MI - Three siblings in juvenile detention for contempt, Pontiac, 9 July 2015

[gitana1]

This sounds like one of the most intense cases of parental alienation ever. It sounds like the judge was at the end of her rope. What is confusing to me is why the children are the ones in jail, instead of the mother. Also, what is more typical in these cases, is for the transfer of custody to occur, to the non-alienating parent. That's probably what the judge should do: Grant sole custody to the father with only supervised therapeutic visitation to the mother.

But I think that the fact that the father lives in Israel and may travel back-and-forth is part of the problem.

In any event, we don't know everything that has gone on in this case. But it is noteworthy that none of the children's attorneys objected to the placement, or to the mother having zero visitation while they are in juvenile hall. Since the children's attorneys look after the best interests of he kids, that's remarkable. It sounds like the judge does not know what else to do in this case and is at her wits end.

It also sounds like these children are extraordinarily rude and defiant in court, which is highly unusual. That speaks to the level of damage that has been done to them. And to the relationship with their father. By the way, the little girl did not agree to go to lunch with her father only to change her mind after being berated by the judge. All three children presented with an extremely defiant attitude in court. The judge was done with it. The little girl (or younger boy?) finally agreed to going to lunch with her father, but apparently she looked over, and saw on a piece of paper that her brother had been unwilling to go. And that's why she changed her mind.

What the judge has done here is highly unprecedented. I also don't know that it is going to help repair the relationship between the father and the children. But frankly, having had too much experience with parental alienation cases, I am just a tiny bit understanding of why the judge went to these lengths.

As surprising as that may be.

 

[MyBelle]

This sounds like one of the most intense cases of parental alienation ever. It sounds like the judge was at the end of her rope. What is confusing to me is why the children are the ones in jail, instead of the mother. Also, what is more typical in these cases, is for the transfer of custody to occur, to the non-alienating parent. That's probably what the judge should do: Grant sole custody to the father with only supervised therapeutic visitation to the mother.

But I think that the fact that the father lives in Israel and may travel back-and-forth is part of the problem.

In any event, we don't know everything that has gone on in this case. But it is noteworthy that none of the children's attorneys objected to the placement, or to the mother having zero visitation while they are in juvenile hall. Since the children's attorneys look after the best interests of he kids, that's remarkable. It sounds like the judge does not know what else to do in this case and is at her wits end.

It also sounds like these children are extraordinarily rude and defiant in court, which is highly unusual. That speaks to the level of damage that has been done to them. And to the relationship with their father. By the way, the little girl did not agree to go to lunch with her father only to change her mind after being berated by the judge. All three children presented with an extremely defiant attitude in court. The judge was done with it. The little girl (or younger boy?) finally agreed to going to lunch with her father, but apparently she looked over, and saw on a piece of paper that her brother had been unwilling to go. And that's why she changed her mind.

What the judge has done here is highly unprecedented. I also don't know that it is going to help repair the relationship between the father and the children. But frankly, having had too much experience with parental alienation cases, I am just a tiny bit understanding of why the judge went to these lengths.

As surprising as that may be.

Hopefully, the father's employer will relocate him back to Michigan. I do believe his spending so much time out of the country is a major problem.

JMO

 

[tlcya]

Please post MSM and not blogs when discussing the case. Thanks, tlcya

 

[nomoresorrow]

If the mother was court-ordered to make the children available for a visitation with the father and the children did not go - for whatever reason - it should be her held in contempt, not the children. I have lived this so I know from experience that the best thing this mother could possibly have done for these kids was to (1) have an experienced family therapist working very closely with the family and (2) help prepare the kids for the visit, rather than resist it and transferring her issues with her ex-spouse onto the children, by instead, encouraging them to use the time with their dad to get to know him better and discover things that they can find enjoyment in doing with him and have confidence in their ability to form their own opinions, independent from hers (the mothers). IMO, the judge is wrong here and had an opportunity to really do something far more positive and meaningful to these kids - and for their future - but she blew it. MO ~

 

[epiphany]

Hearing live at link below:

The Tsimhoni family is back in court and to find out if they could be released from Children's Village.

A hearing was scheduled for 1:30 PM in Oakland County for the Tsimhoni children.

VIDEO: You can watch the hearing live in the video player above.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/2...g-to-comply-with-court-ordered-lunch-with-dad

 

[Irisha]

BBM. What the Judge has done is intervene in what she believes is a very unhealthy relationship between the mother and the children. The kids had a choice between having lunch with dad and being removed from their mother's home and all three chose removal.

I do believe the GALs and the Judge have quite a bit more insight into the history of this case than we do.

JMO

This morning I went with a family member who had to go to court in downtown Detroit. As we were sitting there 1st row, 2 att.s, 1 was my relatives att. started loudly discussing this case. I had just read about it on ClickonDetroit.com yesterday. I got the impression as I was closely easedropping:blushing: that the older att.#1 was 1 of the kids att. or guardian ad litum. They were shocked at the judges actions, BUT the older 1 said she is intelligent, fair, and but should have recused herself. Also said this whole case is a mess. The conversation went on for about an hr. off and on. I heard them say at the next hearing the courtroom will be packed. After the older att. left and family member case was done, I questioned 2nd att. gave him MY opinion, Jail the Mother, parental alienation. He agreed. Att. #1- Blabbermouth Me- need better hearing, my family member absolutely refused to let me tap Att. #1 on the shoulder and question him:gaah:Family member doing really good, staying out of trouble.:happydance:

 

[MyBelle]

This morning I went with a family member who had to go to court in downtown Detroit. As we were sitting there 1st row, 2 att.s, 1 was my relatives att. started loudly discussing this case. I had just read about it on ClickonDetroit.com yesterday. I got the impression as I was closely easedropping:blushing: that the older att.#1 was 1 of the kids att. or guardian ad litum. They were shocked at the judges actions, BUT the older 1 said she is intelligent, fair, and but should have recused herself. Also said this whole case is a mess. The conversation went on for about an hr. off and on. I heard them say at the next hearing the courtroom will be packed. After the older att. left and family member case was done, I questioned 2nd att. gave him MY opinion, Jail the Mother, parental alienation. He agreed. Att. #1- Blabbermouth Me- need better hearing, my family member absolutely refused to let me tap Att. #1 on the shoulder and question him:gaah:Family member doing really good, staying out of trouble.:happydance:

Did they say why the Judge should have recused herself? Thanks!

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Did they say why the Judge should have recused herself? Thanks!

I'll look for a media source, but this is part of what I meant when I said the case has gone on for a while and is too convoluted to follow

 

[MyBelle]

I'll look for a media source, but this is part of what I meant when I said the case has gone on for a while and is too convoluted to follow

Thanks! It is an attention grabber for sure.

 

[gitana1]

If the mother was court-ordered to make the children available for a visitation with the father and the children did not go - for whatever reason - it should be her held in contempt, not the children. I have lived this so I know from experience that the best thing this mother could possibly have done for these kids was to (1) have an experienced family therapist working very closely with the family and (2) help prepare the kids for the visit, rather than resist it and transferring her issues with her ex-spouse onto the children, by instead, encouraging them to use the time with their dad to get to know him better and discover things that they can find enjoyment in doing with him and have confidence in their ability to form their own opinions, independent from hers (the mothers). IMO, the judge is wrong here and had an opportunity to really do something far more positive and meaningful to these kids - and for their future - but she blew it. MO ~

Its way beyond that in this case. Therapists have been involved for a long time, apparently. The mother is crazy.

 

[gitana1]

Is anyone watching the live hearing? I can watch but my audio is not functioning.

 

[MyBelle]

Its way beyond that in this case. The mother is crazy.

I think you are right and that is why the father has tried not to rock the boat out of fear she would take it out on the kids.

The Judge pointed out that the husband had in the past begged her not to do what she ended up doing.

JMO

 

[MyBelle]

Is anyone watching the live hearing? I can watch but my audio is not functioning.

Sorry I don't have audio, either. Is the hearing still going? It's nearly 3:00 pm

 

[Irisha]

Did they say why the Judge should have recused herself? Thanks!

Not that I heard, but he did say he didn't have time or had wanted to file pleadings, but everything happened so fast. I couldn't hear every word and I DID try:shame:

 

[gitana1]

Sorry I don't have audio, either. Is the hearing still going? It's nearly 3:00 pm

I can see movement on the video. My guess is the kids will be released today. But this case will be far from over. If the court doesn't switch custody, the relationship with dad will never be fixed.

 

[gitana1]

I worked with a young attorney who was divorced and was very careful to have an extremely amiable relationship with his ex. She could call him and he would come over and sit as a united front with the mother to deal with whatever the kids were doing.

The he reason he worked so hard to be amicable is because he was the victim of severe parental alienation. It was so bad that by age 15 he hated his dad. Finally, he was sent from California to live with his dad back east, by the court. That fixed it. Within a few months he was tight with his dad.

Another friend of mine was also the victim of terrible parental alienation. She has a good relationship now with both parents although she did change her last name to her mom's as soon as she was old enough (her mom kept going against court orders and forcing her and her sister to use the mother's last name in school, instead of their own. She also didn't allow them to call their dad "dad" at her house. They had to use his first name).

But, she is incapable of a normal, healthy relationship with another adult. She either picks people who are mentally ill or unavailable or she inserts herself in bizarre swinger relationships. It's as if she is trying to recreate the mother/father dynamic with herself as the child, and her parents still together. It's creepy.

Parental alienation is not a joke. It has severe effects.

 

[PrairieWind]

I agree that the kids will likely be released. The publicity of this will make it difficult for the judge now, I think. It will be interesting to see what effect the publicity has on the case. It might make things go better, but could also make things worse.

 

[MyBelle]

I worked with a young attorney who was divorced and was very careful to have an extremely amiable relationship with his ex. She could call him and he would come over and sit as a united front with the mother to deal with whatever the kids were doing.

The he reason he worked so hard to be amicable is because he was the victim of severe parental alienation. It was so bad that by age 15 he hated his dad. Finally, he was sent from California to live with his dad back east, by the court. That fixed it. Within a few months he was tight with his dad.

Another friend of mine was also the victim of terrible parental alienation. She has a good relationship now with both parents although she did change her last name to her mom's as soon as she was old enough (her mom kept going against court orders and forcing her and her sister to use the mother's last name in school, instead of their own. She also didn't allow them to call their dad "dad" at her house. They had to use his first name).

But, she is incapable of a normal, healthy relationship with another adult. She either picks people who are mentally ill or unavailable or she inserts herself in bizarre swinger relationships. It's as if she is trying to recreate the mother/father dynamic with herself as the child, and her parents still together. It's creepy.

Parental alienation is not a joke. It has severe effects.

It does have severe effects. I've seen it up front. The mother in this case seems to have launched an online campaign against the Judge. This could backfire badly. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. I've been in courtrooms where judges have lashed out at parents. I've never witnessed one going after a kid, though. The baseless allegation that his dad is violent really seemed to set her off.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/2...-start-to-free-tsimhoni-children-remove-judge

 

[jjenny]

How do you know it's baseless? Son says he saw it.

 

[jjenny]

Oh I assure you, the court can order that relationship to exist. The court believes, probably correctly, that the reason the children are hostile to the father is that the mother is manipulating them and denying access to them. If the children spend time with the father away from the mother, they will begin to see that Dad isn't the monster Mom is making him out to be. I would say that right now the only thing stopping the court from awarding primary physical custody to father is that his job requires him to be out of the country so much.

Cause it would be kind of hart do raise the children when he is working in Israel?
He went back to Israel, even after the judge locked his children up.