Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #10

[WINDSOR]

Couple points,
Do not lawyers usually keep a copy of the will they draw up for a client. You would think with the amount of publicity in this case, some lawyer who drew up Honey's will would have come forward and advised the family and or authorities? That points to the fact no will existed for Honey, strange but possibly true.

Finally, I get the feeling from reading the Toronto Star article, discussing all the sealed documents and secrecy surrounding this case. the TPS have a very credible suspect, and are just collecting more evidence prior to laying charges. I may be naive on this belief, but nobody in law enforcement is asking for help which, to me is most curious.

For those who believe Barry did it, if that was true, why would the judge approve sealing the documents?

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Well I suppose anything to keep the Sherman homicides in the headlines is always a worthwhile endeavour but this article contains a huge amount of speculation and conjecture regarding Honey’s Will considering the Sherman estate file has already been sealed for several months. The hearing Donovan refers to was held last August.

In the same story, his sole source avoids confirmation of anything so what do we really know?
“....(In an email interview this week, Youdan said he was referring in court only “to the facts as known in the public sphere.” He said he was not revealing details about the order of death, the status of wills, or whether or not an individual had a will. He did not elaborate.)...”
Where is Honey Sherman’s will? | The Star

Toronto Star Newspapers Ltd. v. Sherman Estate, 2018 ONSC 4706 (CanLII)
CanLII - 2018 ONSC 4706 (CanLII)

It’s interesting that The Star’s lawyers didn’t argue the case, it was Kevin Donovan himself.

Even though the records were ordered to be sealed, he would have been exposed to a lot of information as counsel.

 

[deugirtni]

May I say that Donovan has a big stick and likes to stir things up to sell papers.
He is the same fellow who asked women to call in for that 'very famous' trial a year or so back. Misrepresenting/muddying the waters can sell a LOT of papers, esp. on the anniversary of a dreadful crime. IMO

This is not O/T, it shows that the authors previous behaviour can/does show his current behaviour. IMO

Its what Donovan does. IMO

Are you talking about Gomeshi JDG?
I kinda like Donovan. He seems highly respected and has won numerous awards. I hope he unearths some interesting stuff in this case which he is someday able to share.

 

[deugirtni]

Couple points,
Do not lawyers usually keep a copy of the will they draw up for a client. You would think with the amount of publicity in this case, some lawyer who drew up Honey's will would have come forward and advised the family and or authorities? That points to the fact no will existed for Honey, strange but possibly true.

Finally, I get the feeling from reading the Toronto Star article, discussing all the sealed documents and secrecy surrounding this case. the TPS have a very credible suspect, and are just collecting more evidence prior to laying charges. I may be naive on this belief, but nobody in law enforcement is asking for help which, to me is most curious.

For those who believe Barry did it, if that was true, why would the judge approve sealing the documents?

They do keep copies WINDSOR, but whoever that lawyer is, I doubt if he would enlighten authorities and family and lawyers, via the media. I didn't know until Donovan published that article that the Will was even missing. That was long ago, and considering there are sealing orders and even Donovan isn't privy to the information, I have to assume that the Will is in safe hands long ago, just not publicized. jmo.

 

[MistyWaters]

Couple points,
Do not lawyers usually keep a copy of the will they draw up for a client. You would think with the amount of publicity in this case, some lawyer who drew up Honey's will would have come forward and advised the family and or authorities? That points to the fact no will existed for Honey, strange but possibly true.

Finally, I get the feeling from reading the Toronto Star article, discussing all the sealed documents and secrecy surrounding this case. the TPS have a very credible suspect, and are just collecting more evidence prior to laying charges. I may be naive on this belief, but nobody in law enforcement is asking for help which, to me is most curious.

For those who believe Barry did it, if that was true, why would the judge approve sealing the documents?

Absolutely, lawyer’s retain a copy. The second paragraph of the Star article reads like someone searching a house for grandmas handwritten will that’s been stuffed in the far corner of her nightstand. What does “no one reported” mean. No one reported to whom? To Donovan? How can he know “no one reported”.

Another thing, a standard part of a Last Will and a Testiment is a Living Will appointing someone to make critical medical decisions in the event the person is unable to. Honey was reported to have had several bouts with cancer. Me personally, I think this article leans toward a little far fetched drama.

“In the weeks following the discovery of Honey and Barry Sherman’s bodies last December, there was a vigorous search for an important document — Honey Sherman’s will.

No one reported being given it for safekeeping, and when police returned access to the family home where the billionaire couple was murdered, no last will and testament of hers was discovered...”

 

[JDG]

People don't hide their wills. If they haven't come up with one by now, its safe to assume that she never had one.

I don't have one either. Yes, stupid, but some people just put off facing their mortality.

Andreww, you are certainly 'assuming' a lot about this case.

With all due respect, someone worth BILLIONS of dollars is not going to be so stupid as to NOT have a will.

The Shermans were very aware of the laws, court systems etc and would NOT have their amount of assets without wills.

Perhaps this is another rubbish, sensationalist article.

Is it fair to keep slamming the family and accusing them of doing all sorts, just to get their own way? Does that not make them 'interfering with the course of justice' or whatever its' called?

I find your flights of fancy somewhat puzzling, to say in the least.

What do you get out of it? Just curious.

 

[deugirtni]

It’s interesting that The Star’s lawyers didn’t argue the case, it was Kevin Donovan himself.

Even though the records were ordered to be sealed, he would have been exposed to a lot of information as counsel.

I noticed that too, back at the time. I figured that with all that's going on with media right now (layoffs, lack of advertising revenues, people not wanting to pay for subscriptions, nobody buying print any more, loads of them closing or merging, etc.), the outlet was not able/willing to pay the outrageous legal costs, and since Donovan can do it himself, and seems perfectly able to, that was the only way it would happen. And yes, he would be privy to as much as possible, being the legal counsel.

 

[deugirtni]

... For those who believe Barry did it, if that was true, why would the judge approve sealing the documents?

According to some, money talks! But seriously, .. yes, why would the judge approve?

 

[andreww]

The tombstone will not be big enough to perpetuate that the police, despite advanced forensic possibilities, were unable to determine the time of death.

Even if they were able to estimate the time of death very accurately, if one or both of the deaths occurred late on the 13th, you wouldn't be able to specifically say it was before or after midnight.

Actually interesting that I've been comparing this case to the Jon Benet Ramsey case. I remember there was a controversy when the Ramsey's put Dec 25 on Jon Benet's tombstone.

 

[JDG]

Are you talking about Gomeshi JDG?
I kinda like Donovan. He seems highly respected and has won numerous awards. I hope he unearths some interesting stuff in this case which he is someday able to share.

NOT O/T
Yes, Gomeshi.

I kinda like most of what he writes too but it sometimes is not remotely related to the truth.

And, fwiw, I do not think Gomeshi was innocent. Just acquitted.

Donovan has one purpose, selling papers. Not O/T as it proves previous behaviour and future behaviour of this author.

 

[MistyWaters]

“The willingness of the perpetrator(s) of the crimes to resort to extreme violence to pursue whatever motive existed has been amply demonstrated,” Dunphy said in his August ruling. “The risk of harm is foreseeable and the foreseeable harm is grave.”....
Where is Honey Sherman’s will? | The Star

“Extreme violence”

 

[andreww]

According to some, money talks! But seriously, .. yes, why would the judge approve?

Not the case at all. I've never suggested that anyone was offered money. TPS tells the judge that the case is ongoing and that releasing details would jeopardize it, that will be good enough for any judge on any day of the week.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Absolutely, lawyer’s retain a copy. The second paragraph of the Star article reads like someone searching a house for grandmas handwritten will that’s been stuffed in the far corner of her nightstand. What does “no one reported” mean. No one reported to whom? To Donovan? How can he know “no one reported”.

Another thing, a standard part of a Last Will and a Testiment is a Living Will appointing someone to make critical medical decisions in the event the person is unable to. Honey was reported to have had several bouts with cancer. Me personally, I think this article leans toward a little far fetched drama.

“In the weeks following the discovery of Honey and Barry Sherman’s bodies last December, there was a vigorous search for an important document — Honey Sherman’s will.

No one reported being given it for safekeeping, and when police returned access to the family home where the billionaire couple was murdered, no last will and testament of hers was discovered...”

bbm
Apropos medical things: WHY did police request medical reports for the last several moths of both HS and BS? What would it have to do with m/s or m/m??

 

[deugirtni]

Yes, Gomeshi.

I kinda like most of what he writes too but it sometimes is not remotely related to the truth.

And, fwiw, I do not think Gomeshi was innocent. Just acquitted.

Donovan has one purpose, selling papers. Not O/T as it proves previous history and future history of this author.

I disagree that that is Donovan's purpose. That is The Star's purpose. I'll bet he's frustrated as heck that i)he is running into all kinds of roadblocks in accessing information in this case, and ii)that he can't actually report much of what he knows. Maybe this article was just written out of frustration at all of the access issues?

(I don't think Gomeshi was innocent, but I also don't think he was guilty.)

 

[deugirtni]

Not the case at all. I've never suggested that anyone was offered money. TPS tells the judge that the case is ongoing and that releasing details would jeopardize it, that will be good enough for any judge on any day of the week.

Call me naive but I think TPS has to do more than that to convince a judge to keep something under wraps which is the public's right to know, etc. The judge, from what was written, seemed to have information on how releasing certain information might hurt, and on the progress of the investigation, etc.

 

[Lexiintoronto]

Call me naive but I think TPS has to do more than that to convince a judge to keep something under wraps which is the public's right to know, etc. The judge, from what was written, seemed to have information on how releasing certain information might hurt, and on the progress of the investigation, etc.

Rbbm

Add that to this:

One law enforcement official connected to the case said these most recent warrants are “too specific” to be made public — an indication that detectives may be pursuing a theory on the identity of the killer or killers.

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/www.the...warrants-in-sherman-murder-investigation.html

 

[MistyWaters]

Andreww, you are certainly 'assuming' a lot about this case.

With all due respect, someone worth BILLIONS of dollars is not going to be so stupid as to NOT have a will.

The Shermans were very aware of the laws, court systems etc and would NOT have their amount of assets without wills.

Perhaps this is another rubbish, sensationalist article.

Is it fair to keep slamming the family and accusing them of doing all sorts, just to get their own way? Does that not make them 'interfering with the course of justice' or whatever its' called?

I find your flights of fancy somewhat puzzling, to say in the least.

What do you get out of it? Just curious.

Yes and furthermore about the Will, it’s not as if Shermans were the typical sort of senior couple with an estate involving equity in a home, some RSPs, and savings account, drawing a pension, etc having to phone a local law office to make an appointment with a lawyer they’d never set eyes on before, to draw up a Will.

They had to have been surrounded by lawyers, Apotex lawyers, litigations lawyers, tax lawyers, real estate lawyers.... So we are to unquestionably believe Barry named Honey a beneficiary of billions but at the age of 70 considering their joint wealth, all those lawyers but no, she didn’t have a Will just because the insinuation was buried within a media article without established proof.

That’d be a real stretch of the imagination imo.

 

[dotr]

 

[MistyWaters]

bbm
Apropos medical things: WHY did police request medical reports for the last several moths of both HS and BS? What would it have to do with m/s or m/m??

It’s considered due diligence. During a thorough investigation, LE are required collect evidence to determine who committed a crime, but also to eliminate all other possibilities.

 

[MistyWaters]

Another article today, reporting only on the sealing order.

Judge seals estate files of murder victims Barry and Honey Sherman to protect heirs

'The risk of harm is foreseeable and the foreseeable harm is grave,' said Ontario Superior Court Judge Sean Dunphy in a highly unusual sealing order
Judge seals estate files of murder victims Barry and Honey Sherman to protect heirs