There are a couple of women missing, who lived closer to Danby. One young woman lived only 20 minutes away. Thanks for posting. I hope they are able to id the remains.
NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - # 8
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There are a couple of women missing, who lived closer to Danby. One young woman lived only 20 minutes away. Thanks for posting. I hope they are able to id the remains.
OldSteve
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Thanks to JR's blog lots of activity taking place!
I still wonder about the last person who spoke and saw her - how many cases have we seen in which it's that last person who is involved, especially when alibis are only from family or friends. Even saw at least one crime show in which the person involved passed a lie detector.
Add to that, keep in mind where tracking dogs lost scent of MM.
Question, if someone picks up a person and carries that person, would dogs still follow scent of person being carried?
If MM had a flashlight - she could gone 5, 10, who know how many miles in a number of directions before accepting a ride or succumbing to elements.
I still wonder about the last person who spoke and saw her - how many cases have we seen in which it's that last person who is involved, especially when alibis are only from family or friends. Even saw at least one crime show in which the person involved passed a lie detector.
Add to that, keep in mind where tracking dogs lost scent of MM.
Question, if someone picks up a person and carries that person, would dogs still follow scent of person being carried?
If MM had a flashlight - she could gone 5, 10, who know how many miles in a number of directions before accepting a ride or succumbing to elements.
I guess it would depend on the type of search dogs that are used. Air-scent search dogs would detect human scent regardless if someone was being carried or not.
Trailing(tracking) dogs must have a starting point to search and they sniff the ground to follow human scent.
The key with trailing(tracking) dogs is (as I understand it) they must do their searches as quickly as possible from the time somone goes missing, because they will not be as effective if too much time passes. Weather and winds wreak havoc on a trailing dog's trail for searching, they are often keying off a missing person's belongings at the time they start searching and sniffing dead skin cells to develop a trail, something that would be disturbed by cold weather in february and winds and too much time passing.
Two gueses on which type of search dogs were used to try and find maura?
Unscripted
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Regarding the SAR dogs: A Bloodhound (attached to Troop F) searched on Wednesday, February 11, in the AM and tracked her scent 100 yards down the road. On Thursday, February 12, a Belgian Malinois and handler searched the wooded areas leading away from the crash site. No scent was found. I'm no expert, by far, but I've seen a couple documentaries where Bloodhounds followed the scent even when a person had been in the trunk of a moving vehicle days prior to the search.
Are you suggesting she got into a vehicle, because of the results of the bloodhound search?
I think it is very possible Maura got into a car (doesn't mean something sinister happened)
But It is also possible that the search dogs just lost her scent.
Had any search with dogs been done that night or even that next day, I bet we have much better results to work with.
The private investigator John Healy (Forgive if i am spelling last name wrong) has said that the dogs were limited in how far they could track Maura's scent. So them stopping where they did was not a big revelation.
All they know for certain was that the dog picked up a scent and went east and stopped right at the T-intersection of where Rt. 112 and Bradley Hill Rd. Meet up. (Opposite of the Bradley Hill Rd. turnoff which one would turn right onto from Rt. 112) is the school bus driver's long driveway.
For a good scent track, maybe it depends on the weather? Cold vs. warm? Maybe, it depends on whether the person was bloody and sweating in a trunk vs. a person trotting down the road covered in winter clothing and not perspiring yet?
The flashlight question bugs me too. It makes a big difference. If she ran down one of those cold, dark, quiet roads without one, I can see her getting real spooked. In fact, she could have had an accident too. A car could have approached and maybe she didn't want to be seen, so she jumped over a snowbank assuming she was going to land on a level surface, but ends up falling down an embankment--- hurting herself in the process.
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The bloodhound search, no footprints about and the results of the air search. I think Strelzin and police believe that she didn't walk away from the crash site directly and then perish in the woods. Last week's news:
http://www.wmur.com/r/30403992/detail.html
OldSteve
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To me having a flashlight would be a real game changer! When the wife and I ran at night we both carried one, and whenever a car would approach we turned them off so as not to call attention to ourselves - we ran through not the best of areas (a bit foolish thinking about it now)...
I imagine MM could have done the same....
But key point to me is if anyone who knew her knew if she was a night runner.. if so, with her running ability she could have gone 5, 10+ miles.
What better way to escape one's problems than make a run for it!
Absolutely heartbreaking. I hope Fred and his family find answers soon. I can't imagine how they feel.
It's really hard to tell what happened to her.
If she took off on foot from her car and stayed close to the road, footprints wouldn't be an issue. Road traffic would take care of those. keep in mind you had the school bus driver, police and firemen all driving around that night, and well could've disturbed footprints on the road while they were searching for the driver of the car.
She could've sought help at the nearest house:
there were two houses on her side of the road that she wrecked all just seconds away from her
(the further house would be the contractors trailer, the house right next to her wreck would be the likely first option. The occupants of this house may have not even noticed the wreck because they have trees blocking the road right outside their house. Not much if anything has ever been said about these occupants in relation to this case.
And they are not the same neighbors that called 911 about the wreck that was a couple that lived across the street from where maura's car ended up and they own the weathered barn antique store.
She could've hitched a ride with a person who just simply drove her up the road several miles and dropped her off innocently enough and never thought twice about it again, may not have even been a local just someone passing through being a good samaratin.
It is believed She took her backpack with her (although her school books remained in the car) and bottles of alcohol were missing from her car ... yet she left her clothes, valuables and very personal items behind. Could be something to that or could not be.
I think it is possible she could have approached a house, but, IMO, further down the road---not close to the accident. Since she ran off, I suspect she didn't want to be noticed by police. The occupants of a house nearby would know that she was in an accident. I figure, she could have ran down the road for a while, until she got overly spooked by the darkness and quiet. At this point, maybe she decided to approach a house. Although, at that point, maybe she realized a call to AAA would have been futile. I think she was thinking very fast at the time. It is hard to know what decisions she made, because they were probably made in desperation.
OldSteve
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When you mention her thinking very fast at the time, I wonder if instead she simply got lost (state of mind wise) in running and avoiding obstacles to the point of forgetting about the car, the crash..... letting it all be like a bad dream that's behind you now... keep running until the sun rises!
Sorry to always personalize this to my own running, but that was a nice thing about running and losing your thoughts about problems into the exhilaration of covering lots of ground....
Got to find an online calendar to see if there was a full moon out that night - that would make a big difference too if it was clear..
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There's been several Mr112Dirtbag videos posted as of late - I've not bothered checking them out, as I don't think they pertain to Maura's disappearance in any way.
I do think Mr112Dirtbag, whoever he is, is reveling in the attention he is receiving (yet another motivator for me to avoid watching).
I do think Mr112Dirtbag, whoever he is, is reveling in the attention he is receiving (yet another motivator for me to avoid watching).
I don't get that at all. What comments in the article lead you to believe that?
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Took your advice, Unscripted. Thanks for reminding me - I was slacking on it.
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Regarding Beagle - I don't know if everyone here, or anyone here, for that matter, reads @ Topix - but he had some realllllllly out there theories (such as Maura being kidnapped for the purpose of harvesting her eggs). As such, many people would just scroll past his posts -they were often filled with nonsense. Perhaps the videos are a way for him to hold the rapt attention of the Maura Murray audience - and, by default, everyone would be gleaning some portion, at least, of his theory on Maura.
Just my two cents.
This thread has been kinda quiet lately, I hope that's the calm before the storm (of information, leading to Maura.)
lease:
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His comments are on the video in the link I provided (see above).
All sizes | IMG_9838 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
Just posting this photo of the accident site for discussion once again.
This is the very spot (I estimated, but I can't be off by more than a foot or two) that maura wrecked at. Her car would've been facing the opposite direction but east-bound is what you see straight ahead.
Just some basic things to note.
Look at the mailbox that is just feet away and on the same side of the road where maura's car ended up. The house that belongs to this mailbox is actually closer to maura's car, although the house is pushed back further than the mailbox from the road thanks to the same tree-line that maura's car ended up near.
Although, you can't see it. Right past the mailbox is a corner lot that belonged to the contractor and included a house he was building as well as a trailer he was living in.
To the left side of the road, you can see where the school bus driver lived and that building you see was their two-car garage. the SBD's house is pushed back from the road a bit and on that night he parked his bus closer to his house instead of its normal spot which would be to the left-side of his driveway by the two-car garage.
It is clear to me that once he pulled his bus into his driveway that night to have his wife call 911 about maura (because of the tree-line you see at his residence) he would no longer be able to see maura at the wreck location because the trees would be blocking his view.
One last note. The search dogs began from where maura's car ended up and followed a trail east on Rt. 112 before coming to a screeching halt at the turn to Bradley Hill Rd.
Bradley Hill Rd. is just past the school bus driver's two car garage you see in the picture and both Rt. 112 and Bradley Hill Rd. run precisely parallel with the contractor's corner lot
Just posting this photo of the accident site for discussion once again.
This is the very spot (I estimated, but I can't be off by more than a foot or two) that maura wrecked at. Her car would've been facing the opposite direction but east-bound is what you see straight ahead.
Just some basic things to note.
Look at the mailbox that is just feet away and on the same side of the road where maura's car ended up. The house that belongs to this mailbox is actually closer to maura's car, although the house is pushed back further than the mailbox from the road thanks to the same tree-line that maura's car ended up near.
Although, you can't see it. Right past the mailbox is a corner lot that belonged to the contractor and included a house he was building as well as a trailer he was living in.
To the left side of the road, you can see where the school bus driver lived and that building you see was their two-car garage. the SBD's house is pushed back from the road a bit and on that night he parked his bus closer to his house instead of its normal spot which would be to the left-side of his driveway by the two-car garage.
It is clear to me that once he pulled his bus into his driveway that night to have his wife call 911 about maura (because of the tree-line you see at his residence) he would no longer be able to see maura at the wreck location because the trees would be blocking his view.
One last note. The search dogs began from where maura's car ended up and followed a trail east on Rt. 112 before coming to a screeching halt at the turn to Bradley Hill Rd.
Bradley Hill Rd. is just past the school bus driver's two car garage you see in the picture and both Rt. 112 and Bradley Hill Rd. run precisely parallel with the contractor's corner lot
All sizes | IMG_9823 | Flickr - Photo Sharing!
here is a second look, only this time I took this picture standing on Bradley Hill Rd. looking back towards the accident site.
The search dogs are believed to lost maura's scent right at the intersection of Rt. 112 and Bradley Hill Rd.
here is a second look, only this time I took this picture standing on Bradley Hill Rd. looking back towards the accident site.
The search dogs are believed to lost maura's scent right at the intersection of Rt. 112 and Bradley Hill Rd.
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