GUILTY MT - Sherry Arnold, 43, Sidney, 7 Jan 2012 - #2

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It just seems so weird that they're not putting out a description of the vehicle or anything really. Someone could have seen them stopped but just thought "car trouble".

I agree. Someone could have seen them at a gas station or a convenience store or any number of places. They didn't catch these guys until Friday and they took Sherry on Saturday morning. That's a whole lot of lead team for the perps and potentially a whole lot of ground covered by them.
 
I am still thinking along this line given that both are known to do drugs... I still tend to think that maybe the younger one was talking more than the older one but he was either drunk or high when everything was happening that he does not remember where the exact spot is that they put her.

True, they would probably not be able to remember where they buried Sherry if they were under the influence, but I also wonder how familiar they were with the territory. These were isolated, sparsely populated areas they were traveling through. After Sherry was dead, they may not have had a particular destination in mind, but were looking for a deserted, sheltered area to dispose of the body undetected.

I am still wondering at what point Waters and Spell parted company. The fact that Waters was apprehended near the Montana border, while Spell was found far away in South Dakota, and that LE spent so long talking to him, makes me think that he parted company from Waters before Sherry was buried, but described to LE the area where they stopped. And, what appears to be a broken nose...possibly swollen: If that injury is fresh, it's likely he and Waters fought before parting ways (well, I know an alternate theory is that Sherry may have punched him if he assaulted her). But, that's what I'm inclined to think at this point and, IMO, Spell is the only one talking but he has less of an idea where Sherry is than Waters does. MOO
 
A few thoughts because this thread is moving so fast and it is difficult to respond to individual posts.

Searching: Think of the movie FARGO when the guy is burying the money, he looks up to see miles of snow and fence.

Ranchers have small planes and helicopters; they can do searches, weather permitting.

It is going to be a wind chill of -15 here in the Black Hills tonight so it will be very cold further north where they are searching.

Meat sellers: Schwanns is also a company that sells food from trucks but there is no way they would hire these two clowns.
 
IMO if this is the claim and is what occurred(not exact but something similar in nature with it being initially accidental and not intentional) then IMO I can find ZERO REASON, EXCUSE, OR CAUSE FOR EITHER OF THESE MEN TO NOT IMMEDIATELY AID IN RECOVERING HER BODY!!!..

SBM

I don't agree. I can think of several cases where the perpetrator was highly motivated to help LE locate remains but was unable to do so effectively.

Have you ever gone driving aimlessly in a plains area? The entire state of Iowa is a virtual metropolis compared to western North Dakota and northern Montana but it is still possible to get completely lost or to be unable to re-trace one's route here. Rolling hills, trees, more rolling hills, more trees, occasional white farmhouses (there are very few farmhouses not painted white here), more rolling hills, more trees.

To people not in love with the plains, it is boring terrain. To those few of us who love it, it is the most beautiful land on earth.

People think they would remember their route or they think they remembered significant landmarks but when it comes time to actually prove it, it turns out their memory was not as good as they thought, they weren't quite sure where they were (particularly if they got onto two lane or gravel roads) and/or the landmarks they describe turn out to apply to hundreds or thousands of possible sites.

The fact that the time of the crime was approximately an hour before there was significant light means that vision would be restricted mostly to what you can see on the road and a couple feet to either side.

If you are used to living in the plains states, you keep a rough map of the major highways across the states. You know at all times roughly what zone between major highways you're in but you may well not know to any degree of accuracy just where you are.

If you know the plains, it's not a problem. You know that if you keep going in roughly the correct direction, you will sooner or later cross the major highway you're aimed at. But that intersection could be literally a couple hundred miles away.

And if you know the plains in the winter, you never let your gas tank go below half (or better, three quarters) because during one of the extreme drops in temperature, a gas tank that is mostly full is less likely to develop vapour lock while parked. So you're likely to have plenty of gas to keep going and going, if that's what you end up doing.
 
A few thoughts because this thread is moving so fast and it is difficult to respond to individual posts.

Searching: Think of the movieFARGO when the guy is burying the money, he looks up to see miles of snow and fence.

Ranchers have small planes and helicopters; they can do searches, weather permitting.

It is going to be a wind chill of -15 here in the Black Hills tonight so it will be very cold further north where they are searching.

Meat sellers: Schwanns is also a company that sells food from trucks but there is no way they would hire these two clowns.
BBM
That's what I've thought, too, Jacie. Considering the driving records of both of these guys, IF it's true they drove a meat truck I think they must be self-employed. The mayor made a comment at one point to the effect that they can't do a background search on everyone who moves into the area. Could be new residents to Sidney or a nearby town who decided to start they're own business. Could possibly buy the meat in bulk from a local wholesaler and then sell it at a profit, including fuel costs.
 
Report on case coming up on HLN with Mike Galonos.

ETA: Criminal profiler Pat Brown gave her take on the two suspects who have been arrested and charged with aggravated kidnapping.
 
Says that he works for "Farm Work". Think that means he does farm work?
Also says that he is from Ordway, CO.

I saw that. I also noticed that Ordway is clear across the state over 300 miles away from Parachute.
 
True, they would probably not be able to remember where they buried Sherry if they were under the influence, but I also wonder how familiar they were with the territory. These were isolated, sparsely populated areas they were traveling through. After Sherry was dead, they may not have had a particular destination in mind, but were looking for a deserted, sheltered area to dispose of the body undetected.

I am still wondering at what point Waters and Spell parted company. The fact that Waters was apprehended near the Montana border, while Spell was found far away in South Dakota, and that LE spent so long talking to him, makes me think that he parted company from Waters before Sherry was buried, but described to LE the area where they stopped. And, what appears to be a broken nose...possibly swollen: If that injury is fresh, it's likely he and Waters fought before parting ways (well, I know an alternate theory is that Sherry may have punched him if he assaulted her). But, that's what I'm inclined to think at this point and, IMO, Spell is the only one talking but he has less of an idea where Sherry is than Waters does. MOO

Just looked at his Peekyou and in that picture you can see that the nose is the same... crooked.
 
They do have the truck they were traveling in, correct?? I, too am puzzled why not give that make, model, color, description of the vehicle they were traveling in?? I mean for FGS peeps are much more likely to recall a specific truck(ESP if there's any identifying features or damage) before able to notice and recall faces of driver/passenger of that truck.. Very very odd and could produce tremendous forward movement, including even possibly shed light on the incident that morning if locals knew what vehicle that the perps were driving that morning.. I cannot make sense of a motive for not releasing the vehicle description??.. Especially when someone could recall seeing off the side of a road, parked in an odd area, headed up or down a very secluded area and it in fact be the exact area where Sherry's
Body is???

Anyone think of what motive there'd be for with holding this info when obviously they do not have a narrowed down area they suspect her body to be(but rather many many wide spread counties covering 2 states).. Just don't get it?!?! *shrug*
 
Says that he works for "Farm Work". Think that means he does farm work?
Also says that he is from Ordway, CO.

When I saw that, I wondered if he might be an itinerant worker. Maybe he befriended Waters while in Parachute looking for work and Waters offered him employment with his small business. Either business was sparse in Parachute so they decided to take their business elsewhere, or perhaps they committed a crime there and left to avoid detection/incarceration. JMO
 
They do have the truck they were traveling in, correct?? I, too am puzzled why not give that make, model, color, description of the vehicle they were traveling in?? I mean for FGS peeps are much more likely to recall a specific truck(ESP if there's any identifying features or damage) before able to notice and recall faces of driver/passenger of that truck.. Very very odd and could produce tremendous forward movement, including even possibly shed light on the incident that morning if locals knew what vehicle that the perps were driving that morning.. I cannot make sense of a motive for not releasing the vehicle description??.. Especially when someone could recall seeing off the side of a road, parked in an odd area, headed up or down a very secluded area and it in fact be the exact area where Sherry's
Body is???

Anyone think of what motive there'd be for with holding this info when obviously they do not have a narrowed down area they suspect her body to be(but rather many many wide spread counties covering 2 states).. Just don't get it?!?! *shrug*

I've buzzed by a truck mentioned and it just occurred to me, do we know they were driving in a truck? :)

I agree, a vehicle description would be awesome, especially since I'm assuming not many people travel in some of the more isolated areas where they may have hidden Sherry's body.
 
I wonder if they have been able to follow these guys cell phone locations during / right after / and after the time that Sherry disappeared. Did they make a phone call? Did that give LE any ideas of where to search?

:sigh:

I'd hope they have subpoena'd cell records but it may not be of much use. There is an awful lot of territory in the high plains that has no cell coverage. No cell coverage means cell phone records are useless.
 
This reminds me of the Stacey Hazelton case in Mississippi in 2004, except this was a boyfriend. She has never been found. Perp's in prison. His buddy "tried" to lead LE to her remains at a tree line and discarded bed springs, to no avail.

http://www.staceyhazelton.org/index.html
 
Wow, I've been focused on the computer but I have Prime News on and Pat Brown was on.

She's saying that she knew that it was two men because of Sherry's height, that they're a criminal "duo" because its "easier to abduct that way". They "enjoyed the comradery", "kinda like target shooting".

She doesn't think that Sherry was hit accidentally hit because they don't want the police to know where the body is because it will show that it was much more than an accident.
 
http://abcnews.go.com/US/farmers-states-checking-land-signs-sherry-arnold/story?id=15370582
Two Colorado men are being held in connection to Arnold's disappearance. The men are Lester Vann Waters Jr., 47, and Michael Keith Spell, 22.

The two men are in the Williams County Correctional Center in Williston, N.D., as they await extradition to Montana.

Waters and Spell have been charged with aggravated kidnapping. The case is now a federal case because investigators believe Arnold was kidnapped from her hometown of Sidney, Mont., and taken across state lines.
 
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