Peru - Stephany Flores, 21, murdered in Lima hotel room, 30 May 2010 #11

[LadyL]

Not sure what happened to my last post, so I'll try again.

I've seen the video, and if anything I believe it tends to exculpate Joran, at least as far as killing Stephany before he left the room with the coffee cups.

Getting the hotel employee to open the door is a gigantic risk to take. The room was tiny- she opened the door all the way. I think she would have noticed a body on the floor. I admit I don't know what he was doing in the hall, but while it looked kind of strange, I don't think it looked like the actions of someone who'd just committed murder. If he did indeed already kill her, then I don't think it made any sense to get the hotel worker to open the door for him.

Why, by the way, had we never heard about someone having to open the door to his room that morning? I would think the employee would have come forward after that room became notorious. But, I realize those who think Joran is guilty will interpret this video as providing support for their belief, much as the annoying naysayers like myself will interpret it as supporting the view that Joran is innocent.

well, he's kinda proven himself to be a huge risk-taker

there was discussion at the end of the last thread about looking for a link about the hotel employee having to open the door

we did hear about it early on but no one has the link handy

what do the actions of someone who recently committed murder look like to you? you know, for comparison purposes ... :waitasec:

 

[impatientredhead]

If we knew WHy she went with him to his room in the first place that
might put things in perspective. Did she go for sex, a chat, coffee and
danish, because Joran asked her to come see something (spun her a
lie to get her to his room?) ... if he's planning on robbing her how does he
plan to rob her in his own room and get away? He doesnt know who she is
or did he know who she was ? What did they discuss at the poker table?
Its these details that will add perspective on motive and means -

I am now thinking that they casually knew each over for the couple of days that has been reported. I don't think they meet in that video, she seeks him out, after dropping off her friends.

The difference in her demeanor walking in the casino versus hotel PLUS her laying with her head on arm in the casino make me think he drugged her at the casino. Don't we see her reach for the drink in front of him in part of the video.

I think she goes to his room to lay down, I bet she felt sick and groggy, wasn't sure how to get home, her and Dad fought that day, not when you want to call for help, and the date rape drugs make it impossible to think straight.

They go in the room, she is out of it and sick/groggy. He helps her lay down and this is where she takes her own pants off, leaving the panties on, probably at his instruction/suggestion since he wants to look for her cash.

She realizes at some point he is going through her pockets/purse, she tries to stop him, probably from behind since we keep hearing he elbows her in the face, now she is injured, he is a rage, grabs the tennis racket and we know the rest of that scenario.

Now we get the shower, clothes change, coffee/lock out scene, but he sees the camera and bails on the idea of having the clerk find her body with him and hightails it as fast as he can get going.

I bet her tox screen is alcohol and ghb/roofie.

 

[mister happy]

I really think his plan was to pretend she was alive went he went to the store but dead went he came back. Once he saw the camera he knew that wouldn't work but because he didn't have much time to think it out he just went along with the ruse anything.

Good analysis. I agree. Who really knows at this point, though?

 

[Unreals]

Well, admittedly I've never murdered anyone. I also haven't known anybody who murdered anyone. Perhaps I'm not any more of an expert than anyone else here.

However, I do think that, if I was crazy and/or evil enough to kill somebody in my hotel room, I wouldn't purposefully go and get a hotel worker to open up the door for me. Especially when the room is so small, and everything almost certainly could be seen from the doorway.

But, as I noted, I interpret it with the bias that Joran was framed.

 

[trigger]

Goodnight everyone...:bedtime:

See you all in the morning....:seeya:


(now no knock knock jokes)



:behindbar

 

[LadyL]

Those stills confuse me along with the casino videos we saw earlier in the day.

In that one still where she is resting her head...why if she is so tired doesn't she just go home instead of waiting for Jordan...if only she had of!

And then the casino videos...I expected to see her sitting at a table with a ton of chips and Joran coming up and hitting on her but instead it seems she seems to seeks him out as a friend. Their interaction just seems so normal not anything like him planning to rob her. He may have robbed her after the fact but it doesn't look like from what I have seen so far that it was the plan in the beginning.

I guess the more video that gets released the clearer the picture will become.

And by the way...the video they use in Peru amazes me. Most of the video I see on the news here of local crimes have this grainy black and white film that you couldn't recogize anyone from. If more establishments would use better cameras here maybe some of the crimes here could be solved!

[bbm]

I was wondering the same thing. Perhaps she just didn't want to go home (argument with father); perhaps she was waiting to win her big payout from the game (idk anything about poker); perhaps she was drugged (although I haven't seen her with a drink in her hand) - all these questions and if only ... )-;

 

[Benny08]

So basically what happened was.. he beat her to death and had no way to remove her body outside once he knew cameras were there. He thought and sipped coffee and thought again about what to do. He started to formulate the "I left and came back" plan and knew he was fvcked on that. And he ran. That's it.

I def don't think he planned to kill her THEN though.

 

[Lexington]

Instead of fudging around with coffee, biscuits, keys etc., he would have been better off cleaning up the room, making the bed, going on the internet and finding the nearest luggage store. He could have purchased the largest suitcase on wheels he could find and put Stephany's body in there (just supposing, I don't know if they come that big). He could then have used her car to dispose of her body, leaving it a distance from the casino and the hotel. He could explain away the suitcase by saying that he bought it or was holding it for a friend who was in town. The hotel video would not have come to light except for the fact that her body was found in his room. If the casino video was discovered, Joran could have explained it away by saying she drove him home and was headed home herself. I doubt that the desk clerks are alert 24/7 or they pay that much attention to who is coming and going. As long as he paid his room rent, returned to the casinos and kept his usual routine, left Lima in a reasonable amount of time so as not to cause suspicion, he might have been able to get away with it.

 

[LadyL]

did someone say something about her putting her truck up for collateral b/c of a gambling debt? (I read it but can't find the post right now in my half-asleep state of delirium)

just wondering if we can get a link for that ... b/c it has me thinking that's another reason she might still be at the poker table even though she can't hold her head up ... addiction ... she doesn't want to walk away until she wins a certain amount to cover some losses

also speculating that she may have had disputes with her dad over a gambling addiction - maybe she already lost earlier in the night when she was with her friends and now she needs to make that money back - COMPLETE SPECULATION ON MY PART

and now I need to go to bed b/c this is becoming MY addiction

 

[Dr. Know?]

This is just a wild one. Maybe he did go to the store 2x. First coffee was spilled due to Stephanies demise (Mark F), the he reinacts going to get the coffee when he noticed the camera, not very well thought out. He takes the two cups that were knocked over in a fight/stuggle, like free refills at Circle K, but reinacts the leaving over again?

It appears he shut the very same door he was knocking on. That was fake, unless someone has a better reason. TIA

 

[newone]

did someone say something about her putting her truck up for collateral b/c of a gambling debt? (I read it but can't find the post right now in my half-asleep state of delirium)

just wondering if we can get a link for that ... b/c it has me thinking that's another reason she might still be at the poker table even though she can't hold her head up ... addiction ... she doesn't want to walk away until she wins a certain amount to cover some losses

also speculating that she may have had disputes with her dad over a gambling addiction - maybe she already lost earlier in the night when she was with her friends and now she needs to make that money back - COMPLETE SPECULATION ON MY PART

and now I need to go to bed b/c this is becoming MY addiction

http://www.caretas.com.pe/Main.asp?T...To=0&idA=46851

This is a link to the story I referred to earlier -- her father is quoted as saying she had to ''hock'' her truck etc. I think that she and JVS had a lot ''in common'' in terms of their love of poker and being a bit 'spoiled' so they had a lot to chat about

 

[Dr. Know?]

This is just a wild one. Maybe he did go to the store 2x. First coffee was spilled due to Stephanies demise (Mark F), then he reeinacts going to get the coffee when he noticed the camera, not very well thought out. He takes the two cups that were knocked over in a fight/stuggle, the gas station/small store and because he gets free refills? oh my, but reeinacts the leaving over again? That would be stupid.

It appears he shut the very same door he was knocking on. Would like to see an uncut version, yeah....

 

[Melanie]

Can't keep my eyes open. Thanks for a very interesting evening. Night everyone! Or should I say good morning

 

[Kat]

Hi everyone. I'm so sorry to be such a pain but where I am staying right now I can't access streaming media. It's just not possible (although I should have internet turned on in my new home on June 18th and will be able to go back and access videos then) could someone give me a synopsis of what happens in the coffee vid? I would be so thankful! I could just cry with frustration right now!

 

[seagull65]

Not sure what happened to my last post, so I'll try again.

I've seen the video, and if anything I believe it tends to exculpate Joran, at least as far as killing Stephany before he left the room with the coffee cups.

Getting the hotel employee to open the door is a gigantic risk to take. The room was tiny- she opened the door all the way. I think she would have noticed a body on the floor. I admit I don't know what he was doing in the hall, but while it looked kind of strange, I don't think it looked like the actions of someone who'd just committed murder. If he did indeed already kill her, then I don't think it made any sense to get the hotel worker to open the door for him.

Why, by the way, had we never heard about someone having to open the door to his room that morning? I would think the employee would have come forward after that room became notorious. But, I realize those who think Joran is guilty will interpret this video as providing support for their belief, much as the annoying naysayers like myself will interpret it as supporting the view that Joran is innocent.

that's true.

His actions in the hall really were strange. It seems like if he'd killed someone, he wouldn't come out until he was sure what he was going to do. The way he stood there, fiddling with the door for some time, turning this way and that, not closing the door completely for some time, standing there with it not completely closed. Not in any hurry..... gesturing as if to knock but not actually knocking.... He looked kind of confused and dazed. I guess he was still on amphetamines if the "confession" we've heard about is true, I guess that could be the explanation. I'm still puzzled about the waiting at the door and looking like maybe he was knocking.

that's a good point about it being a big risk to hang around and actually ask someone to come open the door, etc. Most people would just flee, surely. Of course maybe he was hoping the clerk would discover the body and this would establish his alibi as far as just returning to the room then and not having a key, etc. But he'd already noticed the camera just before, he knew there was a record of him when he came out, so I'm surprised he went through with this plan of bothering to ask the clerk to come unlock the door. Why bother? Why not just flee.

Well it is weird and chilling and I'm not totally sure what I think about it yet either.

 

[newone]

another link about ''their'' gambling.....according to this link (new) - police say that JVS had bankrolled Stephany days earlier.....


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,594382,00.html

 

[seagull65]

what was it in the one article that was posted here, a guy who knew Stephany and who had been at tables with Stephany and Joran said there had been a rumor (rumor only as far as I know) that S and J were hatching a scam together, (but that he doesn't believe the rumor). Wonder if the rumor was that it was a plan to scam the casino together or something? Or to rip other people off....

 

[mister happy]

that's true.

His actions in the hall really were strange. It seems like if he'd killed someone, he wouldn't come out until he was sure what he was going to do. The way he stood there, fiddling with the door for some time, turning this way and that, not closing the door completely for some time, standing there with it not completely closed. Not in any hurry..... gesturing as if to knock but not actually knocking.... He looked kind of confused and dazed. I guess he was still on amphetamines if the "confession" we've heard about is true, I guess that could be the explanation. I'm still puzzled about the waiting at the door and looking like maybe he was knocking.

that's a good point about it being a big risk to hang around and actually ask someone to come open the door, etc. Most people would just flee, surely. Of course maybe he was hoping the clerk would discover the body and this would establish his alibi as far as just returning to the room then and not having a key, etc. But he'd already noticed the camera just before, he knew there was a record of him when he came out, so I'm surprised he went through with this plan of bothering to ask the clerk to come unlock the door. Why bother? Why not just flee.

Well it is weird and chilling and I'm not totally sure what I think about it yet either.

I think he just got flustered after noticing the camera, and was bumbling around.

 

[seagull65]

You know the handshake when she approached the table in the one video, then her sitting apart from him, then him gesturing to the chair next to him and she finally moves over. It does seem like they knew each other already. Had they supposedly known each other for 2 or 3 days by this time?

I would think she would have probably looked his name up on the internet after meeting him or getting to know him, if he was using his real name. I'm surprised if she didn't know who he was at some point, but surely if she did she wouldn't have followed him into the room

 

[newone]

what was it in the one article that was posted here, a guy who knew Stephany and who had been at tables with Stephany and Joran said there had been a rumor (rumor only as far as I know) that S and J were hatching a scam together, (but that he doesn't believe the rumor). Wonder if the rumor was that it was a plan to scam the casino together or something? Or to rip other people off....

-- I don't know about that one -- I haven't stumbled upon it but will keep eyes open....hey it's 4 a.m. in Peru right now -- getting closer to that 8 a.m. deadline.....:dance: