MN - Mom not at home during fatal Northside fire October 2015

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flourish said:
Not having kids is a great suggestion no one in the history of man has ever suggested. I suppose you have the answer as to how to accomplish that for society? Involuntarily sterelizing the poor?
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Not the poor, the irresponsible. Like this "mother". Like anyone who kills a child, then is allowed to have more. If they can't learn responsibility on their own, us, as a society, must do what it is best for everyone involved. Including potential children these pieces of trash may have.
 
human said:
Obviously she should have not left those little tiny children alone. I imagine she wil be facing some kind of criminal counts.

I hope she realizes that she does not need children. She can have the fun life or whatever it is she wants to do. No need to complicate it with children.
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Ah, but three children bring with them so much welfare that they are "worth" having.
 
The question for me is not why she did not go to her family or why she turned on the oven.

The question is why she left the kids alone. Where did she go? How long was she gone? Is leaving sleeping kids alone acceptable in her eyes?
 
Lulu14 said:
Ah, but three children bring with them so much welfare that they are "worth" having.
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Don't know what it is now, but five years ago for a family of three it was $423 a month. You get one year in total to raise a child where you do not have to be working or going to school. Welfare gives you a six week course which is why most CNA's have been on welfare.

If you are not working or going to school after five years, you receive sanctions each month until you get no cash assistance. True that you can get food stamps, health care and sec 8 housing. But with no cash, you have no clothing, no diaoers, no entertainment, no gas, no car.

If anyone thinks that it is a swell life, they can have it as far as I am concerned. How sad that one thinks this is the way it should be for them.
 
human said:
Don't know what it is now, but five years ago for a family of three it was $423 a month. You get one year in total to raise a child where you do not have to be working or going to school. Welfare gives you a six week course which is why most CNA's have been on welfare.

If you are not working or going to school after five years, you receive sanctions each month until you get no cash assistance. True that you can get food stamps, health care and sec 8 housing. But with no cash, you have no clothing, no diaoers, no entertainment, no gas, no car.

If anyone thinks that it is a swell life, they can have it as far as I am concerned. How sad that one thinks this is the way it should be for them.
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Personally, I think there should be no assistance. Not my problem you don't want to work or decide to have children you can support. Not where my taxes should go.
 
Lulu14 said:
Not the poor, the irresponsible. Like this "mother". Like anyone who kills a child, then is allowed to have more. If they can't learn responsibility on their own, us, as a society, must do what it is best for everyone involved. Including potential children these pieces of trash may have.
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It is established law that this is illegal in the US. Some states are paying people for violating their rights decades ago by involuntarily sterilizing them. Planned Parenthood is the only organization I know of that is given money from the government (us) to locate in what you would call the more "irresponsible" areas of town and separate the irresponsible potential parent from their potential child. Is this what you want more of?
The mother should be charged with whatever crimes she committed and sentenced appropriately. We cannot undo things that happened years ago.
 
Lulu14 said:
Personally, I think there should be no assistance. Not my problem you don't want to work or decide to have children you can support. Not where my taxes should go.
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Yeah. It is not your problem.

Hopefully you never have a problem where you have to rely on society. Say like getting a disease or better yet, having an accident that is your fault. For instance, fallkng off a ladder at your house so you have no one to sue for negligence,

Lots of examples of things that could happen to you.
 
wendybtn said:
It is established law that this is illegal in the US. Some states are paying people for violating their rights decades ago by involuntarily sterilizing them. Planned Parenthood is the only organization I know of that is given money from the government (us) to locate in what you would call the more "irresponsible" areas of town and separate the irresponsible potential parent from their potential child. Is this what you want more of?
The mother should be charged with whatever crimes she committed and sentenced appropriately. We cannot undo things that happened years ago.
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Planned Parenthood provides birth control. Isn't that what we like to see? People not having children?

Never heard of them separating children from parents.

I do think if someone is convicted of killing a child, man or woman, one penalty is sterilization. They lose their ability to do that to another child.
 
I didn't see it reported anywhere whether she and her kids were ever on welfare.
 
human said:
Yes, poverty is hard to understand when you have not been there. There are some easy good books to read such as Nickel and Dimed by an author who lived on minimum wage to see what it was like, Really easy reading.

Another option would be to volunteer with an agency and make friends with a family in need. I worked with families in poverty for thirty years as a teacher. My job required lots of family interaction, The last two years I worked in a special program with the homeless families, Poverty on a whole new level for me. A whole new understanding of barriers to overcome.
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How do you know where I have or haven't been?
 
human said:
ASSume on my part . I ASSume that people who have been in poverty know what it is like .
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Again, what exactly makes it about poverty? Her furnace was broken (which could happen to anyone, poor or rich). She turned on the oven, opened it's door, then allegedly left the house, while her 3 kids were in the house. Yet this is about poverty? How much money in the bank would have prevented her from doing that? Fire doesn't know if you are rich or you are poor. We have discusses some cases where well off people lost their children in fires.
 
More from SM! Sounds like she was knocking on doors of neighbors (people she did not know) asking for someone to babysit and couldn't find anyone.

Nice to know she at least tried to find someone. She should have stayed home though since she couldn' find anyone willing. I would hate to be one of the ones who declined though. If someone had said yes.. well you know.

its the 'north vent' fb page which is publicly view able. search for 'fire' in the search box on the upper right.
 
wendybtn said:
It is established law that this is illegal in the US. Some states are paying people for violating their rights decades ago by involuntarily sterilizing them. Planned Parenthood is the only organization I know of that is given money from the government (us) to locate in what you would call the more "irresponsible" areas of town and separate the irresponsible potential parent from their potential child. Is this what you want more of?
The mother should be charged with whatever crimes she committed and sentenced appropriately. We cannot undo things that happened years ago.
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Laws change. Society changes. People evolve. I don't believe everyone is entitled to having a child, just like not everyone should drive or take a home mortgage.

No, I don't want the state to separate children from potentially irresponsible parents. I want those people never to become parents to start with.
 
human said:
Yeah. It is not your problem.

Hopefully you never have a problem where you have to rely on society. Say like getting a disease or better yet, having an accident that is your fault. For instance, fallkng off a ladder at your house so you have no one to sue for negligence,

Lots of examples of things that could happen to you.
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No, I won't, and do you know why? Because I have savings in the bank, my own house bought and paid for and long term disability insurance. I am responsible.

And even if I did end up in that situation, you know what I would start doing immediately? Yeah, take birth control pills. These people have not fallen on bad times lately, they have always lives like that. That's why they keep on having children when they cannot take care of those they already have.
 
jjenny said:
Again, what exactly makes it about poverty? Her furnace was broken (which could happen to anyone, poor or rich). She turned on the oven, opened it's door, then allegedly left the house, while her 3 kids were in the house. Yet this is about poverty? How much money in the bank would have prevented her from doing that? Fire doesn't know if you are rich or you are poor. We have discusses some cases where well off people lost their children in fires.
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I cannot picture anyone willing to sit in front of an oven at 42 degrees if they have another choice.
 
human said:
I cannot picture anyone willing to sit in front of an oven at 42 degrees if they have another choice.
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If the allegations are true, she didn't exactly sit in front of it, did she?
 
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