Identified! Mystery couple murdered in South Carolina, 1976 - #7 Pam Buckley & James P Freund

[Ozoner]

Definitely. I would be surprised if it's not her. She is the closest I have ever seen to facial similarity. The lack of moles is the only puzzle.

She may simply have covered them with make up for for the photos.

 

[fred&edna]

Sumter's 1976 John and Jane Doe remains identified, to be revealed Not sure if this link will work. Names won't be announced till tomorrow. also change in where female is missing from. now it is Minnesota

Minnesota. Now, this makes quite a difference as it possibly being PB... thank you! I'm no longer so confused!

 

[SurrealisticSlumbers]

I share everyone else's frustrations. I was fully expecting to read that press announcement either this morning or at some point today. All in due time, I guess!

I am skeptical about Pam Buckley being the unidentified woman, because in the photos, Pam is blonde. The facial features, particularly her jawline, is also "off." Just my personal opinion, of course.

As an aside, I cannot help but wonder why LE thought this Minnesota(?) woman was a possible Middle Eastern exchange student, as many official links state (incl. Doe Network). I believe I read on a Reddit thread that the ancestry results released by DDP suggested a bit of Eastern Mediterranean and Native American heritage in her DNA profile, which would explain why she had olive undertones and long, thick eyelashes... Still, why just blindly speculate on that particular theory? Seems like lazy detective work, unless they have other information indicating that was the case, info not made available to the general public.

And "Jacques" Doe, though allegedly from Pennsylvania, still could've been from a Canadian family that perhaps moved to PA / the USA at some point in his life or prior to his birth. Canada is right across Lake Erie from the northwestern part of the state. Maybe he had left Canada for the U.S., particularly PA, at some point. Or maybe his family was just of Canadian, specifically French-Canadian, origin. Many U.S. citizens have Acadian / French Canadian ancestry. And people on Reddit were discussing the fact that his DNA profile indicates a strong Western European background, particularly British and French - basically the DNA profile you'd expect a white Canadian to have. If I am remembering correctly, there was some Spanish ancestry there as well, and some people of Spanish heritage may have "Moorish" features like bushy eyebrows, for instance. He may have had some other regions listed as well that I'm forgetting, but anyway, just saying that he still could have been from a Canadian family after all, and the story he told to the KOA campground guy indeed true. Unless he found it necessary to lie to people he encountered in his travels, which is also likely... Could have been a "half-truth" as well, if he wanted to establish himself as a middle-class individual but have his identity protected; didn't want anyone finding him. The "prodigal son" narrative could still be a valid one, even if he fudged the other details regarding his real name and family background.

 

[landis]

No matter who SC Jane Doe turns out to be - it's wonderful that she was identified. And another good thing happened: Pamela Mae's case was brought to light and got lots of attention. Who knows where it's going to get us if we dig deeper.

 

[Awsi Dooger]

The 5 PM Eastern newscast on WLTX had a brief update, confirming that the presser is tomorrow. They also spoke briefly to Jean Graham, whose father was sheriff at the time. The 6 PM Eastern newscast is going to have a longer interview with Graham regarding the four decade search.

BTW, for anyone who sees the footage at the link below, she was interviewed while standing in front of the Bethel United Methodist Church. The cemetery is immediately behind the church and the Sumter County Does are buried at front left side of the cemetery, alongside a fence. There is a brief clip of the headstones in the newscast:

Watch | NEWS19 Live and On-Demand Videos | Columbia, South Carolina | wltx.com

The 6 PM newscast didn't add much. The 2 PM time tomorrow was specified. The sheriff's daughter said he didn't take his work home with him, but he did in this case. It bothered him they were not identified. Also the current pastor of the church said the Does were welcome to stay in the cemetery or the families could choose to take them home.

 

[theory]

Could it be that Jane never had moles and what we have all seen in the pictures was blood splatter that was not all the way cleaned off? There is one photo I found that shows lots of what I assume is blood splatter - mainly on the right side of her face but the 2 "moles" are there on the left and look just like the spots on the right side. I'm sorry I don't know how to link the photo. I'm sure others have seen this photo I'm talking about. Maybe someone can link for me.

 

[WhiteDragon]

If it is Pam Buckley (and maybe it's not - I agree about the hair being the wrong colour but perhaps it was dyed at some point. I found this reference in the local Redwood Falls, Minnesota newspaper :
• Pamela Buckley, chosen the Redwood Jaycees Sno-Queen in February and set to become Miss Redwood Falls 1971, abdicated the throne to tour the west coast with the folk-singing trio “Sunlending.” Backward Glances: Football player poet gets revenge against his English class
So was she hitchhiking around the US with the band Sunlending?
Do you think the woman in this photo of the band could be Jane Doe?
VANv11iss19p18001
Just speculation as I'm desperately waiting for any news like everyone else. Please go easy on me! It's my first ever post

 

[Andreee]

No matter who SC Jane Doe turns out to be - it's wonderful that she was identified. And another good thing happened: Pamela Mae's case was brought to light and got lots of attention. Who knows where it's going to get us if we dig deeper.

People keep mentioning this Pamela Mae but I can't find a photo of her or much info anywhere for some reason! Can someone post a photo of her or direct me right to a link lol.

P.S. Found a photo and info on Websleuths lol. Wonder why I couldn't find her elsewhere, maybe taken off, hmmm

 

[dotr]

If it is Pam Buckley (and maybe it's not - I agree about the hair being the wrong colour but perhaps it was dyed at some point. I found this reference in the local Redwood Falls, Minnesota newspaper :
• Pamela Buckley, chosen the Redwood Jaycees Sno-Queen in February and set to become Miss Redwood Falls 1971, abdicated the throne to tour the west coast with the folk-singing trio “Sunlending.” Backward Glances: Football player poet gets revenge against his English class
So was she hitchhiking around the US with the band Sunlending?
Do you think the woman in this photo of the band could be Jane Doe?
VANv11iss19p18001
Just speculation as I'm desperately waiting for any news like everyone else. Please go easy on me! It's my first ever post

Welcome to Ws WhiteDragon, interesting find!

 

[Molly's Mom]

No matter who SC Jane Doe turns out to be - it's wonderful that she was identified. And another good thing happened: Pamela Mae's case was brought to light and got lots of attention. Who knows where it's going to get us if we dig deeper.

So true! Every time we talk about a missing person, we bring that much more hope to the case being solved! Any attention has to be good for Pamela Mae at this point.

 

[wmm85]

People keep mentioning this Pamela Mae but I can't find a photo of her or much info anywhere for some reason! Can someone post a photo of her or direct me right to a link lol.

P.S. Found a photo and info on Websleuths lol. Wonder why I couldn't find her elsewhere, maybe taken off, hmmm

There are photos on her thread, check page two (the photos on page one are a different Pam Buckley)
CO - CO - Pamela Mae Buckley, 23, Colorado Springs, Dec 1975

 

[landis]

Guys, for discussion about Pamela Mae go to her thread. All information that we managed to gather about her is there.

 

[JupiterAmmon]

Could it be that Jane never had moles and what we have all seen in the pictures was blood splatter that was not all the way cleaned off? There is one photo I found that shows lots of what I assume is blood splatter - mainly on the right side of her face but the 2 "moles" are there on the left and look just like the spots on the right side. I'm sorry I don't know how to link the photo. I'm sure others have seen this photo I'm talking about. Maybe someone can link for me.

I feel like LE would have clarified this if this was the case and the mortician/LE would have cleaned off the blood... They were displayed for about a year.

 

[theory]

I feel like LE would have clarified this if this was the case and the mortician/LE would have cleaned off the blood... They were displayed for about a year.

Maybe I figured out how to add picture. I agree seems crazy if blood was not removed all the way. But when I see this picture I wonder.

 

[Triss]

I feel like LE would have clarified this if this was the case and the mortician/LE would have cleaned off the blood... They were displayed for about a year.

Agreed. Any coroner can tell the difference between blood splatter and a mole.

 

[leilarose68]

I share everyone else's frustrations. I was fully expecting to read that press announcement either this morning or at some point today. All in due time, I guess!

I am skeptical about Pam Buckley being the unidentified woman, because in the photos, Pam is blonde. The facial features, particularly her jawline, is also "off." Just my personal opinion, of course.


And "Jacques" Doe, though allegedly from Pennsylvania, still could've been from a Canadian family that perhaps moved to PA / the USA at some point in his life or prior to his birth. Canada is right across Lake Erie from the northwestern part of the state. Maybe he had left Canada for the U.S., particularly PA, at some point. Or maybe his family was just of Canadian, specifically French-Canadian, origin. Many U.S. citizens have Acadian / French Canadian ancestry. And people on Reddit were discussing the fact that his DNA profile indicates a strong Western European background, particularly British and French - basically the DNA profile you'd expect a white Canadian to have. If I am remembering correctly, there was some Spanish ancestry there as well, and some people of Spanish heritage may have "Moorish" features like bushy eyebrows, for instance. He may have had some other regions listed as well that I'm forgetting, but anyway, just saying that he still could have been from a Canadian family after all, and the story he told to the KOA campground guy indeed true. Unless he found it necessary to lie to people he encountered in his travels, which is also likely... Could have been a "half-truth" as well, if he wanted to establish himself as a middle-class individual but have his identity protected; didn't want anyone finding him. The "prodigal son" narrative could still be a valid one, even if he fudged the other details regarding his real name and family background.

EDIT: I think I confused the issue more. Disregard this post and read the one below this one

 

[landis]

Unfortunately there is a lot of confusion because there are two Pam Buckleys. One was from Colorado Springs, had short blonde hair, has her own websleuths thread and was reported missing. Pictures of Pam Buckley from Minnesota was posted in the other Pam Buckley thread (which makes it all the more confusing), has brown hair and looks quite a lot like Sumter Jane Doe. Pam Buckley from Minnesota is the Pam that people are speculating is Jane Doe.

There is Pamela Rae Buckley from Colorado Springs who was mistaken for Pamela Mae. Pamela Rae is not missing, she's confirmed alive and well.
Pamela Mae was originally from Redwood Falls Minnesota, got married to a man from Colorado and went missing from Colorado Springs. It's all explained in her thread. Most of the first page can be disregarded, because it's from when Pamela Mae was thought to be Pamela Rae originally from Colorado Springs.

 

[leilarose68]

There is Pamela Rae Buckley from Colorado Springs who was mistaken for Pamela Mae. Pamela Rae is not missing, she's confirmed alive and well.
Pamela Mae was originally from Redwood Falls Minnesota, got married to a man from Colorado and went missing from Colorado Springs. It's all explained in her thread. Most of the first page can be disregarded, because it's from when Pamela Mae was thought to be Pamela Rae originally from Colorado Springs.

Okay... so the brunette with long brown hair is Pamela Mae?

 

[landis]

Okay... so the brunette with long brown hair is Pamela Mae?

Yes. Second and third page. First page is Pamela Rae, and then she's been confirmed alive. It's quite a bit of work, but I'd recommend just reading the thread. We're kind of spamming this thread with Pamela Mae who might or might not be SC Jane Doe and completly forgetting about Jock Doe.

 

[Andreee]

There is Pamela Rae Buckley from Colorado Springs who was mistaken for Pamela Mae. Pamela Rae is not missing, she's confirmed alive and well.
Pamela Mae was originally from Redwood Falls Minnesota, got married to a man from Colorado and went missing from Colorado Springs. It's all explained in her thread. Most of the first page can be disregarded, because it's from when Pamela Mae was thought to be Pamela Rae originally from Colorado Springs.

That's why I'm hoping someone in the know can post the relevant photos of Pamela here again, rather than trying to find them from previous posts, too confusing otherwise lol.