PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #9

[WDW]

RFG actually had another victim in 1998, that the AG didn't have.

How is that? Many have speculated that the only reason RFG did not proceed was because he *didn't* have another victim.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

How is that? Many have speculated that the only reason RFG did not proceed was because he *didn't* have another victim.

According to the Grand Jury report, there was another victim, designated B. K. He was not able to testify before the GJ, because he's active duty military and out of the country.

Those "speculating" are only attempting to spin the story; they tend to be friends of RFG or Amendola.

I mean you have "Victim 6," the mother, and two cops to Sandusky's admission, all of which are admissible. His comments in front of Lauro might not be. You have B. K. who also says the same activity took place.

The judge has already ruled that there was enough evidence on the "Victim 6" incident to try Sandusky on it (conviction is another matter), even though the AG actually has less evidence.

You also have a situation where RFG could have called a grand jury to investigate, and didn't; I should say, petition the court to form one. I have, however, never heard of him calling grand juries, so it is not necessarily out of character.

The more that has come out about 1998, the more uneasy I feel about RFG's role in it.

 

[SyraKelly]

Hey everyone-Have not been to this forum in awhile--but I am curious J.J -how do you feel about that file AG's got Monday night..do you think there is something in it about why RG did not charge Sandusky in 98 & could it have something to do with his disappearance?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Hey everyone-Have not been to this forum in awhile--but I am curious J.J -how do you feel about that file AG's got Monday night..do you think there is something in it about why RG did not charge Sandusky in 98 & could it have something to do with his disappearance?

Obviously, RFG had enough evidence to prosecute. The detective said so, the AG charged with less evidence, and the judge refused to dismiss the charges in regard to 1998.

We also know that RFG removed JKA from the case. She was the "go to" person for child abuse cases in the office at that time. While RFG might have wanted to handle this high profile case personally, it makes no sense not to consult with her while he's doing it.

We also know that, after he made his decision, months (10/13/98) later, RFG had a meeting with the two officers, and Fran Gather (sp?), at the football building. The officers were not with the same department.

We don't know why he did not prosecute. He could have just had a colossal collapse of judgment, thinking that there was not enough evidence; a bright guy making a stupid mistake, but an innocent mistake. That happens.

It could be something beyond an innocent mistake. I am fearful that there is evidence in that it wasn't quite so innocent might be in that file.

Amendola has made the argument that Gricar would have prosecuted the case if it was legitimate. That opens up Gricar's motivation in the Sandusky case. The AG might have evidence of that motivation, and it might not be Amendola's view.

Tied to the disappearance, maybe.

 

[SyraKelly]

Thanks J.J-I appreciate you answering my question?

 

[shefner]

Obviously, RFG had enough evidence to prosecute. The detective said so, the AG charged with less evidence, and the judge refused to dismiss the charges in 1998.

We also know that RFG removed JKA from the case. She was the "go to" person for child abuse cases in the office at that time. While RFG might have wanted to handle this high profile case personally, it makes no sense not to consult with her while he's doing it.

We also know that, after he made his decision, months (10/13/98) later, RFG had a meeting with the two officers, and Fran Gather (sp?), at the football building. The officers were not with the same department.

We don't know why he did not prosecute. He could have just had a colossal collapse of judgment, thinking that there was not enough evidence; a bright guy making a stupid mistake, but an innocent mistake. That happens.

It could be something beyond an innocent mistake. I am fearful that there is evidence in that it wasn't quite so innocent might be in that file.

Amendola has made the argument that Gricar would have prosecuted the case if it was legitimate. That opens up Gricar's motivation in the Sandusky case. The AG might have evidence of that motivation, and it might not be Amendola's view.

Tied to the disappearance, maybe.

Insightful response, as always.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Hopefully, Schultz sent an e-mail that said, "Gricar is a moron, we don't have to worry about him. He's such a fool he can't figure anything out."

It sounds terrible, but it would completely separate RFG from any improper involvement.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Ed Rendell just weighed in and said that Gricar should have prosecuted:

“Second guessing is always easy but i would’ve tried that case,” Rendell explained. “Even if you lost it just the mere fact you arrested Sandusky and brought him to trial might have had an affect on some of the other cases that might not have been heard. If he had been convicted he would’ve gone to jail for a year or two.”

http://www.whptv.com/news/local/sto...ays-he-would-have/XyDk0-3EH0WTzubLU6fX7g.cspx

Same things I've been saying, for a while.

Rendell, other than being a former Governor, and former Mayor, was also the DA of Philadelphia for 8 years. His office probably handled more criminal cases in that time that Centre County has seen since 1900.

 

[HMSHood]

I looked into Ray Gricar and he busted a large heroin ring before he disappeared.

Another drug prosecutor vanishes on a Pennsylvania car ride
http://www.yardbird.com/midnight_ride_another_missing_PA_prosecutor_1.htm

It is probable that someone killed him in retaliation against the drug bust.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I looked into Ray Gricar and he busted a large heroin ring before he disappeared.

Another drug prosecutor vanishes on a Pennsylvania car ride
http://www.yardbird.com/midnight_ride_another_missing_PA_prosecutor_1.htm

It is probable that someone killed him in retaliation against the drug bust.

Not too probable. Neither RFG nor his office was prosecuting the case. It was handled by the AG's Office, by then AAG Michael Madeira.

You should take a look at the first page of this thread to look at the credibility of that site.

 

[HMSHood]

Not too probable. Neither RFG nor his office was prosecuting the case. It was handled by the AG's Office, by then AAG Michael Madeira.

You should take a look at the first page of this thread to look at the credibility of that site.

I didn't look at the first page of this thread. :blushing:

Sadly, we'll never know what happened to Ray Gricar. His remains have never been found. If there are skeletal remains they could probably be long gone. I can't imagine what his family is going through. He had a brother, Roy Gricar, who committed suicide in 1996.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I didn't look at the first page of this thread. :blushing:

Sadly, we'll never know what happened to Ray Gricar. His remains have never been found. If there are skeletal remains they could probably be long gone. I can't imagine what his family is going through. He had a brother, Roy Gricar, who committed suicide in 1996.

Don't assume that he died in 2005. That is not in evidence.

The searches, including a cadaver dog, did not yield anything, and they were possibly the most extensive searches of that stretch of the river ever.

 

[shefner]

J.J., after reading about current testimony of Sandusky's alleged (must I say that?) victims, I was wondering what you thought might have been Gricar's reasons for not pursuing charges?

 

[HMSHood]

Don't assume that he died in 2005. That is not in evidence.

The searches, including a cadaver dog, did not yield anything, and they were possibly the most extensive searches of that stretch of the river ever.

Than from what you say, he is most likely alive. Perhaps Ray Gricar must be living off the grid. Now why would he do that?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

J.J., after reading about current testimony of Sandusky's alleged (must I say that?) victims, I was wondering what you thought might have been Gricar's reasons for not pursuing charges?

I don't know.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Than from what you say, he is most likely alive. Perhaps Ray Gricar must be living off the grid. Now why would he do that?

He had family in Slovenia, where he had visited. The only announced post 4/16 "credible sighting," had him in Southfield, MI. http://www.centredaily.com/2011/02/14/2518751/southfield-sighting.html

It is a possibility, but only that.

 

[shefner]

I don't know.

LOL....this was not the answer I was anticipating!

 

[J. J. in Phila]

LOL....this was not the answer I was anticipating!

I hate speculating why a thought went through RFG's head, without evidence.

It could have been colossally bad judgment.

 

[WDW]

He had family in Slovenia, where he had visited.

Family are the people you grow up with. He didn't really know them did he? He didn't communicate with them regularly and they didn't come here to visit.

 

[BigCat]

We also know that, after he made his decision, months (10/13/98) later, RFG had a meeting with the two officers, and Fran Gather (sp?), at the football building. The officers were not with the same department...

Fran Ganter? Whoa. When did we learn this? I must have miss it. Ganter was Penn State's offensive coordinator in 98. Why would the DA meet with an assistant coach of the football team?