AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #11

[Lillymac]

Surely a phone would not be pinging now. The battery would be flat. Or do you think that it was in that area when it last pinged

Is there a cell tower in the area they are searching today?

 

[MassGuy]

He doesnt know why but he firmly believes Denise was the intended target because if she wasnt and James was there would be no need for the killer to enter the home.

Imo that does make more sense to me. They wouldnt have to risk even entering the home since James was shot right at his door if the intended target was James all along.

Jmo

I do understand his logic. But I’m still confounded with the kidnapping of Jayme, and why this guy would have chosen to commit this crime, this way.

Furhman seems to be indicating that this crime was personal, but if that was in fact the case, I’d expect some movement by now.

Time will tell.

 

[Inthedetails]

Okay I know some of you may not care for Mark Furhman at times including nyself but the thread was closed at the time he was being interviewed on Fox.

Since he spoke I can't get out of my mind what he said because it ALL made so much common sense and none of it I had ever even considered.

Anyway for those who may be interested I will try to post it in my own words for you.

He said he believes the evidence shows that Denise was the intended target. Here is the clear reason he gave. If James had been the intended target the mission would have been over right at the front door with no need to enter the home. They would have shot James and quickly left probably before Denise could have even seen who it was.

But he said they purposefully went inside to murder Denise. He also said the crime scene can reveal who may be the intended target. Such as if one victim suffered more gunshot wounds than another victim. Or if one victim had other type of injuries done by the killer beyond the gunshots themselves.

He said he does believe that Jayme has been killed and thinks the police know that too and know they are in recovery mode now.

He also said this which makes sense to me. He said the experts on the ground have the ability in less than a day's time to know if there are any vehicles in this county of 45000 that matches the 2 vehicles in question.

So he thinks the police already know the vehicles aren't from the county this happened in. He said they will go county by county searching the DMV data base looking for possible matches and interviewing anyone who may own the same type of vehicles crossing them off one by one.

So what do all of you think about this? I found all of it so facisinating. Jmo though

This is very interesting insight, OBE. And it's info we can keep in mind in future cases. I certainly did not see the crime from this point of view. I still lean toward both parents being the target (to get Jayme), but will keep in mind that Denise could've been the primary target in all this.

It's important, imo, to learn something from each case. I'm not here to wallow in tragedy and violence, but to learn.

Thanks for sharing that.

jmo

eta: corrections

 

[Cardinal47]

He doesnt know why but he firmly believes Denise was the intended target because if she wasnt and James was there would be no need for the killer to enter the home.

Imo that does make more sense to me. They wouldnt have to risk even entering the home since James was shot right at his door if the intended target was James all along.

Jmo

We all know Mark Furman has a lot of FBI and LE connections so maybe he's heard something leading him in that direction.

 

[Mom24]

Jumping off your post BeeGirl, is anyone else surprised that JC doesn't have more of an online presence? The only other things I've been able to find are a pinterest and instagram account in her name.
Has anyone else been able to find anything?

 

[stargazer17]

Does anyone know when the next news conference will be?

 

[Seattle1]

GUILTY - NH - Abby Hernandez, 14, North Conway, 9 October 2013 - #15

Didn't realize we're able to use her name now (that's why I used her initials)

She spoke out and gave an interview (i.e., identified herself). I'm also not sure if she's still a minor.
Abigail Hernandez speaks about her 2013 abduction in TV interview - The Boston Globe

 

[thesnowflakesparkles]

Abigail Hernandez. Kidnapped, held for almost a year then returned home.

GUILTY - NH - Abby Hernandez, 14, North Conway, 9 October 2013 - #15

Didn't realize we're able to use her name now (that's why I used her initials)

Thank you both. I am interested in reading about similar cases and I hadn't heard about this one.

 

[Seattle1]

Does anyone know when the next news conference will be?

Revised:




Barron County Sheriff's Department

Just now ·
Press Release

October 23, 2018

Sheriff Chris Fitzgerald thanks the 2,000 volunteers who are assisting law enforcement today in the expanded routine search for articles of evidentiary value that may be related to the disappearance of 13 year old Jayme Closs from our community here in Barron, Wisconsin. Jayme remains missing & endangered. The outpouring of hope and support from the community and law enforcement has been overwhelming.

We have received over 1,400 tips to date, of those, 1,100 have been closed so far, and we are aggressively working the others. As the search continues we have recovered items collected by our volunteer search groups and assessing those items. None of the items collected, thus far, appear to be connected to the disappearance.

There will be a news briefing, in person, tomorrow, Wednesday, October 24, 2018 at 4:00 p.m. at the Barron County Sheriff’s Office, 1420 State Highway 25 North. The briefing will be hosted by Sheriff Chris Fitzgerald, along FBI Special Agent in Charge, Justin Tolomeo, and a representative of Wisconsin Department of Criminal Investigation.

Please continue to provide us your tips, every tip is important: 1-855-744-3879 or jaymetips@co.barron.wi.us

Per Chris Fitzgerald, Barron County Sheriff

 

[saralsim]

Jumping off your post BeeGirl, is anyone else surprised that JC doesn't have more of an online presence? The only other things I've been able to find are a pinterest and instagram account in her name.
Has anyone else been able to find anything?

My 13 year old daughter isn't allowed social media - my almost 15 year old son was just allowed to get instagram (but only instagram) this year when he started 9th grade.

ETA she does have friends on social media at that age, but it's definitely not the norm. IMO

 

[PommyMommy]

I'm pretty sure this has been posted, but all of the articles published today are being updated. This one has had several photos and videos added.

2,000 volunteers join expanded search for missing Wisconsin teen Jayme Closs
Volunteers are conducting a grid search of the area surrounding the Closs home on Highway 8 in Barron. They are searching nearby fields and woods, as well as any outdoor structures that are open.

 

[pinkfly]

Okay I know some of you may not care for Mark Furhman at times including myself but the thread was closed at the time he was being interviewed on Fox.

Since he spoke I can't get out of my mind what he said because it ALL made so much common sense and none of it I had ever even considered.

Anyway for those who may be interested I will try to post it in my own words for you.

He said he believes the evidence shows that Denise was the intended target. Here is the clear reason he gave. If James had been the intended target the mission would have been over right at the front door with no need to enter the home. They would have shot James and quickly left probably before Denise could have even seen who it was.

But he said they purposefully went inside to murder Denise. He also said the crime scene can reveal who may be the intended target. Such as if one victim suffered more gunshot wounds than another victim. Or if one victim had other type of injuries done by the killer beyond the gunshots themselves.

He said he does believe that Jayme has been killed and thinks the police know that too and know they are in recovery mode now.

He also said this which makes sense to me. He said the experts on the ground have the ability in less than a day's time to know if there are any vehicles in this county of 45000 that matches the 2 vehicles in question.

So he thinks the police already know the vehicles aren't from the county this happened in. He said they will go county by county searching the DMV data base looking for possible matches and interviewing anyone who may own the same type of vehicles crossing them off one by one.

So what do all of you think about this? I found all of it so facisinating. Jmo though

Wow! I had not given much thought to it being about Denise but I do have respect for Mark Furhman. If this is true I guess Jayme could have been taken because he just didn't need to kill her.....but then what? Where? and How Long?

 

[HarvestMoon]

This is very interesting insight, OBE. And it's info we can keep in mind in future cases. I certainly did not see the crime from this point of view. I still lean toward both parents being the target (to get Jayme), but will keep in mind that Denise could've been the primary target in all this.

It's important, imo, to learn something from each case. I'm not here to wallow in tragedy and violence, but to learn.

Thanks for sharing that.

jmo

eta: corrections

" Wallow in tragedy" Geeze, how can one not feel for two parents and their child in the supposed safety of their home, being killed and the child taken in the middle of the night. I for one don't wallow, but I do everyday throughout the day-check to see if this 13 year old (now orphan) has been found. On Saturday two people taken down will have a double funeral. That's quite sad.

 

[BeeGirl]

Jumping off your post BeeGirl, is anyone else surprised that JC doesn't have more of an online presence? The only other things I've been able to find are a pinterest and instagram account in her name.
Has anyone else been able to find anything?

I've thought that, too. I know, though, that Facebook requires its users to be at least 13, so it wouldn't surprise me if she was relatively new to the world of social media and hadn't had much time to make a larger digital footprint. On your same vein of thinking, though, I have noted the lack of selfies on her account, which does make me wonder if she has her own phone.

Source: Self - have many teenage relatives and selfies seem to be a cornerstone of SM if they have a phone.

 

[Mollyandme]

I didn't hear him comment on why he thinks she was taken but I could have missed that part HM since my fur babies starting barking at the post lady for a few seconds or so.

Mark has many connections in law enforcement including FBI agents. Often he talks directly to those who are on the ground working the cases.

I got the impression this is what he is being told about the crime scene but that's just the impression I got since he usually does have contacts he has been speaking with that are there.

Jmo

I think if he feels comfortable saying he believes DC was the target and if he has contacts that he had been speaking to, then his opinion that DC was the target might be correct. I think LE and the FBI have a pretty good idea who the target was based on what they found at the scene regarding injuries, as well as victimology for all three victims and all that entails. The only thing that doesn't make sense to me, as others have also posted, is why take Jayme from the scene and harm her in another location? It just seems so risky to bring a 13 year old child with them from the home, but then again, it's impossible for people like ourselves who would never intentionally harm anyone to apply logic to an UNSUB who could commit such a heinous crime to begin with. Thanks for posting this info! I hope and pray Jayme is alive

 

[crhedBngr]

Okay I know some of you may not care for Mark Furhman at times including myself but the thread was closed at the time he was being interviewed on Fox.

Since he spoke I can't get out of my mind what he said because it ALL made so much common sense and none of it I had ever even considered.

Anyway for those who may be interested I will try to post it in my own words for you.

He said he believes the evidence shows that Denise was the intended target. Here is the clear reason he gave. If James had been the intended target the mission would have been over right at the front door with no need to enter the home. They would have shot James and quickly left probably before Denise could have even seen who it was.

But he said they purposefully went inside to murder Denise. He also said the crime scene can reveal who may be the intended target. Such as if one victim suffered more gunshot wounds than another victim. Or if one victim had other type of injuries done by the killer beyond the gunshots themselves.

He said he does believe that Jayme has been killed and thinks the police know that too and know they are in recovery mode now.

He also said this which makes sense to me. He said the experts on the ground have the ability in less than a day's time to know if there are any vehicles in this county of 45000 that matches the 2 vehicles in question.

So he thinks the police already know the vehicles aren't from the county this happened in. He said they will go county by county searching the DMV data base looking for possible matches and interviewing anyone who may own the same type of vehicles crossing them off one by one.

So what do all of you think about this? I found all of it so facisinating. Jmo though

Ocean: Thanks for sharing this. Furhman has his good points, and I respect what he is saying here. (I won't comment on other things he's said - this is not the time nor place for that).

I, too, find it fascinating. Time will tell if he is spot on.

Still hoping and praying Jayme is found alive.

 

[Gardener1850]

Okay I know some of you may not care for Mark Furhman at times including nyself but the thread was closed at the time he was being interviewed on Fox.

Since he spoke I can't get out of my mind what he said because it ALL made so much common sense and none of it I had ever even considered.

Anyway for those who may be interested I will try to post it in my own words for you.

He said he believes the evidence shows that Denise was the intended target. Here is the clear reason he gave. If James had been the intended target the mission would have been over right at the front door with no need to enter the home. They would have shot James and quickly left probably before Denise could have even seen who it was.

But he said they purposefully went inside to murder Denise. He also said the crime scene can reveal who may be the intended target. Such as if one victim suffered more gunshot wounds than another victim. Or if one victim had other type of injuries done by the killer beyond the gunshots themselves.

He said he does believe that Jayme has been killed and thinks the police know that too and know they are in recovery mode now.

He also said this which makes sense to me. He said the experts on the ground have the ability in less than a day's time to know if there are any vehicles in this county of 45000 that matches the 2 vehicles in question.

So he thinks the police already know the vehicles aren't from the county this happened in. He said they will go county by county searching the DMV data base looking for possible matches and interviewing anyone who may own the same type of vehicles crossing them off one by one.

So what do all of you think about this? I found all of it so facisinating. Jmo though

That's really interesting. I partially agree. I have never thought James was the target for that very reason that it appears he was shot first. Also if someone had a problem with him they had many opportunities to shoot him when he was away from his home so that his wife and child didn't need to be killed as well. The same, however, goes for Denise. Both the adults worked factory jobs and probably had schedules that would have been predictable for anyone who wanted to target one of them. They probably often drove to and from work late at night and early morning. It would not be hard to find a moment when one of them was alone on their way to or from work.

Where the above theory loses me is that after James was killed at the front door there were two people left in the house-- one was shot to death and the other was taken. Why would we assume Denise was the target and not Jayme? The perp could have just as easily killed Denise and left Jayme alive. Jayme was probably hiding or terrified and could have been threatened not to tell if she saw them or tied up and left there so she couldn't call for help. If it was someone well known to the family and they only wanted to kill Denise but leave Jayme alive, they would have been wise to wear a ski mask or something. If they knew the family well they would know Jayme was there and would have had a plan if Jayme got in the way-- either coming prepared to kill her as well or plan to hide their identity from her. It makes no sense to plan to take Jayme if the target was Denise. And it makes no sense to take the child on a whim either (unless a random attack by a monster like Thomas Evans in SC who raped both the mother and 4 year old daughter after a home invasion, taking 4 year old HA with him to abuse later). But for someone known to the family targeting Denise-- why take Jayme? It seems more logical to me to conclude that both James and Denise stood in the way of the actual target-- Jayme. MOO.

 

[gg1]

Searchers were divided into 14 separate groups, each with about 150 volunteers, and each group was assigned to a separate mapped out area in a several mile circumference around the residence

2,000 Volunteers Comb Fields, Forests In Search For Jayme Closs

link to barron county gis:
Barron County, WI » WG Xtreme

To the immediate north of the property is a wisconsin central railroad track

Also note that the search instructions were that all open buildings could be searched, closed buildings could not be searched. Logistically I'm sure it took some time to secure permission to search all of these areas as well.

 

[cody22]

I've spent way too much time thinking about Jayme's (admittedly theoretical) phone. In the Ashleigh Banfield interview, the sheriff said:

BANFIELD: Ok. So often times when a young person goes missing, the digital trail is almost like a popcorn trail, which leads me to the question about Jamie`s social media. 13-year-old girls are almost always on their phones or on some form of social media, I`m guessing, and I think it`s a good guess. You have been blanketing that angle. Have you found any information from her social media? Is it possible she has a phone with her?
FITZGERALD: I do not know the answer to the second part of the question, if she had the phone with her. I can tell you that we are looking at the social media platform. Again, that is why our partners in the FBI are so key in this, because they have the experts for smaller agencies like mine in a county of 44,000 people.
​

To me, this says many possible things:

1) Jayme had a phone that was issued by her parents and it is possible she has it in her possession.
2) Jayme had a phone that was issued by her parents and it is possible she does not have it in her possession.
3) Jayme was not issued a phone by her parents and he does not know if she was given one by someone else.
4) He does not know if anyone has ever given Jayme a phone or if she has one.

My understanding is that pings can solve a lot of questions. If she's ever logged into social media (or even email), that IP address was logged, and they'd know if it was from her home computer or a cell she was given. If it was a cell, they could use that data to then help ping.

But there are just so very many 'ifs'.

Just want that sweet girl to be safe. Whoever said it above is correct; she no longer has parents and we all need to rise up and take care of her. Whether that means searching, donating to find her or donating so she has a simpler life when she comes home.

ETA: Banfield Link

I am beginning to get the feeling that Jayme had no phone of her own yet, and that she shared a home computer with her parents....MOO

 

[CuriousMaine]

I've spent way too much time thinking about Jayme's (admittedly theoretical) phone. In the Ashleigh Banfield interview, the sheriff said:

BANFIELD: Ok. So often times when a young person goes missing, the digital trail is almost like a popcorn trail, which leads me to the question about Jamie`s social media. 13-year-old girls are almost always on their phones or on some form of social media, I`m guessing, and I think it`s a good guess. You have been blanketing that angle. Have you found any information from her social media? Is it possible she has a phone with her?
FITZGERALD: I do not know the answer to the second part of the question, if she had the phone with her. I can tell you that we are looking at the social media platform. Again, that is why our partners in the FBI are so key in this, because they have the experts for smaller agencies like mine in a county of 44,000 people.
​

To me, this says many possible things:

1) Jayme had a phone that was issued by her parents and it is possible she has it in her possession.
2) Jayme had a phone that was issued by her parents and it is possible she does not have it in her possession.
3) Jayme was not issued a phone by her parents and he does not know if she was given one by someone else.
4) He does not know if anyone has ever given Jayme a phone or if she has one.

My understanding is that pings can solve a lot of questions. If she's ever logged into social media (or even email), that IP address was logged, and they'd know if it was from her home computer or a cell she was given. If it was a cell, they could use that data to then help ping.

But there are just so very many 'ifs'.

Just want that sweet girl to be safe. Whoever said it above is correct; she no longer has parents and we all need to rise up and take care of her. Whether that means searching, donating to find her or donating so she has a simpler life when she comes home.

ETA: Banfield Link

Interesting find, BeeGirl. LEO should know if she has her own phone, or used her moms/dads/etc. I think his choice of the words "the phone" is a good indication that there is a phone missing/whereabouts unknown.