisie King, but was set to inherit a large part of her $150,000 estate upon her demise. Graham became proactive, planting the bomb in her baggage as she flew from Colorado to Oregon. But Graham got caught, meeting his own end in a gas chamber.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/jus...mom-luggage-kills-44-flight-article-1.1335372

Good Gawd I was just thinking suicide by one person (and taking 238 more with them) to benefit a family (who would not be "in" on it).
Your story makes it even worse :scared:

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

Why are there two possible flight paths? I understand they are pings from an aircraft received by a satellite. The reality is the airplane can only go ONE way! It either went north or went south, but not both routes! Can the brains that know it all not disclose this one simple answer? :banghead:

The way I'm seeing it (and I'm no flight expert), it's because satellites pick up signals in a circular fashion around them (see this map):



Pings ("handshakes") between the satellite and the plane establish that it is a certain distance traveling either northward or southward along an arc. Radar tracking (which is a different form of tracking) helps pinpoint which one of the arcs it's on (if radar is available).

The only radar we've had reported (IIRC) is the Malaysian military radar which last tracked this plane going NW towards the Andaman Islands. The Indonesian military radar did not pick up the plane. To my logic, it would seem, then, IF the plane were traveling in a steadily receding ping route (longer pings) without change of direction as was established at the end of the last thread, that there is still cause to think the plane may have traveled on the northern arc route, as the plane's last documented direction (radar) was in a NW'ly direction. There has still been nothing to say it couldn't have, in other words, and certain info now to suggest it should have (ping data).

IMO (more in the theory thread), I believe the complete lack of radar data after passing through Malaysian military radar may be due to advanced radar-blocking abilities used by the hijackers.

(Personally, I think the 'debris' some satellite images are picking up down by Australia are just part of that part of the ocean's reputation for being the 'garbage basin' of the sea. I could be wrong, though, and my knowledge in this area is certainly limited.)

 

[Boodles]

"&#8230;Route change believed programmed into computer&#8230;"

This is just a guess and not fact, right? If we don't put emphasis on this point it easily changes what we think happened, doesn't it?

Same for the part about ascending to 45K feet, then descending to 25K (or whatever it was). This seems to have been rumor, not fact. After all, the transponder wasn't working properly, or was turned off, so how could it have relayed this data when they don't even know if the plane went north or south?

Supposedly true in regard to the route change (but things are said, then retracted, so who knows?). They (ground) could see the changed programmed path in the ACARS data before it got cut off. So that could be correct.

The altitude info is questionable data, per most of the "experts" due to the distance from whatever device recorded the data (among other reasons). But the alleged altitude changes happened after the transponders and ACARS stopped reporting.

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

:loveyou: Great timeline.

Which to me, points to the co-pilot somehow, based on the very beginnings.

Since he said the last words: "Alright, goodnight" after the flight path was manually changed.

The only 'source' we have for the idea that the copilot said those last words is the Malaysian government. A claim which they earlier had denied, btw.

Between you and me, I don't think they have a good track record for getting the story straight.

 

[margarita25]

You guys are amazing!

:lurk:

 

[Roselvr]

"…Route change believed programmed into computer…"

This is just a guess and not fact, right? If we don't put emphasis on this point it easily changes what we think happened, doesn't it?

Same for the part about ascending to 45K feet, then descending to 25K (or whatever it was). This seems to have been rumor, not fact. After all, the transponder wasn't working properly, or was turned off, so how could it have relayed this data when they don't even know if the plane went north or south?

I read it the other day so am not sure. Been looking for it since I closed it lol

My opinion; they know exactly when the plane turned in relation to when he said good night. They have all of the radar data; whether it was programmed or not. So far what I've seen; NY Times has been right so far with each story they break. They were 1st to break the satellite ping data which was finally confirmed days later.