AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot to death, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #8

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Bluebythec said:
I've been turning this over in my head trying to come up with a scenario that fits what little verified info we have. Someone is fixated on Jayme and has been observing long enough to know that there ware 2 cars in the family and who drives which one. He sees that the Dad's car is missing and assumes the Mom and Jayme are home alone. He brings a gun for intimidation only and has no real intention of using it. It's been said that many don't lock their doors in rural areas so he's able to walk in unimpeded and locks the door behind him. Jayme is in her room. Maybe she's drinking a cold soda. Mom is in the living room watching tv/reading with her cell phone on a table. Perp walks in and points the gun at Mom and says just cooperate and you won't get hurt. Jayme hears the commotion and comes out. He forces them in to the bathroom and secures mom to a chair. While he's doing this the Dad pulls up in the driveway and goes to the front door but it's locked. Mom and Jayme start yelling to him and he kicks in the door. Now the perp, who I think is young, starts to panic and immediately shoots the Dad. The impact of the shot spins him around so it later appears that he was *inside* the door when shot. Mom and Jayme start screaming and he turns his attention to the Mom. Jayme is able to grab her mom's cell phone and dials 911. Mom is screaming at the perp, who has the gun pointed at her "You don't have to do this." Jayme is screaming "we need help." The perps sees Jayme with the phone and knocks it out of her hand and proceeds to shoot the Mom. What was heard on the phone by 911 was "you don't have to do this" followed by "we need help" causing them to think someone was attempting suicide. The perp grabs Jayme and drags her through the woods to a car which he had parked there earlier. He forces her in the trunk and drives to a remote cabin he'd prepared beforehand.

That's the best I can come up with using known facts. I'd be interested in exploring this with all of you.
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Very good theory

Why are the police so sure she’s alive though? This leads me to believe - as is pretty much always the case- that’s they know more than we know.
 
thesnowflakesparkles said:
The community is on edge and in shock. I have lived in major cities and moved to this area about five years ago. While this would not have been out of character for some of those places, it is absolutely unheard of here. A lot of the speculation has no basis in fact and is fear motivated.

That being said, I have heard meth involvement (by the perpetrator, not the Closs family), random, sex offender, online predator, etc. Basically every theory seen here. They family was well liked as I noted before which is why this is so strange. They were the average, everyday household in these parts.

<modsnip - not victim friendly>even before the Sheriff stated she is innocent, the locals I had spoken with described her the same way-shy, introverted, incapable of something so horrific. I am 100% convinced she is the unfortunate victim and I am frustrated she hasn't been found yet.

Sorry if this isn't very helpful, I don't really have any new theories and I haven't even made up my mind what I think happened yet. I love hearing all of your theories, though!
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It is helpful, imo. Thank you. Locals are likely as baffled as we are. And the impression of Jayme that we have seems to be true.

So, we aren't on a wrong track with our speculations....but we don't know what the right track is either.

jmo
 
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SJ16321 said:
I think it's something similar although I wouldn't say we can guess down to such small details with the limited evidence we have. I'd never rule anything out until the evidence does but I'm convinced the perp went there for Jayme. None of the other theories make sense with them taking her.

The perp must know her fairly well or seen her around a lot and be absolutely obsessed with her. If this is just your standard paedophile then I'm sure there's plenty of other little 13 year old girls to grab in the local area who wouldn't require the effort this did. You'd also expect the majority of paedophiles to wait and seize an opportunity, rather than brazenly grab her from her own home.

I think the perp went there to get Jayme and the homicides happened because A) the perp panicked as you've mentioned in your post or B) he was so obsessed with Jayme that nothing was going to stop him taking her.
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unless he couldn’t bring himself to kill a child? Why do the police think she’s still alive? I’m glad they do but there’s something that is leading them to this conclusion.
 
Checking for news. Not seeing anything new. I do see a whole lot of assumptions happening in this discussion. I find it helpful to go back and watch and read the statements that have only been made by LE. I'm thinking of this in an entirely different way than what I've been reading in this forum. I agree with everyone else that I hope Jaymi is found soon and is safe. Praying for that.
 
EJB123456 said:
I wish we knew more about the timeline. I have similarly aged children and there is basically zero chance they’d be awake at midnight or 12:30am on a school night. And we’ve had the doorbell ring, I’ve screamed at sporting events on TV, a locked interior door has been kicked open and nothing will wake them up.

ETA: That’s not to say an extended situation would not eventually wake her up. I’m just thinking out loud. If all of this happened close to midnight - she’d be in pajamas with no shoes and have to get out of bed from a deep sleep. Certainly not hanging out drinking pop in her room.
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(I know the soda is just rumor as of now. But if it has some truth to it, it also could’ve been a cold flavored water in a can, making it more acceptable at nighttime)
 
Inthedetails said:
It is helpful, imo. Thank you. Locals are likely as baffled as we are. And the impression of Jayme that we have seems to be true.

So, we aren't on a wrong track with our speculations....but we don't know what the right track is either.

jmo
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( I remember in Jessica Ridgeway’s case there were alllllll kinda of local rumors which were not true.)
 
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margarita25 said:
Hi the snowflake sparkles,

Gosh do I know your hat horrible feeling about a community being an edge, I have experienced that in a horrific local abduction and murder case. The feelings of fear, etc are indescribable and my heart really goes out to all of you. Just now that LEbis doing their absolute best and has amazing resources at hand. Thank you for being with us and for helping with a map, etc.
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Thank you, I appreciate it. I realize posting on an internet forum isn't action in the way of finding her but it still feels like I am doing something.
 
Inthedetails said:
Okay, this is another thought:

The objective was to abduct and keep Jayme and also kill the parents because the parents would be able to figure out who abducted their daughter. In other words, the abductor was known to the parents. So, in order to not get caught, the parents had to be killed (as opposed to killed simply because they were home at the time).

justanothertheorytoconsider, jmo, speculation
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This makes the most sense as to why the parents were killed.
 
EJB123456 said:
I wish we knew more about the timeline. I have similarly aged children and there is basically zero chance they’d be awake at midnight or 12:30am on a school night. And we’ve had the doorbell ring, I’ve screamed at sporting events on TV, a locked interior door has been kicked open and nothing will wake them up.

ETA: That’s not to say an extended situation would not eventually wake her up. I’m just thinking out loud. If all of this happened close to midnight - she’d be in pajamas with no shoes and have to get out of bed from a deep sleep. Certainly not hanging out drinking pop in her room.
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Same here. I always say my daughter wouldn't wake up if a bomb went off.
 
Just a few comments on the dog. Dogs have different temperaments and not all will react the same. I had a dog that was terrified of thunder and other loud noises and definitely would have hid if he heard gunshots. I like to play a game with my current dog when I come home after work. I will come in the outside door and there's another door into the kitchen which is where she is when I'm gone. I will knock on the door and say "hey" in a real deep voice and open it a tiny crack. She always knows it's me except for one time, my voice must have been deeper. I could see her slink away into the other room. When my six year old granddaughter comes, she likes to do this now. We can see the dog jumping up and down with her tail wagging and she knows it's us.

Another possibility is the dog was kept in a crate at night. Although I don't do this, I know several people that do. As for Jayme, I've seen pictures of her with that dog and you can see that she loved it. IMO, I don't think there is any possibility that she would have willingly walked out that door and left that dog alone, knowing that her parents were deceased.
 
justwannahelp said:
unless he couldn’t bring himself to kill a child? Why do the police think she’s still alive? I’m glad they do but there’s something that is leading them to this conclusion.
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Guessing it's because she wasn't killed at the scene. That would mean whoever broke in that didn't come for the express purpose of killing everyone.
 
SharonNeedles said:
The first mention of a possible suicide was from the first officer at the scene who saw the father’s body. This was an initial impression only. The officer at that point would have only known that he was responding to an open line 911 call and possible domestic disturbance. Upon seeing a body with an apparent gunshot wound and nobody else around he described it as a possible suicide attempt in his communications to dispatch.

To be clear - nobody thought this was a possible suicide before the officers arrived, and obviously nobody thought it was a possible suicide as the crime scene unfolded.
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It was interesting to see the whole “wrong house” on google maps unfold via posts yesterday.
 
cj1132 said:
Just a few comments on the dog. Dogs have different temperaments and not all will react the same. I had a dog that was terrified of thunder and other loud noises and definitely would have hid if he heard gunshots. I like to play a game with my current dog when I come home after work. I will come in the outside door and there's another door into the kitchen which is where she is when I'm gone. I will knock on the door and say "hey" in a real deep voice and open it a tiny crack. She always knows it's me except for one time, my voice must have been deeper. I could see her slink away into the other room. When my six year old granddaughter comes, she likes to do this now. We can see the dog jumping up and down with her tail wagging and she knows it's us.

Another possibility is the dog was kept in a crate at night. Although I don't do this, I know several people that do. As for Jayme, I've seen pictures of her with that dog and you can see that she loved it. IMO, I don't think there is any possibility that she would have willingly walked out that door and left that dog alone, knowing that her parents were deceased.
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Dog in a crate is a possibility I totally overlooked, thanks for bringing that up!
 
I've been all over the map theorizing in my head. After reading more of everyone's posts the past few days...... the family is described as pretty regular and even generous in what little information has been posted here about the family. What if they'd been helping out a friend or family member. That person could be the one losing their mortgage or rent at the casino or buying meth. I could see how gambling or meth could be an issue here, but maybe it's from this perspective. One or both of the Closs' finally said no more. We can't afford to keep helping. Person now desperate or raging or both does this. Not sure how that fits with Jayme missing. Maybe they couldn't kill her so they took her.

Thoughts anyone. Is this viable if so, where's Jayme?

All my own speculation not based on anything special I know.
 
SharonNeedles said:
Do you realize what a tightly regulated business a casino is? Every employee goes through an extensive background investigation to get a gaming license and any subsequent criminal activity can get that license immediately revoked. If I get pulled over for a DUI tonight I’ll lose my license before I go to work tomorrow - even before a guilty verdict. Not to mention the fact that I’m on camera from the minute I arrive on property until I leave. If I pick my nose it’s on camera.
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Just wondering, how different would a casino would be operations wise if it were a Native American casino? Is it still required to run the same way say as a Vegas casino? Tia.
 
MKZoo said:
Just to clarify. We have no indication at all that Jayme was adopted. We also have no indication that she is not the biological child of both JC and DC.

And frankly if she’s not the biological child of DC, I’ll eat my hat because she looks just like her mom. Jmo.
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And inherited her cleft chin from her dad James Closs. On him, his cleft chin shows as a dimple per the one pic I've seen.
 
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