Was there more than one shirt?

[wonders]

KC kept the car seat and the diaper bag in her car. The napkins covered with maggots were still in KC's car. Gum packages, a dinner knife and stinky pants were still in the car. Why would KC throw away Caylee's shoes?

I didn't say KC.
I was talking about when Cindy cleaned the car out. She washed some pants of Casey's. When she was doing that she could have thrown away Caylee's shoes and much more stuff that had evidence on them. I am saying she could have done it purposely. The car was a pig sty and Cindy wanted to cover for KC but she couldn't do it all the way because of the stinch.

ETA: Never mind. I guess I don't know how to put in words what I'm trying to get across.

 

[Valhall]

the white cloth with the purple strip.....

could have come from doll clothes or something like that......i know LE took stuff like that from the A's if im remember right.....im trying to think if a toy like my little pony would come with a small blanket for the pony......little toys like that can come with a tiny blanket and comb or brush.....could it be something like that?

sorry....but i have trouble opening all the doc dump....so i have not seen the pics of the clothes or cloth that was found.....

add: can someone post the pic of the cloth and shirt/shorts

Here you go.

 

[snow_walker]

I think Caylee was wearing the shorts, they simply survived the weathering and animals better, for some unknown reason. Most likely they had more polyester in them, or were heavier material. Who knows why some clothes that I wear all the time last forever, and others that I don't wear half as often seem to crumble in the washer in a month or two?
I can't really see a reason why Caylee wouldn't be dressed, she strikes me as one of those kids who had so many clothes that her family would be quick to change her clothes and keep her well dressed all the time, like a little princess. Not one pic shows her in undies or inadequate or ragged clothes of any sort. Of course that doesn't mean she wasn't sometimes left running about in a diaper, for example, just that I put the odds against it.
As for the collar.. seems likely to me the lower body was removed and the collar simply slipped down .. a childs head and neck wouldn't withstand much in the line of weathering, decomp, and insect activity, I wouldn't think. and the torso would be dragged away more or less intact, possibly dragging the t-shirt remnates with it, while the skull would likely be quickly consumed where it lay.

And now I have to get out of this thread.. some things I just can't keep on thinking about.

 

[RR0004]

Here you go.

Oh my...I hadn't seen the shorts...that poor baby.

 

[Valhall]

I think Caylee was wearing the shorts, they simply survived the weathering and animals better, for some unknown reason. Most likely they had more polyester in them, or were heavier material. Who knows why some clothes that I wear all the time last forever, and others that I don't wear half as often seem to crumble in the washer in a month or two?
I can't really see a reason why Caylee wouldn't be dressed, she strikes me as one of those kids who had so many clothes that her family would be quick to change her clothes and keep her well dressed all the time, like a little princess. Not one pic shows her in undies or inadequate or ragged clothes of any sort. Of course that doesn't mean she wasn't sometimes left running about in a diaper, for example, just that I put the odds against it.
As for the collar.. seems likely to me the lower body was removed and the collar simply slipped down .. a childs head and neck wouldn't withstand much in the line of weathering, decomp, and insect activity, I wouldn't think. and the torso would be dragged away more or less intact, possibly dragging the t-shirt remnates with it, while the skull would likely be quickly consumed where it lay.

And now I have to get out of this thread.. some things I just can't keep on thinking about.

The shorts were 100% cotton.

 

[MD MOMMY]

FWIW..my daughter has several pairs of shorts Circo from Target like these. Not the same pattern but similar stripes etc The shorts are made indenitcally to these with the cuff and button. They have a $4 shelf that has coordinating shorts/tops that come out every Summer. I get them for my daughter every year. They also have the same thing in the Winter with pants and coordinating shirts. All of these items are 100% cotton. I'm not saying with 100% certainty that these are all cotton, but I would bet the better half of my savings they are. Also the shorts are a thicker type material way thicker than a t-shirt.

ETA...I was in the process of typing when Vahall posted. LOL.

 

[MomofBoys]

I didn't say KC.
I was talking about when Cindy cleaned the car out. She washed some pants of Casey's. When she was doing that she could have thrown away Caylee's shoes and much more stuff that had evidence on them. I am saying she could have done it purposely. The car was a pig sty and Cindy wanted to cover for KC but she couldn't do it all the way because of the stinch.

ETA: Never mind. I guess I don't know how to put in words what I'm trying to get across.

ICAM. I said in another thread that I find CA's statements that every piece of clothing and every pair of shoes Caylee had was accounted for was misleading, either intentionally or not. I lean toward intentionally because I think most rational, truthful adults would err on the side of "Unless I'm forgetting something/unless KC had some outfits with her" especially when dealing with LE. Would you want to be accused of being untruthful later over a simple oversight? I wouldn't.

I found a little 12 month size Bucs jersey today that was hiding in a plastic bag after a trip to grandma's. I hadn't seen it in months, but I sometimes have bins of overflow stuff in the laundry room. Sometimes a shirt slides under a bed and I forget about it for a few weeks. I find it incredibly hard to believe that anyone catalogues their baby clothes, particularly when infants and toddlers usually have SO much. A quick perusal of the images from Caylee's room makes me think she didn't have a shortage of clothes and shoes.

Then again, if she "washed" a pair of pants with a nasty decomp smell (I'm not sure I'd be able to do that, especially knowing what decomp smells like from previous experience as she likely does) and a knife of unknown use (didn't she put it back in her kitchen) then maybe she would salvage a pair of little shoes. But have those pants of KC's been accounted for?

I swear this case gives me brain palpitations.

 

[capps]

I just had a thought...

When KC was questioned by LE,before Caylee was found,I'm sure they asked KC what was Caylee wearing the last time you saw her. I don't remember ever seeing that being asked of her. Unless I missed it some how and someone can direct me to it. If they did ask her,I wonder if she stated the clothes we are seeing now...also I'm sure they would have asked about shoes.

ETA:Wait a minute,after I thought about it,I think I answered my own question. George described what Caylee was wearing the last time he saw her,and KC went along with Georges' description. Right? ( I guess that's another question.lol.)

 

[RR0004]

I just had a thought...

When KC was questioned by LE,before Caylee was found,I'm sure they asked KC what was Caylee wearing the last time you saw her. I don't remember ever seeing that being asked of her. Unless I missed it some how and someone can direct me to it. If they did ask her,I wonder if she stated the clothes we are seeing now...also I'm sure they would have asked about shoes.

ETA:Wait a minute,after I thought about it,I think I answered my own question. George described what Caylee was wearing the last time he saw her,and KC went along with Georges' description. Right? ( I guess that's another question.lol.)

Yup...different descriptions IIRC. I believe George said jean shorts/skirt...doesn't really matter...I always found it hard to believe he could remember exactly.

 

[icherish]

I just had a thought...

When KC was questioned by LE,before Caylee was found,I'm sure they asked KC what was Caylee wearing the last time you saw her. I don't remember ever seeing that being asked of her. Unless I missed it some how and someone can direct me to it. If they did ask her,I wonder if she stated the clothes we are seeing now...also I'm sure they would have asked about shoes.

ETA:Wait a minute,after I thought about it,I think I answered my own question. George described what Caylee was wearing the last time he saw her,and KC went along with Georges' description. Right? ( I guess that's another question.lol.)

I didn't know Casey went along with George's description. It may be the case, just saying I'm not aware of it on the record. I do know I've never heard or read in any of the audio or documents LE specifically asking Casey what Caylee was wearing when Casey last saw her. I never could understand that. Or am I missing something? :waitasec:

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

I didn't know Casey went along with George's description. It may be the case, just saying I'm not aware of it on the record. I do know I've never heard or read in any of the audio or documents LE specifically asking Casey what Caylee was wearing when Casey last saw her. I never could understand that. Or am I missing something? :waitasec:

Per Casey's official handwritten statement to LE: "On the day of her disappearance, Caylee was wearing a pink shirt, with jean shorts, white sneakers, and her hair was pulled back in a ponytail."

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/Stories/Local/Casey Anthony discovery Pages 1-150.pdf (page 29)

 

[Harmony 2]

I have to admit I thought about that statement. But at the same time, this shirt is over in an area where ribs, the scapula and even part of the C1 vertebrae was located. Which implies all that made it's way over there en masse...or so it would seem. But how?

This would require the skull disconnecting from the torso prior to animals dragging part of the remains away. And I'm not sure that should happen under normal circumstances. Should it?

Here you go.

(Note: Please bear with me, I am just halfway through my first cup of coffee.)

I had a restless sleep thinking about the images of Caylee's clothes and the knowledge that her torso/body was ripped apart by scavengers. I am disturbed and emotional about it.

We know the additional duct tape (Q104) was also found with the letters, ribs, scapula and C1 vertebrae. We also know it had fringe hair on it which excluded the limbs.

I am perplexed about those facts. Considering the fringe hairs it appears the duct tape would have to have been on the skin of the upper torso and under the shirt. (I cannot fathom for what purpose.) Moreover, the shirt either had to be off or raised up high for placement of the duct tape.

If the duct tape was under the shirt and chewed up badly on one end why are the letters not chewed and obliterated?

ETA: I am including an attachment of a similar shirt to Caylee's for reference purposes as to the placement of the letters when worn.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

(Note: Please bear with me, I am just halfway through my first cup of coffee.)

I had a restless sleep thinking about the images of Caylee's clothes and the knowledge that her torso/body was ripped apart by scavengers. I am disturbed and emotional about it.

We know the additional duct tape (Q104) was also found with the letters, ribs, scapula and C1 vertebrae. We also know it had fringe hair on it which excluded the limbs.

I am perplexed about those facts. Considering the fringe hairs it appears the duct tape would have to have been on the skin of the upper torso and under the shirt. (I cannot fathom for what purpose.) Moreover, the shirt either had to be off or raised up high for placement of the duct tape.

If the duct tape was under the shirt and chewed up badly on one end why are the letters not chewed and obliterated?

ETA: I am including an attachment of a similar shirt to Caylee's for reference purposes as to the placement of the letters when worn.

These are many of the same upsetting questions that have come to my mind too, Harmony, and it sure does stir up the emotions! IIRC, fringe hairs are also found on the neck. Now, remember the collar of the shirt for some reason did not decompose at the same rate as the rest of the shirt. It could be because collars are usually folded over (two thicknesses) or a double (thicker) weave. But if the tape had been put around the neck it could have covered the collar which may have given it additional protection. I can't explore this thought much deeper because it requires visualization and I just can't go that far. But, if not on the neck, then it seems the chest/abdomen area is all that would be left. . . If that's the case, maybe the early rumors of Caylee being undressed were more than just rumors. I just can't make any real sense out of it . . . What could be the purpose of putting duct tape on anyone's chest or belly? OMGosh, I just remembered someone telling me that they heard of a mother duct taping her toddler son's diaper in place (around his waist) because he always took it off in the middle of the night. Surely Casey wouldn't have done this as a punishment for a potty training accident, would she?

 

[Valhall]

(Note: Please bear with me, I am just halfway through my first cup of coffee.)

I had a restless sleep thinking about the images of Caylee's clothes and the knowledge that her torso/body was ripped apart by scavengers. I am disturbed and emotional about it.

We know the additional duct tape (Q104) was also found with the letters, ribs, scapula and C1 vertebrae. We also know it had fringe hair on it which excluded the limbs.

I am perplexed about those facts. Considering the fringe hairs it appears the duct tape would have to have been on the skin of the upper torso and under the shirt. (I cannot fathom for what purpose.) Moreover, the shirt either had to be off or raised up high for placement of the duct tape.

If the duct tape was under the shirt and chewed up badly on one end why are the letters not chewed and obliterated?

ETA: I am including an attachment of a similar shirt to Caylee's for reference purposes as to the placement of the letters when worn.

This is extremely thought provoking. Thank you.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

Well, one of my thoughts in post #53 is wrong. I just read that there are no pink fibers on that 4th piece of Henkel tape so it couldn't have been covering the collar. Sure is sounding more and more like she was undressed, huh?

 

[milliac]

These are many of the same upsetting questions that have come to my mind too, Harmony, and it sure does stir up the emotions! IIRC, fringe hairs are also found on the neck. Now, remember the collar of the shirt for some reason did not decompose at the same rate as the rest of the shirt. It could be because collars are usually folded over (two thicknesses) or a double (thicker) weave. But if the tape had been put around the neck it could have covered the collar which may have given it additional protection. I can't explore this thought much deeper because it requires visualization and I just can't go that far. But, if not on the neck, then it seems the chest/abdomen area is all that would be left. . . If that's the case, maybe the early rumors of Caylee being undressed were more than just rumors. I just can't make any real sense out of it . . . What could be the purpose of putting duct tape on anyone's chest or belly? OMGosh, I just remembered someone telling me that they heard of a mother duct taping her toddler son's diaper in place (around his waist) because he always took it off in the middle of the night. Surely Casey wouldn't have done this as a punishment for a potty training accident, would she?

BBM

Was this the 13" piece of tape? Just thinking maybe she pinned her arms to her side, wrapping the tape around the belly and arms. I would think that length of tape would be enough.

 

[It's Not the Nanny]

BBM

Was this the 13" piece of tape? Just thinking maybe she pinned her arms to her side, wrapping the tape around the belly and arms. I would think that length of tape would be enough.

That's what I've been wondering......

 

[sarah7855]

BBM

Was this the 13" piece of tape? Just thinking maybe she pinned her arms to her side, wrapping the tape around the belly and arms. I would think that length of tape would be enough.

That's what I've been wondering......

Exactly what I was thinking...

 

[Tuffy]

Exactly what I was thinking...

Would that length of tape be long enough to go all the way around a child's belly and arms? It seems like it would need to be longer to me.

 

[sarah7855]

Would that length of tape be long enough to go all the way around a child's belly and arms? It seems like it would need to be longer to me.

picture a child lying on their back or side (possibly in fetal position?), tape from one arm, across belly to maybe halfway around the back, enough to bind the arms to the body but not all the way around the body. Would be plenty long enough. It wouldn't need to go all the way around to bind them, IMO.