What about all these 3's?

[MurriFlower]

to think that anyone could have planned out such coincidences when this murder and that ridculous RN were so thrown together is illogical.that is the only real pattern I see.the R's were doing whatever they could to get by,and by the skin of their teeth at that,and I don't think they planned any such things.jmo.

Yes, if you are RDI of course you have to think that. However, if you are IDI then you know this was planned, (perhaps not how it actually played out), but at least at the stage that the RN was written. So looking for some kind of pattern (maybe 3's, maybe something else) may help to decipher the RN and hence, help identify the IDI.

 

[txsvicki]

It seems to me that the ransom note got longer because the writer enjoyed the taunting of John towards the end. There probably was only one maybe two people involved with one possibly being female, and the three loops in the knot might have been used to do further restraining and was significant for that. The garrotting and head wound were the main causes of death and made sure that JonBenet was dead and couldn't identify anyone. The bristle part of the paint brush didn't seem to be used since it was still in the paint tray. I think Santa and things that could be related to Santa are more noticeable.

 

[MurriFlower]

It seems to me that the ransom note got longer because the writer enjoyed the taunting of John towards the end. There probably was only one maybe two people involved with one possibly being female, and the three loops in the knot might have been used to do further restraining and was significant for that. The garrotting and head wound were the main causes of death and made sure that JonBenet was dead and couldn't identify anyone. The bristle part of the paint brush didn't seem to be used since it was still in the paint tray. I think Santa and things that could be related to Santa are more noticeable.

It does seem like there might have been more than one person involved in it's composition doesn't it? That applies to RDI or IDI.

What do you mean about 'the three loops in the knot'?

Also what do you mean by 'I think Santa and things that could be related to Santa are more noticeable'??

 

[JMO8778]

Yes, if you are RDI of course you have to think that. However, if you are IDI then you know this was planned, (perhaps not how it actually played out), but at least at the stage that the RN was written. So looking for some kind of pattern (maybe 3's, maybe something else) may help to decipher the RN and hence, help identify the IDI.

I'm not even gonna waste any more space here replying to that one...keep looking.maybe hir is on the golf course w OJ.

 

[JMO8778]

It does seem like there might have been more than one person involved in it's composition doesn't it? That applies to RDI or IDI.

yeah,as in,John dicated it to Patsy,who,IMO,gave away the method they used to write it in DOI,when she said they composed the Christmas letter together (the one that had 'and hence' in it) and merged it from each individual copy they each wrote.Oops.

 

[joeskidbeck]

yeah,as in,John dicated it to Patsy,who,IMO,gave away the method they used to write it in DOI,when she said they composed the Christmas letter together (the one that had 'and hence' in it) and merged it from each individual copy they each wrote.Oops.

JMO8778, your siggy actually says more about this than the number 3 could ever. If one really wants to understand the rn, check into Victory!
That's where the writer's heart was. It wasn't money, or sexual gratification, it was in Victory! JonBenet's victory was forced on her and Patsy's came way too soon, but each now has their Victory!

 

[Agatha_C]

yeah,as in,John dicated it to Patsy,who,IMO,gave away the method they used to write it in DOI,when she said they composed the Christmas letter together (the one that had 'and hence' in it) and merged it from each individual copy they each wrote.Oops.

Patsy even tells us that JR dictates and she writes


2000 March 18
John and Patsy Ramsey book
"Death of Innocence"

DOI (HB) Page 234:

"John and I wrote message of appreciation to our friends to be printed on the back of the liturgy of the day. We thanked the people for their support through the past year and expressed how much their love had meant to us. We also commended on the meaning of the Christmas season and why it was important to remember the real season we celebrate this time of the year. In composing this expression of appreciation, John and I had each written a version. With both copies in hand, John dictated and I typed at the computer as we merged the two into one. Later Susan Stine and Roxy Walker made a few edits as they type it into the liturgical program. This edited version included the phrase and, hence. Those two words turned out to be the next bombshell!"

Seems to be a habit or hobby of the Rs. They liked playing Dictator and secretary. IMO

 

[MurriFlower]

.keep looking.maybe hir is on the golf course w OJ.

Keh??

 

[BBB167893]

Keh??

I believe JMO is referring to your intruder.

 

[MurriFlower]

I believe JMO is referring to your intruder.

Ah I see. Well as you guys have it all figured out already, then there's no need for any investigation is there?

 

[BBB167893]

Ah I see. Well as you guys have it all figured out already, then there's no need for any investigation is there?

Don't put words in my mouth, please.

 

[MurriFlower]

Don't put words in my mouth, please.

So you haven't got it all figured out then?

 

[BBB167893]

So you haven't got it all figured out then?

Murri, this is precisely why I jumped into this to begin with. You'll have to forgive me, but I find it a bit funny when someone sneers that we "have it all figured out," when that very same someone just a few posts earlier said, "Yes, if you are RDI of course you have to think that. However, if you are IDI then you know this was planned" (original emphasis). Not to MENTION the idea of assuming what RDI has to think.

But to answer your question, I never claimed to have some magical Rosetta Stone for this case. Naturally, I don't have every single thing figured out, and I'm coming to terms with the fact that it's likely I never will.

 

[MurriFlower]

Murri, this is precisely why I jumped into this to begin with. You'll have to forgive me, but I find it a bit funny when someone sneers that we "have it all figured out," when that very same someone just a few posts earlier said, "Yes, if you are RDI of course you have to think that. However, if you are IDI then you know this was planned" (original emphasis). Not to MENTION the idea of assuming what RDI has to think.

But to answer your question, I never claimed to have some magical Rosetta Stone for this case. Naturally, I don't have every single thing figured out, and I'm coming to terms with the fact that it's likely I never will.

Perhaps I misunderstood. JMO said "to think that anyone could have planned out such coincidences when this murder and that ridculous RN were so thrown together is illogical.that is the only real pattern I see.the R's were doing whatever they could to get by,and by the skin of their teeth at that,and I don't think they planned any such things.jmo. " to which I commented "Yes, if you are RDI of course you have to think that". By that I was commenting on JMO's answer to me. JMO then responded with "I'm not even gonna waste any more space here replying to that one...keep looking.maybe hir is on the golf course w OJ. ", which I didn't (and still don't understand) but I gather it was some vague reference to OJ Simpson and the purported taking of the golf bag by PP. You answered my Keh?? with "I believe JMO is referring to your intruder." and by interjecting yourself, I gathered it was a sentiment with which you agreed with JMO and that there was no need to "waste any more space here replying to that one" meaning presumably that the murderers were playing golf. I commented that as you had it solved then there was no need for further investigation. You then use this to make some point that I was trying to "put words in your mouth" whereas it was YOU who jumped into the exchange.

It seems quite logical to me that RDI almost universally assume the RN to have been written after the murder by one/all the Rs. They therefore must assert also that none of it is true and it was merely to deflect attention from themselves. If you think differently, then I haven't yet read it.

By the same logic, IDI believes the RN was written before the murder by the murderer or accomplice. On this basis, it was a message to JR about the kidnapping/ransom of his daughter and (even if we don't understand it) explains the reason. The wording of the RN was planned in advance of the murder, so it is an indication of how the IDI was thinking at that time, so as hard evidence, it requires investigation, not the dismissal as afforded to it by RDI.

 

[BBB167893]

Perhaps I misunderstood. JMO said "to think that anyone could have planned out such coincidences when this murder and that ridculous RN were so thrown together is illogical.that is the only real pattern I see.the R's were doing whatever they could to get by,and by the skin of their teeth at that,and I don't think they planned any such things.jmo. " to which I commented "Yes, if you are RDI of course you have to think that". By that I was commenting on JMO's answer to me. JMO then responded with "I'm not even gonna waste any more space here replying to that one...keep looking.maybe hir is on the golf course w OJ. ", which I didn't (and still don't understand) but I gather it was some vague reference to OJ Simpson and the purported taking of the golf bag by PP.

Yes, I think there has been a misunderstanding. The reference to OJ Simpson and the golf course is fairly well-known to us Yankees. It refers to Simpson's pledge to spend the rest of his life to find the "real" killers of Nicole and Ron Goldman, only to spend all of his free time (emphasis on free) playing around on the links. Well, to most of us, that's exactly what John Ramsey's similar pledge and similar actions remind us of: they're not looking for the "real" killer because they know who the real killer is already. Follow? As far as I know, it has nothing to do with PP or the golf bag.

You answered my Keh?? with "I believe JMO is referring to your intruder." and by interjecting yourself, I gathered it was a sentiment with which you agreed with JMO and that there was no need to "waste any more space here replying to that one" meaning presumably that the murderers were playing golf.

I don't know exactly what JMO meant by wasting time replying. I think it was more a reference to his/her frustration with the snarky attitude that IDI often adopts, not in reference to anything case-related. You'd have to ask JMO, though.

BUT, let's say you're right, and JMO is saying that the murderers are walking free and playing golf. If so, yeah, I agree with it 100 percent!

I commented that as you had it solved then there was no need for further investigation.

No. You didn't say we had it solved. You said we had it all figured out. That may seem like mere semantics to you, but to me they imply different things. More on that in a moment.

You then use this to make some point that I was trying to "put words in your mouth" whereas it was YOU who jumped into the exchange.

I wish I hadn't! If anything, I'm convinced that JMO had the right idea.

It seems quite logical to me that RDI almost universally assume the RN to have been written after the murder by one/all the Rs.

I don't know about universally. The great majority, I would guess.

They therefore must assert also that none of it is true and it was merely to deflect attention from themselves. If you think differently, then I haven't yet read it.

I DON'T think differently! I just get upset when someone speaks as if RDI shares one big collective mind.

By the same logic, IDI believes the RN was written before the murder by the murderer or accomplice. On this basis, it was a message to JR about the kidnapping/ransom of his daughter and (even if we don't understand it) explains the reason. The wording of the RN was planned in advance of the murder, so it is an indication of how the IDI was thinking at that time, so as hard evidence, it requires investigation, not the dismissal as afforded to it by RDI.

Yeah, but you just said it: you BELIEVE it is hard evidence. You call it dismissal, but you seem to misunderstand why we dismiss it. I'll give you a hint: it's not denial.

 

[MurriFlower]

Yes, I think there has been a misunderstanding. The reference to OJ Simpson and the golf course is fairly well-known to us Yankees. It refers to Simpson's pledge to spend the rest of his life to find the "real" killers of Nicole and Ron Goldman, only to spend all of his free time (emphasis on free) playing around on the links. Well, to most of us, that's exactly what John Ramsey's similar pledge and similar actions remind us of: they're not looking for the "real" killer because they know who the real killer is already. Follow? As far as I know, it has nothing to do with PP or the golf bag.

Ok, maybe I didn't have it exact, but the idea was the same. You see, silly old me expects the cops to be looking for the real killer not the parents of the murdered child. You Yankees must do it different to us. From memory there was this crazy idea that PR's sister PP came to the house and took all the incriminating evidence away in a golf bag. This is in order to explain the ABSENCE of hard evidence against the Rs.

I don't know exactly what JMO meant by wasting time replying. I think it was more a reference to his/her frustration with the snarky attitude that IDI often adopts, not in reference to anything case-related. You'd have to ask JMO, though.

You see, I am constantly accused of snarky attitude, but it is a result of GETTING snarky attitude from some other posters. There was no reason for JMO to chime in and say "this is dumb", except as a put down. This apparently is not regarded as 'snarky' according to RDI. There is the 'oh we respect all opinions' but this only seems to apply if those opinions are RDI based. All are equal but some are more equal than others.

BUT, let's say you're right, and JMO is saying that the murderers are walking free and playing golf. If so, yeah, I agree with it 100 percent!

Right then.

No. You didn't say we had it solved. You said we had it all figured out. That may seem like mere semantics to you, but to me they imply different things. More on that in a moment.

Figured out, solved. What's the difference? You don't need to wonder about what the RN means because you know it is nonsense. When someone who doesn't agree attempts to make sense out of it, it's ridiculed. I'm trying to find clues here, if you don't want to help out --fine. Just don't try to hinder.

I wish I hadn't! If anything, I'm convinced that JMO had the right idea.

Yeah, well, you can just discuss the dolls and the sexual abuse and the other voice on the 911 call and other unsubstantiated tabloid invented 'facts' forever, for all I care. Just don't butt in when someone is attempting to analyse a clue in order to deflect the conversation back to RDI.

I don't know about universally. The great majority, I would guess.

99.99999% I would guess.

I DON'T think differently! I just get upset when someone speaks as if RDI shares one big collective mind.

Well, what are you complaining about then? You believe what he said but then just automatically argue with me when I point it out?

Yeah, but you just said it: you BELIEVE it is hard evidence. You call it dismissal, but you seem to misunderstand why we dismiss it. I'll give you a hint: it's not denial.

Not denial, just another theory. Hey guess what? I've got a different theory!! This is something written on a piece of paper with a pen. It's HARD evidence.[/QUOTE]

 

[Holdontoyourhat]

By the same logic, IDI believes the RN was written before the murder by the murderer or accomplice. On this basis, it was a message to JR about the kidnapping/ransom of his daughter and (even if we don't understand it) explains the reason. The wording of the RN was planned in advance of the murder, so it is an indication of how the IDI was thinking at that time, so as hard evidence, it requires investigation, not the dismissal as afforded to it by RDI.

Right. Nobody who is serious about the investigation can afford to dismiss hard evidence.

The entire content of the RN has not been ruled out as bogus. The DNA has not been ruled out as unrelated. It has been ruled out as random however. The cord and tape cannot be ruled out as having been brought there by the unknown male owner of the DNA.

RDI has asked that the RN content and the DNA deposits be disregarded. RDI has asked that the cord, tape, and object that struck JBR's head be owned by the R's. This really is a lot to ask.

And its a lot to not know...

 

[BBB167893]

Ok, maybe I didn't have it exact, but the idea was the same. You see, silly old me expects the cops to be looking for the real killer not the parents of the murdered child.

That was the general point I was trying to make, Murri. JMO's statement was not referring to how the cops handle murders; it was a reference to how John Ramsey's pledge is turning out as empty as OJ's. And you have to wonder WHY.

You Yankees must do it different to us.

I don't know about that.

From memory there was this crazy idea that PR's sister PP came to the house and took all the incriminating evidence away in a golf bag. This is in order to explain the ABSENCE of hard evidence against the Rs.

I don't know how crazy that idea is.

You see, I am constantly accused of snarky attitude, but it is a result of GETTING snarky attitude from some other posters.

Please, Murri. I've been at this way too long to fall for that.

There is the 'oh we respect all opinions' but this only seems to apply if those opinions are RDI based.

That's nonsense. I've been nothing but accomodating up to now.

All are equal but some are more equal than others.

Using Orwell, Murri? You've got the right man.

Figured out, solved. What's the difference?

The difference is you can solve a case without accounting for every single thing. Like I said, at this point, I doubt very seriously that I'll ever figure the whole thing.

You don't need to wonder about what the RN means because you know it is nonsense. When someone who doesn't agree attempts to make sense out of it, it's ridiculed.

Now I KNOW that's not true. Just about every person here has tried to make sense out if it. You and I will just have to disagree on the definition of "sense," I guess.

I'm trying to find clues here, if you don't want to help out --fine. Just don't try to hinder.

I sympathize, Murri. I can't tell you how many times I've said that!

Yeah, well, you can just discuss the dolls and the sexual abuse and the other voice on the 911 call and other unsubstantiated tabloid invented 'facts' forever, for all I care.

Maybe I will. But I take umbrage with your claim of "unsubstantiated tabloid inventions." You only WISH they WERE unsubstantiated!

Just don't butt in when someone is attempting to analyse a clue in order to deflect the conversation back to RDI.

I'm pretty sure I wasn't trying to deflect the conversation just then.

99.99999% I would guess.

Your guess is as good as mine.

Well, what are you complaining about then? You believe what he said but then just automatically argue with me when I point it out?

It's the principle of the thing with me, Murri. More specifically, the idea that I have no mind of my own, no intelligence.

Not denial, just another theory. Hey guess what? I've got a different theory!!

Join the club! Too late; you did when you signed on here.

This is something written on a piece of paper with a pen. It's HARD evidence.

Now we're talking!

 

[BBB167893]

Right. Nobody who is serious about the investigation can afford to dismiss hard evidence.

There are SOOOO many ways I could go with that statement, it boggles the mind!

 

[SunnieRN]

Ok, maybe I didn't have it exact, but the idea was the same. You see, silly old me expects the cops to be looking for the real killer not the parents of the murdered child. You Yankees must do it different to us. From memory there was this crazy idea that PR's sister PP came to the house and took all the incriminating evidence away in a golf bag. This is in order to explain the ABSENCE of hard evidence against the Rs.



You see, I am constantly accused of snarky attitude, but it is a result of GETTING snarky attitude from some other posters. There was no reason for JMO to chime in and say "this is dumb", except as a put down. This apparently is not regarded as 'snarky' according to RDI. There is the 'oh we respect all opinions' but this only seems to apply if those opinions are RDI based. All are equal but some are more equal than others.



Right then.



Figured out, solved. What's the difference? You don't need to wonder about what the RN means because you know it is nonsense. When someone who doesn't agree attempts to make sense out of it, it's ridiculed. I'm trying to find clues here, if you don't want to help out --fine. Just don't try to hinder.


Yeah, well, you can just discuss the dolls and the sexual abuse and the other voice on the 911 call and other unsubstantiated tabloid invented 'facts' forever, for all I care. Just don't butt in when someone is attempting to analyse a clue in order to deflect the conversation back to RDI.


99.99999% I would guess.


Well, what are you complaining about then? You believe what he said but then just automatically argue with me when I point it out?


Not denial, just another theory. Hey guess what? I've got a different theory!! This is something written on a piece of paper with a pen. It's HARD evidence.

[/QUOTE]

I would say that a person who removed squad carS pf evidence would have removed evidence without even trying.