Retrieving wreckage from AirAsia Flight To Singapore- no survivors recovered #2

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CARIIS said:
It boils down to someone in 1A could get 12 million, while the passenger in 2A could max out 15747

After main deal all this stuff comes into the receipes. claims can then be made in any one of five places: the primary residence of the plaintiff, the destination of the flight, where the ticket was bought, where the carrier is domiciled or its main place of business.

The nationality of each passenger will make a staggering difference to the compensation

Public liability lawyers say the biggest disparity will be the difference between the payouts offered to the relatives of western passengers, compared to those from Asian countries.

American aviation crash attorney Floyd Wisner said passengers and crew from China, Malaysia and Indonesia would fare worse in their claims due to what they are calling a limited view of damages.

'They could evaluate these cases and say a Chinese life is (of) less value than an American life.

Under the multilateral Montreal Convention, relatives of air crash victims from signatory countries are entitled to about $US176,000 in damages without having to prove fault.




Ms Rolfe estimated an American court would pay compensation of between $8-10 million per passenger, while Chinese relatives would likely receive less than $1 million per passenger.

MAL 370:
The lawyer said the airline could pay between $500-750 million in damages to relatives it was probable it had liability insurance of about $1 billion.

It has been reported that $US110 million has been placed in an escrow account and the insurance company settled to make hardship payments to the families of those lost.
Malaysia Airlines said it will not consider compensation payouts until what happened aboard the flight is determined, the Sydney Morning Herald reported.

AN AIr FRance one NOT 447


Within one week of the crash, cash payments ranging from C$1,000 to C$3,700 (all figures in this article in Canadian dollars unless otherwise stated) were given to passengers for interim emergency use. These funds were given to passengers through an emergency centre set up in the Novotel Hotel in Mississauga, near the airport. These payments were independent of the claims process, which has been started for passengers who have not retained counsel. It is expected that the insurers of Air France will pay for all damages as well as extra compensation for having passengers go through the ordeal; however, only amounts of €6,000 to €9,000 have been offered, prompting passengers to turn to the lawsuit to seek legal action. The insurance is handled by the Societé de Gestion & D'Expertises D'Assurances in France. All passengers have also been offered a free round-trip ticket to any Air France destination in the world in the same fare class in which they were originally booked on AF358.
After a lawsuit lasting four and a half years, Air France settled the compensation lawsuit with 184 of the 297 passengers (no crew members included) aboard Flight 358. The compensation is for a total of $12 million. Air France will pay $10 million, and have been released from passengers claim's stemming from the incident, according to the judgement's summary. Airbus and Goodrich, the company that made the emergency evacuation system on the plane will pay $1.65 million and claims against them in a lawsuit have been released.[SUP][35][/SUP]
J.J. Camp, a Vancouver lawyer representing claimants, says passengers seriously harmed with either physical or psychological injuries will be eligible for the maximum payout of $175,000. Passengers who weren't seriously harmed in the crash will receive the minimum payment of between $5,000 and $10,000.[SUP][35]

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price of life in liability claims is daunting

remember Bhopal India? -- killed 1000's overnight and maimed others

average payout $550 per life

"payouts by the Indian government to Bhopal claimants over the years averaged about $550 apiece''

http://www.businessweek.com/article...d-today-would-the-world-react-any-differently
 
Searchers today doubled the area of the Java Sea that is being scanned in the hunt for the wreckage of AirAsia Flight QZ 8501.

Planes and ships are now scouring 13,500 square nautical miles in an effort to find the plane, Malaysia's Chief of Navy Abdul Aziz Jaafar said in a tweet today. The search had been focused on an area that encompassed 6,160 square nautical miles.

Strong currents and rough seas, however, are believed to be moving debris, including what officials said early in the search was what appeared to be a large part of the missing plane.

“We are expecting extra vessels – hopefully they will enter the area today,” Soelistyo said, speaking at a press conference Wednesday. “They have tools to search objects under water. They will be the leading forces to be able to find a majority of the parts of the plane.”

Meanwhile, the Malaysian Navy said it had spotted at least three more bodies floating in the sea but hadn't recovered them.

http://abcnews.go.com/International...ht-qz-8501-recovery-efforts/story?id=27918011
 
SouthAussie said:
Searchers today doubled the area of the Java Sea that is being scanned in the hunt for the wreckage of AirAsia Flight QZ 8501.

Planes and ships are now scouring 13,500 square nautical miles in an effort to find the plane, Malaysia's Chief of Navy Abdul Aziz Jaafar said in a tweet today. The search had been focused on an area that encompassed 6,160 square nautical miles.

Strong currents and rough seas, however, are believed to be moving debris, including what officials said early in the search was what appeared to be a large part of the missing plane.

“We are expecting extra vessels – hopefully they will enter the area today,” Soelistyo said, speaking at a press conference Wednesday. “They have tools to search objects under water. They will be the leading forces to be able to find a majority of the parts of the plane.”

Meanwhile, the Malaysian Navy said it had spotted at least three more bodies floating in the sea but hadn't recovered them.

http://abcnews.go.com/International...ht-qz-8501-recovery-efforts/story?id=27918011
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Gosh when I was reading this I thought the sonar thing must have been total BS, I was kind od expecting something like there was some confusion regarding the sonar report but we will be looking in THAT area right at the start.

David Soucie called Lennon out last night live when Lennon was carrying on about how the plane had been found.
 
newone said:
I found the comments as to paint thickness as an attraction for lightning very interesting--unsure of accuracy of paint vs lightning. So the blackness of the maps just indicates temperature and NOT storm as previously thought. Thank you!
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Re: meteorological conditions over the Java Sea on the morning of 28 December, which weren’t particularly unusual.

That struck me as probably true but historically that part of the world is hideous - for people - for airplanes goodness. But there has to be something to the intesnsity to the weather in that area that day, the headlines over their for the past three or so weeks have been like :

Nov 20, 2014 - SINGAPORE has the infrastructure in place to minimise disruption from flash floods during the oncoming north-east monsoon season, said ... The authority said that, as of Monday, there have been 14 flash flood days this year

news.asiaone.com/.../singapore/pub-ready-tackle-looming-threat-fl...AsiaOne

So I assume that the weather was really bad, but a couple of experts, SOucie/Tiller on ABC have both, more than once however implied that they think the many are going to be surprised when more comes out. (the ceiling thing today was amazizng)

Tongiht Soucie calculated glide path on air (both engines flame out - what happened on HUdson) and they worked which is also fascinating.


.
 
SouthAussie said:
RSBM

$8,300 would be a small fortune to many/most Indonesian people, greg. The minimum wage is about US$22 per week ... annual US$1,163.

But, I agree - that is an insultingly low amount for anyone else ... and possibly for them too.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minimum_wages_by_country
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I hope everyone of all nationalities gets a fair amount. I agree $8300 would be a small fortune but there are children who have lost both their parents. The Airline and the government need to ensure people are adequately compensated for loss of earnings etc. Children can't be expected to be left orphaned end up homeless and left in poverty because of this disaster. It is common in Asia for working adults to support their elderly parents as well so that needs to be considered also. I am sure the families do not care about financial matters at the moment and just want the remains of their loved ones to be found.

Off topic - Yeah the site has been down for me too. I've tried to reply to posts and have been left waiting for ages. Hopefully it will sort itself out.
 
newone said:
I found the comments as to paint thickness as an attraction for lightning very interesting--unsure of accuracy of paint vs lightning. So the blackness of the maps just indicates temperature and NOT storm as previously thought. Thank you!
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I notice that the report explains that black is the coldest zone at around -70/80C ... and it goes on to say ....

"Clouds at -70C will probably be around 50,000ft in this region. In general the severity of a storm is directly proportional to the altitude that the clouds reach,” Proud explained.

“The weather information available to the crew depends very much on the airline. It may range from a ‘significant weather’ chart (which can often be vague or inaccurate) and some data on conditions at the departure and arrival airports up to something much more complex. In most cases the crew will have access to some satellite data showing cloud formations, but this would only be pre-departure and could be several hours old. In-flight they will have their weather radar and also information transmitted over radio from other aircraft and air traffic control in the region, which would give turbulence reports and so on.”


The charts attached to ElleElle's post say that they are prognostic charts, so perhaps do not fully reflect the actual conditions of the morning, as well. Sounds as though it is possible that these pilots may not have had a really clear idea of what they were flying into until they got very close.
 
gregjrichards said:
I hope everyone of all nationalities gets a fair amount. I agree $8300 would be a small fortune but there are children who have lost both their parents. The Airline and the government need to ensure people are adequately compensated for loss of earnings etc. Children can't be expected to be left orphaned end up homeless and left in poverty because of this disaster. It is common in Asia for working adults to support their elderly parents as well so that needs to be considered also.
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Especially when the country has no government benefits for the public to access in times of need either. When I once asked my brother's Indonesian friends about taxes and income tax returns they looked at me blankly. No such thing in their area, apparently. Hence, no govt support systems.
 
My day has arrived! Kathy Griffin on CNN is gonna destroy Richard Qwest - this I shall enjoy! Lov Griffin
 
The sheer volume of flights in the skies over Southeast Asia is putting pressure on outdated air traffic control and on pilots to take risky unilateral action in crises such as that possibly faced by the AirAsia Flight QZ8501......
Pilots who have flown the Indonesia to Singapore route say it's not unusual for delays to requests to increase altitude to avoid bad weather - and for requests to eventually be rejected due to the number of other planes in the area.......

That leaves pilots flying in a region of volatile weather conditions facing a high-risk challenge: when to take matters into their own hands and declare an emergency, allowing them to take action without getting permission from air traffic control......
Most consider that step, which requires them to broadcast a wideband call to other aircraft in the area and that will later be closely scrutinised by regulators, a last resort......
"As a professional pilot, you are obligated to think quickly," a pilot for Quantas Airways who has 25 years experience in the region said........

"If you've signed for the plane, as we put it, you've signed for potentially 300 passengers and millions of dollars worth of aircraft; that's a multibillion dollar liability. Part of the job is to balance the risk and make a snap decision," he said..........

Weighing those risks has become increasingly difficult in Southeast Asia, an area that has seen explosive growth in budget air travel in recent years..........
The number of passengers carried annually across Asia-Pacific has jumped by two-thirds in the past five years to more than one billion, according to the Centre for Asia Pacific Aviation. Budget airlines, which only took to the skies around a dozen years ago, today make up about 60 percent of Southeast Asia's seat capacity. AirAsia and Indonesia's Lion Air have placed record orders with the main plane makers........
Boeing predicts the region's airlines will need about 13,000 new planes over the next two decades, and Airbus expects Asia-Pacific to drive demand over that period."There are certain flight corridors that are over-stressed due to traffic," said a former Singapore Airlines pilot with a decade's flying experience at the carrier. "One certainly would be the Indonesia/Singapore flights which are flown by many different companies and aircraft types at a variety of altitudes and speeds."......

http://www.scmp.com/news/asia/artic...-asia-put-pressure-pilots-air-traffic-control
 
Search teams looking for the sunken wreck of an AirAsia jet off Borneo struggled to resume full-scale operations on Thursday after a small window of fine weather closed, giving way to rising seas which have dogged the search from the start.

"Clouds have started to descend again...and the weather conditions will deteriorate again," search and rescue official Tatang Zaenudin told TV, adding that the conditions would limit air searches. "For the sea search, we will continue."

A team of 47 Indonesian Navy divers is on standby to go down to a large, dark object detected by sonar on the ocean floor, lying just 30-50 metres (100-165 feet) deep.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/01/indonesia-airplane-idUSL3N0UG00Q20150101
 
SouthAussie said:
Search teams looking for the sunken wreck of an AirAsia jet off Borneo struggled to resume full-scale operations on Thursday after a small window of fine weather closed, giving way to rising seas which have dogged the search from the start.

"Clouds have started to descend again...and the weather conditions will deteriorate again," search and rescue official Tatang Zaenudin told TV, adding that the conditions would limit air searches. "For the sea search, we will continue."

A team of 47 Indonesian Navy divers is on standby to go down to a large, dark object detected by sonar on the ocean floor, lying just 30-50 metres (100-165 feet) deep.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/01/01/indonesia-airplane-idUSL3N0UG00Q20150101
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someone should have some drone subs or mini subs -- they do have a navy


http://news.usni.org/2013/11/13/asias-submarine-race
 
CARIIS said:
I just hope the "officials" dont try to hide any accurate information;

Because aviation has gotten so safe the last decade, there are not many accidents to make natl headlines. Prior to MAL370 straight news reports especially in the first month after a major air carrier accident were pretty straightforward public/media wise. At this point there was nothing being "hidden".
In commercial stuff the sleaziness came in typically 18-24 months afterward, not in the media spotlight, when NTSB "probable cause" was cemented, and published in the final report.

Then it get gets sleazy. Pilot error very common, (and true in the context of how much we have learned as it relates to human factors in aviation accidents). 20 years ago this one would have probably been an inclement weather probable cause.

But since MA LA 370 and its mysterious ways , now the basic feeling is there is a lot of "lying" form the onset. None of what happened in the first three weeks of MAL , all the overt lying (all behavior has meaning) had never happened before).ANd cause of that they media focus is not not trusting. When there is nothing neararious or deviant going on, there is no agenda, to not find out, and have whats found reported. They are tradegies.

Prior to all the mal370 shannigans the headlines this week would have been like:
Air Asia flight crashes into the ocean
262 feared dead in AIr Asia crash

none of this missing, vanished,"stuff" would ever be in or a part of the story. ANd becasue this is a aviation accident, a plane crash,what has happened for eternity, after some time, wreckage was located- becasue the plane crashed and we now proceed with whats and why

with todays search technolgy, airplanes that have crashed are located. The media is confusing two very importaint things here. IN the past there was not the technology to look for and find downed planes in remote places. None of those planes vanished, they were just unable to be found.That is a very important distiction that gets lost whenver an aviation event has happened since 370.

A this week illisturates, today our technology does affort us the capabiltiy to locate crashed planes in tough areas. Only planes that are reported to crash, that have not, vanish. We certainly have the capablity - heck Google earth to locate any plane crash on land anywhere, and as this week clearly shows we can now do so under water-pretty strgihtforward!

Aviation accident investigation got more sophisticated, it became clear that rarely was there one thing that cause a major commercial accident, but a chain link of events.

IN this context, if any one of the links were removed, and all the other links remained an accident would not have occurred.

easiest way to share this angle is to just do some links in chain!

-they will start with what was the airlines basic unspoken rules about monsoon flying
-they will talk to a lot of crews to ascertain the degree of subtle pressure flight crews felt by management to proceed
- they will look for weather related incidents to see how this pressure works in real life on the line
-they will explore ways Air Asia communicates its weather info and its warnings
-they will explore each indie flight crew propensity to be "driven", take chances, to complete the segment on time
-they will be looking for colleague statements like he was by the book, or one time when i flew with him i def did not think we should have departed – that kind of stuff
-they will ask friends and family how pressure their loved one felt to complete – did he feel their might be consequences if the he canceled the flight
-were there covert pressures to keep fuel reserves as tight as poss on each flight $
-if they had internal weather folks what were the policies procedures, they will get the manuals and read them
- what was the airlines weather (upper management in that department) notions about delaying or canceling
-what percentage of flights did that dept actual cancel or hold or reroute prior to departure
- was their friction between line captains and the department
-did flight crews feel respected by the dept
-from all departments and employees what is the overall feel as it relates to getting flights out period
that is one link in the chain


another link would be the aircraft itself
-same deal, what is the maintenance dept staff notions about management pushing them to delay repairs if it meant a cancel
-did not maintenance folks feel supported when mechanic did not release an aircraft for flight
-did line mechanics appeared pressured by maintenance management to meet numbers
-were shortcuts encouraged? OK? firmly prohibited
-did line crews feel as if there shifts were staffed correctly or did they feel understaffed chronically

another link in the chain
did the particular aircraft, historically, show a particular issue that kept popping up
-how was it addressed
-did it cease the problem or did it keep reoccurring
-what was managements response to more expensive maintenance recommendations
-what calibration testing standards do they use to assure reliability in radar altimeters etc
-do staff performing those calibrations feel supported if they verbalize a concern or rec a replacement
another link

record keeping link
- did the maintenance debt records "feel" as if it was an effort to look good, or to actually track each aircraft medical history accurately and timely.
- did staff feel like their sign offs were being reviewed or rubber stamped by management


another link
each crew members life
-in this case the funeral will be huge
-were they close
-what was pilots behavior like after funeral -
-did many of his colleagues know about the funeral
-how many hours he sleep
-did he smoke
-on mess-
-what was his marriage like-
-his relation to his children
-was he respected by peers
-did colleagues like flying whit him or prefer someone else
-what climate did he create in the cockpit
-did other feel it is OK to bring up a concern or would they tend to keep quiet
-had the two pilots on this segment flown tighter before, how often, what was their relationship like
-how others who have flown with each of them rate their skills, are they rule benders, or strictly by the book
-

another link
-time of departure
-body clock issues
-had the flight crew been on the 3 in the morning schedule for some time
-how did they feel about it
-did they complain about it
-on the cockpit voice recorder was there i am tired, i wish i slept last night stuff
-excessive yawning heard on tape
-asking for three cups of coffee before push back
-time went to bed each night the previous week/time of awakening
-either wear glasses -anyone notice if another crew member appeared to be having a hard time reading material
-complaint of a headache sore foot, fight with child that morning
-car wouldn’t start on way in


another link
-hassle with boarding
-fuel load issue
-baggage-
-unruly passenger
-conflict with gate agent-
-concern in maintenance log for that aircraft
-argument over that item
-affair with cabin crew member on the flight
-trouble closing the cabin door

another link
communication with control tower
-any difficulty understanding each other
-any off hand comments in cockpit regarding the controller handling the flight
-overt tension between them
-reverse it for the air traffic control and the flight crew


another link
-how much conversation about weather in cockpit
-difference of opinion between crew members about how to handle weather before takeoff
-final plan established between the two regarding what would occur as it relates to the weather once airborne


another link
once in the air
-did he dialog about the weather ahead indicate increasing concern
-fear
-discussion about turning back and canceling-
-any discussion between the two regarding reports from planes ahead of them
-how many other diversion requests had they overheard
-what reports were they hearing from pilots ahead of them about conditions ahead
-dialog between the two crew members regarding the effects of the weather on the aircraft along the way
-what sounds were being heard, turbulence, wind shelf wipers
-trouble maintain heading and speeds before getting close
-cabin crew questions about when to start service – delay or proceed?


Another link
-dialog right before requesting diversion between pilots
-response after climb refused
-discussion about the left turn appearing as if issue mitigated
-response when seeing the cloud for the first time after the divert (panic/feeling it was more of a hassle or a serious situation
-cockpit microphone noises at this time
-hear maintain control of aircraft becoming more difficult


etc etc
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That's brilliant information. I agree there is a hell of a lot the general public don't come across. If you can your hands on an aviation magazine called "chrash comics", there are also a lot hilarious things that happen as well.
 
SouthAussie said:
The governor of Indonesia’s East Java province canceled New Year’s Eve celebrations in the region, according to the BBC. A public memorial is slated for Wednesday evening in Surabaya.


And here are the 40 people again, in an updated new article in usually up-to-date and reliable publication. :confused:
I guess only time will tell, maybe they have not been officially received by the rescue centre yet, but I do hope they find everyone.

Authorities have recovered at least 40 bodies from the search zone. Some of the victims were wearing life jackets, fueling speculation that at least some of the plane’s passengers may have been alive after the plane went down and before it sank. Officials have wondered why the pilots did not issue a distress call, even though it appears there may have been some forewarning that the aircraft was in trouble.

http://www.ibtimes.com/airasia-flig...s-held-victims-surabaya-new-years-eve-1770736


And in this new article.

There are reports of at least 40 bodies being found in the Java Sea, seven of which have been retrieved.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/12/31/airasia-flight-qz8501_n_6400174.html
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Aviation mantra….aviate, navigate, communicate. My guess is they did not have time and were battling to fly the A/C …no time to don lifejackets either. We fly solo and have had many bird strikes, engine shutdowns, aborted take-offs, aborted landings, go-arounds. Whilst I know what is happening sometimes you may not hear from the Pilot for up to 3 minutes ….and your sitting thinking please just say something. The longer there is no communication obviously the worse it is for those on board. Communication will come last.
 
HI EMerates!

Journalists are suppossed to be about the story, the fact. I never liked Lemmon - he is passive aggressive and controlling in his interviews. BUt last night , was so not ok - he works at a joint called CNN! He is hugely responsible for spreading the myth that the plane had been found. During the broadcast , I had sensed tension (before this BS broke) between Sousie and him, but then concluded Sousie had been with talking heads for the last 12 hours - maybe he is exhausted.

Then the sonar thing "broke". I could see Sousie being uncomfortable before he , after a break, he finally challenged Lemmon by saying he just got a text from a friend reminding him that there were a lot of shipwrecks, and planes in the Java Sea and maybe we should wait.

Well , Sousie was evidenty as we now know - in the loop, with knowledgeable aviation people, not a prima dona who wants to be the one to break a story , on his show, even if it is not accurate. Thats not a journalist. His drama, and CNN crawl at the bottom last "Indonesia finds plane", felt uncomfortable, too declarative, to facty , in 45 seconds, for it to just be "found". But hey great!

A therspists biggest asset is not training, its intuitiveness. Today , to slowly over time , learn that my sensing capabities were eveidently right on the mark (it was total BS), frustrated me . It is not ok .

So I wanted to learn more about Lennon, who I never cared for , I felt validated, in terms of how not ok last night was, on a story of this magnitude, in the climate the world is in. As an aviation enthusatit since 13 , yes I acknolwedge THIS story has different implications coming off of the mAL 370 escapade - but forget your ego dude.

Here is what I found:
From the Columbia Journalism Review - the bible of braodcasting and print magazine in AMerica. He was honored.


When life gives you Lemon
As one of the most recognizable anchors on CNN, Don Lemon has helped lead the cable network’s coverage of the biggest stories of the year. Live television is exceedingly difficult to produce, of course, but Lemon’s gaffes this year offer a case study in how to choose words wisely — or not.
On March 20, he asked guests whether Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 could have been swallowed by a black hole: “I know it’s preposterous, but is it preposterous?” He later compared spanking children to training dogs and probed similarities between the release of US Army POW Bowe Bergdahl and the Showtime series Homeland. When an alleged Bill Cosby rape victim appeared on his show on Nov. 18, he lectured, “You know, there are ways not to perform oral sex if you didn’t want to do it…Meaning the use of teeth, right?” Less than a week later, as protests turned violent in Ferguson, MO, he described the scene: “Obviously, there’s a smell of marijuana in the air.” Lemon’s job isn’t easy. But he’s earned a DART for going there. Obviously.
- See more at: http://www.cjr.org/darts_and_laurels/the_worst_journalism_of_2014.php#sthash.W6YY3kqf.dpuf
 
emirates1957 said:
That's brilliant information. I agree there is a hell of a lot the general public don't come across. If you can your hands on an aviation magazine called "chrash comics", there are also a lot hilarious things that happen as well.
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I just love the NTSB! As a kid, to this day , I have no idea how I knew to do this. This was 40 years ago, when the govt worked for the people. I would write the NTSB, request a specfic accidnet report. Back then they were called blue cover reports - meaning that was the FINAL.
They are amazing reads. All accidents are a "mystery". The get every second down. They do not , in the first half of the report, do anything other than give the information. Then the second half of each report is analyasis. It is amazing reading - it is the perfect mystery , figured out explained. But the writing style is very neutral, which leaves the reader to make own conclusions.
Then they do reccomdnations. THey have no legal authority, but they are IMO collecitily, the most dedicated public servants around. Their mandate and want - safer air travel. The agency holds these values dearly. All these decades later, in this horrible govt climate, they remain dedcated.
The amazing decrease in aviation numbers the last two decades is directly corrleated with them. They have saved lives, they are free from political crap, they reccomend what they need to, and then it goes to the the FAA , who is so govt eee messes it up and does not follow any of their reccomdations for about a decade, a couple of houndred deaths, and then the FAA finally implements what these folk told them they should have done a decade earlier.

If these is gonna be a replay (there will be some distance cause the French equivalent of our NTSB handled 447 - talk about currupt oye that group is skilled but Airbus is out of France - hello problem!) And the 447 deal was a racket - thats why the pivot tubes were not replaced, and then when they were only on the 340 330 series - just a mess~

Sosie at CNN held similair role at faa - investigating dozens of aircraft accidents the last couple of decades and has been true and blue .

This guy -Greg Feith- superstar at NTSB in his day. CBS or NBC grabbed him, I follow him on this story . He is real good!

Emerates, my sense is you lov aviation like I do . I am going to go for AIr FLorida flight 90 crash - it was amazing.

Here is link to NTSB final:

Goggle this

Aircraft Accident Report: Air Florida, Inc., Boeing 737-222, N62AF, Collision with 14th Street Bridge, Near Washington National Airport, Washington, D.C., January 13, 1982 National Transportation Safety Board report (PDF, 140 pages)

Enjoy- great mysteries unraveled!


 
AirAsia flight's behaviour 'on the edge of logic'.

The Airbus 320-200 climbed in a way that was impossible to achieve by the pilot, adding that it subsequently "didn't fall out of the sky like an aeroplane".

"It was like a piece of metal being thrown down. It's really hard to comprehend … The way it goes down is bordering on the edge of logic".

Mr Soejatman said that at least as baffling was "the extremely low ground speed" which was as low as 61 knots during the descent. This would suggest the plane was heading almost straight down, explaining why it was found in the water just 10km from its last point of radar contact.

The new claims lend weight to the impression that the plane was subject to extraordinary forces from the weather.

1420093154301.png

Leaked information on AirAsia flight QZ8501 from the air crash investigation team,
provided by Indonesian aviation analyst Gerry Soejatman.

Mr Soejatman said the plane was equipped with a Mode S radar, a relatively new piece of equipment which sends more comprehensive information, in real time, from aircraft to ground.

Leaked figures show the plane climbed at a virtually unprecedented rate of 6000 to 9000 feet per minute, and "you can't do that at altitude in an Airbus 320 with pilot action".

The most that could normally be expected would be 1000 to 1500 feet on a sustained basis, with up to 3000 feet in a burst, he said.

The plane then fell at an even more incredible rate: 11,000 feet per minute with bursts of up to 24,000 feet per minute.

"We can't rule out that the data is wrong," he said, but added that they came from the aircraft itself, transmitted over the Mode S radar.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/airasia-flights-behaviour-on-the-edge-of-logic-20150101-12gk9a.html
 
Brightbird said:
Great article. It supports the updraft/downdraft theory.

http://m.theage.com.au/world/airasia-flights-behaviour-on-the-edge-of-logic-20150101-12gk9a.html

The AirAsia jet in which 162 people lost their lives this week behaved in ways "bordering on the edge of logic" according to Indonesian aviation analyst Gerry Soejatman citing leaked information from the air crash investigation team.
Click to expand...

Haha .. snap, Brightbird. I just posted about the same thing! So interesting.
 
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