Meredith Kercher murdered-Amanda Knox appeals conviction #17

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On p 235 Burleigh gives account of the Reid technique of interrogation, which is 3 pronged and which she believes, due to her research with numerous homicide investigators and criminologists, was used on Ms. Knox.

The text also abounds with abundant and rich material on Guede, and several others. I must say, I cannot put it down....I am surprised that there are no court dates until next month??? Hence no new articles, so I read a book instead :( ....

okay, I'm going to download it already! :maddening::crazy:

What page are you on? If you're on until late, maybe we can discuss it as we read. I'll get it from Amazon right now. :crazy:

BTW, I got Monster of Perugia, and murder in Italy, and injustice in perugia. I feel like I'm buying books for a college course!
 
okay, I'm going to download it already! :maddening::crazy:

What page are you on? If you're on until late, maybe we can discuss it as we read. I'll get it from Amazon right now. :crazy:

BTW, I got Monster of Perugia, and murder in Italy, and injustice in perugia. I feel like I'm buying books for a college course!
LOL, I have devoured nearly the whole thing, although I must confess I have skipped around a bit in my excitement, a bad habit left over from my undergraduate days... :blushing: Do let me know what your impressions are! Wow, you have indeed been reading, you might well earn in "A" in "the Knox saga" :crazy: I read Bruce Fisher's Injustice in Perugia, and wrote several reviews on Writers' forums for him as well...
 
I think salem was saying that it's okay to cite certain sources, but with the caveat understood by ALL WHO read that if it's not the "X,Y,Z" type of source, don't take it as fact without sleuthing of your own. I think it's impossible for every post to contain a vetting of every source, as we pull our memories from many sources to compose each and every sentence we type. if we cite things, the readers are welcome to look at the source and evaluate it for themselves. For example, in the political realm in the US, CNN is seen as a partisan joke for new political reporting. If you heard it from Rush Limbaugh, it's doubtful that progressives or democrats will give it much weight. There are people here who think you can't believe anything President Obama says, nor do they believe the Koran or the bible. So you can't please everyone with your source.

I don't think we can dismiss any source out of hand because they might prove some useful information. For example, that TJMK site, I think it's a joke personally, but I believe I wound up getting RG's italian MOT from there. Which brings me to my next point. The majority of our debates are rooted in information that has been translated to us by reporters, bloggers, and well-meaning sleuthers from other websites. So it's almost impossible to say that we even have the correct information or translation of something. I am very grateful that these people made the effort, but I have also heard that the PMF's verision of the MOT report contains some meaningful errors.

I'm not sure what you do in a case like ours, where EVEN THE POLICE leaked false information to the media, where even the forensic investigator withheld and then discounted her own findings (as to bloody footprints). So I think we can just do the best we can, judge sources for ourselves, but it's pointless to debate the sources. Esp since, as I've said, this case has bloggers who have more facts on it than the media.
EXCELLENT points, all......:clap:
 
LOL, I have devoured nearly the whole thing, although I must confess I have skipped around a bit in my excitement, a bad habit left over from my undergraduate days... :blushing: Do let me know what your impressions are! Wow, you have indeed been reading, you might well earn in "A" in "the Knox saga" :crazy: I read Bruce Fisher's Injustice in Perugia, and wrote several reviews on Writers' forums for him as well...

I got that impression after I left that post, because I looked back and saw you were quoting page 200 and something. Truthfully, I skipped around in dempsey's book, but enough to take all my quizzes.

I'm mad cause I have to pay $12.99 for an invisible book. I guesss I'm old school, but I remember when you could pay that for a hardcopy! Now, if I want a copy of this, I have to see if I'm allowed to even print it with my own paper and ink, and it still costs more than an average paperback.

One good thing is I can read chapter one for free. So If I don't like chapter 1, then you all will know I ain't plopping down the $12.99.

So let's see. Chapter one: "It was the best of times, it was the worse of times...."
 
I got that impression after I left that post, because I looked back and saw you were quoting page 200 and something. Truthfully, I skipped around in dempsey's book, but enough to take all my quizzes.

I'm mad cause I have to pay $12.99 for an invisible book. I guesss I'm old school, but I remember when you could pay that for a hardcopy! Now, if I want a copy of this, I have to see if I'm allowed to even print it with my own paper and ink, and it still costs more than an average paperback.

One good thing is I can read chapter one for free. So If I don't like chapter 1, then you all will know I ain't plopping down the $12.99.

So let's see. Chapter one: "It was the best of times, it was the worse of times...."
Chap 1 may not be the best one...:eek: am I going to get a bill for a book from one "Ms. Wasnt_Me" :waitasec:
 
On p. 242, Burleigh reveals the sloppy journalism which pervaded the case during the original trial:

Added to the selective information download, many journalists approached the case with a casual attitude toward the facts.

If a lawyer said something, it was broadcast or printed, subject to debate, but rarely if ever to official correction. Non-existent "evidence" - such as the girls' "mixed blood" DNA in the bathroom they shared, Raffael's Googling of "bleach" and "blood" [. . . ] - remained on the public record forever.

The section on Mignini's life, his early studies and affiliations, makes for very good reading: Illuminating and profound. There is, it seems, a deviant and leftover Masonic cult in Umbria and Tuscan which has had a great effect on Mignini....I see now the source of many of his suspicions...

Tell me if you like the descriptive prose, wasnt_me, of the "Hallowtide" chapter.....

I do wonder now when the verdict will be.....so it is Sep 5, and then are there other dates set? Originally, the verdict was due Sep 15, but I see no chance of that now.....
 
Chap 1 may not be the best one...:eek: am I going to get a bill for a book from one "Ms. Wasnt_Me" :waitasec:

I tried to hack Amazon, but all I know is SMK, so....:floorlaugh:

I read the first chapter and I was glad to see in the prolouge some of what was said on the last day of trial. She made it seem like the verdict came back within a few hours. For all this significant poring over of evidence and deliberating that hundreds of us have done for YEARS, I seriously doubt the jury did anything but enter, listen to Massei and obeyed so they could go eat dinner.

The author is right: there seems to hardly be nothing at all that the two debating sides agreed upon accept that MK is dead. I was even shocked to learn there were RG sympathizers.
 
I think the pros are all right, but it's so flowerly I almost forget it's supposed to be nonfiction.

Did you see what she said about the expresso vending machine? came from RG's family? If so, and if his adoptive family has money like that, then I guess I have another theory as to why RG hardly, if ever, got arrested around there.

Oh, and I haven't heard anything about the court dates. I'm just so mad everything takes a month to happen. Justice is slower than the wheels of time over there. Although, to be fair, Jodi Arias has been awaiting trial FOREVER it seems like. I believe she's been in jail for a year now. I also believe she'll be found guilty, but still. I know it's been maybe a year and a half. It's been a long time, but her trial was supposed to be October 2010. And it just keeps getting changed and getting changed. I almost thought I'd forget about it since it's taking so long.

It's funnt because i wasn't at all interested in Ak's case when I first saw it unfolding. I think I got turned off because I kept hearing so much italian and I couldn't understand it or read it. But then one day, I watched the 48 hours thing for the second time, actually paid attention instead of doing other things, and I was sucked in to finding out who the heck really killed MK.
 
I think the pros are all right, but it's so flowerly I almost forget it's supposed to be nonfiction.

Did you see what she said about the expresso vending machine? came from RG's family? If so, and if his adoptive family has money like that, then I guess I have another theory as to why RG hardly, if ever, got arrested around there.

Oh, and I haven't heard anything about the court dates. I'm just so mad everything takes a month to happen. Justice is slower than the wheels of time over there. Although, to be fair, Jodi Arias has been awaiting trial FOREVER it seems like. I believe she's been in jail for a year now. I also believe she'll be found guilty, but still. I know it's been maybe a year and a half. It's been a long time, but her trial was supposed to be October 2010. And it just keeps getting changed and getting changed. I almost thought I'd forget about it since it's taking so long.

It's funnt because i wasn't at all interested in Ak's case when I first saw it unfolding. I think I got turned off because I kept hearing so much italian and I couldn't understand it or read it. But then one day, I watched the 48 hours thing for the second time, actually paid attention instead of doing other things, and I was sucked in to finding out who the heck really killed MK.
Well, I think the prose is very stylized and eloquent, myself. :snooty: It reads to me a lot like Capote's "In Cold Blood".....

Yes, it seems Guede self-destructed, and really did not have to have his vagabond existence...although the loss of his mother, and various violent memories of his childhood, may have been the cause of his demise...:waitasec:

Yes, the wheels of justice grind exceedingly slowly, just look at Casey Anthony's 3 year wait for her trial....I am impatient, though.....I became engrossed with Knox via the blog, "Lies Our Mothers Told Us". I believed fully in her guilt, until I happened upon Hendry and Fisher.....

Cannot believe Mignini fathered a new baby girl in 2010.....the old rascal.... ;)
 
OMG! You're gonna have me up till 6am, falling asleep reading with tidbits like that. and knowing me, I'll miss all the good stuff because I was so tired and sleepy, but still trying to read.

No, the pros are all you said. It's just I prefer a strict more newsy or factual voice when I'm reading nonfiction. Like she said something that made me upset, really. It was something about men osbessed with internet *advertiser censored* tuning into the the case for titilation. I didn't like that stereotype, but you know how I am about stereotypes....


The story titillated men habituated by Internet *advertiser censored* to the real possibilities of group sex and the slithery catfight.

Burleigh, Nina (2011). The Fatal Gift of Beauty: The Trials of Amanda Knox (Kindle Location 394). Broadway. Kindle Edition.

I don't really know how she knows this above. It's just I get strict about people taking a creative license to facts, that's all.

I do like her time line at the beginning.

I didn't know that RG had broken into 2 nurseries. All of his activities happened on the weekends, if the crimes were all indeed his. MK's happened on a Thursday? But it was a holiday weekend, so that counts as weekend to me. starting sept 27th. So he moved back there in July. If nothing else can be linked between sept and July, then he allegedly had a month long spree before MK.
 
I find it interesting that Mignini was originally suspecting "the usual suspects": Drug dealers, immigrants, vagrants....until Sophie said something about Amanda bringing home "weird men". Then Mignini began to look with suspicion on "the light eyed girl". At least according to this author......
 
OMG! You're gonna have me up till 6am, falling asleep reading with tidbits like that. and knowing me, I'll miss all the good stuff because I was so tired and sleepy, but still trying to read.

No, the pros are all you said. It's just I prefer a strict more newsy or factual voice when I'm reading nonfiction. Like she said something that made me upset, really. It was something about men osbessed with internet *advertiser censored* tuning into the the case for titilation. I didn't like that stereotype, but you know how I am about stereotypes....


The story titillated men habituated by Internet *advertiser censored* to the real possibilities of group sex and the slithery catfight.

Burleigh, Nina (2011). The Fatal Gift of Beauty: The Trials of Amanda Knox (Kindle Location 394). Broadway. Kindle Edition.

I don't really know how she knows this above. It's just I get strict about people taking a creative license to facts, that's all.
Okie.....:waitasec:.... what about it upsets you? Yes, I think I see what you mean, she is generalizing.....but are you thinking she is being unfair to men? I think the group sex theory , combined with Amanda's angelic looks, was indeed titilating to many....blog posts and news comments certainly would have revealed this to the author as she researched....

Mignini says in one section that he gave up the satanic theory, with some reluctance....he was as a youth very conservative, - she speculates Facist, politically - very suspicious of the Masonic sect, and worried about Perugia....

anyway, tell me why this upsets you, what Burleigh says....:waitasec:

Also, I never heard of "Shaky"....but he was an original person of interest, it seems....

Giocomo seems unworthy of Meredith, to me. He never took her out anywhere, he seemed to be interested only in sex and smoking hash....he had her watering his pot plants, which she was hesitant to do....And boasting to the boys downstairs about untoward things he did to her. I think MK was allowing an inferior type into her life, and it seems the poor girl was not with the right guy, not at all.........
 
I thought it was her hips?

Look, they get arrested on the 6th. The knife is announced as the weapon on the 15th. So what is PS talking about the lab wasn't used for days prior to the knife testing?

That can't be so. If they got the knife on the 6th, I don't even know how fast you can get DNA results, but they had to be sending everything from the murder house to another lab then. They had hundreds of things to process, right? isn't that what they said? So where was all this getting processed at while the machines PS used sat idle for 6 days before the 15th of Nov?
 
Okie.....:waitasec:.... what about it upsets you? Yes, I think I see what you mean, she is generalizing.....but are you thinking she is being unfair to men? I think the group sex theory , combined with Amanda's angelic looks, was indeed titilating to many....Mignini says in one section that he gave up the satanic theory, with some reluctance....he was as a youth very conservative, very suspicious of the Masonic sect, and worried about Perugia....anyway, tell me why this upsets you, what Burleigh says....:waitasec:

Also, I never heard of "Shaky"....but he was an original person of interest, it seems....

Yes, because you don't have to be a man to be onto internet *advertiser censored* or think what she said. Also, it made it sound like sick perverts just getting off on sex and murder. I didn't care for it all around. again for me, to silacious a phrase to intermingle into a factual account of a girl raped and murdered.

I never read a book and discussed it with someone in a forum at the same time. Kind of cool. I know you're reading it for Mig. :p

I can't believe he has a baby!
 
Yes, because you don't have to be a man to be onto internet *advertiser censored* or think what she said. Also, it made it sound like sick perverts just getting off on sex and murder. I didn't care for it all around. again for me, to silacious a phrase to intermingle into a factual account of a girl raped and murdered.

I never read a book and discussed it with someone in a forum at the same time. Kind of cool. I know you're reading it for Mig. :p

I can't believe he has a baby!
Well, I think she ought to have simply said, that people in general were titillated by the sexual theme, involving this sweet-seeming young couple....No, indeed, men are surely not the only ones interested in internet *advertiser censored* nor in Amanda..:mad:...Yes, I read it for *my beloved Giuliano*, :heartluv::heartluv::heartluv: am so jealous of Mrs. Mignini I could spit.... :razz: :(
 
Giocomo seems unworthy of Meredith, to me. He never took her out anywhere, he seemed to be interested only in sex and smoking hash....he had her watering his pot plants, which she was hesitant to do....And boasting to the boys downstairs about untoward things he did to her. I think MK was allowing an inferior type into her life, and it seems the poor girl was not with the right guy, not at all.........

I see ur point. But, they'd only been dating two weeks and she thankfully did not know about his gossiping. Maybe, if she'd had the chance, she would hve dumped him before new years?
 
Yes, I read it for *my beloved Giuliano*, am so jealous of Mrs. Mignini I could spit.... :(

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:
 
:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:
The funny part, the really sad part, is when I read that part about "the 45 year old Mrs. Mignini giving birth to their fourth girl in 2010", I really did feel jealous, and I really did spit....:eek::razz:
 
I see ur point. But, they'd only been dating two weeks and she thankfully did not know about his gossiping. Maybe, if she'd had the chance, she would hve dumped him before new years?
I think so. I read an article about the wonderful classical education MK had as a little girl. I think she was quite classical, and was simply "going along with" the student life in Perugia. Poor thing, she never got to get beyond it....makes me furious at that selfish Rudy....:furious:
 
From the other thread, Otto said: "I'm not particularly interested in Dougie Preston and his problems after interfering with a serial murder investigation in Italy. It's shameful that he is piggy backing on the murder of Meredith Kercher to further his cause."

In fact, the article written by CPJ outlined the fact that Mignini was found guilty of illegally wiretapping journalists. Douglas Preston and Frank Sfarzo were not the only people to complain (as cited by this artcle). Also Giangavino Sulas, Umberto Brindani, Joe Cottonwood, and Mario Spezi complained of intimidation and harrasment.

From the article:
In October 2009, when Spezi was attending a preliminary court hearing in one such indictment, he read a statement in his defense, the journalist told CPJ. The statement was sharply critical of Mignini, Spezi told CPJ. Soon after the hearing, the prosecutor indicted Spezi for "offending the honor and prestige of a judge"--a criminal charge that carries up to five years in prison if convicted.
 
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