Stain in Trunk May Show Outline of Child**REVISIT FOR READING*

[AZlawyer]

Apologies in advance for the drive-by posting...esp. if already covered ad nauseum...

Thought I recalled one of the statements made by LE to the media early on in the case that the stain in the trunk responded to black light exposure (luminol test).

However, IF I understood correctly that the stain was stated recently NOT to be the result of decomp fluid/blood (not sure if I understood that...or perhaps misread it, etc. :bang

So...curious 'bout how these two things could coexist I searched and found this article (link), which includes the following comment:

"Typically, luminol only shows investigators that there might be blood in an area, since other substances, including household bleach, can also cause the luminol to glow"

BJB, pp. 50-55 of this doc explains that the FBI did not find any BLOOD on or obtain any DNA typing results for any of the spare tire cover/trunk liner samples. I believe it is a big overstatement for ClickOrlando to say that the FBI determined that the stain did not contain any "bodily fluids." You can't always get DNA results from an item that contains DNA (especially if it gets "cleaned" first....).

http://www.clickorlando.com/download...9/21146801.pdf

 

[Jaylergirl]

Could somebody here do a still picture and lightly highlight the outline of a child they think is in the trunk please?
My eyesight is not good..need help seeing that thanks!:angel:

My eyesight is excellent and I can't see the image! :waitasec: So yes, it would be wonderful if someone who does see it, could outlined it!

 

[irishbosoxfan]

momtective, can you please share the source and date of these pictures? Are they the ones that are supposed to show the stain/outline/impression? TIA

Is this the pic that was posted earlier in this thread? I think we need to stop posting those--I am 99.9% certain that this was some member's Sunfire (or a friend of a member) and she took pictures and posted them here so we could stop speculating about the size of the trunk, etc.

So far, the only photo of the ACTUAL trunk that I know of is the terrible black & white one in the report that was released today.

THE PHOTOS POSTED EARLIER IN THIS THREAD ARE NOT PHOTOS OF CASEY'S TRUNK

I believe the pictures posted earlier in the thread were taken by a poster named Murt. If I remember correctly Murt owned a used car lot and got a Sunfire in that matched Casey's so he went out and photographed it.

I also remember a female poster who owned one and photographed it for us posters here at WS. I think both sets of photos were in the same thread.

 

[Kentjbkent]

So didn't we learn that CA or GA attempted to clean the car as soon as they got it home, and at one point, it was speculated by some that the positive test for chloroform could have been related to some kind of cleaning agent used in the trunk?

If that is the case, could a cleaning agent on this particular stain have altered testing for presence of decomp or human fluid, but not enough to completely lift the stain from existence?

 

[Balthazar]

Apologies in advance for the drive-by posting...esp. if already covered ad nauseum...

Thought I recalled one of the statements made by LE to the media early on in the case that the stain in the trunk responded to black light exposure (luminol test).

However, IF I understood correctly that the stain was stated recently NOT to be the result of decomp fluid/blood (not sure if I understood that...or perhaps misread it, etc. :bang

So...curious 'bout how these two things could coexist I searched and found this article (link), which includes the following comment:

"Typically, luminol only shows investigators that there might be blood in an area, since other substances, including household bleach, can also cause the luminol to glow"

The trunk liner doesn't look faded out like what I would expect if you applied liquid bleach to it. I would have expected to see a whole lot of discoloration from regular liquid bleach - even if it was diluted with water. For example, I recently splashed some Navy blue shorts with diluted bleach and got white spots on the shorts. So why wouldn't the liner have that discoloration? Could it be that they used bleach for colors? Would that have the same effect with luminol?

 

[MissJames]

we used vick's, under and in our nostrils.

Didn't help, all that much.

ouch !

 

[ZsaZsa]

THE PHOTOS POSTED EARLIER IN THIS THREAD ARE NOT PHOTOS OF CASEY'S TRUNK

I believe the pictures posted earlier in the thread were taken by a poster named Murt. If I remember correctly Murt owned a used car lot and got a Sunfire in that matched Casey's so he went out and photographed it.

I also remember a female poster who owned one and photographed it for us posters here at WS. I think both sets of photos were in the same thread.

I hope the photos they have show it in detail. A photograph displayed at trial would be a very compelling item.
One of the prosecutors on the Nancy Grace Panel said that she would prominently display two photos of Caylee in court,one of her being her usual cute little self and alongside it a photo of the remains, as found in a swamp. Very impressive, and it would have a huge impact on Jurors.

 

[butwhatif?]

Remember when they released some of the dump site pics and we all saw things that were not there?
This stain looking like a child in a fetal position reminds me of that.

JMO

 

[MissJames]

Remember when they released some of the dump site pics and we all saw things that were not there?
This stain looking like a child in a fetal position reminds me of that.

JMO

I remember the thread,but how was it determined that those things were not there? The book,stuffed animals,etc?
I also believe investigators seeing an outline in a piece of evidence is a bit different than posters looking at pics of the crime scene.This was an official murder investigation.

 

[noonie]

I typed in asking for pic on my search web page and they have a very good detailed one at the .com!

 

[AZlawyer]

I typed in asking for pic on my search web page and they have a very good detailed one at the .com!

I hope we see a better one than that at some point. I looked at all their different "enhancements," including the one with outlining to show the body, and I just don't see it....

 

[noonie]

None of the others looked any better!

 

[jcamille]

My thoughts when I read the report on the stain - which by the way - I could make out clearly....was that perhaps it was the residue or the stain left by swimming pool chemicals.

If Caylee was soaking wet - i.e. she was drowned in the pool - and then put in the trunk, it is reasonable that the body outline could have been left by chlorine residue or whatever chemicals the As use in their pool.

 

[Jaylergirl]

I hope we see a better one than that at some point. I looked at all their different "enhancements," including the one with outlining to show the body, and I just don't see it....

All I see is a blob! :banghead:

 

[capps]

I hope we see a better one than that at some point. I looked at all their different "enhancements," including the one with outlining to show the body, and I just don't see it....

I immediately saw it. But,I don't think I would have noticed it,if I wasn't looking for it.IOW,because I was actively looking for a fetal position little body,I noticed it right away,if I wasn't specifically looking for that,I probably wouldn't have noticed it.

 

[countzero]

The trunk liner doesn't look faded out like what I would expect if you applied liquid bleach to it. I would have expected to see a whole lot of discoloration from regular liquid bleach - even if it was diluted with water. For example, I recently splashed some Navy blue shorts with diluted bleach and got white spots on the shorts. So why wouldn't the liner have that discoloration? Could it be that they used bleach for colors? Would that have the same effect with luminol?

Not if the A compound has bleach for colors. I use it all the time, even on whites, to avoid doing just what you did.

Costco, Sams Club, BJs all have their own brand of bleach for colors as does the original Clorox brand.

 

[christee]

The outline I saw was on the left side of the trunk, laying on it's left side. The knees looked drawn up, the arm only slightly bent at the elbow. When looking at the pic the "B" marker would be against her back, and the hand is below the black metal disc in the floor next to the "A" marker. The head was above the black metal disc.
In the NG pic the markers were not in the pic, so maybe there was more than 1 pic taken, or pic was altered?

I'm replying to my own quote because I saw another pic and after looking at it for awhile I can see a different outline than the 1st one. They were 2 different pics-1 had the A, B markers the 2nd one didn't- so now I'm not so sure!

 

[Truthwillsetufree]

I still believe Caylee was in the tire well at some point, that is why she was in the fetal position and GA and the Tow guy did not see her at the tow yard. GA drove the Pontiac home, CA went back to work. GA went through the car and found Caylee. KC had a flat at some time during this time frame and as irresponsible as she was I'm sure she didn't have it fixed, leaving the tire well empty. Caylee was decomposing and the fluids were wicking up to the spare tire cover. At some point someone retrieved Caylee out of the tirewell and layed her on the trunk floor and then placed her in the garbage and laundry bags both of which were available in the A's garage. Just my theory on the stain.

 

[OneLostGrl]

Yeah, you're wrong. Wrong in three separate ways because none of them are the same person.

FBI agent who saw stain in trunk - Karen Cowan at the Tampa FBI office, not the lab (page 47 of this pdf http://www.wftv.com/pdf/21147519/detail.html)

FBI agent who saw heart shape on tape - Fontaine at the FBI lab (page 134 of the same pdf)

FBI agent whose DNA was on tape - Lorie Gottesman, works in the QDU (Questions Document Unit)...again, not in the FBI lab (page 348 of same pdf).

haha gotta love that TRUTH thing!

 

[OneLostGrl]

I still believe Caylee was in the tire well at some point, that is why she was in the fetal position and GA and the Tow guy did not see her at the tow yard. GA drove the Pontiac home, CA went back to work. GA went through the car and found Caylee. KC had a flat at some time during this time frame and as irresponsible as she was I'm sure she didn't have it fixed, leaving the tire well empty. Caylee was decomposing and the fluids were wicking up to the spare tire cover. At some point someone retrieved Caylee out of the tirewell and layed her on the trunk floor and then placed her in the garbage and laundry bags both of which were available in the A's garage. Just my theory on the stain.

Yeah I keep thinking George found her too.