GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #62

[PommyMommy]

IIRC NK had also googled SW during the summer of 2018... to see FB page maybe? (Not sure what other reason there could be) and there was the pregnancy test reveal video on FB in early June, I think...

Here's what I have as far as NK's searches for the names "Chris Watts" or "Shanann Watts." (IOW, not a complete list of NK's internet/google searches.)

Unless otherwise noted, the information comes from the Phone Data Review beginning on pg 1887 (Discovery pg 2082)

8/3/2017 – searched items “chris watts” Pg 1601 (Discovery pg 1783)

9/1/2017 - searched the internet for the name "Shanann Watts"

1/7/2018 – searched items “shanann watts” Pg 1601 (Discovery pg 1783)

8/4/2018 - Google search for Chris and Shanann's Facebook accounts

8/11/2018 - having concluded her evening tryst with Watts, Kessinger searched the internet on topics like "Chris Watts" - "Shanann Watts" - "Ronnie Watts" and "2825 Saratoga Trail"

8/14/2018 - searched Google for Shanann Watts

8/14/2018 - spent nearly four hours searching Google and the internet for Watts, news outlets and news accounts of Shanann's disappearance

8/14/2018 - searched the internet for news accounts of this incident and Shanann's name (these searches were conducted frequently by Kessinger throughout the next several days. She deleted every one afterwards)

 

[tmar]

No. @PommyMommy has a team of experts housed in her basement that do all her research for her.

She pays them with freshly baked pies.

You must also have a similar team, working for you.
Paid, by staying on, only if they produce relevant info.

 

[CocoChanel]

I am neither a psychologist or physiatrist but this has entered my mind because she did look so much like him. And Cece did too but not as much as Bella.
And this makes no sense but I wonder if he was able to do such an act because he really wanted to kill himself and it made it easier because they looked like him? We know he should have offed himself but he was to chicken to do that plus he had a new exciting life to go to.
But it makes me wonder how you can kill your children especially in such a personal way as he did.

This theory would fit with the pathology of NPD where the NP views their children as extensions of themselves.

 

[k-mac]

SW was the sales rep, though.

she is romantically interested in this womans husband.
so shes not googling her to check her out shes going to her to look into thrive products???
right.

 

[MsBetsy]

I didn’t interpret it as SW being needy, IMO she was vulnerable as she was ill, and not long divorced. She said herself in one of her videos that she pushed him away at first. She was vulnerable, the perfect target for a predator like him. How dare he do this to her after he’s the one who pursued her.

Yes, people can be very powerful and strong and yet be vulnerable at times. It's not black and white. People who are manipulative and controlling know just the right time to move in. Imo

 

[NuttMegg]

Here's what I have as far as NK's searches for the names "Chris Watts" or "Shanann Watts." (IOW, not a complete list of NK's internet/google searches.)

Unless otherwise noted, the information comes from the Phone Data Review beginning on pg 1887 (Discovery pg 2082)

8/3/2017 – searched items “chris watts” Pg 1601 (Discovery pg 1783)

9/1/2017 - searched the internet for the name "Shanann Watts"

1/7/2018 – searched items “shanann watts” Pg 1601 (Discovery pg 1783)

8/4/2018 - Google search for Chris and Shanann's Facebook accounts

8/11/2018 - having concluded her evening tryst with Watts, Kessinger searched the internet on topics like "Chris Watts" - "Shanann Watts" - "Ronnie Watts" and "2825 Saratoga Trail"

8/14/2018 - searched Google for Shanann Watts

8/14/2018 - spent nearly four hours searching Google and the internet for Watts, news outlets and news accounts of Shanann's disappearance

8/14/2018 - searched the internet for news accounts of this incident and Shanann's name (these searches were conducted frequently by Kessinger throughout the next several days. She deleted every one afterwards)

Thanks, Pommy. So there are 2 "Watts" searches as early as Sept 2017.

 

[human]

One thing I have noticed about so many bizarre killers is that their photos change so much over time . They are not recognizable to me.

CW has changed in looks so much. I recognize people from decades ago, But some of these killers change in weeks

 

[Tortoise]

I agree, the timing of the text to his colleague tells me he was planning it and that he murdered the girls before SW got home.

If I had to put money on it I would say it was Shanann first, then the girls, then bag, bag, sheet, throw on some clothes in the basement he had prepared the night before and right outta there. Boom boom boom, like a robot. He may have sat on his bed in the basement to put his boots on and his hands from picking them up pressed into the bed and left a trace scent that the dogs detected.

 

[Thinker Belle]

It was probably already posted but I saw on sm that a 20/20 story will air this Friday about this case.

 

[spangled]

Watts gave mistress cards, love letters in weeks leading up to murders
Convicted murderer Christopher Watts gave his mistress, Nichole Kessinger, several handwritten cards and love letters in the weeks leading up to the murders of his wife and kids, records from the latest cache of case file data show.

The letter first in the case file, dated July 3, is a birthday card for Kessinger in which Watts states he hopes all of her dreams come true and that her year is filled with smiles, laughter and love. In one of two handwritten notes on the card, Watts writes:

"Your energy is so insane. You heat me up, you make me melt and then you cool me down like rain."

"Big things will happen this year, Dreams will come true," Watts writes in the second handwritten portion of the card. "That smile (that stare), that laugh (that giggle) gets me every time!!"

On July 30, Watts gave Kessinger two cards; one he purchased and one he made himself with a folded piece of paper. In the latter, Watts writes:

A birthday card Watts sent to mistress Nichole Kessinger
"Wow, where do I even start? The first day I saw you, you took my breath away. The first day I had the guts to talk to you, I got lost in those stunning green eyes. The first day we hung out in the park together, I knew I was addicted. The first time we kissed, I knew I had met the most amazing, unique and electric woman EVER!!

First part of the card seems to be song lyrics, just chucked it in to google, how original.

If they were hooking up mid June this seems pretty full on for just a couple of weeks later.

 

[ZsaZsa]

I still think in the back of my brain that he was trying (at first) to get rid of her, but not necessarily the kids. I was thinking that strangling, because of the length of time it takes is therefore "premeditated"(?) As others have mentioned, I too have a hard time envisioning him doing something that I myself would not do, ie plan ahead of time to kill my family. I'm sure everyone will correct me, but I am under the impression that "premeditated" can really involve a pretty short amount of time.

As soon as someone mentions premeditation I have a vivid picture of Nancy Grace saying "Premeditation can occur in the blink of an eye - it's not the time involved, but the choice". She said it almost every night....

 

[katie565]

I am neither a psychologist or physiatrist but this has entered my mind because she did look so much like him. And Cece did too but not as much as Bella.
And this makes no sense but I wonder if he was able to do such an act because he really wanted to kill himself and it made it easier because they looked like him? We know he should have offed himself but he was to chicken to do that plus he had a new exciting life to go to.
But it makes me wonder how you can kill your children especially in such a personal way as he did.

And in a way, killing your children is killing yourself or a big part of yourself. Children are your way of going on after you’re gone - your immortality. I don’t know. I’ll never get any of this and trying makes my head hurt

 

[MsBetsy]

This theory would fit with the pathology of NPD where the NP views their children as extensions of themselves.

Especially a father and son. Which he never allowed to be.

 

[Jennifer17]

And in a way, killing your children is killing yourself or a big part of yourself. Children are your way of going on after you’re gone - your immortality. I don’t know. I’ll never get any of this and trying makes my head hurt

But he could have more to replace them, with a different woman.

 

[Charlot123]

JMO but I wonder if that’s why the photo and video discovery (second round) has been so stunted. Maybe the Kessingers threatened to sue if they released her photos? Just an idea. They seem to be trying to keep her image as clean as possible.

Honestly, her photos are not relevant to the case. Her texts, are.

Chris Watts he is married and marriage appears seamless. Maybe not, but he and Shanann have two kids and the third one on the way. Must have been good enough, that marriage. Then Chris and Nichol Kessenger start having an affair. They work together; the workers seem to notice but no one cares as it often happens.

In the context of this affair, Chris Watts kills his pregnant wife, his two daughters, 3 and 4 years of age, and buries the corpses at his company's property. He is caught very fast, accuses his dead wife, but finally justice is done in the way of cleaning his wife Shanann's good name and he gets life sentence for this heinous deed.

In the course of investigation, his love interest, Nichol Kessenger, comes forward after her company provides the police with the information about the affair. She is interviewed by the police (twice, I believe). She comes with her father to the second interview and her father behaves in a strange, entitled manner. The tone of his voice - what I heard when he said "leading" - is angry and he is almost yelling at the police. Nichol Kessenger is also not too polite to them. She does not even say, "detective", all I heard was "you guys". It is almost like she does not understand what has happened. She claims poor memory and minimizes the severity of the situation.

She promises to give the police her cell phone but does factory reset so most of her communication with Watts is unavailable.

She has a witness to her whereabouts on Sunday night/Monday evening but refuses to provide his full name to the police.

She is interviewed by Denver Post but an article is a lie; she comes across as the hero in it but she is not.

I understand, as the love interest of a married man she may not have positive feelings towards his wife. But as a human being, can she have compassion towards his slain children? As a logical person, can she realize the gravity of the situation? That she is also at risk now? She does not, it seems.

Amber Frey, who she now seems to model herself after, to a degree that she Googles her net worth, withered a lot of storm around her. She came forward willingly. She risked as SP was not arrested yet. Someone traced her nude photos made a while ago and posted them; she survived that humiliation. People remembered her being a party girl, wrote bad things about her family. She took it humbly. Amber willingly took a polygraph test. She passed it. She did not give any interviews, made no money during the trial. She provided all tapes of her conversations with SP and they were played at his trial. Because of how she behaved, Laci's family and friends never blamed her. Her lawyer defended her pro bono. Her book was written after the trial.

Scott P. cheated on Laci many times, especially during the pregnancy. Amber Frey was the only one who came forward. She deserved the money for her book.

Personally, I don't blame Nichol for having an affair with a married man. I don't like it, but it takes two. And Nichol was single.

I don't care about her sexual interests. I'd rather not see or hear about anything that has no direct connection to the case. The public is not entitled to full account of her private life. It is her life.

And maybe the public is not entitled to much.

But the slain Wattses, Shanann, Bella, CeCe and unborn Nico, are entitled to justice and honesty, hence the society has the right to see:

- a true story
- texts of full communication between the two, CW and NK
- ughm, maybe polygraph results of NK? Amber Frey took one.
- a lawyer is a lawyer, and they usually are present at interviews. But why her dad? It feels as unnecessary pressure on the detectives. Either he is out of this story - and it is fine as she is a private person - or he is fully in.

Currently Nichol is not honest at all.

You know what? In the course of the SP's investigation and trial, Amber Frey helped so much that one of Laci's friends said, "you are now Laci's voice".

I am not implying that Nichol can ever be Shanann's voice, but, at least, try to do something positive?

 

[MsBetsy]

One thing I have noticed about so many bizarre killers is that their photos change so much over time . They are not recognizable to me.

CW has changed in looks so much. I recognize people from decades ago, But some of these killers change in weeks

Probably reflects what he has become. A completely broken man. There wasn't much there to begin with, but now there is nothing.

 

[Jessthinkin]

If I had to put money on it I would say it was Shanann first, then the girls, then bag, bag, sheet, throw on some clothes in the basement he had prepared the night before and right outta there. Boom boom boom, like a robot. He may have sat on his bed in the basement to put his boots on and his hands from picking them up pressed into the bed and left a trace scent that the dogs detected.

Makes sense, and getting up at 4AM for a 5:30 departure that didn't include a shower, etc. is an awful lot of time...

 

[The Farm]

If I had to put money on it I would say it was Shanann first, then the girls, then bag, bag, sheet, throw on some clothes in the basement he had prepared the night before and right outta there. Boom boom boom, like a robot. He may have sat on his bed in the basement to put his boots on and his hands from picking them up pressed into the bed and left a trace scent that the dogs detected.

When the video shows him going down the driveway in the dark to get his truck to back in he is in his stocking feet, he does not have his work boots on but you do see them when he is leaving with them already in the truck.
Makes sense, the boots were the last things he put on.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

I did like the question about whether he’d ever said anything hurtful to someone he loved in anger. Pretty sure most people have done this. He said no.

Yes, that is why they asked that question. I thought it was a very interesting question to ask on a polygraph because almost everyone has done such, but they may not feel guilty about it and perhaps that is what the Baseline was for the test. Very intriguing is to learning stuff because I always thought they just asked yes or no questions

 

[Gardener1850]

Sorry to multi-quote but trying to catch up on the thread.

I'm not sure what the significance is of this, but I did notice on the reports that the toilet in the Jack and Jill bathroom between the children's rooms was locked. And also there was no water in the toilet. I guess they did not use that bathroom in between the girls room and used another one for the girls that had the toys in it. But it also leads me to believe that if he was doing something to one girl, that the bathroom was locked in between and there was much space so that the other girl and if she was there would not hear him going in there and doing anything.

IIRC, people who stayed with the family said in their LE interviews that SW and CW typically locked the girl's bathroom doors at night after they put the girls to bed. So the significance of those doors being locked still is that it means SW and and girls never woke up that day. I'm not sure why there would be no water in the toilet though.

I have had this thought for a long time- I recall the video where Shannan said when she met CW, how he saved her life: how she was so sick and he accepted her and how grateful she was. Fast forward two children later, another one on the way, and Shannan during those years she was with Chris becoming a healthier and stronger woman, bringing in a good income and developing a strong personality--I think he may have liked the sick weaker grateful Shannan better than the person she became over the years of their marriage. Perhaps she stopped being grateful and spoke her mind---and CW just did not like the woman she had become over the years and decided he wanted a new model----It is obvious that what you see on the videos with his wife and children was a
total lie-- he had no attachment to any of them and disposed of them like yesterday's garbage (sorry for that reference but that is what he did).

I had similar thoughts about their relationship until we got the discovery documents and heard NK's interviews. NK is not a shy nor weak personality and doesn't have any health issues as far as we know. If CW was only attracted to weaker women he could control I don't see him choosing someone as assertive as NK. NK was very opinionated-- giving him advice on his diet, exercise, what to do/say in regards to his marriage, where he should live and how to control his finances better, even how to deal with his kids.

In retrospect I think SW was always a confident, positive and organized woman. She had gone through a divorce which can make someone struggle with trusting a new partner. I think SW might have been more "clingy" to CW in the beginning of their relationship due to her health issues and her divorce. And I think CW liked that a lot-- he liked being needed and told what he should do and being checked up on constantly. He liked a certain structure in a relationship IMO. Perhaps SW had grown more confident as their relationship progressed, the kids came along and she came into a career she loved. I think she put more of her her efforts into organizing their house and organizing the kids and less organizing/controlling of CW himself.

I think it's possible SW had reached a point where she truly trusted CW, still loved him and didn't feel the need to monitor him closely. Plus she had much more to occupy her time with her career and kids. She still did things to show she cared about CW like making him 5 weeks worth of freezer meals and buying him clothes he liked. She still slept with him and thought their sex life was great-- he couldn't keep his hands off of her. SW would also take photos and videos of CW and praise him on social media too.

SW thought they were in a good place in their relationship where she could go away with the kids for 5 weeks and not have to worry that CW would cheat-- why would she suspect that when CW had appeared faithful for 8 years so far? She trusted him. CW may have seen SW's trust and letting him do what he wanted more as a sign she did not love him as much anymore (and this is an unnatural conclusion for most people but it's possible IMO). Perhaps he saw this 5 weeks as an opportunity/excuse for him to have an affair he always wanted to have.

His life revolved around him and fulfilling his own needs. Perhaps when he decided SW had other things she cared about as much as or more than him (the kids/Thrive/visiting family) he justified the affair and later the murders in his sick mind. He decided he preferred his controlling/dominating mistress over his loving and trusting wife. He could not have been more wrong. SW continued to love him and make efforts to show him love but these were rejected by him or not recognized by him as real love for some inexplicable reason. He is so stupid and selfish. MOO.

CW says he weighed 248 before he started thrive, or was it when he met SW? Just trying to envision him in his skater clothes, with greased hair. He's not all that tall.

Another thing, he told his dad "I killed her". Then dad says, leading him, you smothered her? You strangled her? CW is not all that decisive in his answer, imo, although the sound was poor. Then CW says I did the same to her, (as she did to the girls), iirc. Then later with the agents, he mumbles about not actually seeing sw's hands, it was from the side. Sounded vague to me. Other than saying "I killed her" to his dad, did he ever just looked at any of the 3 and say I strangled her? Meaning sw.

I thought that 1 segment of the interrogation, after the polygraph was fascinating, where the agents were suggesting there was an accident, or that one of the girls was killed so that the dead one would not have to keep living alone, or that SW did it. It seems like they tried out several permutations, watching closely to see where he would enter the trap. Leaning very heavily on flattery, his being such a good father, keeping them warm, his own father would always love him, etc.

It made me wonder, in their training, if they have suggested techniques tailored to personality types/crimes/age groups. For instance, if I had killed my husband, I don't think that flattery would have swayed me to confess.

I think you can see CW's "skater boy" look in some of their older pictures. Here are some on Bella's baby blog: Journey of Bella Marie: Mommy and Daddy love you so much already!
Journey of Bella Marie: Bruno Mars Concert 8/6/13
Journey of Bella Marie: Your first rock concert! Carnival of Madness!
Although, I have not seen any of him with lots of hair gel. His hair is really short in all those. Perhaps that was one of the first things SW helped him change about his look? Since her mom owns a salon I think it's possible SW took CW to get his hair cut at her mom's salon. JMO.

I have a couple of questions. I've asked before, but I didn't really get any answers. Probably because the thread ended. Sorry for duplication. I appreciate all the information and opinions here.

Does the manner in which the girls were murdered, combined with the posed doll photo, imply that the girls were murdered first? I believe it does.

Is NK a good person or a bad person, and will she disappear now or will we be hearing from her again?

Thanks in advance.

I didn't think the doll photo was significant until I saw that CW sent it to SW with no explanation. Some people have said it was a sub-conscious threat. I almost wonder if he sent that to SW on accident? Could he have meant to send it to his parents or NK? Perhaps setting up a future claim SW did that to the doll in order to show her as "crazy"? That's what CW's dad ultimately thought anyway-- that SW posed that doll picture.

As for NK, she asked her friend "Are we bad people?" My answer to her is-- if you have to ask that question, you already know the answer.

I hadn't seen this. I notice CW is rocking with arms wrapped around his chest like we saw in media interviews.

Why did he not yell for Shanann, Bella and CeCe as he went through the house? He didn't even attempt to look concerned. Even a bitter soon to be ex-husband who had a fight with his wife that morning would be worried she might have had a medical episode and the girls could be in danger from being left unsupervised. His behavior gave himself away so fast. And good thing that it did, but it's baffling to watch all the same.