This trash bag is interesting. Another poster on another thread suggested that the trash bag was carried out of the apartment to enable KC to place one trash bag in her trunk and remove another to be thrown away without arousing suspicion, which seems possible to me. I have also considered that this trash bag was her "excuse" to leave the apartment and check on AH's car as in she may have needed an excuse to exit the apartment at any time by herself. If she was cooking and doing their laundry, it wouldn't seem too odd if she insisted on taking out their garbage, which by the way might also have provided her some insight on the location of the dumpsters and possibly the trash pickup schedule.
Where is Amy's totalled car? Time Line and Ping
- Thread starter mom2chloe
- Start date
This trash bag is interesting. Another poster on another thread suggested that the trash bag was carried out of the apartment to enable KC to place one trash bag in her trunk and remove another to be thrown away without arousing suspicion, which seems possible to me. I have also considered that this trash bag was her "excuse" to leave the apartment and check on AH's car as in she may have needed an excuse to exit the apartment at any time by herself. If she was cooking and doing their laundry, it wouldn't seem too odd if she insisted on taking out their garbage, which by the way might also have provided her some insight on the location of the dumpsters and possibly the trash pickup schedule.
BondJamesBond
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To see how events unfolded on the afternoon of 6/19 that had Casey:
1) Urgently take out the trash from Tony's apartment, then remove the small bags within a large bag in the trunk of her Pontiac in order to use the large bag to place Caylee's body in it because she had to,
2) Transfer Caylee's body from Amy's totalled car into the Pontiac, because
3) Amy was coming over immediately to check on the car
4) Which led to Casey quickly taking Caylee's body in the Pontiac in the plastic bag and either disposing of it near JBPark to return later OR placing it in a leak-proof container she purchased and temporarily leaving the body near JBPark to return later...however, only after the bagged body leaked 2.6 decomp-day fluid into the trunk of the Pontiac...
5) After visiting Crane's Landing Apt w/ Tony Casey had the opportunity to return for a more permanent disposal or relocation of the body in a leak-proof
container.
...all speculation supported by evidence text & ping data
Start with post 67=>69 here: http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73226&page=3
1) Urgently take out the trash from Tony's apartment, then remove the small bags within a large bag in the trunk of her Pontiac in order to use the large bag to place Caylee's body in it because she had to,
2) Transfer Caylee's body from Amy's totalled car into the Pontiac, because
3) Amy was coming over immediately to check on the car
4) Which led to Casey quickly taking Caylee's body in the Pontiac in the plastic bag and either disposing of it near JBPark to return later OR placing it in a leak-proof container she purchased and temporarily leaving the body near JBPark to return later...however, only after the bagged body leaked 2.6 decomp-day fluid into the trunk of the Pontiac...
5) After visiting Crane's Landing Apt w/ Tony Casey had the opportunity to return for a more permanent disposal or relocation of the body in a leak-proof
container.
...all speculation supported by evidence text & ping data
Start with post 67=>69 here: http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=73226&page=3
BondJamesBond
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The following # was disconnected, but, only used twice, and I believe may have something to do with access to Amy's totalled car while stored @ Tony's.
(321) 948-##81
It was called only two times from Tony's apt on Casey's cell between 6/15-7/15 in a critical time of dealing with the totalled car:
6/19/08 THU 2:09:36 PM after Amy advises via text she's on her way over. Dur. 1 min.
6/20/08 FRI 1:04:04 PM Dur. 12.7 min.
Other 321 Area code #'s belonged to:
Hmmm...
(321) 948-##81
It was called only two times from Tony's apt on Casey's cell between 6/15-7/15 in a critical time of dealing with the totalled car:
6/19/08 THU 2:09:36 PM after Amy advises via text she's on her way over. Dur. 1 min.
6/20/08 FRI 1:04:04 PM Dur. 12.7 min.
Other 321 Area code #'s belonged to:
Adam ?
B Jacke
Brittany S.
Corey
Danny C.
Erika ?
Heather M.
Mike C.
Sandra S.
Will W.
Unidentified # 0081
Unidentified # 1996
Unidentified # 6564
Unidentified # 6993
Unidentified # 9765
B Jacke
Brittany S.
Corey
Danny C.
Erika ?
Heather M.
Mike C.
Sandra S.
Will W.
Unidentified # 0081
Unidentified # 1996
Unidentified # 6564
Unidentified # 6993
Unidentified # 9765
Hmmm...
It's Not the Nanny
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BondJamesBond - LOVE THIS THEORY.
I know I keep saying it, but I KNOW Amy's wrecked car is involved somehow!
I know I keep saying it, but I KNOW Amy's wrecked car is involved somehow!
But IIRC KC & WW did not meet until 4th of July???
What jumped at me was B Jacke--I'll have to check that BlackJack phone thread again . . . this is the first I've heard that KC had this name in her phone contacts ...
Or where did this list come from?
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Mr. Bond...James Bond...
That is really good stuff. The transfer theory is excellent.
The totalled car had to be titled to the junk yard as salvage...that way ppl can't buy it by the piece to re-assemble...so a title search would easily determine where the remains of the car are right now.
As LE is all over this case, I would be surprised if they haven't located it....
That is really good stuff. The transfer theory is excellent.
The totalled car had to be titled to the junk yard as salvage...that way ppl can't buy it by the piece to re-assemble...so a title search would easily determine where the remains of the car are right now.
As LE is all over this case, I would be surprised if they haven't located it....
shadow of my mind
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LE little comversation with Will W. about the guy who claimed that he new a mechanic who had worked on a smelly car...
LE asked Will W. about a Crime line Tip: Winter Park arrested a kid on 7/26; Ryan H. said Will W., Casey’s supposed boyfriend had been in an accident and brought her car in repair. Unknown mechanic, unknown garage stated the car smelled like a dead animal. Will did not know who Ryan was, then he remembered his friend Dusty M. [This may be an incorrect spelling] has a buddy who just got arrested and his name is Ryan. Will states that this Ryan and Dusty where at the July 4 party. Dusty works for the government over off Alafaya, he does trouble shooting government armory, police vests and stuff like that. Gives phone number of Dusty.
Page 1418, Page 1419, Page 1420 Lines 1-14 William W. Interview with LE on 7/30/ 2008
http://flawebhosting.net/docs092308/ww092308.pdf
This is the text message between Amy and Casey about the tow guy for her car was a friend of Will W.
AH KC 6/14/08 OK. I finally got Will going. We are about to leave to see his buddy about towing. Where is Tony’s place so I can tell them and the name of it again?
So, maybe it was not a mechanic but a tow truck driver that was saying something about a smelly car.
Casey called Matt C. that day about looking at an apartment.
Looking at the cell logs for that part of the day
6/19/08 THU 1:06:56 PM OUTGOING TEXT 9286 Casey A. 9214 Amy H. Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt Call me when you’re headed over to see your car.
6/19/08 THU 1:07:32 PM INCOMING TEXT 9214 Amy H. 9286 Casey A. Tower 57: 0.5 mi NW of TonE L Apt I'm on my way.
6/19/08 THU 1:14:33 PM INCOMING TEXT 9286 Casey A. Tower 57: 0.5 mi NW of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 1:20:18 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 9214 Amy H. 0.1 Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 1:20:41 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 9214 Amy H. 4.6 Tower 57: 0.5 mi NW of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:09:36 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 81 Unidentified # 0081 Tower 57: 0.5 mi NW of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:10:36 PM OUTGOING TEXT 9286 Casey A. 7965 Matthew C. Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:10:40 PM INCOMING CALL 7965 Matthew C. 9286 Casey A. 1.4 Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:27:55 PM INCOMING TEXT 5132 Lee A. (Cell) 9286 Casey A. Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:58:17 PM OUTGOING TEXT 9286 Casey A. 7965 Matthew C. Tower 48: 0.5 mi SE of JB Park, 2.5 mi E of Amscot, 2 mi SW of Tony R Home, 2 mi SW of JG
6/19/08 THU 2:58:42 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 9286 Casey A. 0.3 Tower 48: 0.5 mi SE of JB Park, 2.5 mi E of Amscot, 2 mi SW of Tony R Home, 2 mi SW of JG
6/19/08 THU 2:59:06 PM INCOMING TEXT 9286 Casey A. Tower 48: 0.5 mi SE of JB Park, 2.5 mi E of Amscot, 2 mi SW of Tony R Home, 2 mi SW of JG
6/19/08 THU 3:07:23 PM INCOMING TEXT 7965 Matthew C. 9286 Casey A. Tower 56: 1.5 mi E of TonE L, 1 mi NW of JB Park
6/19/08 THU 4:20:20 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 0 Lexus Dlrshp 2.1 Tower 46: 0.5 mi W of Amscot, 2 mi S of TonE L
6/19/08 THU 4:23:10 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 9214 Amy H. 3.6 Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
Well two things, communication with Lee which is rare, and the Lexus Dealer which is rare.
LE asked Will W. about a Crime line Tip: Winter Park arrested a kid on 7/26; Ryan H. said Will W., Casey’s supposed boyfriend had been in an accident and brought her car in repair. Unknown mechanic, unknown garage stated the car smelled like a dead animal. Will did not know who Ryan was, then he remembered his friend Dusty M. [This may be an incorrect spelling] has a buddy who just got arrested and his name is Ryan. Will states that this Ryan and Dusty where at the July 4 party. Dusty works for the government over off Alafaya, he does trouble shooting government armory, police vests and stuff like that. Gives phone number of Dusty.
Page 1418, Page 1419, Page 1420 Lines 1-14 William W. Interview with LE on 7/30/ 2008
http://flawebhosting.net/docs092308/ww092308.pdf
This is the text message between Amy and Casey about the tow guy for her car was a friend of Will W.
AH KC 6/14/08 OK. I finally got Will going. We are about to leave to see his buddy about towing. Where is Tony’s place so I can tell them and the name of it again?
So, maybe it was not a mechanic but a tow truck driver that was saying something about a smelly car.
Casey called Matt C. that day about looking at an apartment.
Looking at the cell logs for that part of the day
6/19/08 THU 1:06:56 PM OUTGOING TEXT 9286 Casey A. 9214 Amy H. Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt Call me when you’re headed over to see your car.
6/19/08 THU 1:07:32 PM INCOMING TEXT 9214 Amy H. 9286 Casey A. Tower 57: 0.5 mi NW of TonE L Apt I'm on my way.
6/19/08 THU 1:14:33 PM INCOMING TEXT 9286 Casey A. Tower 57: 0.5 mi NW of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 1:20:18 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 9214 Amy H. 0.1 Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 1:20:41 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 9214 Amy H. 4.6 Tower 57: 0.5 mi NW of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:09:36 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 81 Unidentified # 0081 Tower 57: 0.5 mi NW of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:10:36 PM OUTGOING TEXT 9286 Casey A. 7965 Matthew C. Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:10:40 PM INCOMING CALL 7965 Matthew C. 9286 Casey A. 1.4 Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:27:55 PM INCOMING TEXT 5132 Lee A. (Cell) 9286 Casey A. Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
6/19/08 THU 2:58:17 PM OUTGOING TEXT 9286 Casey A. 7965 Matthew C. Tower 48: 0.5 mi SE of JB Park, 2.5 mi E of Amscot, 2 mi SW of Tony R Home, 2 mi SW of JG
6/19/08 THU 2:58:42 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 9286 Casey A. 0.3 Tower 48: 0.5 mi SE of JB Park, 2.5 mi E of Amscot, 2 mi SW of Tony R Home, 2 mi SW of JG
6/19/08 THU 2:59:06 PM INCOMING TEXT 9286 Casey A. Tower 48: 0.5 mi SE of JB Park, 2.5 mi E of Amscot, 2 mi SW of Tony R Home, 2 mi SW of JG
6/19/08 THU 3:07:23 PM INCOMING TEXT 7965 Matthew C. 9286 Casey A. Tower 56: 1.5 mi E of TonE L, 1 mi NW of JB Park
6/19/08 THU 4:20:20 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 0 Lexus Dlrshp 2.1 Tower 46: 0.5 mi W of Amscot, 2 mi S of TonE L
6/19/08 THU 4:23:10 PM OUTGOING CALL 9286 Casey A. 9214 Amy H. 3.6 Tower 58: 0.5 mi NE of TonE L Apt
Well two things, communication with Lee which is rare, and the Lexus Dealer which is rare.
wanttohelp
http://thewaronwomen.org
Actually our theory isnt quite that. "totaled" by an insurance company doesn't necasarly mean totaled literally. If the damage is greater than the blue book value, that could be termed totaled. Amy stated she needed to keep the car someone, because her dad was coming in July and somehow they were gonna get it fixed and sell it. The car was then agreed to be kept at Tony's. Will W was with Amy when it was towed over. Casey wanted to know when Amy was coming to look at the car, Amy did on the 19. We don't know what happen to the car after that date. Some even mentioned maybe Casey took it somewhere to be repaired because she wanted to use it as a get away "get out of dodge" vehicle. Most of us think at some point Caylee was kept in the car. Amy mentioned everyone has keys to her car. Questions we are trying to answer:
1)what kind of car was it?
2)did her dad ever come?
3)what happened to it?
4)did anyone know it was there?the complex?Tony?Lee?
momtective
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#1 I don't recall ever seeing mention of what kind of car it was
#2 I didn't know her Dad was coming (I may have missed that)
#3 They were going to fix it and sell it.
#4 refer to post 192 & 193 this thread. Tony knew about it and gave permission for it to be parked there.
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Im not sure, but a common thread around sociopaths is their desire to keep all parties to their ongoing lies seperated at all costs.
momtective
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321 is an area code in these Florida areas:
Canaveral Air Station
Cape Canaveral
Cocoa
Cocoa Beach
Eau Gallie
Grant
Harris Corp
Harris Corporation
Indialantic
Indian Harbor Beach
Indian Harbour Beach
Interchange Square
Malabar
Melbourne
Melbourne Beach
Melbourne Village
Merritt Island
Mims
Palm Bay
Palm Bay West
Patrick Afb
Port Canaveral
Port Saint John
Rockledge
Satellite Beach
Scottsmoor
Sharpes
Suntree
Titusville
Valkaria
Viera
W Cocoa
West Melbourne
BondJamesBond
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My apologies...I didn't intend to choke up this thread with phone# stuff.
We've had success in the past ferreting out the unidentified #'s on the "cells pings" general threads. The most current (#3, iirc) is on the sticky forum.
Also - any info available on whether Amy showed or not that afternoon? Sure seems like they were mobilized to make it happen, IMHO.
I like Shadow's thought re: tow driver commenting on decomp odor of Amy's car.
We've had success in the past ferreting out the unidentified #'s on the "cells pings" general threads. The most current (#3, iirc) is on the sticky forum.
Also - any info available on whether Amy showed or not that afternoon? Sure seems like they were mobilized to make it happen, IMHO.
I like Shadow's thought re: tow driver commenting on decomp odor of Amy's car.
Bond, my best guesses are Clint H, a/k/a Roy (H) (TL's roommate) as I am certain she placed two calls to him during this time and Steve J(?) the ex boyfriend in the Bithlo area who is discussed in the initial RM interview. I will check out the specifics tomorrow and document whatever I find.
mountaintime
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To all of you on this thread...
YOU ARE REALLY GOOD.
I sure hope that LE is as sharp as y'all....it is tempting to email this whole thread to them...considering we have heard nothing from them about Amy's car.
YOU ARE REALLY GOOD.
I sure hope that LE is as sharp as y'all....it is tempting to email this whole thread to them...considering we have heard nothing from them about Amy's car.
BondJamesBond
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Hi, M2C.
Clint: Not saying that there's only one # for him, but, have a # for Clint that she used 12 times through the entire period. IMHO, these calls weren't to him.
Steve: Is there a thread you can direct me to that already discusses him? Interested to learn more.
ETA: Located the following re: Steve J. on another site:
"During Ricardo's' July 25, 2008, interview, he says that Steve was Casey's fling (not officially dating, just seeing each other) from June 2007 through October 2007. He lived with four roommates. Possibly Lake Pickett area, down 50. (Could be the reason LE was asking questions about this area is that there was a set of handwritten directions which appear to by written by Casey. (http://media.myfoxorlando.com/photo.../lg/Evidence_and_incident_reports_Page_35.htm) Need to verify: Also, during the first segment of George’s FBI interview, he kept insisting that one of the photos he had brought was Steve but wasn't sure about the last name. He said it might be Johns but he was sure of the first name Steve. He said Steve went to Puerto Rico with Ricardo and Amy and he thought Steve may be Ricardo’s roommate. It seems he was talking about JP but for some reason kept insisting his name was Steve."
FWIW....the handwritten directions referenced in the quote above are actually directions to Jenna P. a.k.a. "shotgirl"s home. Casey never pinged in that area and IIRC, others have indicated that a statement suggests she never went their either.
Thanks!
Y'all I'm way behind in my reading so I apologize in advance if this has been discussed already -- and if so, would someone please point me in the right direction? TIA:blowkiss:
Here's what just dawned on me: Will W may have LIED about when he met KC!
See handwritten page #1408 (page #6 of transcript):
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/1643417/Waters-William---Statement
Will W answers OCSO's question about the 4th of July party at his place: "First time you ever met her [KC]?" Will W answers "Yeah" and goes on to describe how much he was "totally like a love bug" and that he, as OCSO's follow-up question put it, "dug her right off the bat."
If Will W was with Amy when she went to check on her wrecked car 6/19 and KC was there, too -- then Will W would have met her at that time -- and that may not have even been the first time.
Couple that with the mystery smelly car/Ryan/Dusty stuff OCSO asked Will W about. Have y'all talked about this????
Here's what just dawned on me: Will W may have LIED about when he met KC!
See handwritten page #1408 (page #6 of transcript):
http://www.docstoc.com/docs/1643417/Waters-William---Statement
Will W answers OCSO's question about the 4th of July party at his place: "First time you ever met her [KC]?" Will W answers "Yeah" and goes on to describe how much he was "totally like a love bug" and that he, as OCSO's follow-up question put it, "dug her right off the bat."
If Will W was with Amy when she went to check on her wrecked car 6/19 and KC was there, too -- then Will W would have met her at that time -- and that may not have even been the first time.
Couple that with the mystery smelly car/Ryan/Dusty stuff OCSO asked Will W about. Have y'all talked about this????
<respectfully snipped>
Hi Bond. I see we are thinking along the same lines. Good to see you here!
My early notes are a little murky and I'd have to go back and re-read some older docs to be sure. But If I interpret my own notes correctly, it was an early interview with LA when he was playing LE investigator for OCSO. I questioned the name Steve J because it was the first I heard of it. (Steve shares a last name with a former The View regular who used to be obese.)
IIRC the name came up when asked by OCSO about Bithlo (sp?) area and Steve J lives off Lake Pickett.
This was the same LA/OCSO interview when LA said he had talked to a Heather about work at Kodak/Colorvision.
HTH
BondJamesBond
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FWIW, there are still unknown #'s, but, the first contact between Casey & WW on the cell logs for the WW# we know start ~2:45AM 7/5.
There is a thread regarding the Ryan/Dusty, etc. I'll see if I can find it and post the link here w/ an edit.
ETA: The "William W. Interview" thread is the one I'm seeing. FWIW, in that thread re: Casey meeting Will <7/4...the following was posted: