What Does The Crime Scene Tell Us About The Killer

[Sammiejam]

My 17 yr old had some interesting thoughts about this subject -she's in phsycology in school - when we were talking abut the case, how and where Caylee was found and how Casey has acted - my daughter said that she uses the part of her brain that thinks only of herself (I forget the exact term she used), she goes on - there are two parts of your brain, one is self centered but one has empathy which counteracts the self centered part of the brain - Casey's problem, her brain developed in the self centered part and the other part has either underdeveloped or didn't develop at all

My daughter goes on - she tells me this is how sociopaths are born - aka Ted Bundy who was a classic sociopath, Scott Peterson, another classic sociopath and now we can add Casey Anthony - all of these people have something in common, parents who didn't let them mature on the empathy part of the brain, it was all about them, they were given everything, didn't have to work for anything, they had no or very little responsibility - whatever they started, they would stop when it got too hard

So I ask my daughter, were these people responsible for their actions? It sounds like they were stunted in their growth - my daughter goes on, yes they are responsible, they know right from wrong, those that only use the part of the self centered part of the brain, are considered selfish, not ones without able to reason right from wrong - it's the total need to only create the world for themselves, no one else matters

Soooo, after all that - what does the crime scene tell us? well we can break it down - Caylee was found with no clothes on (as we know so far) in a trash bag thrown in an area where teens hang out, get high and some bury their pets.....

It tells us that this person knows the area, remembers it as a place of youth, and they threw out a 'pet' - thats what Caylee was, a pet - UNTIL it got too difficult to control the situation AND it took some mode of responsibility to take care of her

We have to also remember, when Caylee was an infant, Casey didn't have a job, so whoever took care of Caylee was doing it for someone who was out playing, acting like a teen - so what if Casey just had a baby, it complicated her 'now' lifestyle

Long winded I know, sorry

I think she was talking about the Id, Ego and the SuperEgo, which are the 3 elements of the personality.

Its part of Freuds "Structure of the Mind" theory.

 

[mikeysmommom]

It doesn't speak much about the killer, other than to emphasize that she is a freeloader.

The comfort of the home comes solely from Caylee's grandparents, not her mother. So they don't speak to Casey's character at all.

It's my opinion that the crime scenes include the car and the dump site. And these speak volumes of Casey's callous disregard for Caylee's life. They scream, "She is not a person to me!" They indicate indifference and laziness and self-absorption. They attest to her evil lack of conscience.

But mostly, they tell a tale of a little girl whose time alone with her mother---even before this murderous night--- must have been very, very sad and scary.

Thank God she had her grandparents. However flawed they may be--and we all are--they adored her.

ITA with your post yes I believed they adored her as well. My heart breaks for them.And I feel the same way you do about KC she is pure evil.
:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

 

[mikeysmommom]

And she thought is was funny, and she thought she was clever by telling everyone from the beginning exactly where she was located. Devious with no remorse, removing the one thing Cindy loved more than her.

When she said she dropped her off between 9 and 1, she didn't lie.
The body was found between and behind the houses ending in 9 and 1.

When she said the child was with Zanaida Gonzalez, she didn't lie to a degree if she did a reverse lookup in phonebook.com and whitepages.com because a Zanaida is listed at one of those addresses and a Gonzalez at the other.

She deposited the body in Sawgrass weeds and possibly ferns (fernandez).

She knew or left markers that later DC would be looking for, pavers or "step" pavers from the backyard.

She left her close to "home" but said "hope" possibly.

Basically she left her in sawgrass rather than at sawgrass and in the ferns between the properties listed as Z and G rather than with ZFG personally. She left her between 9 and 1 alright but it had nothing to do with time. She dropped her off near the "step" pavers rather than on the steps at Sawgrass. She was close to home, both home and close to Hope(spring) as she said. Right where friends and family would be "familiar".

Gotta find some more time to assemble other clues and figure out how she was playing a game of 'catch me if you can'.

WOW I am in awe.........:clap::clap::clap:

 

[aprilshowers]

My 17 yr old had some interesting thoughts about this subject -she's in phsycology in school - when we were talking abut the case, how and where Caylee was found and how Casey has acted - my daughter said that she uses the part of her brain that thinks only of herself (I forget the exact term she used), she goes on - there are two parts of your brain, one is self centered but one has empathy which counteracts the self centered part of the brain - Casey's problem, her brain developed in the self centered part and the other part has either underdeveloped or didn't develop at all

My daughter goes on - she tells me this is how sociopaths are born - aka Ted Bundy who was a classic sociopath, Scott Peterson, another classic sociopath and now we can add Casey Anthony - all of these people have something in common, parents who didn't let them mature on the empathy part of the brain, it was all about them, they were given everything, didn't have to work for anything, they had no or very little responsibility - whatever they started, they would stop when it got too hard

So I ask my daughter, were these people responsible for their actions? It sounds like they were stunted in their growth - my daughter goes on, yes they are responsible, they know right from wrong, those that only use the part of the self centered part of the brain, are considered selfish, not ones without able to reason right from wrong - it's the total need to only create the world for themselves, no one else matters

Soooo, after all that - what does the crime scene tell us? well we can break it down - Caylee was found with no clothes on (as we know so far) in a trash bag thrown in an area where teens hang out, get high and some bury their pets.....

It tells us that this person knows the area, remembers it as a place of youth, and they threw out a 'pet' - thats what Caylee was, a pet - UNTIL it got too difficult to control the situation AND it took some mode of responsibility to take care of her

We have to also remember, when Caylee was an infant, Casey didn't have a job, so whoever took care of Caylee was doing it for someone who was out playing, acting like a teen - so what if Casey just had a baby, it complicated her 'now' lifestyle

Long winded I know, sorry

Then we would have to observe from this, that the videos of KC playing with Caylee .... smiling so big, etc. ... were all for show ... to show how SHE was a good mom, loved Caylee, etc. etc. ... Yes?

 

[aprilshowers]

Good question! The disposal site.

A body is found, at least partially encased in a plastic bag, in a wooded surburban area not far from where a child was reported missing. What does this particular crime scene tell us about the killer?

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Looking at this from the point of not having a suspect and looking at the discovery scene, I would say:

1. Could very well have been abduction, and she very well could have been raped. Especially if she was found naked.

2. Tape around whole head might indicate being placed there when abduction happened, or soon after, to silence her .. while rape was taking place, or some other torture/beating.

3. My first guess would be a man (pedophile)

4. He may have kept her for awhile, in his home or hidden elsewhere, where he raped her more than once, etc.

5. He COULD be from the area, but not necessarily, also could be a transient, who saw her playing alone outside or took her from her bedroom. My thoughts on this of course, would depend on what the parents/grandparents reported, of how she was abducted, missing.

6. Finding her skeleton in a garbage bag, would indicate of course, she was placed there awhile ago[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif], and that he may have had her dead body in his possession for awhile before putting it there.

7. Placing her so close to home, would say to me, that either he raped and killed her there, or raped her elsewhere and in some strange way, wanted her to be close to her family.

That's my analogy of it. MOO

[/FONT]

 

[thelmadawg]

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Looking at this from the point of not having a suspect and looking at the discovery scene, I would say:

1. Could very well have been abduction, and she very well could have been raped. Especially if she was found naked.

2. Tape around whole head might indicate being placed there when abduction happened, or soon after, to silence her .. while rape was taking place, or some other torture/beating.

3. My first guess would be a man (pedophile)

4. He may have kept her for awhile, in his home or hidden elsewhere, where he raped her more than once, etc.

5. He COULD be from the area, but not necessarily, also could be a transient, who saw her playing alone outside or took her from her bedroom. My thoughts on this of course, would depend on what the parents/grandparents reported, of how she was abducted, missing.

6. Finding her skeleton in a garbage bag, would indicate of course, she was placed there awhile ago[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif], and that he may have had her dead body in his possession for awhile before putting it there.

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]7. Placing her so close to home, would say to me, that either he raped and killed her there, or raped her elsewhere and in some strange way, wanted her to be close to her family.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]That's my analogy of it. MOO [/FONT]

[/FONT]

Great observation! Would the concept that personal items of the child, say, blanket, books, clothing, photos were found change your perspective at all?

 

[not_my_kids]

Killer is more than likely a female as evidenced by the lack of trauma to the body and the wrapping of the corpse.
Initial dump site would tell us that the child should have a missing persons report active as the child was well nourished and there were no blatant signs of abuse, such as broken bones or signs of malnutrition.
The killer is local to the area, evidenced by the killer knowing how thick the woods were in that area. Killer also felt comfortable to dump a body in the middle (essentially) of a residential neighborhood, which shows they know the area.
Inexperienced, definitely not dealing with a pro or a person that fantasizes about killing children.
Killer was not displaying the body in plain sight or with any type of posing, which shows that killer was not wanting the body found.
Body is wrapped which could show that killer felt remorse and wanted to protect the childs body, however, that is unlikely given the other elements of the scene.

 

[aprilshowers]

Thinking of the discovery scene, I did a bit of research on murdered children, found close to home and/or in garbage bags. Here's what I found:

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Amanda , 13, known as Milly, was found dead in remote woodlands six months after she went missing. [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The remains were discovered by a couple picking mushrooms 25 miles from the home.

[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]October 23, 1997, Levi was found dead. The afternoon before he rode his bike to a friend's house not far from where he lived in Cumming, Georgia. He never made it home. He was found 15 miles away shot to death in a ditch in a remote area of Dawson County. [/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Cecil , 2, aka C. T. was murdered between August 11, 1996, 10:30 p.m. and August 12, 1996, 2:30 a.m. in Orange County, CA. C. T. died of asphyxiation. His parents reported him missing in the morning after his step-father reportedly returned from his morning jog. C. T.s body was found August 13, 1996, in the creek bed close proximity to his home. [/FONT]

William went missing on May 16, 1981, and his body was found close to his home

HANAHAN, S.C. - Two young children who had been left in a hot car while their mother was at work were later found dead, their bodies wrapped in trash bags under an apartment sink, authorities said Tuesday.

SAVANNAH, Ga. - A convicted child molester and his parents were indicted Wednesday on charges they molested and then murdered a 6-year-old neighbor boy, whose body was found last week in a trash bag dumped by a roadside.

Barry County investigators say a 16-year-old girl placed her baby in a plastic bag then hid it in her closet. The infant girl was found dead just one day after she was born.

NEW YORK (AP) - With her slight frame and big grin, Sharell still looks like a child. But authorities say that over three days the 15-year-old girl killed two men, including one whose dismembered remains were found in a garbage bag.

There are more, but it shows that it DOES happen. Also, I noticed that allot of the 'garbage bag' bodies, were infants placed there by teens, something another poster mentioned ... and there were allot of links to the KC story.

 

[aprilshowers]

Great observation! Would the concept that personal items of the child, say, blanket, books, clothing, photos were found change your perspective at all?

Hmmmm????

I might think it was a relative (ex-husband, etc.) that took her away from the mother (or grandparents, if that's what the story reported).

Also, if it was a night abduction from the child's room, they may have taken a few personal items, to keep the child quiet or company, while they had her in their possession.

Photos are harder, unless those were inside the child's book, or he had taken them himself.

And yes, I might think it was the mother.

 

[BondJamesBond]

Narcissist-supreme.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_personality_disorder

 

[NCUser1]

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Looking at this from the point of not having a suspect and looking at the discovery scene, I would say:

1. Could very well have been abduction, and she very well could have been raped. Especially if she was found naked.

2. Tape around whole head might indicate being placed there when abduction happened, or soon after, to silence her .. while rape was taking place, or some other torture/beating.

3. My first guess would be a man (pedophile)

4. He may have kept her for awhile, in his home or hidden elsewhere, where he raped her more than once, etc.

5. He COULD be from the area, but not necessarily, also could be a transient, who saw her playing alone outside or took her from her bedroom. My thoughts on this of course, would depend on what the parents/grandparents reported, of how she was abducted, missing.

6. Finding her skeleton in a garbage bag, would indicate of course, she was placed there awhile ago[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif], and that he may have had her dead body in his possession for awhile before putting it there.

7. Placing her so close to home, would say to me, that either he raped and killed her there, or raped her elsewhere and in some strange way, wanted her to be close to her family.

That's my analogy of it. MOO

[/FONT]

Killer was in a hurry (bag couldn't have been buried deep)

Killer wanted her close to family or then again was in a hurry.

No clothes? Didn't want anyone to identify clothes.


But...How would the killer (if not Casey) have gotten a hair (from a dead body) in Casey's trunk?

 

[Kat]

And she thought is was funny, and she thought she was clever by telling everyone from the beginning exactly where she was located. Devious with no remorse, removing the one thing Cindy loved more than her.

When she said she dropped her off between 9 and 1, she didn't lie.
The body was found between and behind the houses ending in 9 and 1.

When she said the child was with Zanaida Gonzalez, she didn't lie to a degree if she did a reverse lookup in phonebook.com and whitepages.com because a Zanaida is listed at one of those addresses and a Gonzalez at the other.

She deposited the body in Sawgrass weeds and possibly ferns (fernandez).

She knew or left markers that later DC would be looking for, pavers or "step" pavers from the backyard.

She left her close to "home" but said "hope" possibly.

Basically she left her in sawgrass rather than at sawgrass and in the ferns between the properties listed as Z and G rather than with ZFG personally. She left her between 9 and 1 alright but it had nothing to do with time. She dropped her off near the "step" pavers rather than on the steps at Sawgrass. She was close to home, both home and close to Hope(spring) as she said. Right where friends and family would be "familiar".

Gotta find some more time to assemble other clues and figure out how she was playing a game of 'catch me if you can'.

Very well done!:clap: Bolding by me. She could also say to the LE when they said she lied about everything...no not everything (pulling that off the top of my head, not her exact words). She does think she is clever, no?

And according to her ex-fiance, a diabolical liar

 

[LambChop]

Broderick:
(Quote) The houses behind which the body was found directly in between end in 9 and 1 so when you do the reverse look (end quote)

By George, I think you have something here!!!

Did KC not say that she dropped Caylee off at ZFG between 9 and 1??? And that she is was going about this in a "backwards sort of way."

 

[Pattymarie]

I SERIOUSLY think that KC killed Caylee to SPITE her mother as her mother had choked her which is TOTALLY humiliating to KC and it totally took her sense of power away and she had the ONE THING that just kill her inside and that was to kill Caylee.
Caylee must have been a real bargaining chip with the Anthonys as she was still living like a child with no responsibilities. I do sometimes feel terrible for KC that her parents didn't love her enough to discipline her and teach her how to live and cope with life.
I will NEVER defend her but I was a single parent of two sons (that are now in the military) and I was VERY selfish when I had the first one at age 19, but I had it in my heart to love him enough to love him and teach him the total opposite of how I was brought up as I had no discipline either but I learned really quick when I moved out of the house and had a baby to take care of. My dad wouldn't let me move back in with him when I left their dad and I thank God he didnt today.

I think she was in a hurry to hang out with AL and the quicker of getting rid of her the better. I still tend to think the pool has something to do with all of this.
I don't think anything to do with the choloroform
I also think she was planning on killing CA though. I think Caylee was just in the way and the fight made KC do that to Caylee.

I agree with you...I think Casey killed her to spite her mother...but one thought I have is, if this is so...wouldn't she want her mother to know this? Wouldn't there be some sort of smug satisfaction for her that Cindy knew she did this?

 

[secretsquirrel]

The crime scene tells us the killer wasn't very smart, didn't think it out and didn't give a rats arse. Timer55 doesn't mean anything, there are no secret clues. How could it mean 55 seconds from house? 55 seconds at what speed? Too much is being read into this considering the only fact is that this little girl was thrown out like trash.

 

[kgeaux]

I'm never sure about when it's OK to start a new thread, BUT, if we had no idea about who the killer was, what would the crime scene tell us -- a profile, if you will, of the killer?

I don't think we know where the crime occured. We just know where Caylee's body was disposed of, and that the body (already deceased) allegedly spent a couple of days in the trunk of Casey's car.

From those facts, and the fact that duct tape was across Caylee's mouth, I think I can say:

(IF THE TAPE WAS APPLIED PRE-DEATH) The person who taped Caylee's mouth did not see Caylee as a "real" little girl who mattered very much. It was more important to the person who applied the tape that Caylee remain silent than that she was comfortable and feeling secure. The only thing that really mattered to the taper was that the taper be free to do what he/she wanted.

(IF THE TAPE WAS APPLIED POST-MORTEM) The person who applied the tape to the already deceased body would have been attempting to stage a crime scene.....to make it look as though someone else had caused the death.

With regards to the body being stashed in the trunk, in garbage bags: The body was nothing but trash to be discarded of to the one who placed that baby in a garbage bag, sealed it, and placed the bag into the trunk of the car. While this person did not value Caylee, he/she knew that OTHERS did, and that is why they didn't just leave the body where the death occured. The person responsible did not want to be held accountable. In that person's mind, I believe it was sort of like "well, she's dead. I am going to be standing in big doodoo if they find out I did this, so I better make sure no one finds out." The two days in the trunk was just how long it took for the person responsible for this death to think of the best disposal scene.

In regards to dumping her in the woods: The area was known, accessible and unaccessible at the same time......easy enough to get into to dump the bag, but hard enough of an area to traverse to discourage frequent activity by others who could discover the body.

It may also have served as an area that was easy for the person responsible to check up on......they'd have a reason to be there, so no one could question why they were at the area.

Cold, unloving, self-centered. I think that sums up the killer.

 

[Hope for the Best]

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Looking at this from the point of not having a suspect and looking at the discovery scene, I would say:

1. Could very well have been abduction, and she very well could have been raped. Especially if she was found naked.

2. Tape around whole head might indicate being placed there when abduction happened, or soon after, to silence her .. while rape was taking place, or some other torture/beating.

3. My first guess would be a man (pedophile)

4. He may have kept her for awhile, in his home or hidden elsewhere, where he raped her more than once, etc.

5. He COULD be from the area, but not necessarily, also could be a transient, who saw her playing alone outside or took her from her bedroom. My thoughts on this of course, would depend on what the parents/grandparents reported, of how she was abducted, missing.

6. Finding her skeleton in a garbage bag, would indicate of course, she was placed there awhile ago[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif], and that he may have had her dead body in his possession for awhile before putting it there.

7. Placing her so close to home, would say to me, that either he raped and killed her there, or raped her elsewhere and in some strange way, wanted her to be close to her family.

That's my analogy of it. MOO

[/FONT]

That's exactly what I would've thought, if we didn't know better. Had she reported Caylee missing immediately, and not waited 31 days, and there was no decomp in KC's trunk, I would totally have thought that this was likely what happened.

 

[Hope for the Best]

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Looking at this from the point of not having a suspect and looking at the discovery scene, I would say:

1. Could very well have been abduction, and she very well could have been raped. Especially if she was found naked.

2. Tape around whole head might indicate being placed there when abduction happened, or soon after, to silence her .. while rape was taking place, or some other torture/beating.

3. My first guess would be a man (pedophile)

4. He may have kept her for awhile, in his home or hidden elsewhere, where he raped her more than once, etc.

5. He COULD be from the area, but not necessarily, also could be a transient, who saw her playing alone outside or took her from her bedroom. My thoughts on this of course, would depend on what the parents/grandparents reported, of how she was abducted, missing.

6. Finding her skeleton in a garbage bag, would indicate of course, she was placed there awhile ago[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif], and that he may have had her dead body in his possession for awhile before putting it there.

7. Placing her so close to home, would say to me, that either he raped and killed her there, or raped her elsewhere and in some strange way, wanted her to be close to her family.

That's my analogy of it. MOO

[/FONT]

That's exactly what I would've thought, if we didn't know better. Had she reported Caylee missing immediately, and not waited 31 days, and there was no decomp in KC's trunk, I would totally have thought that this was likely what happened.

 

[minazoe]

killer dumped the body on the side of the road where the grandparents of the victim probably drive by everyday.

this is a grand display of their handiwork, almost devil may care, maybe even proud.

no attempt to conceal other than the trash bag...nope right there in the open.

killer wanted to rub it in the face of those she resented the most. Killer blames them for what she was forced to do. killer feels no connection to her crime and felt completely removed from any responsibility once she dumped the child there. killer did this to hurt those grandparents.

this part of the murder story is what I think can lead one down the path to thinking it was a pedophile homicide , because there was little effort to conceal the child.

I think Caylee was murdered inside the A home.

 

[Cayleefan]

The murder occurred close by where body was found.
The killer was heartless and cold.
The killer made light of what she had done (not taking it very seriously).
The killer knew what she did was wrong but didn't care.
The killer thought she could get away with it.