PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #4

[christine2448]

Lol...yeah. Like I say, I really wish it would turn up something, but am afraid it's unrelated to his disappearance.

Well, I was thinking maybe a PLANT now that all this stuff is going on...sometimes I just don't even think at all.

Thanks HB for smackin me in the face with that one :slap:

I just don't know where my head is sometimes! :crazy:

Glad you pointed it out, I agree....I don't think it's related to the disappearence, now that you so nicely reminded me he was retiring anyway...dang, I honestly didn't even piece the 2 together....LOL...that's why I am here sleuthing and not FBI or CIA or anything LMAO!

 

[Lili]

But it was an election year. A new DA would be elected.

In Pennsylvania our District Attorney is an elected official.

 

[christine2448]

But it was an election year. A new DA would be elected.

In Pennsylvania our District Attorney is an elected official.

Please, explain more what you mean?

I mean I understand, LOL, but, ok, spell it out, if elected then the book that was there is relevant, or not, or...#$%T, I'm tired! LOL. It's not computing. Give me some more honey LOL~

 

[izzyB]

But it was an election year. A new DA would be elected.

In Pennsylvania our District Attorney is an elected official.

lili: i had logged on to address this very issue. thank you for answering the first question i was going to ask. DA's are also elected in texas, and therefore if ray was planning to retire, he would most likely do so at the election cycle and just not run again, let someone else have a shot on the ballot. and that is my understanding of what was to happen in his case.

HOWEVER, if a DA left office when there was no election planned, there would be a procedure in place as to what would be done until or IF a special election could be held. i feel this situation is what the book was dealing with.

therefore, i still feel that the book could be a telling clue.

(a day or so before my mother died of a massive stroke, she put all kinds of things out on her dining room table: our dad's obituary, take out menus, family photos, etc....things that would not normally be on her table....but things she must have thought we would need if she were to die suddenly and everyone come into town in a state of shock, etc.....

all i am saying is that sometimes people will send subtle signals.)

 

[meliss]

Fox News Channel's "The Lineup" will feature another segment on the disappearance of former Centre County District Attorney Ray Gricar at 9 p.m. Saturday.

http://www.centredaily.com/mld/centredaily/14677347.htm

 

[luthersmama]

lili: i had logged on to address this very issue. thank you for answering the first question i was going to ask. DA's are also elected in texas, and therefore if ray was planning to retire, he would most likely do so at the election cycle and just not run again, let someone else have a shot on the ballot. and that is my understanding of what was to happen in his case.

HOWEVER, if a DA left office when there was no election planned, there would be a procedure in place as to what would be done until or IF a special election could be held. i feel this situation is what the book was dealing with.

therefore, i still feel that the book could be a telling clue.

(a day or so before my mother died of a massive stroke, she put all kinds of things out on her dining room table: our dad's obituary, take out menus, family photos, etc....things that would not normally be on her table....but things she must have thought we would need if she were to die suddenly and everyone come into town in a state of shock, etc.....

all i am saying is that sometimes people will send subtle signals.)

I pulled out the book in question and took a look at it a few days ago.

When the office is vacated to due death, disability etc., the Governor appoints someone to fill the office until the next election.

Nothing exciting popped out. The section is only one paragraph long.

 

[wondering22]

Is it possible that the Feds put him and his lady friend in a highly secretive Witness Protection Program?

And... if that IS possible, then there'd really be no way to ever find that out, right?

 

[izzyB]

Is it possible that the Feds put him and his lady friend in a highly secretive Witness Protection Program?

And... if that IS possible, then there'd really be no way to ever find that out, right?

while speculating about this case over the past year, this possibility has been mentioned several times by posters. of course there would be no way to ever know.

 

[wondering22]

while speculating about this case over the past year, this possibility has been mentioned several times by posters. of course there would be no way to ever know.

You'd think that every LEO in the entire nation, at all levels of law enforcement would be interested in this case, but when you examine the actual investigation, it seems very lax & lazidaisical.

 

[Louisa]

Sorry if this has been discussed elsewhere, but I haven't seen it on the threads.

The FBI Missing Persons Flyer for Ray--most of it is the usual stuff: height, weight, hair and eye color, etc.

Under "Remarks," there's this:

Ray Gricar may also use the names Ray Lange or Ray Gray.

What do you all make of these names? Are they stage names Ray used when involved in community theater productions? Nom de plumes he used while writing some short stories? Something else less innocent?

And with the exception of women who have taken their husbands' names, how many people can say they "may also use the names . . ."?

I'm just fixated on this tonight. If it's old news, I apologize! I'm local to the Gricar case and have followed it with great interest (renewed interest with Bosak getting involved and the "elite"/CIA group's involvement).

I'm also in the process of entirely rethinking my stand on the case--which is to say before I had basically resolved that he'd met with foul play connected to his work. Now I'm having all sorts of doubts, or at the very least, rethinking to do.

This is turning out to be almost as perplexing as the Ramsey case. For Ray's family and friends, I would so much like to see answers.

Would like to hear your thoughts about these names!


http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/kidnap/gricar_rf.htm

 

[izzyB]

Ray Gricar may also use the names Ray Lange or Ray Gray.

What do you all make of these names? Are they stage names Ray used when involved in community theater productions? Nom de plumes he used while writing some short stories? Something else less innocent?

And with the exception of women who have taken their husbands' names, how many people can say they "may also use the names . . ."?

I'm just fixated on this tonight. If it's old news, I apologize! I'm local to the Gricar case and have followed it with great interest (renewed interest with Bosak getting involved and the "elite"/CIA group's involvement).

I'm also in the process of entirely rethinking my stand on the case--which is to say before I had basically resolved that he'd met with foul play connected to his work. Now I'm having all sorts of doubts, or at the very least, rethinking to do.

This is turning out to be almost as perplexing as the Ramsey case. For Ray's family and friends, I would so much like to see answers.

Would like to hear your thoughts about these names!


http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/kidnap/gricar_rf.htm

hello louisa! this is the first i have heard of ray possibly using another name! but i have only followed the case here and while i try to read links to articles posted by the faithful in this case like lili and christine, i must confess that sometimes i am unable to. also missed the Dateline show due to a family "emergency", so others that read here may know about this.

i am like you, i have been all over the map on this case, but recently, with the eye-witness accounts some of us are just now hearing about, and the fact that LE seems to have done a half-investigation, and the fact that no body has turned up, i am back to believing that ray has gone off and started a new life.

sometimes people just snap.

 

[christine2448]

Sorry if this has been discussed elsewhere, but I haven't seen it on the threads.

The FBI Missing Persons Flyer for Ray--most of it is the usual stuff: height, weight, hair and eye color, etc.

Under "Remarks," there's this:

Ray Gricar may also use the names Ray Lange or Ray Gray.

What do you all make of these names? Are they stage names Ray used when involved in community theater productions? Nom de plumes he used while writing some short stories? Something else less innocent?

And with the exception of women who have taken their husbands' names, how many people can say they "may also use the names . . ."?

I'm just fixated on this tonight. If it's old news, I apologize! I'm local to the Gricar case and have followed it with great interest (renewed interest with Bosak getting involved and the "elite"/CIA group's involvement).

I'm also in the process of entirely rethinking my stand on the case--which is to say before I had basically resolved that he'd met with foul play connected to his work. Now I'm having all sorts of doubts, or at the very least, rethinking to do.

This is turning out to be almost as perplexing as the Ramsey case. For Ray's family and friends, I would so much like to see answers.

Would like to hear your thoughts about these names!


http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/kidnap/gricar_rf.htm

Thanks for the post, and obviously we all missed that, great observation.

Could mean something, could be nothin'....I wonder if he did some kinda undercover for something??? Drug cases....wouldn't that be odd for DA to do undercover? I'm not sure bout this, anyone?

I have never looked at this poster! I wonder...I just emailed mom and sis w/link to poster, to get their thoughts...odd indeed...why the 2 aliases?

 

[Louisa]

hello louisa! this is the first i have heard of ray possibly using another name! but i have only followed the case here and while i try to read links to articles posted by the faithful in this case like lili and christine, i must confess that sometimes i am unable to. also missed the Dateline show due to a family "emergency", so others that read here may know about this.

i am like you, i have been all over the map on this case, but recently, with the eye-witness accounts some of us are just now hearing about, and the fact that LE seems to have done a half-investigation, and the fact that no body has turned up, i am back to believing that ray has gone off and started a new life.

sometimes people just snap.

Hi Izzy,
Thanks for the feedback! I'm glad I wasn't bringing old news! BTW, you didn't miss anything, really. We were away for the day and hustled to be home by 8 p.m., then were sort of disappointed it was such a brief segment with so little information in it.

Like you, I am also, for a variety of reasons, back to giving more weight to the theory that he may have gone off and started a new life. With some of the new things we've learned lately, it's impossible any more to just accept the "lured to Lewisburg/death by foul play" theory, isn't it?

Have a good day!

 

[Louisa]

Thanks for the post, and obviously we all missed that, great observation.

Could mean something, could be nothin'....I wonder if he did some kinda undercover for something??? Drug cases....wouldn't that be odd for DA to do undercover? I'm not sure bout this, anyone?

I have never looked at this poster! I wonder...I just emailed mom and sis w/link to poster, to get their thoughts...odd indeed...why the 2 aliases?

Hi Christine,

Thanks also for your reply. I'm so glad to see others interested in this case. Your idea about the undercover names is a great one--hadn't thought about that. Wondering though whether Ray's position ever had him doing actual investigative level work like that as opposed to say, a friend of ours who actually worked undercover as a DEA agent. Perhaps informally? It's a good explanation connected to his work. It would also explain how the FBI knows about this, too, perhaps. Would love to know more about those names. It's one of those "little things" that's gonna BUG me, I can tell . . .

Hope your mom and sis have some ideas, too!

 

[wondering22]

Under "Remarks," there's this:

Ray Gricar may also use the names Ray Lange or Ray Gray.

What do you all make of these names? Are they stage names Ray used when involved in community theater productions? Nom de plumes he used while writing some short stories? Something else less innocent?

And with the exception of women who have taken their husbands' names, how many people can say they "may also use the names . . ."?

http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/kidnap/gricar_rf.htm

omigawd...

 

[Gozgals]

Thanks for the post, and obviously we all missed that, great observation.

Could mean something, could be nothin'....I wonder if he did some kinda undercover for something??? Drug cases....wouldn't that be odd for DA to do undercover? I'm not sure bout this, anyone?

I have never looked at this poster! I wonder...I just emailed mom and sis w/link to poster, to get their thoughts...odd indeed...why the 2 aliases?

First off, thanks for keeping Ray alive Christine and all of you here. Not a day goes by that he and his family are not in my thoughts, and this case.

I too never noticed the names on the poster. Great observation! Maybe it was part of his job to use the names, I'm not sure either. I'm skeptical about the undercover/ CIA connections though.

I'm starting to go back to one of my theories that maybe Ray is in a Witness Protection Program. This case gets stranger and stranger as it goes on. Originally, I was sure he met with foul play-- (J. Luna) example-- as a case I relate Ray's case too, the drug cases worked on.

My hopes are we can find the answers soon and the media coverage gives us more than the pittance they have as of late.

Good day all,
Goz

 

[Louisa]

Hello again! It's not much, but I was able to find that Pete Bosak actually responded to a question about the names on the FBI flyer on 5/11 in the CDT Q&A section. Here's the relevant part of his response:

Ray Gricar's aliases are listed on his FBI missing persons file as Ray Lange and Ray Gray. The maiden name of Gricar's first wife is Gray. The maiden name of his second wife, is Lange. The lead investigator tells me that, what he believes happened, is that over the years, Gricar's first name was somehow linked to his wives' maiden names in credit reports, etc. Bellefonte Police Officer Darrel Zaccagni, the lead investigator on the case, tells me he has not found any instances of Ray actually using an alias.

http://www.centredaily.com/mld/centredaily/news/special_packages/ray_gricar/qa_forum.html?forumId=1882&mode=display&action=&type=list&pageNo=8

I'm not terribly satisfied with the explanation he's been given by the lead investigator, because if Det. Z has found no instances of Ray actually using an alias, and it was just a paperwork mess up, then why would the FBI flyer just casually state that he "might" be using either of those names? It seems like a sloppy thing for the FBI to do, but them maybe I'm just letting this case drive me nuts when I think about it too much!

 

[christine2448]

Hello again! It's not much, but I was able to find that Pete Bosak actually responded to a question about the names on the FBI flyer on 5/11 in the CDT Q&A section. Here's the relevant part of his response:


http://www.centredaily.com/mld/centredaily/news/special_packages/ray_gricar/qa_forum.html?forumId=1882&mode=display&action=&type=list&pageNo=8

I'm not terribly satisfied with the explanation he's been given by the lead investigator, because if Det. Z has found no instances of Ray actually using an alias, and it was just a paperwork mess up, then why would the FBI flyer just casually state that he "might" be using either of those names? It seems like a sloppy thing for the FBI to do, but them maybe I'm just letting this case drive me nuts when I think about it too much!

Good sleuthin there Louisa, thanks for the info, very interesting!

 

[izzyB]

Hello again! It's not much, but I was able to find that Pete Bosak actually responded to a question about the names on the FBI flyer on 5/11 in the CDT Q&A section. Here's the relevant part of his response:


http://www.centredaily.com/mld/centredaily/news/special_packages/ray_gricar/qa_forum.html?forumId=1882&mode=display&action=&type=list&pageNo=8

I'm not terribly satisfied with the explanation he's been given by the lead investigator, because if Det. Z has found no instances of Ray actually using an alias, and it was just a paperwork mess up, then why would the FBI flyer just casually state that he "might" be using either of those names? It seems like a sloppy thing for the FBI to do, but them maybe I'm just letting this case drive me nuts when I think about it too much!

thanks for this report louisa and i agree with you....poor poor explanation. mr. izzyB and i have applied for about 10 house, car, business loans over the lifetime of our 30 year marriage and yet if he went missing today i can promise you that no one would be looking for him under my maiden name. :snooty: ...or his mother's maiden name, or my mother's, etc.

IMHO only, this is a lame excuse for more going on behind the scenes than LE is willing to divulge to the public....could we once again use the phrase cover-up?

 

[Hbgchick]

Agreed IzzyB! I can't think of any reason my husband would use my maiden name, or even be "linked" to it. What do you think Louisa21?