Trial Thread, May 1, 2012 Defense begins it case in chief

[Sailor Bug]

I didn't expect fire works from Derstine

it is a shame the defence didn't even give...a teeny tiny fire cracker

JUSTICE for lil Tori...is not far away...

jmo

 

[tmhco]

Personally, any points made on cross by Derenstine were negated when he produced no evidence to back them up. So what TLM listened to gangster rap? Millions do. She was violent, understood. Still NO REASONABLE explanation for abducting VS. JMO

 

[crazyladi]

I didn't expect fire works from Derstine

it is a shame the defence didn't even give...a teeny tiny fire cracker

JUSTICE for lil Tori...is not far away...

jmo

Maybe all the fireworks were let off from the Crown. I sure as heck said OMG a dozen times during all the testimony and evidence.

 

[lightlady]

I agree with others that now it is up to Mr Derstine to close and bring together reasonable doubt about intent. It all comes down to him convincing the jurors that MR had no intent to kidnap and did not rape VS. If he can seed doubt there, then they will not be able to convict with first degree.
I do not believe the testimony today will be enough for that. There are still the issues of the drive by of the school, the hard-to-believe view that for two hours VS went along and never protested, etc.
As to the rape, the forensic evidence, missing bottoms, etc. will have to be enough.
I will be surprised if he is not convicted.

 

[Sailor Bug]

i thought the defense would close last?

Mike Knoll: - if they call evidence, they forfeit the right to go last.


deliberations will start tuesday then?

Mike Knoll: - as soon as the judge's charge is complete deliberations will begin. It could take more than one day.


Will the closing statements be a part of this live feed as well

Mike Knoll: - yes

 

[Macright]

Thats what I think. His closing arguments have to do with all the weird questions he has asked witnesses and it will all come together. I dont think he is stupid at all just surprised really that there was one witness.

actually I am not surprised because if anyone had seen MR or TLM other than the witness's that have already been called by the crown I am sure we would have heard something about them previously...we knew about everything else give or take...I knew last week when the crown wrapped up that this would be a short week, defence wise..really who else could the defence call..there were no witness's to the actual crime and I don't think a bunch of people swearing to his character would mean a great deal considering the judge had already warned the jury that his character was not on trial here..I think Dirk did a great job in his cross ..he got lots of info that throws doubt on some of the crowns evidence that could make the jury go.."but"..... we shall see but I bet we will have a verdict next week this time... there is no doubt there will be a jail sentence thrown at MR but it remains to be seen for what charges...JMO

 

[Bravo]

The dance lessons should come in handy too. Especially the side step when Big Bubba is trying to make a run at ya. MOO

 

[JayFriend]

I guess the Judge must need time to write his charge, because the Shafia charge to the jury was over 200 pages.

That is the only thing I can think of, why a 2 day break would be allowed, after what I can only surmise as a non-existant effort for defense.

So the judge would write his charge before the summations by the defence and Crown? I suppose that makes sense because the summations aren't evidence, just sales pitches and interpretations of the evidence.

 

[crazyladi]

I just dont think there was any evidence to back MTR. Where is the evidence of a drug debt? If that is why TLM took TS then where is his evidence? Sorry just not buying it.

I am telling you his closing arguments are going to be TLM needed to kill someone as initiation in to the EOA gang and he was afraid to go to the police... JMO

 

[JayFriend]

The defense, or crown for that matter, cannot reveal new info in their closing statements without facts? In other words, we shouldn't be anticipating a bombshell from either side during closing?

That would be my take. The defence can't even make suggestions, like he did trying to lead TLM into agreeing with his hypotheses. But you legal eagles can correct me if I'm wrong. Can the defence put forward alternate theories of what might have happened that's not in evidence? Gang initiations, the whole 9 yards?

 

[Macright]

I am quite confident that he will be found guilty on all charges. Where he is going he will not need POF to find partners.

no but he may have to take up golf as he could be sent to that new prison in BC with all the perks....JMO

 

[Salem]

Steven D'Souza ‏ @cbcsteve
Defence closing arguments go on Friday. Crown's closing goes on Monday, judge charges the jury on Tuesday #Rafferty #sl

Canada is much like the Italian system - hurry and wait while we do whatever. In the US -- defense would close tomorrow, if there was time the State would follow, if not, then Thursday.

They just had 4 days off, including 2 working days. Both sides should have closings prepared and ready to present. The Crown may need to tweak a bit to accommodate today's witness, but that's it. Now.... we have to wait until the end of the week and move into next week before the jury will begin to deliberate. I'm mind-boggled at the extensive delays. Just seems to me it costs lots of time and money.

Oh well..... we will wait (but not patiently) LOL!

Salem

 

[Dmman]

That would be my take. The defence can't even make suggestions, like he did trying to lead TLM into agreeing with his hypotheses. But you legal eagles can correct me if I'm wrong. Can the defence put forward alternate theories of what might have happened that's not in evidence? Gang initiations, the whole 9 yards?

That's exactly what I was trying to convey! Thanks

 

[Sailor Bug]

Kingston Pen's children, child killers, murderers and monsters
Canada's oldest penitentiary to close after nearly 180 years

Intersesting article

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/story/2012/04/22/f-kingston-penitentiary-inmates.html

 

[Sailor Bug]

no but he may have to take up golf as he could be sent to that new prison in BC with all the perks....JMO

Hope not

Government had better tread very carefully as to where Rafferty will end up at

jmo

 

[littlebirdie]

Yes, he has aged through this trial. Rodney's kids can be proud of their father and how he has set an example of how to soldier on in the face of great tragedy. What a good example for his son's. I think we will be hearing from Rodney Stafford many times over the next years; he has come into his own and has so much to offer others in a similar crisis. MOO I remember when he rode his bike across country, I felt like every revolution of his pedals was a tear shed for Tori. It was powerful example of how to positively push through tribulation and positive coping skills. JMO With all the talk of drugs and tragedy in lives during this trial; he delivered a needed message for this community about developing good coping skills and for young people, that drugs are not the answer. IMO

I couldn't have said this better myself. All day today and throughout this entire ordeal I have been pondering my thoughts about Rodney and -- if I can word this correctly -- even after Victoria's death, Rodney will always have a meaningful connection to his daughter through the work he is doing regarding the safety of all our precious children. I will definitely watch for him in the future and be waiting for 'Tori's Law' to become a reality. This is the bright light to come out of this terrible darkness. I think of it as Victoria's light. So much discussion and awareness has been brought forward. MOO

 

[~n/t~]

Canada is much like the Italian system - hurry and wait while we do whatever. In the US -- defense would close tomorrow, if there was time the State would follow, if not, then Thursday.

They just had 4 days off, including 2 working days. Both sides should have closings prepared and ready to present. The Crown may need to tweak a bit to accommodate today's witness, but that's it. Now.... we have to wait until the end of the week and move into next week before the jury will begin to deliberate. I'm mind-boggled at the extensive delays. Just seems to me it costs lots of time and money.

Oh well..... we will wait (but not patiently) LOL!

Salem

Yup and taxpayers are footing the bill. UGH

 

[Sailor Bug]

Mike Knoll: - complete archived minutes here: http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/raffertytrial/2012/03/23/19539806.html

 

[Alison]

no but he may have to take up golf as he could be sent to that new prison in BC with all the perks....JMO

Well that would be a sad day in Canadian Justice if a child killer (my opinion as he has not yet been judged) gets to golf.
If he is found guilty he should have to go to Milhaven, and have to live in general population, for that is all a child killer deserves (they deserve less but that is Canadian justice for you).
I want him to feel the terror Tori felt those last few hours of her life, but I want him to feel them every minute of every day for the rest of his life.

 

[Kamille]

Canada is much like the Italian system - hurry and wait while we do whatever. In the US -- defense would close tomorrow, if there was time the State would follow, if not, then Thursday.

They just had 4 days off, including 2 working days. Both sides should have closings prepared and ready to present. The Crown may need to tweak a bit to accommodate today's witness, but that's it. Now.... we have to wait until the end of the week and move into next week before the jury will begin to deliberate. I'm mind-boggled at the extensive delays. Just seems to me it costs lots of time and money.

Oh well..... we will wait (but not patiently) LOL!

Salem

As a Canadian taxpayer, I'm surprised by this too. The backlog in our courts is terrible from what I understand and this is a classic example of why. Has that courtroom been used to try other short cases during all of these days off? Will it be used in the next two days? This trial was predicted to last into June. It could have been finished in less than two months if they had adhered to a regular working schedule like the rest of the population. That courtroom was tied up all day every day when court was in session and they only used it for about 4 hours of actual court time each day. They started at 10am, were usually done by 4pm or sometimes earlier and they took two 20 minute breaks and an hour and half lunch each day.

It's pretty frustrating.

MOO