CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #18 *ARREST*

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True, but my point remains the same. LE can't get away with hiding the date they started investigating a missing persons case (as was suggested by other posters I was replying to). Everything they investigate will be released as public info either at trial or after sentencing. Not to mention that there are so many people involved in an investigation of this size, I don't see how it would be possible to hide the date they started to investigate nor what purpose that could serve. If they didn't document their early investigation then they can't use anything they found out in court-- so those early days would be worthless. LE is allowed to lie to a suspect but there's just no reason to deceive the general public on something like that. JMO.
Agreed. The doc dump in the Watts case showed us all how detailed they were in documenting that case, taking notes, and working together with other agencies. They did a fantastic job. They cannot give us false information, so what they do NOT say speaks volumes.
 
And it's easy to find someone who lives in the same state. Reaching out to someone in another state may have been a sign that PF did not want a serious relationship. IMO, he freaked when she decided to move there.
I don't know, he did move her down there. I'm beginning to wonder if her murder had anything to do with their relationship. It just doesn't make any sense. He planned the murder in advance, why? What happened to cause that? This wasn't sudden rage, this was cold, determined and goes far deeper than a relational problem between the two of them.
 
When a relationship sours, it is common for one or the other to start up another relationship, or already be in another relationship. And they usually follow a pattern. PF apparently met Kelsey thru online dating. If PF wanted to start up another relationship, and use the same pattern, he would probably go to an online dating site where there are millions of women seeking a relationship. And it is easy to find someone your age with common interests (rodeo). IMO

When a relationship sours, it is common for one or the other to start up another relationship, or already be in another relationship. And they usually follow a pattern. PF apparently met Kelsey thru online dating. If PF wanted to start up another relationship, and use the same pattern, he would probably go to an online dating site where there are millions of women seeking a relationship. And it is easy to find someone your age with common interests (rodeo). IMO
I don't think that his motive for murdering Kelsey would be because he was looking for someone else. Usually the guy kills a woman because the woman wants to move on. All a guess at this point, though.
 
I think the neighbor left on the 22nd and was gone for three days? Pommy can you chime in?
From what I remember from the pics of the interior the loft was a bedroom and I think the bathroom was on the shared wall. But I'm not certain of that.
I seem to remember that the neighbor left on Thanksgiving for an extended period of time (longer than just dinner - perhaps several days?) but I don't recall exactly. I'll see if I can find what she said. :)
MOO
 
And it's easy to find someone who lives in the same state. Reaching out to someone in another state may have been a sign that PF did not want a serious relationship. IMO, he freaked when she decided to move there.
It was stated that he helped KB move to Colorado. Although at first she lived on the Western Slope about 3 plus hours away. Maybe that was close enough for him. Maybe freaked out when she became pregnant and moved to his area, however. IMO
 
I don't know, he did move her down there. I'm beginning to wonder if her murder had anything to do with their relationship. It just doesn't make any sense. He planned the murder in advance, why? What happened to cause that? This wasn't sudden rage, this was cold, determined and goes far deeper than a relational problem between the two of them.
I agree with this. "...deeper than a relationship problem..."
 
Agreed. The doc dump in the Watts case showed us all how detailed they were in documenting that case, taking notes, and working together with other agencies. They did a fantastic job. They cannot give us false information, so what they do NOT say speaks volumes.

Exactly. LE often withholds info from the public to protect an investigation. I believe they withheld that PF was their prime suspect (but they telegraphed it strongly with other things they said and did). That's not the same thing as telling the public concrete lies such as the date KB was reported missing. JMO.
 
Not sure. It could have been because of the international interest in that case. I don't recall any document release of the Harold Henthorne case where he was found guilty.
Harold Henthorn was tried in federal court as his wife's murder was in a national park. (There was a thread for that trial on WS) Federal court is much different and things are not released, nor cameras allowed in the courtroom.
 
LE must have enough evidence (and very specific) to say she is deceased. If it’s electronic, it has to be photos, video or graphic/clear enough language in texts or emails. If it’s evidence from within the apartment, it must be very telling — enough but still that no one who went in there before LE (KB’s brother) could tell. Will be very interesting to see what they have.
 
I read somewhere she worked at the coffee shop in Florrisant (Costello house, delicious coffee!).... right down the road from the 35 acre property...

I've read that she moved here
For the pilot job??? Why would she work here at coffee shop, if she had the pilot job? And
She got
Her mail in Florrisant? She moved to 269 e Lake in June, where did she live prior to that?

If PF helped her move to area, she stayed with PF and SF, got her mailbox set up, got a local job... I think she wanted things to be sunshine and rainbows with PF but it wasn't so she was moving on and co-parenting... got her good paying job, bought her home, was responsible enough to have 2 vehicles (4wd for winter and small car for summer), she took care of herself. PF was losing control... she was done w him and he was going to lose baby K too...
 
I don't know, he did move her down there. I'm beginning to wonder if her murder had anything to do with their relationship. It just doesn't make any sense. He planned the murder in advance, why? What happened to cause that? This wasn't sudden rage, this was cold, determined and goes far deeper than a relational problem between the two of them.

IDK. I don't think that cold calculating murderers have much depth. Unless by deeper you mean planning the murder and carrying it out reveals who he has been all his life? That I would agree with. But I don't think we will find a deeper meaning nor a satisfying motive to explain why he did it. MOO.
 
It was stated that he helped KB move to Colorado. Although at first she lived on the Western Slope about 3 plus hours away. Maybe that was close enough for him. Maybe freaked out when she became pregnant and moved to his area, however. IMO
This is what I think. I think he likes women online far away he can hold at arms length and visit at will.
 
Harold Henthorn was tried in federal court as his wife's murder was in a national park. (There was a thread for that trial on WS) Federal court is much different and things are not released, nor cameras allowed in the courtroom.
Thank you!
 
Okay, so I started reading over the past few weeks about uxoricide, or the murder of one's mate. The general there are three reasons why men kill their partners: jealousy, control or fear of abandonment. Cohabitation increases the likelihood of murder by a partner, while marriage lessens it (living together causes the man to feel less in control of the relationship). Age is another factor in that the younger a couple is or the greater the age difference, the more likely a murder is to occur. Most murders occur with a past history of abuse, but we didn't see any of that here and I've been unable to find any previous records of Frazee having assaulted anyone, but I've only been able to access the past three months of records through the county.
What I'm wondering is, perhaps she was holding off on the wedding until he got his finances in order and maybe that loss of control and fear of abandonment precipitated his desire to kill her. Maybe that was his motive.
 
What evidence do you have that he “freaked out” by her moving there?

I haven’t seen a single report of this.
One of the reasons I think he freaked out is because his history had not placed him in a good light in terms of carrying on healthy adult male-female relationships. No woman has come forward supporting he was a reliable partner. He cheated on an old girlfriend while she was sick in the hospital. He did not live together with the woman he impregnated. He still lived at home. And he probably killed KB. I don't think he ever had reached a maturity level to be involved in a healthy relationship and live like a family. I bet he freaked out when she moved there and then again, when she became pregnant.
 
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